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walshb

Sebastian Dangerfield wrote: »

I keep reading this, and yet I dont think anyone has put him down as a pro?

That is true. But I don’t think he’s been hit real heavy and clean.

Ortiz did get to him with a good shot, and he was very shaky for a little bit of time. Had Ortiz followed up more cleanly, Wilder was gone..

I reckon AJ knocks him clean out....

Providing, of course, that Wilder doesn’t knock him out first..

normanoffside

Lion Killer wrote: »

Apparently he was knocked down in his fight against Harold Sconiers but Wilder's team seem to have scrubbed every copy of the fight from the internet.

It mentions on on Boxrec

https://boxrec.com/en/event/607296

Sebastian Dangerfield

walshb wrote: »

That is true. But I don’t think he’s been hit real heavy and clean.

Ortiz did get to him with a good shot, and he was very shaky for a little bit of time. Had Ortiz followed up more cleanly, Wilder was gone..

I reckon AJ knocks him clean out....

Providing, of course, that Wilder doesn’t knock him out first..

I do think his style of movement can make him sometimes looks as though he has been buzzed more than he was. He's all arms and legs, I think it exaggerates the impact sometimes. He was definitely clipped by Ortiz, and I think even Breazele caught him in the first exchange but that one clearly didnt have too much effect on him...

walshb

Sebastian Dangerfield wrote: »

I do think his style of movement can make him sometimes looks as though he has been buzzed more than he was. He's all arms and legs, I think it exaggerates the impact sometimes. He was definitely clipped by Ortiz, and I think even Breazele caught him in the first exchange but that one clearly didnt have too much effect on him...

Exactly, his frame and awkwardness allow him to be very difficult to tag clean....so, very difficult to claim he has a good chin or a bad one.....I have a feeling he has a weak one, because of how he reacted to Ortiz...

Similar to some great defensive fighters who were never stopped. It's not until you see them hit hard and clean before you can assess the chin.

Floyd was one who was difficult to assess, but he did take some hard shots throughout his career, that showed us a good beard....

Sebastian Dangerfield

walshb wrote: »

Exactly, his frame and awkwardness allow him to be very difficult to tag clean....so, very difficult to claim he has a good chin or a bad one.....I have a feeling he has a weak one, because of how he reacted to Ortiz...

Similar to some great defensive fighters who were never stopped. It's not until you see them hit hard and clean before you can assess the chin.

Floyd was one who was difficult to assess, but he did take some hard shots throughout his career, that showed us a good beard....

Whereas RJJ....

walshb

Sebastian Dangerfield wrote: »

Whereas RJJ....

Funny, I was thinking of him, too...

His chin was not too bad. But, for a lot of his fights he was so fast and reflexive, that it was difficult to see a real whopper connecting clean

But, when his reflexes slowed down, his chin let him down....several times....

BTW, Floyd was badly hurt v Mosley, and had Shane had a better follow up....

Also, I think it was fight 1 vs Maidana where he was tagged with a right hand counter beside his corner and he was visibly stopped in his tracks, and very groggy looking. Bell saved him

Brock Turnpike

walshb wrote: »

Funny, I was thinking of him, too...

His chin was not too bad. But, for a lot of his fights he was so fast and reflexive, that it was difficult to see a real whopper connecting clean

But, when his reflexes slowed down, his chin let him down....several times....

BTW, Floyd was badly hurt v Mosley, and had Shane had a better follow up....

Also, I think it was fight 1 vs Maidana where he was tagged with a right hand counter beside his corner and he was visibly stopped in his tracks, and very groggy looking. Bell saved him

https://youtu.be/9ofeqQ_ljCk

normanoffside

walshb wrote: »

BTW, Floyd was badly hurt v Mosley, and had Shane had a better follow up....

Also, I think it was fight 1 vs Maidana where he was tagged with a right hand counter beside his corner and he was visibly stopped in his tracks, and very groggy looking. Bell saved him

What made Floyd so good was his composure when buzzed, he would grab, hold, take a knee, play dirty when necessary and he would recover quickly too.

I think he had a great chin, but more importantly he had great composure on the few occasions he was in trouble.

walshb

John Joe Nevin and Paddy Donovan boxing in the UK tonight.

JJNs bout is on channel 5. Starts at 9

Donovan is 1000-1 on. Don’t think I have ever seen odds that heavy...even Elvis you wouldn’t get those odds on him being alive and well..

JJN is 8-1 on against his best opponent to date..

Johnny Sausage

walshb wrote: »

John Joe Nevin and Paddy Donovan boxing in the UK tonight.

JJNs bout is on channel 5. Starts at 9

Donovan is 1000-1 on. Don’t think I have ever seen odds that heavy...even Elvis you wouldn’t get those odds on him being alive and well..

JJN is 8-1 on against his best opponent to date..

Pierce o'Leary fighting Chris Adaway on the same card as donovan, hes listed for the fight after Donovan

Big Ears

walshb wrote: »

John Joe Nevin and Paddy Donovan boxing in the UK tonight.

JJNs bout is on channel 5. Starts at 9

Donovan is 1000-1 on. Don’t think I have ever seen odds that heavy...even Elvis you wouldn’t get those odds on him being alive and well..

JJN is 8-1 on against his best opponent to date..

Strangely I think Dilmaghani (who's headlining) is on straight away when the coverage starts and Nevin follows him.

Biggest fight of Nevin pro career by a long way.
First semi-meaningdul fight and with tv coverage. A loss here and you wonder where he'll go. Win however and he could easily see more televised fights on Channel 5 and a chance to build himself into a World ranking and big fights.

Donovan looks like he has plenty of potential, will be interesting to follow.
Not show how far O'Leary will go, but he's going to be tremendously exciting whatever level he does get to.

walshb

Big Ears wrote: »

Strangely I think Dilmaghani (who's headlining) is on straight away when the coverage starts and Nevin follows him.

Biggest fight of Nevin pro career by a long way.
First semi-meaningdul fight and with tv coverage. A loss here and you wonder where he'll go. Win however and he could easily see more televised fights on Channel 5 and a chance to build himself into a World ranking and big fights.

Donovan looks like he has plenty of potential, will be interesting to follow.
Not show how far O'Leary will go, but he's going to be tremendously exciting whatever level he does get to.

Stuck here watching Strictly come effing dancing!😝

walshb

Watched fair bit of Paddy and Pierce in the stadium...

Both will need to get a lot busier if they are to go anywhere in the pro game...

Morrison J

Really looking forward to the McGregor-Farooq fight. Very difficult to call.

walshb

Stunning 1-2 from Nevin to drop Fonseca rd 2..

walshb

Opponent is so slow...

Hard to assess Nevin...Still that very basic amateur style..kind of disjointed.

Morrison J

Farooq is picking his punches so well. Winning most of these rounds for me.

selectamatic

walshb wrote: »

Opponent is so slow...

Hard to assess Nevin...Still that very basic amateur style..kind of disjointed.

Had some very nice spells of boxing from shot selection and delivery to head movement and footwork but also some periods of mundane sorta going through the motions stuff.

I really felt he could have applied some more effective pressure for the remainder of rd2 after the knockdown to see how well his opponent would react instead John Joe seemed content to see the round out at his ease. Kinda set the tone for the rest of the fight.

At present a faster and more relentless opponent will cause problems for him but I suppose it's hard know how much he and his output will progress with regular action.

Solid win all the same.

Morrison J

Farooq won that to my eyes pretty clearly. Judges swayed by majority of the crowd cheering McGregor's shots.

walshb

selectamatic wrote: »

Had some very nice spells of boxing from shot selection and delivery to head movement and footwork but also some periods of mundane sorta going through the motions stuff.

I really felt he could have applied some more effective pressure for the remainder of rd2 after the knockdown to see how well his opponent would react instead John Joe seemed content to see the round out at his ease. Kinda set the tone for the rest of the fight.

At present a faster and more relentless opponent will cause problems for him but I suppose it's hard know how much he and his output will progress with regular action.

Solid win all the same.

Good assessment. All about levels. If assessing him as an average run of the mill pro, it was a decent showing...

If assessing him as future world contender, then there is nothing I am seeing..

He seems to lack any kind of sustained offense and intensity. Happy to pot shot here and there and evade. That just won’t cut it against stronger opposition that press him and fire heavy artillery...

Big Ears

walshb wrote: »

Good assessment. All about levels. If assessing him as an average run of the mill pro, it was a decent showing...

If assessing him as future world contender, then there is nothing I am seeing..

He seems to lack any kind of sustained offense and intensity. Happy to pot shot here and there and evade. That just won’t cut it against stronger opposition that press him and fire heavy artillery...

I think you're both on the money there. Definitely not seeing someone who is going to go on and compete for World titles.

On the other hand, if you told me Nevin would of actually got to this stage 12 months ago I'd of been shocked. It seemed his career was going to peter out with long spells of inactivity and occasional untelevised bouts against journeymen where he performs poorly.
Perhaps culminating with a loss against this sort of opponent.
His pro career is definitely looking much more positive than it was !

Big Ears

This weekend coming sees James Tennyson take on Craig Evans in a very intriguing match up. Evans slick mover and can be hard to pin down, where as Tennyson as we know is a pressure fighter with murderous punching power.
A nice clash of styles and a win for Tennyson could see him into big fights, possibly moving back up to World level soon.

Eric Donovan also continues his career with a marking time fight in Glasgow. Due to the costs associated with running shoes in the Republic, Donovan has found fights hard to come by (and had one in the North cancelled). He's got plenty of ability and dedication to the game, but time is getty away from him.
His next fight is already scheduled, for February against Cristian Montilla (who once drew with former European champion Dennis Ceylan), so his is getting more active, but badly needs bigger fights !

walshb

Big Ears wrote: »

This weekend coming sees James Tennyson take on Craig Evans in a very intriguing match up. Evans slick mover and can be hard to pin down, where as Tennyson as we know is a pressure fighter with murderous punching power.
A nice clash of styles and a win for Tennyson could see him into big fights, possibly moving back up to World level soon.

Eric Donovan also continues his career with a marking time fight in Glasgow. Due to the costs associated with running shoes in the Republic, Donovan has found fights hard to come by (and had one in the North cancelled). He's got plenty of ability and dedication to the game, but time is getty away from him.
His next fight is already scheduled, for February against Cristian Montilla (who once drew with former European champion Dennis Ceylan), so his is getting more active, but badly needs bigger fights !

I am very surprised to see Tennyson such a heavy favorite at 6-1 on...

He can punch, but he is not murderous, as you describe.

undertaker fan 88

Another fight coming up on 11th January for spike o Sullivan in San Antonio against munguia in munguias first fight at 160

Big Ears

walshb wrote: »

I am very surprised to see Tennyson such a heavy favorite at 6-1 on...

He can punch, but he is not murderous, as you describe.

Okay odds that heavy is his favour are crazy.
However.....what you talking about Willis ?

Granted he's just moved up a weight, but pretty much anyone he catches clean has an 'oh ****' look on their face. Anyone he catches clean with semi-regularity ends up being counted out or rescued by the referee.....and normally early in a fight.

Ability wise he's domestic level. Punch resistance wise he's domestic level. But power wise Tennyson is absolutely World Class.

fitzparker

Floyd coming back 2020 :rolleyes::rolleyes:

walshb

Big Ears wrote: »

Okay odds that heavy is his favour are crazy.
However.....what you talking about Willis ?

Granted he's just moved up a weight, but pretty much anyone he catches clean has an 'oh ****' look on their face. Anyone he catches clean with semi-regularity ends up being counted out or rescued by the referee.....and normally early in a fight.

Ability wise he's domestic level. Punch resistance wise he's domestic level. But power wise Tennyson is absolutely World Class.

Well, he hasn't fought anyone apart from Farmer, who dominated him.

I Know he can punch. He is quite heavy handed. I agree...

I think your description is a bit exaggerated, that's all.

Big Ears

walshb wrote: »

Well, he hasn't fought anyone apart from Farmer, who dominated him.

I Know he can punch. He is quite heavy handed. I agree...

I think your description is a bit exaggerated, that's all.

Farmer is World class, and ability wise Tennyson is some way off that, that's why he was dominated. If he'd have been able to catch Farmer like he did guys at domestic level he'd have got him out of there imo.

Martin J Ward is fringe World level imo, and while getting dominated early it was the power that changed everything in that fight.
Same against Geraghty, but as lovely a boxer as Geraghty is he can't punch and can't hold a shot.

He's got some nice domestic level wins Ward, Doyle, Traynor, Geraghty, Hughes, Shafiq, but I understand what you're saying that he's not proved it much at a higher level.
I've seen him fight in person a couple of times (Traynor and Neale), and while Neale was completely unproven and has no power to keep Tennyson honest, you could feel the shots from outside the ring !

I think he'll struggle tomorrow night, but his power will turn the fight and see him through, and in time I'll be proven right.

walshb

Big Ears wrote: »

Farmer is World class, and ability wise Tennyson is some way off that, that's why he was dominated. If he'd have been able to catch Farmer like he did guys at domestic level he'd have got him out of there imo.

Martin J Ward is fringe World level imo, and while getting dominated early it was the power that changed everything in that fight.
Same against Geraghty, but as lovely a boxer as Geraghty is he can't punch and can't hold a shot.

He's got some nice domestic level wins Ward, Doyle, Traynor, Geraghty, Hughes, Shafiq, but I understand what you're saying that he's not proved it much at a higher level.
I've seen him fight in person a couple of times (Traynor and Neale), and while Neale was completely unproven and has no power to keep Tennyson honest, you could feel the shots from outside the ring !

I think he'll struggle tomorrow night, but his power will turn the fight and see him through, and in time I'll be proven right.

I get your point about skill wise and ability wise and who he has proved it against....

Yes, had he landed clean on Farmer he could have taken him out...

I have seen a few of Jame's fights....Maybe I need to re-watch.

Bobby Baccala

selectamatic wrote: »

Sneaking a decision won't be possible for Ortiz imo. All 3 judges had Wilder up on the cards before the stoppage in their first fight. And that was after Ortiz putting in a very very good effort for the early rounds.

If it goes the distance and is in any way close Wilder will get the decision. So for Ortiz to win a decision he'll have to school him. I can't see him doing that.

Wilder KO win, Ortiz KO win or Wilder decision; in that order of probability imo.

Ortiz decision is how it seemed to be going until Wilder planted him, I know it makes no sense but I still think Ortiz is the better boxer even if hes been knocked out twice. He brings a lot more to the table and maybe if he was 5 years younger he could have avoided the big right for the whole fight.