Is anyone else worried about Saturday's loyalist protest?

RobbingBandit

WileyCoyote wrote: »

Well in the first instance it could be argued that they are citizens of this country.
I dont see how it can be stopped, personally I'm not worried about the loyalists , but I am very worried about the so called "republican" rent a mob who will use this as an excuse to riot and loot.

The sad thing here is the Loyalists will use the republican idiots as an excuse to start major trouble up north again,keep out of town on Saturday is a good plan for this.

20Cent

I predict about 20 "loyalists" surrounded by 200 Gardai and journalists shuffling towards the Dail. Counter protesters not allowed anywhere near them. They'll say their bit outside then be marched back to their mini bus and feck off home an hour at most.

junder

20Cent wrote: »

I predict about 20 "loyalists" surrounded by 200 Gardai and journalists shuffling towards the Dail. Counter protesters not allowed anywhere near them. They'll say their bit outside then be marched back to their mini bus and feck off home an hour at most.

I think your pretty much on the money there. Personnly I think the reasoning behind this protest is flawed and will achieve nothing

Sin City

Dont they realise that we fly the German flag here these days?

loveboat captain

It depends if you get the real protestors or the rent a mob lot who are causing the bother. There are some proper protestors, who have been doing things peacefully. Then you have the louts who are using this as an excuse to bring bother back to the country. I should stress I dont agree with the reason behind the protest, however, everyone is entitled to protest if they feel the need to. It just baffles me that in a time when the whole world is going tits up these idiots decide to protest over a piece of cloth that they probably didnt even know flew over city hall. Surely there are better things to protest about like the health cuts? Cuts to policing budgets? Cuts to benefits? Cuts to all public services? XFactor still being inflicted on us every year?

Incidentally, if you get the louts down I hope the Gardai deal with them in the appropriate manner. Throwing them into The Liffey while wearing concrete boots would suffice

flutered

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

I was joking! I most duly apologize for any offense caused, I also draw you to my signature where I have a pre-written disclaimer

thank you, i never look at sigs, but is not a per written disclamier an easy opt out clause, not saying so in your case, but is it not an easy escape/ opt out clause.

enda1

flutered wrote: »

thank you, i never look at sigs, but is not a per written disclamier an easy opt out clause, not saying so in your case, but is it not an easy escape/ opt out clause.

Likewise. I have sigs and avatars blocked.

I've no problem with the loyalists having a peaceful protest. Let them at it and I respect their right to protest. They should also however respect our right to ignore them as I hope our democratically elected parliament chose to do, thus reflecting public opinion.

touts

The loyalists didn't riot last time. Most of the rioters were wearing celtic shirts and struck a blow for Irish freedom by looting shops such as foot locker. It was an excuse by a few scumbags for a fight and a new pair of runners.

gallag

loveboat captain wrote: »

XFactor still being inflicted on us every year?

This is the real scourge on us, as a unionist I would forget queen and County and wrap myself in a tricolour if sinn fein promised to rid us of it. Some things are just to dam important! !

enda1

touts wrote: »

The loyalists didn't riot last time. Most of the rioters were wearing celtic shirts and struck a blow for Irish freedom by looting shops such as foot locker. It was an excuse by a few scumbags for a fight and a new pair of runners.

Sounds much like the London riots of 2011. Perhaps its time to microtag soccer jerseys and reeboks. Correlate the swarm maps to crime records. Would make some interesting reading.

sheesh

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Pre-emptively stifling free speech because of a hypothetical scenario of what consequences might happen is a very big step on the slippery slope to oppression...

the citizens of a country have a right to free speech and peaceful protest these people are citizens of the UK and are coming to the Republic to protest about the actions of their own government in Northern Ireland.

I do not need to point out (but I'm going to) the fact that they are loyalist means that they do not see themselves as part of the republic of ireland in any way.

Finally, this group protests have resulted in riots in Belfast. it is not much of a stretch to say that the same will happen in Diublin.

enda1

sheesh wrote: »

the citizens of a country have a right to free speech and peaceful protest these people are citizens of the UK and are coming to the Republic to protest about the actions of their own government in Northern Ireland.

I do not need to point out (but I'm going to) the fact that they are loyalist means that they do not see themselves as part of the republic of ireland in any way.

Finally, this group protests have resulted in riots in Belfast. it is not much of a stretch to say that the same will happen in Diublin.

All NI born people have the right to Irish citizenship. This country recognises them even if they don't want citizenship from us. And there is no way of knowing if they actually have Irish citizenship or not. So its really a moot point that you're making.

sheesh

enda1 wrote: »

All NI born people have the right to Irish citizenship. This country recognises them even if they don't want citizenship from us. And there is no way of knowing if they actually have Irish citizenship or not. So its really a moot point that you're making.

Are you suggesting that all the people from the loyalist protests in northern ireland are in fact republic of ireland citizens.

I know that these people have the right to be citizens of the irish republic that does not make them Irish citizens.

my point about UK citizens coming here to protest here about the actions of their own government is valid I think.

nemesisdg

enda1 wrote: »

All NI born people have the right to Irish citizenship. This country recognises them even if they don't want citizenship from us. And there is no way of knowing if they actually have Irish citizenship or not. So its really a moot point that you're making.

I'm not sure I agree Enda1. I think the point is that even if these people have a right to Irish citizenship they certainly don't want it. That much is clear. They have chosen who they wish to govern them. Power sharing is in place in Northern Ireland and they really do need to try and get used to it. After all the pain and death in the previous decades isnt moving on what most people have decided to do? Embrace change for the better.

Flying a flag for both powers in a power sharing government would seem to be very logical and fair.

The argument of travelling to Ireland to ask us take down our flag because that's what they see us as asking them to do is illogical. Its there own government that has made the decision, jointly.

I'm not sure but is the tricolour being flown on the days the Union Jack isn't up?

maximoose

nemesisdg wrote: »

I'm not sure but is the tricolour being flown on the days the Union Jack isn't up?

No, they'd be absolutely wrecking the place if it was.

donaghs

Anyone serious about a united Ireland should let them peacefully protest and express their point of view.

I personally will be staying well away as the odds of rioting and opportunistic looting/punch-ups are very high.

Hopefully there won't be any trouble.

I think it is grand that these guys feel comfortable coming to the south and protesting.

Maybe protesting down here reflects that they think we have a legitimate interest in the north and vice versa.

JustinDee

donaghs wrote: »

Anyone serious about a united Ireland should let them peacefully protest and express their point of view

Unfortunately, there aren't enough mature folk of that ilk for this to happen.
I'd say there will be trouble. Maybe not with idiot factions face-to-face, but on both sides of an heavy police cordon.
Sometimes this island just shamefully depresses the hell out of itself. On one side we've republicans saying forget the past 40 or so years but remember 800 years blah blah blah, then on the other, we've the same but from a different tribal stance.
Its as if these people actually miss the grey, bitter, vacuous sh*thole the island of Ireland was, no thanks to a sick few. Shame on anyone who supports them and if they're parents teaching their myopic viewpoint to their kids, doubly so.

enda1

nemesisdg wrote: »

I'm not sure I agree Enda1. I think the point is that even if these people have a right to Irish citizenship they certainly don't want it. That much is clear. They have chosen who they wish to govern them. Power sharing is in place in Northern Ireland and they really do need to try and get used to it. After all the pain and death in the previous decades isnt moving on what most people have decided to do? Embrace change for the better.

Flying a flag for both powers in a power sharing government would seem to be very logical and fair.

The argument of travelling to Ireland to ask us take down our flag because that's what they see us as asking them to do is illogical. Its there own government that has made the decision, jointly.

I'm not sure but is the tricolour being flown on the days the Union Jack isn't up?

Lots of protests are illogical, doesn't mean people shouldn't have the right to protest. Citizenship and governship (sp?) are not entirely related. There are plenty of foreign nationals living in Ireland who are governed by our government, and plenty of citizens living abroad who are not.

There's not really much point in complaining about the subject of the protest really, more interesting is the right to protest for them. But I feel that they do have a right as laid down by the GFA and our constitution. I'm also sure that there are loyalists who are actually Irish citizens from an earlier time in their lives, and ones who are dual nationals whose "loyalty" is still to the UK.

All in all, let them at it and ignore if you so wish.

johnnyskeleton

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Pre-emptively stifling free speech because of a hypothetical scenario of what consequences might happen is a very big step on the slippery slope to oppression...

Well, they are deliberately trying to bring the Belfast riots down to dublin so even if it is hypothetical as to whether there will be violence, that is certainly their intention.

Perhaps if they were to provide an undertaking as to damages for local businesses that would be a good compromise.

On a more academic level, demanding the partial removal of the national flag from the national parliament could be considered sedition.

getz

johnnyskeleton wrote: »

Well, they are deliberately trying to bring the Belfast riots down to dublin so even if it is hypothetical as to whether there will be violence, that is certainly their intention.

Perhaps if they were to provide an undertaking as to damages for local businesses that would be a good compromise.

On a more academic level, demanding the partial removal of the national flag from the national parliament could be considered sedition.

do you think that a country should be responsible for what its citizens get up to in other countries,for inst if the so called british from northern ireland engage in criminal activity in the republic the UK goverment should prosecute them,and the same for the irish citizens in the north of the island, just a idea

VinLieger

getz wrote: »

do you think that a country should be responsible for what its citizens get up to in other countries,for inst if the so called british from northern ireland engage in criminal activity in the republic the UK goverment should prosecute them,and the same for the irish citizens in the north of the island, just a idea

They arent coming down here to riot though, there presence will simply cause one by certain thuggish elements and they know this, if the gardai dont adequately protect them, they blame us for being anti unionist, if a massive riot ensues they say we are part of the problem for being sectarian.
There is NO negative outcome for them by coming down here unless absolutely nothing happens and they look like morons asking for a flag that isnt even flying to be taken down.
But we know that there will deffinitely be some group of uneducated morons who are gonna go out and cause trouble just for the fun of it

COYW

VinLieger wrote: »

There is NO negative outcome for them by coming down here unless absolutely nothing happens and they look like morons asking for a flag that isn't even flying to be taken down.

I think the majority of unionists and loyalists, well from conversations with those I know, don't take him seriously, so I don't think the context of the protest will register.

He is of the opinion that we are citizens of the Republic of Ireland would take offence to the idea of the removal of our flag. I can only speak for myself but I wouldn't. I honestly couldn't tell you when it is flown. Dare I suggest that most citizens would be the same?

I see that tomorrow is the birthday of the Duchess of Cambridge, so the Union flag will fly over Belfast city hall. Interesting to see the reaction in NI.

FreudianSlippers

ruserious wrote: »

I dunno about ye but I'm getting a front row seat at the Italien embassey

They conduct a mandatory spell check at the door.

getz

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

They conduct a mandatory spell check at the door.

no they take cash their in need

pcworldisajoke

VinLieger wrote: »

They arent coming down here to riot though, there presence will simply cause one by certain thuggish elements and they know this, if the gardai dont adequately protect them, they blame us for being anti unionist, if a massive riot ensues they say we are part of the problem for being sectarian.
There is NO negative outcome for them by coming down here unless absolutely nothing happens and they look like morons asking for a flag that isnt even flying to be taken down.
But we know that there will deffinitely be some group of uneducated morons who are gonna go out and cause trouble just for the fun of it

This coment is about as bigotted as the muppets that are coming down here to cause trouble. I think you'll find the lads that started all the trouble in 1916 were far from uneducated.

It is quite wrong and pathetic to suggest anyone who protests this will be an uneducated moron. It is their right, and is completely understandable, if they wish to protest the arrival of this disgusting element in their capital city. Sure there might be the odd eejit who's there for the craic, but im sure it's the same with the leylists. The majority of the people there will be your countrymen and women who don't want to see these people in your country protesting something irrelevant to the republic, just to cause trouble. I say if they want trouble, give it to them in spades - if nothing else it will demonstrate the woeful lack of policing that exists in the state.

What a snob you are sir. When did you start hating your own people? And will you be surveying contra-protesters for their education level to back up your claim?? M****T

enda1

pcworldisajoke wrote: »

This coment is about as bigotted as the muppets that are coming down here to cause trouble. I think you'll find the lads that started all the trouble in 1916 were far from uneducated.

It is quite wrong and pathetic to suggest anyone who protests this will be an uneducated moron. It is their right, and is completely understandable, if they wish to protest the arrival of this disgusting element in their capital city. Sure there might be the odd eejit who's there for the craic, but im sure it's the same with the leylists. The majority of the people there will be your countrymen and women who don't want to see these people in your country protesting something irrelevant to the republic, just to cause trouble. I say if they want trouble, give it to them in spades - if nothing else it will demonstrate the woeful lack of policing that exists in the state.

What a snob you are sir. When did you start hating your own people? And will you be surveying contra-protesters for their education level to back up your claim?? M****T

I think you've completely missed his point. He's concerned that there will be people out "causing trouble". i.e. rioting and looting for fun which is not a legitimate form of protest.

pcworldisajoke

enda1 wrote: »

All NI born people have the right to Irish citizenship. This country recognises them even if they don't want citizenship from us. And there is no way of knowing if they actually have Irish citizenship or not. So its really a moot point that you're making.

it's not a 'moot point'!! You ask everyone of these fools arriving down here on Saturday if they want dual Irish citizenship and I'll be amazed if you find three. The well known fact is that they don't want it, so coming down here is ridiculous in the extreme.

The 'way of knowing' is using your common sense.

donaghs

pcworldisajoke wrote: »

This coment is about as bigotted as the muppets that are coming down here to cause trouble. I think you'll find the lads that started all the trouble in 1916 were far from uneducated.

.....

What a snob you are sir. When did you start hating your own people? And will you be surveying contra-protesters for their education level to back up your claim?? M****T

You're deliberately missing the point. You know well that nobody is denying the right to a peaceful counter-protest.

Looking what happened at the last Love Ulster parade explains people fear of the counter-protest. And the fate of Schuh and Foot Locker shows there was quite a few people "there for the craic".

enda1

pcworldisajoke wrote: »

it's not a 'moot point'!! You ask everyone of these fools arriving down here on Saturday if they want dual Irish citizenship and I'll be amazed if you find three. The well known fact is that they don't want it, so coming down here is ridiculous in the extreme.

The 'way of knowing' is using your common sense.

Well I disagree with you. I think they have every right to protest here as do other non-resident Irish such as the Republicans in the North.