PDC vs BDO - Discuss

Felexicon

Devastator wrote: »

yes your absolutely correct because I only started watching darts 20 mins ago :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

don't be a plum your whole life lad :rolleyes:

Devastator wrote: »

I agree about the BDO looking like amateur competition(nothing to do with players) and that delay over the scores was a joke!

It is not comparable to semi between Wade/Lewis because that was over a breeze coming in.....today they couldnt get the scores right! :rolleyes: PDC have markers on stage, if there is a discrepancy over the score it takes 15-20 seconds to fix and the game continues. That must have taken 5 minutes to sort out today

I'll quote your original post again then. You only mentioned an incident that happened 30 minutes ago. You do realise I don't know you and can only go by your posts content

Jayob10

Deleted User wrote: »

But take football. A lot of Irish people will watch Liverpool, a mid table team in an inferior league, compared to La Liga. If quality was the only issue in sports, then everyone would watch Barcelona and ManU. Do you watch club football? Do you limit it to the best teams only?

yeah thats all well and good, but you don't see San Marino, Liechenstein, Azerbaijan and Luxembourg pretending they are competing in the World Cup.

I have no problem with the BDO, I watch it every year aswell as the PDC.

A better football analogy would be the PDC is the Champions League, the BDO being the Europa league. You don't call the winners of the Europa league the best in Europe.

Pro Boxing is a farce of a sport (and im a huge fan) for its many sanctioning bodies and versions of world champions. Darts is not far off that.

Jayob10

Jayob10 wrote: »

yeah thats all well and good, but you don't see San Marino, Liechenstein, Azerbaijan and Luxembourg pretending they are competing in the World Cup.

I have no problem with the BDO, I watch it every year aswell as the PDC.

A better football analogy would be the PDC is the Champions League, the BDO being the Europa league. You don't call the winners of the Europa league the best in Europe.

Pro Boxing is a farce of a sport (and im a huge fan) for its many sanctioning bodies and versions of world champions. Darts is not far off that.

Ah steady on, Scott Waites is hardly in the San Marino, or even Europa League, standard.

You said in darts the only issue is quality. Might I ask if you follow football and if so what club? Just curious if you are as rigorous about applying the "quality is the only thing" rule across the board.

ArmaniJeanss

Felexicon wrote: »

It's not Sky who I'd lay the blame at as much as Barry Hearne. He tried to bring the football style crowd behaviour to snooker until the players told him to fúck off.
If he wanted to stop it he could just instruct referees to stop games until crowds were quiet

Meh, the PDC players could stop it instantly if they wanted.
Some regular boooo victim (Nicholson, Lewis, King or whoever) could refuse to throw until the crowd shut up, and his opponent and other senior players could support them on this. Then the authorities would have to sort it.

The players don't do this however, as they realise that one of the biggest reason there are 7/8 tourneys each year with £100K for the winner (and very decent prize money down the field) is that 7000/8000 are paying £30 a session purely on the understanding that they can get drunk and be abusive.

Ultimately the PDC players appear to consider it a price well worth paying.

Jayob10

Deleted User wrote: »

Ah steady on, Scott Waites is hardly in the San Marino, or even Europa League, standard.

You said in darts the only issue is quality. Might I ask if you follow football and if so what club? Just curious if you are as rigorous about applying the "quality is the only thing" rule across the board.

i'm not saying quality is the only thing.

But tell me, how can the BDO champ claim to be world champion?

The thread title is PDC v BDO- My claim was that the PDC is better quality. Shock horror.

Devastator

KevIRL wrote: »

I wouldnt call the BDO guys amatuers purely based on a faulty scoreboard

Maybe you should go back and re-read my post again because I didn't say anything of the sort infact I made a point of sayign it was NOTHING to do with the players

T-K-O

Jayob10 wrote: »

yeah thats all well and good, but you don't see San Marino, Liechenstein, Azerbaijan and Luxembourg pretending they are competing in the World Cup.

I have no problem with the BDO, I watch it every year aswell as the PDC.

A better football analogy would be the PDC is the Champions League, the BDO being the Europa league. You don't call the winners of the Europa league the best in Europe.

Pro Boxing is a farce of a sport (and im a huge fan) for its many sanctioning bodies and versions of world champions. Darts is not far off that.

Wrong, both cups are the same organisation. Level 1 and 2 if you will.

A better football analogy would be the Premier league v the bundesliga. Bayern have a great history but sky and their money allows lesser EPL teams to compete. Eventually all players flock to their new paymasters.

Glad you brought up boxing and pretending. PDC world titles is like the IBO world boxing title with bags loads of cash

Jayob10

T-K-O wrote: »

Wrong, both cups are the same organisation. Level 1 and 2 if you will.

A better football analogy would be the Premier league v the bundesliga. Bayern have a great history but sky and their money allows lesser EPL teams to compete. Eventually all players flock to their new paymasters.

Glad you brought up boxing and pretending. PDC world titles is like the IBO world boxing title with bags loads of cash

no chance.

The best of the bundesliga beat the best in the EPL. Thats not the case in the Darts.

As for the PDC being like the IBO world title??? Any boxer worth his salt (Barring Wlad Klitschko) knows this title isn't worth a feck.

The best fighters know belts don't matter. They just want to beat the best. And barring a couple of names, the best all compete in the PDC.

The Champions League/Europa analogy is a good one in terms of quality. There are a number of teams in the Europa who could hang with the best the champions league has to offer. Likewise, there are some minnows in the champions league who would be quickly dumped out of the Europa.

But at the business end of the Champions league, the cream rises to the top and is there for all to see.

T-K-O

Jayob10 wrote: »

no chance.

The best of the bundesliga beat the best in the EPL. Thats not the case in the Darts.

As for the PDC being like the IBO world title??? Any boxer worth his salt (Barring Wlad Klitschko) knows this title isn't worth a feck.

The best fighters know belts don't matter. They just want to beat the best. And barring a couple of names, the best all compete in the PDC.

The Champions League/Europa analogy is a good one in terms of quality. There are a number of teams in the Europa who could hang with the best the champions league has to offer. Likewise, there are some minnows in the champions league who would be quickly dumped out of the Europa.

But at the business end of the Champions league, the cream rises to the top and is there for all to see.

Belts do not matter in boxing ONCE a guy has reached the top. To reach the top you must win a belt. Once you are an established champion you can then forget the belts and pick and choose you opponents. That is how the business works.


WE agree on the IBO, now, if starting tomorrow the IBO offered their champions 10 million each. All the fighers would flock to that organisation but we as fans would know the history is with WBO/WBC.... wouldn't we??

Felexicon

T-K-O wrote: »

Belts do not matter in boxing ONCE a guy has reached the top. To reach the top you must win a belt. Once you are an established champion you can then forget the belts and pick and choose you opponents. That is how the business works.


WE agree on the IBO, now, if starting tomorrow the IBO offered their champions 10 million each. All the fighers would flock to that organisation but we as fans would know the history is with WBO/WBC.... wouldn't we??

I thought this was the darts thread?

T-K-O

Felexicon wrote: »

I thought this was the darts thread?

It is yeah

Jayob10

T-K-O wrote: »

Belts do not matter in boxing ONCE a guy has reached the top. To reach the top you must win a belt. Once you are an established champion you can then forget the belts and pick and choose you opponents. That is how the business works.


WE agree on the IBO, now, if starting tomorrow the IBO offered their champions 10 million each. All the fighers would flock to that organisation but we as fans would know the history is with WBO/WBC.... wouldn't we??

Not on the WBO part

Taylor is the best darts player on the planet. How can you operate in another organisation and potentially call yourself World Champ without ever crossing swords with him?

Jayob10

Jayob10 wrote: »

But tell me, how can the BDO champ claim to be world champion?

Oh I dunno, because he wins the BDO World Championship and gets his name engraved beside Bristow, Lowe, Wilson, Taylor and Van Barneveld?

Jayob10

Deleted User wrote: »

Oh I dunno, because he wins the BDO World Championship and gets his name engraved beside Bristow, Lowe, Wilson, Taylor and Van Barneveld?

you can have your name on the trophy sure, but until you beat the best you cannot be recognised as being champion.

T-K-O

Jayob10 wrote: »

Not on the WBO part

Taylor is the best darts player on the planet. How can you operate in another organisation and potentially call yourself World Champ without ever crossing swords with him?

Taylor is a very UN-likeable but very talented player. If we are to follow your logic at least half of his world titles do not count because the competition was so so poor.

Barney went over took the titles and basically retired :pac::pac::pac::pac:

Jayob10

Jayob10 wrote: »

Not on the WBO part

Taylor is the best darts player on the planet. How can you operate in another organisation and potentially call yourself World Champ without ever crossing swords with him?

When a BDO player wins the Grand Slam, does that make the BDO worlds more legitimate that year?

When Taylor does not win the PDC title and a player who doesn't meet him in the tournament wins, is that player the PDC world champion? Is it less legitimate?

I wouldn't define any sport by reference to one person.

Jayob10

Jayob10 wrote: »

you can have your name on the trophy sure, but until you beat the best you cannot be recognised as being champion.

When Waites was the best around in 2010, is there a blank space on the PDC Worlds Trophy?

Jayob10

Deleted User wrote: »

When Waites was the best around in 2010, is there a blank space on the PDC Worlds Trophy?

If Waites beats everyone then he should be called world champ yes.

My main point is that id like to see a single organisation and one world champ.

But also that theres alot more strength in depth in the PDC.

Kingp35

Deleted User wrote: »

When Waites was the best around in 2010, is there a blank space on the PDC Worlds Trophy?

Waites lost in the Quarter Finals of the Worlds in 2010. Hardly the best player around, in fact not even close.

T-K-O

Jayob10 wrote: »

If Waites beats everyone then he should be called world champ yes.

My main point is that id like to see a single organisation and one world champ.

But also that theres alot more strength in depth in the PDC.

But the IBO will never be the WBC no matter what

Jayob10

T-K-O wrote: »

Taylor is a very UN-likeable but very talented player. If we are to follow your logic at least half of his world titles do not count because the competition was so so poor.

Barney went over took the titles and basically retired :pac::pac::pac::pac:

Thats all very true. But with stiffer competition in the PDC he has continued to win.

So anyone else calling themselves world champ (in the BDO) during his reign at the top in the PDC is stretching the truth.

Theres arguments to be made for both sides. But the stronger competition in the PDC gives the holder of that world title more of a claim to the title of world champ.

Sure the BDO is the historical tournament, and the PDC is the glossy, manufactured tournament. You have to look at the players.

Where is there more strength in depth?

unknown13

You cannot compare Boxing with Darts. Just because the Hearn's are serious promoters of both sports means nothing. Also, comparing boxing sanctioning bodies to darts is just stupid.

I saw a bit of the BDO darts and it was the 10th seed against a qualifier and they were going out in 18 or more darts. For a 10th seed that is pretty shocking. If you are good enough to be ranked that high, you should be going in less. You cannot get away with that in the PDC.

Jayob10

T-K-O wrote: »

But the IBO will never be the WBC no matter what

correct in terms of history it won't.

But if Floyd, Manny, Maravilla and Co all decided in the morn that they would only fight for IBO titles, then IBO becomes the most competitive.

The fact Shane Mosley, Zab Judah and Josh Clottey are still clinging onto the WBC belts history means damn all.

Ok enough boxing talk TKO, we'll be banned

Felexicon

But the title they win is called BDO WORLD CHAMPION and PDC WORLD CHAMPION.

As in they are the world champions or the respective organisations.

T-K-O

Jayob10 wrote: »

Thats all very true. But with stiffer competition in the PDC he has continued to win.

So anyone else calling themselves world champ (in the BDO) during his reign at the top in the PDC is stretching the truth.

Theres arguments to be made for both sides. But the stronger competition in the PDC gives the holder of that world title more of a claim to the title of world champ.

Sure the BDO is the historical tournament, and the PDC is the glossy, manufactured tournament. You have to look at the players.

Where is there more strength in depth?

I have already said, in the last few years PDC successfully poached most of the talent. But it's wasn't that long ago when the BDO (less Taylor) still had the better players.

So Taylor is a 6 time world champion and we should scratch the BDO

T-K-O

Jayob10 wrote: »

correct in terms of history it won't.

But if Floyd, Manny, Maravilla and Co all decided in the morn that they would only fight for IBO titles, then IBO becomes the most competitive.

The fact Shane Mosley, Zab Judah and Josh Clottey are still clinging onto the WBC belts history means damn all.

Ok enough boxing talk TKO, we'll be banned

Right lets be friends.

BDO is better....:pac::pac:

But seriously there is room for both. What annoys me more is the newer fan who knows nothing about the BDO, is blinded by the lights over at Sky and does not appreciate what the BDO has done for the game

Jayob10

unknown13 wrote: »

You cannot compare Boxing with Darts. Just because the Hearn's are serious promoters of both sports means nothing. Also, comparing boxing sanctioning bodies to darts is just stupid.

I saw a bit of the BDO darts and it was the 10th seed against a qualifier and they were going out in 18 or more darts. For a 10th seed that is pretty shocking. If you are good enough to be ranked that high, you should be going in less. You cannot get away with that in the PDC.

of course you can compare.

The IBO boxing title is a relatively new mad up belt by the sanctioning body. Lots of money behind it.

It has zero relevance historically speaking amongst the greats.

If all the worlds best boxers start competing for the IBO title only, leaving the dregs to compete over the WBC belt (held by Tyson and Co.) does this mean the WBC belt (the historically prestigous one) is still the barometre of the best?

You judge it by the players who are currently competing.

Kingp35

Kingp35 wrote: »

Waites lost in the Quarter Finals of the Worlds in 2010. Hardly the best player around, in fact not even close.

Was he not the no. 1 BDO player when he won the Grand Slam?

Either way, my point is the fallacy of saying to be world champion you have to beat Taylor. The game should not be defined in that way. Heck even the PDC worlds should not be defined in that way.

T-K-O

The boxing analogy is perfect but it has nothing to do with Hearns

T-K-O

T-K-O wrote: »

But seriously there is room for both.

That certainly is true. As they both show at the moment. They coexist. Uneasily perhaps, but it is what it is. Insisting that the PDC is better is like insisting the Spanish League is better than the English League. We know that, but the question is "so what".