Aer Lingus Fleet Discusion

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Are EI going to get rid of their three A321's soon or will they replace them with A320's? They're getting a bit old these days compared to the rest of the fleet.

I was on EI-CPG last year and found it a very noisy and shakey. On the journey over I was on EI-DVM and the difference was astonishing.

L1011

They're owned outright rather than leased and I imagine stand EI nothing at this stage. Unless they keep going tech they'll probably hold on to them.

I've not been on one in years - and that was relieving BHX-DUB after a flight cancellation left more people than the next scheduled 320 could handle. Seem to remember reading something suggesting that none of them are really assigned to routes and are just placed as demand requires.

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MYOB wrote: »

They're owned outright rather than leased and I imagine stand EI nothing at this stage. Unless they keep going tech they'll probably hold on to them.

I've not been on one in years - and that was relieving BHX-DUB after a flight cancellation left more people than the next scheduled 320 could handle. Seem to remember reading something suggesting that none of them are really assigned to routes and are just placed as demand requires.

Well if they own them outright, I can't see them getting rid of them any time soon. The one I was on was an awful boneshaker, I hope I don't have the pleasure of flying on one again. Thank God EI have a top class maintenance program.

airbusa320

Due to fly on one in July to Faro.

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airbusa320 wrote: »

Due to fly on one in July to Faro.

Surely the schedule wouldn't tell you that already?

Plowman

This post has been deleted.

Preset No.3

The 'oldest' 321 is just over 14 years old. Not exactly old by aircraft standards.

Delta has a fleet of 170 MD-88/90s, which are about 26 years old and still flying. Their oldest A320 is almost 23 years old. The oldest 320 in United's fleet is almost 20 years old.

So if the aircraft is solid and maintained, I see no reason why EI could not hold on to those 321's for at least another 10 years.

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Preset No.3 wrote: »

The 'oldest' 321 is just over 14 years old. Not exactly old by aircraft standards.

Delta has a fleet of 170 MD-88/90s, which are about 26 years old and still flying. Their oldest A320 is almost 23 years old. The oldest 320 in United's fleet is almost 20 years old.

So that's Delta and united scratched off the list for me.

MuffinsDa

Flew on a A321 back from Amsterdam a few months ago, didn't notice any difference in conditions compared to outbound A320, apart from it taking longer to boards the passengers!

zone 1

if there profit making why get rid . plus aer lingus dont have any have any plane order apart from A350s. i think there good safe airline

Zonda999

Preset No.3 wrote: »

The 'oldest' 321 is just over 14 years old. Not exactly old by aircraft standards.

Delta has a fleet of 170 MD-88/90s, which are about 26 years old and still flying. Their oldest A320 is almost 23 years old. The oldest 320 in United's fleet is almost 20 years old.

So if the aircraft is solid and maintained, I see no reason why EI could not hold on to those 321's for at least another 10 years.

Exactly.

And as well remember, they sold off three slight older (all delivered to EI in 1998) A321's they had since 1998 to Ural Airlines about two years ago. These were EI-CPC, EI-CPD and EI-CPF They clearly thought the other three might come in handy so they'll hold on ti them as long as they see it is profitable for them to do so..

Have a look here:

http://www.airfleets.net/flottecie/Aer%20Lingus.htm

EDIT: Some interesting reading there. You'd tend to forget EI operated B734's until 2004 and B735's until 2006! Also never knew EI had B733QC's..

BuffyBot

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So that's Delta and united scratched off the list for me.

There are plenty of old aircraft out there. BA's oldest 747-400 is almost 24 years old. Age is pretty much irrelevant once they are maintained correctly.

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BuffyBot wrote: »

There are plenty of old aircraft out there. BA's oldest 747-400 is almost 24 years old. Age is pretty much irrelevant once they are maintained correctly.

I have just added BA 747's to my list, I will fly on their 777's.

Zonda999

BuffyBot wrote: »

There are plenty of old aircraft out there. BA's oldest 747-400 is almost 24 years old. Age is pretty much irrelevant once they are maintained correctly.

+1

Those oldest 747's in that fleet will probably be leaving soon enough though as the A380 arrives. I think I saw somewhere though that BA will be operating the newest of its 744's right up to 2020

L1011

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I have just added BA 747's to my list, I will fly on their 777's.

You might want to knock SAS, Aer Arann, Loganair and indeed probably half the airlines in Europe off your list too.

Ryanair (and indeed Aer Lingus) have given people an unrealistic idea of how soon aircraft need to be replaced.

A320

MYOB wrote: »

You might want to knock SAS, Aer Arann, Loganair and indeed probably half the airlines in Europe off your list too.

Ryanair (and indeed Aer Lingus) have given people an unrealistic idea of how soon aircraft need to be replaced.

True,some of SAS 737 CL are absolute buckets of sh1t,they are due to be replaced soon,even their NG's are now Classic!!

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MYOB wrote: »

You might want to knock SAS, Aer Arann, Loganair and indeed probably half the airlines in Europe off your list too.

Ryanair (and indeed Aer Lingus) have given people an unrealistic idea of how soon aircraft need to be replaced.

I would never fly Ryanair, not even if I was being tortured with electrodes on my balls. You can have an up to date fleet, but the fuel league should be banned by authorities. This is a disaster waiting to happen.

L1011

A320 wrote: »

True,some of SAS 737 CL are absolute buckets of sh1t,they are due to be replaced soon,even their NG's are now Classic!!

I was more thinking of the MD-8x. I was rather disappointed to find out that the one I flew on to CPH late last summer was actually younger than me. Barely.

Was like flying in the 1980s - except I only paid 98 quid for the ticket which is probably less in direct currency than it would has cost then, let alone real terms. Free newspaper (in Danish though) on boarding, free drinks, legroom, ashtrays in the arm rests...

Tenger

The A321's are very useful to EI (and indeed any other airline using A320 family)

They give the airline a little bit of flexibility in their scheduling. Finnair and TAP both have approx 50/30/20 split in their A320 familt with A320/A319/A321 variants.

Flight & cabin crew are trained on all, engineering is the same.

To go back to EI, they have 3. Obviously they plan out a schedule well in advance (Faro in July apparently) But lets say that Alicante or Madrid suddenly see a jump in demand, very easy to switch that particular flight to an A321, or on the other hand dropping a lower demand route to an A319.

So this summer EI will have 37 A319/320/321 family.......4/30/3

as well as 4 A320 operating for Virgin Atlantic.


As for calling them boneshakers.....I would disagree, Yes the cabin's are older and the aircraft themselves are an older generation A320 variant. (You can even see the subtle difference's between the EI A320's delivered in 2001, 2005 and 2010) But if aircraft are well maintained they can fly safely for several decades.

I read online the other day that a Lufty B7444 delivered in 1989 is being retired with 120K hours on the clock. (Thats 13 years airborne)

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Tenger wrote: »

The A321's are very useful to EI (and indeed any other airline using A320 family)

They give the airline a little bit of flexibility in their scheduling. Finnair and TAP both have approx 50/30/20 split in their A320 familt with A320/A319/A321 variants.

Flight & cabin crew are trained on all, engineering is the same.

To go back to EI, they have 3. Obviously they plan out a schedule well in advance (Faro in July apparently) But lets say that Alicante or Madrid suddenly see a jump in demand, very easy to switch that particular flight to an A321, or on the other hand dropping a lower demand route to an A319.

So this summer EI will have 37 A319/320/321 family.......4/30/3

as well as 4 A320 operating for Virgin Atlantic.


As for calling them boneshakers.....I would disagree, Yes the cabin's are older and the aircraft themselves are an older generation A320 variant. (You can even see the subtle difference's between the EI A320's delivered in 2001, 2005 and 2010) But if aircraft are well maintained they can fly safely for several decades.

I read online the other day that a Lufty B7444 delivered in 1989 is being retired with 500K hours on the clock. (Thats 13 years airborne)

You are a wealth of knowledge Tenger, I did notice a difference between DVM and CPG, mainly the engines at takeoff were very loud until we reached cruising altitude on the A321.

orionm_73

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I was on EI-CPG last year and found it a very noisy and shakey. On the journey over I was on EI-DVM and the difference was astonishing.

Perhaps the shakiness was more to do with the condition of the runway rather than the age of the A321. The cabins were refitted a few years ago with the now standard leather seats and the galley @ door 2 right taken out.

donvito99

orionm_73 wrote: »

Perhaps the shakiness was more to do with the condition of the runway rather than the age of the A321. The cabins were refitted a few years ago with the now standard leather seats and the galley @ door 2 right taken out.

Surely the galley has been removed more than a few years!

EchoIndia

Tenger wrote: »

I read online the other day that a Lufty B7444 delivered in 1989 is being retired with 500K hours on the clock. (Thats 13 years airborne)

I read the same discussion and the LH B744s are being retired at about the 120k hours mark. The maximum service life for the 747-400 is 165k hours.

CaptainSkidmark

Sorry, had to laugh at CPG, the Cork people will know

Preset No.3

Lads, lets not feed the troll!

NewSigGuy

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You are a wealth of knowledge Tenger, I did notice a difference between DVM and CPG, mainly the engines at takeoff were very loud until we reached cruising altitude on the A321.

DVM is a 320 and CPG is a 321, they have different thrust ratings on the engines(27000Lbs V 32000Lbs iirc) due to the aircrafts Takeoff weight, this might explain the difference in noise, also DVM is a new gen 320 and has better noise insulation.

zone 1

jet 2 are another airline with old fleet of 737 and doing the job fine. buffalo airlines now thats a old fleet of planes..

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NewSigGuy wrote: »

DVM is a 320 and CPG is a 321, they have different thrust ratings on the engines(27000Lbs V 32000Lbs iirc) due to the aircrafts Takeoff weight, this might explain the difference in noise, also DVM is a new gen 320 and has better noise insulation.

That's probably why I thought DVM was a lot smoother than CPG.

Tenger

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That's probably why I thought DVM was a lot smoother than CPG.

But it shows you the difference between earlier gen and latest aircraft. DVM was delivered in 2011, CPG in 1999. Airbus are evolving the A320 to keep it attractive to airlines.

pclancy

In comparison...

Air New Zealand's stats

Boeing 737 13 14.8 years
Boeing 747 2 17.9 years
Boeing 767 5 17.2 years

Age doesnt matter once they're well maintained. Man the 737-300s get a slamming at Wellington.

globemaster1986

Some of the posters on here are hysterical! Age has nothing to do with safety once the aircraft is well maintained! To the poster who mentioned Delta, you neglected to mention they still operate a fleet of 18 DC-9-50s!!!

http://www.delta.com/content/www/en_US/traveling-with-us/airports-and-aircraft/Aircraft/mcdonnell-douglas-dc9-50.html

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Delta-Air-Lines/McDonnell-Douglas-DC-9-51/2219556/L/&sid=cd3d637f9eeef5f03170d8d744294aae

http://www.planespotters.net/Production_List/McDonnell-Douglas/DC-9/operator.php

The oldest of these is over 37 years old and they still operate safely day in day out on domestic services for Delta. Had the pleasure to fly on one just last summer, fantastic aircraft! The sound of those JT8Ds is epic:D

martinsvi

I flew EI A321 last year, flight was very nice, didn't notice any signs of age or anything.

Strumms

I had the pleasure of travelling on EI a few times last year. Down to Nice a handful of times and once to Amsterdam. Certainly last year it appeared that during the summer months that the 321s were a daily feature on the Nice route.

I Found the aircraft very well maintained as in the cabin, not looking at all shabby. Got used to booking Seat 10A with all that nice extra legroom which made the trip a little more comfy.

keroseneboy

Best username ever wrote: »

You are a wealth of knowledge Tenger, I did notice a difference between DVM and CPG, mainly the engines at takeoff were very loud until we reached cruising altitude on the A321.

Even though the engines are the same CFM56/5B on the A320 and 321, the fuel systems are not making the A321 thrust ratings higher than it's little sister.

Chemical Burn

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Are EI going to get rid of their three A321's soon or will they replace them with A320's? They're getting a bit old these days compared to the rest of the fleet.

I was on EI-CPG last year and found it a very noisy and shakey. On the journey over I was on EI-DVM and the difference was astonishing.

What route do they normally operate the 321's on OP?

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Chemical Burn wrote: »

What route do they normally operate the 321's on OP?

That particular journey was to PMI on DVM and I returned on CPG.

airbusa320

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Surely the schedule wouldn't tell you that already?

I booked the flight before the Christmas and on the website when you click on the flight number it is listed as A321 equipment

kona

keroseneboy wrote: »

Even though the engines are the same CFM56/5B on the A320 and 321, the fuel systems are not making the A321 thrust ratings higher than it's little sister.

It's a matter of reprogramming the fadec. The actual engines are the same, the limits just change.

munchkin_utd

Chemical Burn wrote: »

What route do they normally operate the 321's on OP?

its a good question!
A few years back they had the A321 on the Munich run around christmas time but I drove the last 2 time so cant say if its still what they do.
At this stage the frequency to Munich has increased enough that maybe its no longer needed.

IIRC it was a single flight 5 or 6 days a week which has been cranked up to 2 flights a day apart from Sat and Tues(only 1 flight) which is double the previous capacity (and maybe meaning there'll be no sighting of the A321 on that route any more?)

Stinicker

Do EI still operate the A330 to Spain when they get heavy loads or were they only ran to relieve cancellations etc? Are all the A330's utilised in TranATL now, because I remember reading last year somewhere that an A330 would come in from the states very early, deplane and then do a run to Malaga or somewhere before returning to Dublin for a night flight to the US?

MuffinsDa

Chemical Burn wrote: »

What route do they normally operate the 321's on OP?

DUB/AMS occasionally, I think. At least I've been on it twice on that route during the past 9 months.

Preset No.3

Stinicker wrote: »

Do EI still operate the A330 to Spain when they get heavy loads or were they only ran to relieve cancellations etc? Are all the A330's utilised in TranATL now, because I remember reading last year somewhere that an A330 would come in from the states very early, deplane and then do a run to Malaga or somewhere before returning to Dublin for a night flight to the US?

During the summer schedule, the aircraft that did the BOS or JFK - DUB which got in around 0500, would be turned around for the 0730 flight to AGP. On its return, it would operate the 2nd flight to JFK (109) which would depart at 1530.

Nortcider

Chemical Burn wrote: »

What route do they normally operate the 321's on OP?

Been to Dubrovnik a few times and it was always a 321.

Claiomh

In case anyone's interested, an EI 321 is operating the flight to Berlin tomorrow at 17.00- Due to a security personnel strike at Hamburg (where I'm to be going!), they have offered a free rebooking or the flight to Berlin and a bus onwards. Looking forward to getting onto one of these again- its been a long time!

Dr.Rieux

Claiomh wrote: »

In case anyone's interested, an EI 321 is operating the flight to Berlin tomorrow at 17.00- Due to a security personnel strike at Hamburg (where I'm to be going!), they have offered a free rebooking or the flight to Berlin and a bus onwards. Looking forward to getting onto one of these again- its been a long time!

I went to Berlin for a weekend at the start of December. Went out on the Saturday on a 320 and home Sunday evening on a 321. It's a much nicer looking aircraft I think

keroseneboy

Aer Lingus use an A321 quite a bit on the Nice route(I seem to remember flying on EI-CPH). In 2006 they even had an A330...

donvito99

-CPG is arriving from MAN, so they do get out and about.

I do hope we see an A321neo heading EIs way in the future.

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donvito99 wrote: »

-CPG is arriving from MAN, so they do get out and about.

I do hope we see an A321neo heading EIs way in the future.

An A321 with sharklets would look fantastic.

donvito99

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An A321 with sharklets would look fantastic.

http://www.airliners.net/search/photo.search?cx=partner-pub-8297169501225184%3Aa05n2n-tzky&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=a321+sharklet&sa=Submit&search_active=1&search=&sheadline=&search_field=datedesc&submit=&siteurl=www.airliners.net%2F&ref=&ss=5307j4937787j13

You are correct.

zone 1

why is it only now that Airbus are putting sharklets on there planes is it a design thing ? . fuel ? whats on all Airbus wingtips at the moment called and what function have they? i think it started with the A300..

Suasdaguna1

donvito99 wrote: »

I do hope we see an A321neo heading EIs way in the future.