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New campaign 'Don't be that guy' - how effective will it really be?
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mariaalice wrote: »There in lies the rub....you cant be a rapist and an average decent guy who made a mistake. It has to be one or the other, if that were the case you are making judgement about behaviour including the woman behaviour you are taking a nuanced view of the situation.
In a way I agreer with you it is a very had one to call, sometimes people do things when they are young/teenagers that they would never do as an adult with an adults brain and mature understanding of the world.
What can be just a mistake for man can have devastating life long consequences for a woman.
Sorry but I disagree. I would imagine there are a lot of decent guys who get too drunk and make poor decisions that wouldn't typically come to mind when you think of 'rape'. As has been said before, there are less black and white situations.
What if the man is so drunk he doesn't realise the girl is trying to say no (I know there's occassions where I've got so drunk I can barely speak so a woman could be trying to say no but physically not able to move or speak)? What if the man is so drunk he doesn't realise the girl is passed out? What if the girl is extremely drunk and the man relatively sober but the woman appears to be ok (as has been said before a lot of people appear to be relatively sober but are so drunk they remember nothing from the night).runawaybishop wrote: »That is an excuse though
"I had drink taken and she didnt refuse me before she passed out" <-- rape. No two ways about it. Sometimes stuff really is black and white.
Well, that is a very black and white situation you gave. What about the examples I gave above?runawaybishop wrote: »Who could possibly think that isn't rape? Like, really and truly believe it was grand?
If you've read the thread you will see there are many.captainpants23 wrote: »The underlying assumption of this ad campaign is that ALL men are potential rapists or sex offenders. I find that deeply offensive, as a male. Also, the idea that a genuine sexual predator is going to change his behaviour because of a misandrist advertising campaign seems hopelessly naive.
HOW is it assuming all men are potential rapists?
Is an ad promoting drinking responsibly assuming everyone who drinks alcohol irresponsible?
Is an ad about speeding or drink driving saying all drivers are like that?0 -
Join Date:Posts: 25439
Years and years ago, drink driving meant the auld lad that had seventeen pints and a few whiskeys and meandered his way home in his car. Having 2 or 3 drinks and driving was considered being the designated driver.
Indeed when I first started to drive, having "one for the road" was common. If you refused a pint, a shot was offered I was deeply uncomfortable with consuming any alcohol while driving as firstly a fatality in the family caused by a drunk driver was at the forefront of my mind at all times, and also, I could never be sure if I was over the limit even marginally or not.
Many occasions I would have 3 pints of lager lined up in front of me, bought by the passengers who got miffed when I wouldn't drink them, and they still thought I would have been sober enough to get them home safely.
These days, thanks to high profile campaigns, social change has happened. We no longer insist designated drivers have a drink, or have another, in fact its common to see friends taking the keys off someone who intended to drive. Its become uncool to drink and drive. There ARE still drink drivers of course, but the nice, well rounded individuals now recognise that being over the limit is not worth the fall-out should they get in an accident, or pulled over by the Gardai. They know where the line into illegality is drawn now, and so do the group they are drinking with. This needs to happen with rape.
I've seen groups of guys think its hilarious to see their mate "cop off" with the comatose girl, and they need to see its not funny, its rape. If this campaign raises awareness so that even one guy in a group recognises that their friend is straying into a rape situation and says "mate, I think she is too drunk, better not go there", or steps in to prevent another friend from dragging said girl to a bathroom or bedroom because they recognise it as rape, its a step in the right direction.0 -
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It's the study's definitions. Did you read it? It's not my definition. These were clearly defined acts of rape.
ETA: This is the very clear definition:
2) Have you ever had sexual intercourse with someone who did not want you to because they were too intoxicated to resist?
There's no grey area there. That's rape.
ETA 2: The girl in that ad campaign is visibly too drunk to give consent. I don't see the message of the ad being in any way "muddled".
Like I said, I'm not having a go. But what you've quoted there isn't the same as what you ended up translating it into in your post, i.e. that "having sex with someone while drunk is rape".
They're your words, not mine, nor the reports for that matter. I'm simply saying that that needs to be clarified. In a campaign for raising awareness...that matters.
I don't dispute the definition you gave in that post, nor would I have if it was what you said to begin with. We're on the same team here, relax.
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Like I said, I'm not having a go. But what you've quoted there isn't the same as what you ended up translating it into in your post, i.e. that "having sex with someone while drunk is rape".
They're your words, not mine, nor the reports for that matter. I'm simply saying that that needs to be clarified. In a campaign for raising awareness...that matters.
I don't dispute the definition you gave in that post, nor would I have if it was what you said to begin with. We're on the same team here, relax.
Sorry. I've been in a few of these threads and it's happened in just about all of them that people try to downplay the seriousness of the subject by throwing things off track with pedantry.
I shouldn't have assumed that of you; these threads just make me a bit defensive sometimes.0 -
Sorry. I've been in a few of these threads and it's happened in just about all of them that people try to downplay the seriousness of the subject by throwing things off track with pedantry.
I shouldn't have assumed that of you; these threads just make me a bit defensive sometimes.
Not at all, I can see why it might seem that way. I would never try and downplay or detract from the seriousness of the issue, though. All good! 0 -
captainpants23 wrote: »The phrase "Don't be that guy" addresses all men, without subtlety, nuance or qualification. It assumes that all men need to heed its message. I find the ad campaigns of Drink Aware and the RSA similarly hectoring, confrontational and unsubtle. (I don't drink alcohol and I cycle rather than drive, but I still feel like they are addressing me.) And for an advertising campaign to be effective, the perception of the target audience is very important.
So you're admitting the RSA ads are similar in that retrospect and that you don't like them either?
Yet the RSA ads have likely contributed significantly to the decrease in accidents on our roads over the last few years?
Just shows that they can be effective.
"Don't be that guy" doesn't address all men. It addresses specific men who are thinking that what they're doing is ok and it's trying to change their perceptions. 0 -
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