The Raid 2

TerrorFirmer

Saw it yesterday, very good film though it could have easily been quite a lot shorter than it was. I have to say the Raid was a better film, if only because it was tighter and more comfortable in what it was. But as sequels go, it was good with exceptionally well done action sequences.

The Black Oil

In Gareth Evans We Trust, Part Deux.

Having recently watched Donnie Brasco, it was hard not to notice some similarities - domestic and investigatory, organisational structure, trust issues, the ambitious, hotheaded son, etc.

One of the things about Raid I was that the violence was largely floor-by-floor, giving the film a certain energy. Here, it's spread across a number of locations - starting post-title with a zombie like brawl followed by wall practice, which is both intense and powerful. In between these moments through the rest of the film we see Evans's visual eye pause for snow, liquid. Well, there's that and the character stuff. And let's just call Mr. Slick Combover that because... The mud fight seemed like fun, though I think enjoyed all the non-verbal cues in the build up to it, to light the fuse. But it seemed like they took maximum advantage of, well, dirt on the ground, basically. Hammer Girl, well, I felt she lacked any real charisma. I'm putting that on the actress as much as anything else, which is perhaps a little unfair. In general, the violence is savage. Evans and co. deserve credit for not overly rehashing the content and design of martial arts on display, bananas though it may be, at times. Oh, and that kitchen fight...yeah. I liked that the nemesis wasn't a younger guy. Things had started to build nicely towards this point and what came after.

As with the first film, there is a but, and here it's largely with the first half or more, which I'll admit was a bit of slog (as per johnny_ultimate's comments).

Now, what the feck are they going to do with 3?

johnny_ultimate

To add a positive observation - since, despite my negativity, there's a whole lot to admire the heck out of here - I think my favourite moment in the whole film was during the penultimate duel.

Our two brawlers, each exhausted and injured, pause in the middle of the fight and silently stare at each other for some incredibly exciting moments before commencing their fight to the death

. It's the type of economic, exhilarating tension building Evans excels at, and the whole extended battle feels so much more immense because of those few moments where not a single punch is thrown, and you really feel the gruelling physical and emotional exhaustion without a word being said.

The Black Oil

One thing that went over my head - what was the significance of

the wrist tattoo?

Looper007

The Black Oil wrote: »

One thing that went over my head - what was the significance of

the wrist tattoo?

Hope this helps

Uco notices Bejo’s tornado tattoo, the same one Bemi (the guy who UCO cut his throat) had on his wrist. Uco realizes Bejo tried to have him killed in prison and probably plans to have him killed after their alliance is no longer usefu

The Black Oil

Aye, I got that. But, did the symbol itself have some sort of cultural meaning or something we were meant to pick up on? Guess not.

Looper007

The Black Oil wrote: »

Aye, I got that. But, did the symbol itself have some sort of cultural meaning or something we were meant to pick up on? Guess not.

probably a gang sign Oil.

Icaras

Went to see it last night. In the UK and just after the kitchen fight a guy comes in and says a fire alarm has gone off so we have to evacuate. We asked him was there a fire and the says no but we have to evacuate anyway. I know it was near the end and only about 10mins left but fecking brits and their health and safety!!!
Still got free tickets to see it again and its a great film, better than the first for me but did drag in places.

Potential-Monke

Finally got to see it (Mahon Point), and i'm still reveling in it's awesome! Granted, it took a while to really get going, and the shaky cam in the mud scene irked me slightly, but my God that last half hour or so was just intense! Starting with the

police attacking Rama in the taxi, and yer man getting bent in two when the taxi crashes

, to the car chase, and the epic fight heading towards the kitchen, including the amazing set piece with Baseball Bat Boy and Hammer Girl,

wedging the bat into Baseball Bat Boys face was unbelievable, and got chuckles of amazement from the cinema

, and the final "boss" fight was nail biting stuff, followed by the

brutal end piece - i don't think some people expected the shotgun to the head bit

, it was just an amazing action flick.

While i wish i could give it a perfect score, the plot, coupled with some fairly bad acting, does detract from the overall experience, but it is still my favourite hand-to-hand fight movie to date, surpassing the original and Ong-Bak for sheer brutality.

Marty McFly

I don't get the love for Ong Bak at all yea it had some good action sequences but overall it's a terrible film imo. There are far better films out there.

unreggd

Marty McFly wrote: »

I don't get the love for Ong Bak at all yea it had some good action sequences but overall it's a terrible film imo. There are far better films out there.

Jk. What films do you consider far better?

Marty McFly

unreggd wrote: »

Jk. What films do you consider far better?

As I said earlier in the thread the first two that spring to mind would be Ip Man 1 & 2 The Donnie Yen ones and Chocolate be the first two that spring to mind for now.

Looper007

Marty McFly wrote: »

As I said earlier in the thread the first two that spring to mind would be Ip Man 1 & 2 The Donnie Yen ones and Chocolate be the first two that spring to mind for now.

get off the boat, The Raid films are far better films, Ip man are enjoyable but they ain't genre making movies. The Raid films have changed the way people look at action movies. The films you mentioned haven't touched the surface like the Raid films have.

Marty McFly

Looper007 wrote: »

get off the boat, The Raid films are far better films, Ip man are enjoyable but they ain't genre making movies. The Raid films have changed the way people look at action movies. The films you mentioned haven't touched the surface like the Raid films have.

I was talking about Ong Bak not the Raid films ;).

Ash.J.Williams

Looper007 wrote: »

probably a gang sign Oil.

Could be something from Raid 3. He has said raid 3 is a tangent to raid 2 and that piece seemed unfinished to me.

Finally got to see this earlier today and I loved every minute of it. It's a film very much in search of an identity and as such it's easy to understand why so many people were disappointed by it.

The film is two very distinct and separate entities that never quite gel. On one hand we have what amounts to a somewhat generic Takeshi Kitano imitation that takes a long time to go nowhere of any note. There appears to be quite a lot of plot but really you could jot it all down on the back of a napkin and still have plenty of space. The sprawling crime story is one that's been done so often that it's almost impossible to offer anything new and as such large parts of the film felt like little more than a best off album. There's shades of the Godfather, Goodfellas, Donnie Brasco, Casino, Hana Bi, Sonatine, the entire filmography of Johnnie To and far too many others to note. The film desperately wants to be an epic, slow burning crime thriller but the disjointed, drawn out and odd pacing really hamper it.

I'm hoping that the third film will help expand a little on the plot and fill in the gaps. The rumors are that it will run concurrently with part 2 so I'd expect to see more of Goto, Hammer Girl and a hell of a lot of Prakoso who was built up only for nothing to come of it. I think that this is one of those films which we may come back and reevaluate once the series is over.

Now onto the important stuff. The Raid is the most visceral, gleefully violent and exhilarating piece of action cinema of the past decade it not three. It was a film that knew exactly what it wanted to do and delivered in spades. The Raid 2 may be in search of an identity but the action is superb. The claustrophobic, cramped fights of the original give way to large sprawling free for alls that put pretty much every other action film to shame. The opening set piece in the bathroom feels like a knowing nod to the original but once we get into the mud the action really opens up. There's a brutality to each of the fights that's unmatched, yet it's never reveled in. The violence is unflinchingly grotesque but has its tongue planted firmly in cheek. There's never a sense that it's cheap titalliation or that Evans wants the viewer to be turned on by it. It's ugly yet it's played just right. A lot has been said about how the film glorifies etreme violence or that it's offensive, but personally I find the violence in shows such as C.S.I. and Criminal Minds to far more offensive.

It's been awhile since a film has had me on the edge of my seat, something that Raid 2 managed every 15 or so minutes. The final third is an extraordinary work of art and the car chase is one of the all time greats. The simplicity of it manages to impress far more than any CGI heavy spectacle could. That it's followed by two of the greatest fight scenes ever show is a joy, the hallway fight is one which will go down in cinema history and then Evans one ups himself moments later with that kitchen set piece which is literally breathtaking. It's uncompromising, kinetic and in a few short minutes packs more of a punch than most manage with 9 minutes. And then he goes and delivers one of the simplest shoot outs in years, one that once again demonstrates that less is more.

The Raid 2 has it's share of problems but it's a film that can't really be judged till all the pieces are in place. Hopefully the third film will offer some context to the story and expand upon it in a way that makes it into more than just a Kitano knock off. As it stands, taken on it's own merits part 2 is somewhat of a disappointment but the action more than makes up for any dramatic shortcomings. It's 2 and a half hours of gleeful violence that will put a smile on your face and leave you hungry for more. I know that my first question upon leaving the cinema was to ask if the film would still be playing net week as I want to see it on the big screen again.

Banjaxed82

Breath-taking action sequences. Unfortunately, more often than not, the bits in between; namely not really caring a jot for anyone in the film, the endless conversations and the overall episodic nature of the film had me restless.

If Gareth Evans can hook up with a writer who can fashion a screenplay that's even half as good as Evans ability to direct action (and assuming Evans can hang on to creative control) then there's a genuine action classic in the pipeline.

adamski8

What an awesome film, better than raid 1, no probably not, more drawn out with a plot that doesnt quite do it but the fighting and suspence etc is unrivalled. I loved both raids and wish i could see #1 again on the big screen.

bad2dabone

What A Movie.

I saw it last night. Walked out of it thinking, "well, that was the most violent movie I have ever seen".

But I wasn't disgusted by it, which, to be perfectly honest, I could well have been - there were some extremely horrible and violent scenes. There's some admirable about that, when you think about it.

What I also thought was great was that among the violence and the gore, there were some touching moments and even some genuinely laugh out loud ones. Heck, you even had to laugh at some of the uber-gore.

You could also tell that he had a much more ramped up budget - in the Raid, we had just one location for the most part, which he worked extremely well with. In the Raid 2, we have multiple vast locations and even some of the most intense and well-choreographed car chase scenes of most movies in the past decade. It's amazing to think that the budget he had to work with was probably still a drop in the ocean compared to what most Hollywood movies have.

Gareth Evans, a Welsh person making these superb movies in Indonesia, has really given Hollywood a go for its money - I cannot wait to see the Raid 3.

fitz

Saw it the other night, and while I thoroughly enjoyed it, I though some of the gore was a step too far, like it was trying to hard to take things up a notch from the first one. I liked the expanded scope, but I felt it didn't need to use as much of the nastier gore as it did. One of the main strengths of the first movie, and this, is the beauty of the choreography. The first movie made you really feel al the contract, there isn't a need to make you flinch by focusing in on showing some of the horrible injuries. There's a balance to be struck, and I thought this was a hair the wrong side of it at times.

Still, great movie, and look forward to a third...
Having said that, if the finished it there I wouldn't be disappointed.

SherlockWatson

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I saw it last night. Walked out of it thinking, "well, that was the most violent movie I have ever seen".

But I wasn't disgusted by it, which, to be perfectly honest, I could well have been - there were some extremely horrible and violent scenes. There's some admirable about that, when you think about it.

What I also thought was great was that among the violence and the gore, there were some touching moments and even some genuinely laugh out loud ones. Heck, you even had to laugh at some of the uber-gore.

You could also tell that he had a much more ramped up budget - in the Raid, we had just one location for the most part, which he worked extremely well with. In the Raid 2, we have multiple vast locations and even some of the most intense and well-choreographed car chase scenes of most movies in the past decade. It's amazing to think that the budget he had to work with was probably still a drop in the ocean compared to what most Hollywood movies have.

Gareth Evans, a Welsh person making these superb movies in Indonesia, has really given Hollywood a go for its money - I cannot wait to see the Raid 3.

Think the budget for the second is 4.1m and the budget for the first is 1.1m or something like that, crazy stuff!

Marty McFly

SherlockWatson wrote: »

Think the budget for the second is 4.1m and the budget for the first is 1.1m or something like that, crazy stuff!

Thatis crazy how much has each film grossed?

SherlockWatson

Marty McFly wrote: »

Thatis crazy how much has each film grossed?

Not sure on the second, but Afair the money from the first covered the budget of both movies!

S.M.B.

The sequel is not performing well at all.

Worldwide box office figures look to be on a par with production costs and I doubt it'll bring in too much more in the coming weeks.

Has anyone come across any decent article with a breakdown of where revenue comes from in this day and age?

S.M.B.

S.M.B. wrote: »

The sequel is not performing well at all.

Worldwide box office figures look to be on a par with production costs and I doubt it'll bring in too much more in the coming weeks.

Has anyone come across any decent article with a breakdown of where revenue comes from in this day and age?

DVD and Blu-Ray sales are where this will make money. It's a low budget film with a small marketing campaign that no one ever expected to light up the box office. Considering the limited release it's doing really well and should be in profit before it leaves cinemas which leaves it nicely set up to do well on the home market.

QikBax

Forbes - Raid 2 bombed but deserves praise

S.M.B.

Deleted User wrote: »

DVD and Blu-Ray sales are where this will make money. It's a low budget film with a small marketing campaign that no one ever expected to light up the box office. Considering the limited release it's doing really well and should be in profit before it leaves cinemas which leaves it nicely set up to do well on the home market.

not really though, it's doing pretty poorly

it has also expanded in the states and failed miserably to gain some traction

but if dvd sales and netflix licencing is where they will make the bulk of their money then it's not an issue

i'm guessing there are studio folk unhappy with its current performance though

Ash.J.Williams

S.M.B. wrote: »

not really though, it's doing pretty poorly

it has also expanded in the states and failed miserably to gain some traction

but if dvd sales and netflix licencing is where they will make the bulk of their money then it's not an issue

i'm guessing there are studio folk unhappy with its current performance though

the article seems to be taking the angle that a major distributor released the movie statewide because it's a great movie, knowing it's audience...kinda misleading saying it bombed.

Fysh

Deleted User wrote: »

DVD and Blu-Ray sales are where this will make money. It's a low budget film with a small marketing campaign that no one ever expected to light up the box office. Considering the limited release it's doing really well and should be in profit before it leaves cinemas which leaves it nicely set up to do well on the home market.

+1 - it's a foreign-language R-rated action film, and while I do think that the action sequences are unlikely to be topped for the rest of the year (or at least not by anything released by an anglophone studio), that was never going to be an easy sell. Which is a pity, because I'd bet that anyone who enjoys action fare like Brick Mansions would find a lot to enjoy in TR2 if they gave it a chance.

In saying that, though, I've yet to meet anyone to whom I've recommended The Raid who didn't enjoy it, and I'd imagine that has translated into steady sales on DVD & Blu-Ray. So if they've been smart with TR2 the same will hold true. A budget of $5M is still conservative by contemporary film standards, and if it's covered its production costs by the time it hits home release it'll be a nice earner for the next few years.