Netherlands

Saurophaganax

Hi folks

I might have need to move to the Netherlands - specifically Arnhem - for a job. I've visited the country twice before and have fond childhood memories but was wondering what it's like to live in. Any advice?

keithclancy

Saurophaganax wrote: »

Hi folks

I might have need to move to the Netherlands - specifically Arnhem - for a job. I've visited the country twice before and have fond childhood memories but was wondering what it's like to live in. Any advice?

Pros:
Public Transport is fantastic
Great roads
Easy access to other nearby countries
Lots of Airports to choose from when going to visit Ireland and other places (Eindhoven, Maastricht, Amsterdam, Groningen, Weeze etc)
Good beer.
You don't necessarily need a car.
People are friendly as long as you make an effort to integrate.
Public services are great.

Cons:
High Taxes (Divide your salary in half) although if you get the 30% Ruling this is much lower.
Food isn't great.
Weather is just as bad as Ireland.
While services are great, you will be restricted if you do not speak Dutch (e.g. Tax office won't deal with anything officially in English)

We love it here though.

nbar12

keithclancy wrote: »

Pros:


Cons:
High Taxes (Divide your salary in half) although if you get the 30% Ruling this is much lower.
Food isn't great.
Weather is just as bad as Ireland.
While services are great, you will be restricted if you do not speak Dutch (e.g. Tax office won't deal with anything officially in English)

We love it here though.

i'm moving over soon enough for work and was wondering about the taxes, if I have to divide my salary in half, well that has me freaked!

Jim2007

nbar12 wrote: »

i'm moving over soon enough for work and was wondering about the taxes, if I have to divide my salary in half, well that has me freaked!

It is a progressive tax rate, so splitting your salary in two would appear to be an exaggeration, unless you are a very high income earner. Google for an online tax calculator to see how it will impact you.

keeponhurling

About the 30% ruling....

For simplicity, just say your salary is 100k, so only 70k is considered taxable.

Within that 70k, is all of it taxed at 52% rate? So your overall tax rate is 70%*52% = 36.4%. So take home pay would be 63.6k theoretically?

Or is first part of 70k taxed at 30%, then 42%, then 52% etc.

keithclancy

Jim2007 wrote: »

It is a progressive tax rate, so splitting your salary in two would appear to be an exaggeration, unless you are a very high income earner. Google for an online tax calculator to see how it will impact you.

IMO after all the calculations, income taxes, city taxes and mandatory heath insurance its about half.

Actually I work in Germany now and its pretty much half also, even though the taxation systems are pretty different.

dissed doc

keeponhurling wrote: »

About the 30% ruling....

For simplicity, just say your salary is 100k, so only 70k is considered taxable.

Within that 70k, is all of it taxed at 52% rate? So your overall tax rate is 70%*52% = 36.4%. So take home pay would be 63.6k theoretically?

Or is first part of 70k taxed at 30%, then 42%, then 52% etc.

The 70k is taxed normally and it becomes your annual salary on your payslip, so each band, pension deduction, etc., is as per normal. At the end of your salary slip, the tax free bit is added on.

100k is around €5900 with the 30% ruling or €4600 without.

weisses

keithclancy wrote: »

Pros:
Public Transport is fantastic
Great roads
Easy access to other nearby countries
Lots of Airports to choose from when going to visit Ireland and other places (Eindhoven, Maastricht, Amsterdam, Groningen, Weeze etc)
Good beer.
You don't necessarily need a car.
People are friendly as long as you make an effort to integrate.
Public services are great.

Cons:
High Taxes (Divide your salary in half) although if you get the 30% Ruling this is much lower.
Food isn't great.
Weather is just as bad as Ireland.
While services are great, you will be restricted if you do not speak Dutch (e.g. Tax office won't deal with anything officially in English)

We love it here though.

What is wrong with the food Keith ? I am experiencing the opposite as a Dutchman in Ireland

Weather is better then in Ireland IMO warmer in summers colder in Winters specially around Arnhem ...More influence from the continent

You are right when it comes to taxes ... but people must consider that there are a couple of "perks" ..Vakantiegeld en Reiskostenvergoeding for instance (holiday and travel allowances) Holiday allowance is 8%of your yearly income. And you get 70% of your last income when you are made redundant (WW. ... And more Holidays although i dunno how that compares to the extra Bank holidays here.

keithclancy

weisses wrote: »

What is wrong with the food Keith ? I am experiencing the opposite as a Dutchman in Ireland

Weather is better then in Ireland IMO warmer in summers colder in Winters specially around Arnhem ...More influence from the continent

You are right when it comes to taxes ... but people must consider that there are a couple of "perks" ..Vakantiegeld en Reiskostenvergoeding for instance (holiday and travel allowances) Holiday allowance is 8%of your yearly income. And you get 70% of your last income when you are made redundant (WW. ... And more Holidays although i dunno how that compares to the extra Bank holidays here.

Jesus .. show me a place where they sell a decent leg of lamb that doesn't cost a fortune .. or a butcher that sells a good Sirloin steak and knows the farm where it came from.

Tax Wise I'm not saying its a bad thing, merely giving a guideline on what you can expect in your net pay.

Your 13th month is your money anyway, its not charity

Alun

keithclancy wrote: »

Jesus .. show me a place where they sell a decent leg of lamb that doesn't cost a fortune.

Halal butchers are the best option for lamb over there. I used to go to one in Eindhoven for a while (can't remember where it was now, too long ago after I left!)

Just before I left though I discovered a farm that had it's own Halal butchers that also sold direct to the public at very reasonable prices. I'll have a rummage around on Google maps and see if I can figure out where it was again (could take a while!)

Alun

OK, I'm fairly confident it's this place out near Oirschot...

http://www.detelefoongids.nl/linden-islam-slachterij-h-j-vd/11725782/5-1/?what=slachthuizen&where=Brabant

https://maps.google.com/maps?oe=utf-8&client=firefox-a&channel=rcs&ie=UTF-8&layer=c&z=17&iwloc=A&sll=51.531685,5.302273&cbp=13,86.4,0,0,0&cbll=51.531676,5.302035&q=Meierijsebaan+8&ei=RZV3UvqxOIey7AbAh4HYCg&ved=0CCwQxB0wAA

There's no info on the net about the place apart from contact info, but it seemed to be one of those places you just had to know about rather than find by accident. The only way you'll know if it's the right place is to give them a ring.

keithclancy

Alun wrote: »

Halal butchers are the best option for lamb over there. I used to go to one in Eindhoven for a while (can't remember where it was now, too long ago after I left!)

Just before I left though I discovered a farm that had it's own Halal butchers that also sold direct to the public at very reasonable prices. I'll have a rummage around on Google maps and see if I can figure out where it was again (could take a while!)

Cool .. cheers for that .. will have a look into it.

We also found a Halal butcher in the neighbourhood that's priced a little bit better ... he rarely has good beef though.

Alun

keithclancy wrote: »

Cool .. cheers for that .. will have a look into it.

We also found a Halal butcher in the neighbourhood that's priced a little bit better ... he rarely has good beef though.

I have just remembered the one we went to was on the Marconiplein, but looking at Google Streetview all the shops seem to be boarded up now. Still, I guess assuming nothing would have changed since I left in 2001 is a bit much I still miss the place sometimes!

keithclancy

Alun wrote: »

I have just remembered the one we went to was on the Marconiplein, but looking at Google Streetview all the shops seem to be boarded up now. Still, I guess assuming nothing would have changed since I left in 2001 is a bit much I still miss the place sometimes!

Probably gone now ... that area is a complete dump, I once stopped to buy cigarettes in a shop there ... they were fake

stickybookmark

weisses wrote: »

What is wrong with the food Keith ? I am experiencing the opposite as a Dutchman in Ireland

Weather is better then in Ireland IMO warmer in summers colder in Winters specially around Arnhem ...More influence from the continent
.

Had to smile at this - fair play to you standing up for dutch food/weather.

You have to remember that for Irish people travelling to the continent conjures up ideas of Spain or France or Italy i.e. people expect delicious food and great weather. Holland kind of contradicts those stereotypes for irish people!!

People back in Ireland will assume anywhere on continental Europe has better weather than we do, that's why it's necessary to point out clearly - that is not the case for Holland - in fact it rains as much here as it does in parts of Ireland and the winters here are more harsh than ours.

Also the food - the dutch don't have native cuisine that compares with spanish tapas or lovely italian pizzas or french food cooking. So it's not a comparison with irish food (we never claim to have deleicious cuisine in Ireland), it's a comparision with other continental european food!

denhaagenite

stickybookmark wrote: »

Had to smile at this - fair play to you standing up for dutch food/weather.

You have to remember that for Irish people travelling to the continent conjures up ideas of Spain or France or Italy i.e. people expect delicious food and great weather. Holland kind of contradicts those stereotypes for irish people!!

People back in Ireland will assume anywhere on continental Europe has better weather than we do, that's why it's necessary to point out clearly - that is not the case for Holland - in fact it rains as much here as it does in parts of Ireland and the winters here are more harsh than ours.

Also the food - the dutch don't have native cuisine that compares with spanish tapas or lovely italian pizzas or french food cooking. So it's not a comparison with irish food (we never claim to have deleicious cuisine in Ireland), it's a comparision with other continental european food!

Yes because we're all big potato heads who've only ever been to Santa Ponsa- wtf??

I'm entitled to say I miss Irish food or that I'd like to have better weather where I live- in fact my Dutch neighbours praise food from other countries and also enjoy the few days of good weather we get here.

I swear, smug emigrants really do get up my nose, as the smell of their own farts get up theirs I bet :rolleyes:

Thomas D

The weather is better in Holland, no question. Substantially more sunshine, hotter summer temperatures. Precipitation days are about the same but heavier rainfall events for certain parts of the year. Colder winters and higher chance of snow.

stickybookmark

denhaagenite wrote: »

Yes because we're all big potato heads who've only ever been to Santa Ponsa- wtf??

I'm entitled to say I miss Irish food or that I'd like to have better weather where I live- in fact my Dutch neighbours praise food from other countries and also enjoy the few days of good weather we get here.

I swear, smug emigrants really do get up my nose, as the smell of their own farts get up theirs I bet :rolleyes:

A smug emigrant? That means you think I''m smug about Ireland. What in my post implied that? A dutch guy said he doesn't understand Irish complaining about dutch food coz in his opinion d food in Ireland isn't good. I replied by explaining d Irish think good food , good weather &continental Europe go hand in hand. How is that me being smug about Ireland?!

keithclancy

stickybookmark wrote: »

A smug emigrant? That means you think I''m smug about Ireland. What in my post implied that? A dutch guy said he doesn't understand Irish complaining about dutch food coz in his opinion d food in Ireland isn't good. I replied by explaining d Irish think good food , good weather &continental Europe go hand in hand. How is that me being smug about Ireland?!

I don't know any Irish people of that opinion, if anything the only assumption is that its cheaper.

I think it was more around you implying that all Irish people have the assumption that you mention based on a cheap package holiday to somewhere in the Mediterranean.

lufties

Hi, I just wondered if I could get some opinions/experiences from Irish expats in The Netherlands. It's a place that always interested me(well amsterdam at least), I just like the idea of living in a so called free society where almost nothing is taboo. I'm actually learning some dutch at the moment using the pimsleur method, which is all audio, but still pretty good. I've been told the dutch are very direct, but i've lived in Germany so I've an idea how they'd be.
A mate of mine who spent time in holland also said dutch people are 10 years ahead of the germans, not really sure what he meant. Perhaps with regards to society and outlook on life. A bold statement if there ever was one

Thanks.

Soldie

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056917588

lufties

keithclancy wrote: »

I don't know any Irish people of that opinion, if anything the only assumption is that its cheaper.

I think it was more around you implying that all Irish people have the assumption that you mention based on a cheap package holiday to somewhere in the Mediterranean.

What are dutch women like generally? After living in germany I found the local women, unapprochable, sour faced and agressive to an extent. Although friends of mine had no prob with that so it might have just been me.

nbar12

lufties wrote: »

What are dutch women like generally? After living in germany I found the local women, unapprochable, sour faced and agressive to an extent. Although friends of mine had no prob with that so it might have just been me.

Dutch women are weird! They're not much craic imo but then again the Dutch are a bit boring! After a week of moving over here, I hooked up with a Dutch girl and it was a terrible mistake, she told me she loved me and sent me a picture of a wedding dress after 2 weeks!

lufties

nbar12 wrote: »

Dutch women are weird! They're not much craic imo but then again the Dutch are a bit boring! After a week of moving over here, I hooked up with a Dutch girl and it was a terrible mistake, she told me she loved me and sent me a picture of a wedding dress after 2 weeks!

:eek:

denhaagenite

nbar12 wrote: »

Dutch women are weird! They're not much craic imo but then again the Dutch are a bit boring! After a week of moving over here, I hooked up with a Dutch girl and it was a terrible mistake, she told me she loved me and sent me a picture of a wedding dress after 2 weeks!

There isn't as much of a "hooking up" culture here unless you actively look for like minded people I believe- they have plenty of clubs for that sort of thing in Amsterdam :P.

I wouldn't describe the Dutch as boring exactly, they tend to party for longer at a lower decibel. That's why middle aged people are always hilarious here, years of practice! The women are definitely different to Irish women- not as willing to put up with the s***e we're willing to put up with that's for sure. They know what they want and are more likely to be pushy about it. While I think it can be OTT most of the time I do appreciate the influence it's had, making me a lot less passive about things that affect me.

Of course I wouldn't say that all Dutch women are like this without exception, I have friends that are nothing like this aswell. This country is so diverse that you really can't generalise.

keithclancy

nbar12 wrote: »

Dutch women are weird! They're not much craic imo but then again the Dutch are a bit boring! After a week of moving over here, I hooked up with a Dutch girl and it was a terrible mistake, she told me she loved me and sent me a picture of a wedding dress after 2 weeks!

Dude, you hooked up with a bunny boiler, just because she was dutch doesn't mean we don't have any in Ireland :P

Dutch women in general ... they drink less.. sense of humor is different, I couldn't generalise more than that really.

You'd probably have the same experience with someone that didn't watch the same TV shows or grow up reading the same books.

People that grow up in the south don't really get people from the north and west/east, country side/city.

Same as Ireland really.

Phil UGC

I lived there for a few years and loved it (back in the 90s). The hardest thing was to find accommodation, especially in Amsterdam. Never had any trouble finding work through the uitzendbureaus (temp agencies).

nbar12

I have to go to Brussels on Saturday to visit my sister and I can only spend the day there so I want to get the train. The thing is that the train is outrageously expensive, €150 return from Amsterdam just for a day trip! Does anyone know any cheap way of getting there by train? I would get the bus but I'm unable to book a return journey for Saturday night

lufties

nbar12 wrote: »

I have to go to Brussels on Saturday to visit my sister and I can only spend the day there so I want to get the train. The thing is that the train is outrageously expensive, €150 return from Amsterdam just for a day trip! Does anyone know any cheap way of getting there by train? I would get the bus but I'm unable to book a return journey for Saturday night

Try rent a car?

denhaagenite

If you could stay the weekend it's cheaper to fly and would only take an hour each way. Also carsharing could be an option?

keithclancy

nbar12 wrote: »

I have to go to Brussels on Saturday to visit my sister and I can only spend the day there so I want to get the train. The thing is that the train is outrageously expensive, €150 return from Amsterdam just for a day trip! Does anyone know any cheap way of getting there by train? I would get the bus but I'm unable to book a return journey for Saturday night

Car rental for Saturday from 8am to 9pm on www.autoeurope.ie is coming in at €35.58 with Dollar Car Rental from Schiphol Airport.

That would be your cheapest/most convenient option.

Schiphol would be the handiest as most of the city locations are closed after 6 in the evening.

CountingClocks

Bus will cost you EUR31 return

www.eurolines.nl

keithclancy

nbar12 wrote: »

I have to go to Brussels on Saturday to visit my sister and I can only spend the day there so I want to get the train. The thing is that the train is outrageously expensive, €150 return from Amsterdam just for a day trip! Does anyone know any cheap way of getting there by train? I would get the bus but I'm unable to book a return journey for Saturday night

Wait .. were are you getting that price from ?

Its coming out at 47.20 for me on nshispeed.nl with a connection in Rotterdam.

Amsterdam Centraal - Bruxelles Central/Brussel Centraal
Vertrek: zaterdag 01 februari om 09:25
Aankomst: zaterdag 01 februari om 11:59
Reistijd: 02:34
Overstap: 1
Comfortklasse: 2e klas
Voorwaarden: Wijzigen / annuleren tegen kosten

Bruxelles Central/Brussel Centraal - Amsterdam Centraal
Vertrek: zaterdag 01 februari om 21:01
Aankomst: zaterdag 01 februari om 23:36
Reistijd: 02:35
Overstap: 1
Comfortklasse: 2e klas
Voorwaarden: Wijzigen / annuleren tegen kosten

Totaalprijs
€47,20

CountingClocks

keithclancy wrote: »

Wait .. were are you getting that price from ?

Its coming out at 47.20 for me on nshispeed.nl with a connection in Rotterdam.

Amsterdam Centraal - Bruxelles Central/Brussel Centraal
Vertrek: zaterdag 01 februari om 09:25
Aankomst: zaterdag 01 februari om 11:59
Reistijd: 02:34
Overstap: 1
Comfortklasse: 2e klas
Voorwaarden: Wijzigen / annuleren tegen kosten

Bruxelles Central/Brussel Centraal - Amsterdam Centraal
Vertrek: zaterdag 01 februari om 21:01
Aankomst: zaterdag 01 februari om 23:36
Reistijd: 02:35
Overstap: 1
Comfortklasse: 2e klas
Voorwaarden: Wijzigen / annuleren tegen kosten

Totaalprijs
€47,20

Yeah, just saw that too. Maybe OP was looking at Thalys prices?

nbar12

CountingClocks wrote: »

Yeah, just saw that too. Maybe OP was looking at Thalys prices?

I certainly was haha, thinking of car pooling now!

keithclancy

nbar12 wrote: »

I certainly was haha, thinking of car pooling now!

Bit late now i'd say, Carpooling is fairly hit and miss and its difficult to get them at the right time.

Try
http://www.karzoo.nl/

nbar12

keithclancy wrote: »

Bit late now i'd say, Carpooling is fairly hit and miss and its difficult to get them at the right time.

Try
http://www.karzoo.nl/

When I got home from work I was able to properly look and booked those exact train tickets for €47, Cheers for your help!

stickybookmark

lufties wrote: »

Hi, I just wondered if I could get some opinions/experiences from Irish expats in The Netherlands. It's a place that always interested me(well amsterdam at least), I just like the idea of living in a so called free society where almost nothing is taboo

Thanks.

I love living in Amsterdam I have to say. It's just so easy to live here, there are very few dramas or stresses. I find the Dutch a great race - practical, good sense of humour, friendly, very little airs n graces about them, no bull they call a spade a spade.
Great flight connections to both Dublin &Cork too and u don't have to endure Ryanair yay Schipol is sooo easy and cheap to get to on public transport, makes flying home just so easy and stress-free.
And there's always stuff on and stuff to do. Irish gang in droves if u join the GAA club (little/no prior GAA exp req'd!) and huge expat scene here through meetup.com
Almost everyone speaks English and loads of English speaking jobs/workplaces here.
Only little fly in the ointment is the cost of rent here. That is saucy but there are ways to save, like house shares

lufties

stickybookmark wrote: »

I love living in Amsterdam I have to say. It's just so easy to live here, there are very few dramas or stresses. I find the Dutch a great race - practical, good sense of humour, friendly, very little airs n graces about them, no bull they call a spade a spade.
Great flight connections to both Dublin &Cork too and u don't have to endure Ryanair yay Schipol is sooo easy and cheap to get to on public transport, makes flying home just so easy and stress-free.
And there's always stuff on and stuff to do. Irish gang in droves if u join the GAA club (little/no prior GAA exp req'd!) and huge expat scene here through meetup.com
Almost everyone speaks English and loads of English speaking jobs/workplaces here.
Only little fly in the ointment is the cost of rent here. That is saucy but there are ways to save, like house shares

Cool thanks for the bit of info, I'm moving to london soon but NL is probably where I'd go if it didn't work out in Jolly old

seachto7

How did you find looking for jobs in NL? Monster?

stickybookmark

couldn't advise you on jobs sorry. i work in a very specialised field. i emailed a guy i used to work with in ireland who i heard had moved here and he gave me the names of 2 agencies to send my cv to (they only operate in the field i'm in) and i got an interview each out of the 2 of them, and took one of the jobs.

stickybookmark

Hey just tried using my dutch bank card which says ''Maestro'' to book a flight on Aer lingus and AL doesn't seem to have an option for Maestro from the drop down menu :-( Are all dutch bank cards the same? Any way round this? Cheers

keithclancy

stickybookmark wrote: »

Hey just tried using my dutch bank card which says ''Maestro'' to book a flight on Aer lingus and AL doesn't seem to have an option for Maestro from the drop down menu :-( Are all dutch bank cards the same? Any way round this? Cheers

You can't use Maestro online, same as most European countries.

Mate of mine used this crowd and was able to pay with iDeal for the same price:
http://www.goedkopevliegtuigtickets.be/en/

You could also get an online prepaid Mastercard but this takes some time:
https://vikingcard.com/nl/

Nessel

How did you find looking for jobs in NL? Monster?

Job wise there are several sites you can visit.

Monsterboard.nl
nationalevacaturebank.nl
vacatures.nl
stepstone.nl
vacaturekrant.nl
Hope that will help a little

Hey just tried using my dutch bank card which says ''Maestro'' to book a flight on Aer lingus and AL doesn't seem to have an option for Maestro from the drop down menu :-( Are all dutch bank cards the same? Any way round this? Cheers

And a regular debit card cannot be used like a creditcard no. Payment via iDeal only usually.
It's like that for all debit cards no matter which bank it's from.

stickybookmark

Just for general info - Mate of mine just moved here and was told that Sofi numbers are now a thing of the past, you get a ''temporary BSN'' instead (if you tell them you're not sure if you'll be here for longer than 4 months) he's going in to get one next Monday.

keithclancy

stickybookmark wrote: »

Just for general info - Mate of mine just moved here and was told that Sofi numbers are now a thing of the past, you get a ''temporary BSN'' instead (if you tell them you're not sure if you'll be here for longer than 4 months) he's going in to get one next Monday.

In principal they are both the same thing, just the temporary one you mention is only registered with the Belastingdienst for tax purposes, but its not temporary, you could have it for years just to do your taxes.

Its just your number that the Dutch Government offices use to identify you.

My BSN and Sofi number are the same all they did was change the name.

keeponhurling

stickybookmark wrote: »

Hey just tried using my dutch bank card which says ''Maestro'' to book a flight on Aer lingus and AL doesn't seem to have an option for Maestro from the drop down menu :-( Are all dutch bank cards the same? Any way round this? Cheers

I keep a few quid in my Irish bank account, and use that for booking on aerlingus.com
It's just handier.

Even with KLM you have to actually go into your online banking and do a bank transfer. Seems a bit primitive.

keeponhurling

stickybookmark wrote: »

Only little fly in the ointment is the cost of rent here. That is saucy but there are ways to save, like house shares

but easier to buy a gaff here

keithclancy

keeponhurling wrote: »

I keep a few quid in my Irish bank account, and use that for booking on aerlingus.com
It's just handier.

Even with KLM you have to actually go into your online banking and do a bank transfer. Seems a bit primitive.

Isn't that just a Visa Debit card ? AFAIK Laser is phased out now.

KLM use iDeal which is a transaction system that's not really anything like a normal SEPA Transfer.

stickybookmark

keeponhurling wrote: »

Even with KLM you have to actually go into your online banking and do a bank transfer. Seems a bit primitive.

Paying for stuff using 'IDEAL' is funny alright, especially how different it is between different banks. Like if you're with ABN Amro in order to buy anything online you have to have your little device thingy with you, put your card and PIN into it and therefore have to be on a laptop. Totally inconvenient.

Whereas with ING as long as you have Wifi/data you can buy stuff online with it just by putting in your username, password and getting a text to your phone - you don't even need your card with you

keithclancy

stickybookmark wrote: »

Paying for stuff using 'IDEAL' is funny alright, especially how different it is between different banks. Like if you're with ABN Amro in order to buy anything online you have to have your little device thingy with you, put your card and PIN into it and therefore have to be on a laptop. Totally inconvenient.

Whereas with ING as long as you have Wifi/data you can buy stuff online with it just by putting in your username, password and getting a text to your phone - you don't even need your card with you

Works fine on my phone.