Heres an idea ..

Idjit

I get that some people are comparing retail to actually necessary services like healthcare, electricity etc but I don't agree myself. I think people, whether religious or not, should be able to have at least the two days to spend that time with their family and loved ones, or even just by themselves relaxing.

I know it's not really a possibility for those in the aforementioned necessary industries but can't clothes shopping wait one more day? Also, some people are commenting that if you don't like working stephen's day in retail you shouldn't have chosen to work in retail but the sad fact is, some people just don't have a choice in the matter, they can't get work in any other sector.

I'm in work tomorrow morning until evening myself but don't mind it because I'm a student and my older relatives all came over to see me today, but I know single mothers who break their back working all year who have to work tomorrow too. They get that one day with their kids and it's right back to the grind, which I think is sad..

P_1

Biggins wrote: »

You say most people - debatable but I'll take your word for it.
Even still, another point...

What is better - close up some shops, stay at home and let the business go elsewhere and then see that so those other businesses get greater profits and your own job and employment place lose out?

Its NOT a ideal situation to be working tomorrow but for some it seems, they are damned if they do and possibly damned if they don't.

Ideal situation would be a ban on non essential retail outlets of over a certain size opening on the 26th.

This way, the money hungry English shitebag shops will be forced to close on the day (it was they who instigated this shite in the first place) and the owner run smaller shops can feel free to open if they wish.

TLDR version, the only way you can open a shop on the 26th is if its your own shop and you're the one forced to work on it.

orestes

Dj Stiggie wrote: »

I'm a barman. I've worked every 24th, 26th, New Year's Eve and New Year's Day since I was 16. Along with most Paddy's Days, Hallowe'ens and Easter Weekends (except Good Friday obviously). I don't get double time for these shifts. Why aren't you calling for pubs to stay closed for an extra day over Christmas too? Or would that mean you couldn't get a few pints in with your mates? Seriously, if you have a problem with it, don't enter an industry where the busiest time of year is Christmas.

I spent the last couple of years working in the bar trade in mainland Europe, no day off on christmas or good friday, tis 365 days a year. Being stood behind a bar in Belgium at 10 am on christmas morning is not fun, believe me, but it's part of the job so you do it.

Duggys Housemate wrote: »

The emergency services are essential, bar staff are retail. Id be happy if pubs were closed for two days at Christmas.

Bar staff aren't retail, it's the hospitality industry. Big difference.

poeticseraphim

OP if it was your business you would appreciate the trade.

For some businesses these takings ARE necessary especially now . People spend less in January and this trade is what pays your wages.

If people stay home retail staff lose jobs it is that simple..especially now.

And yes one day will make a difference to overall Christmas takings and it would impact greatly.

If you don't want to do it choose something else if you don't have a choice then you REALLY need to protect that job.
It is not about workers rights i assume you do get holidays at a time more convenient for your employer.

Contact your union rep if you have an issue. Maybe you cold opt out on a religious holiday basis.

Unions are there to handle this stuff if helps no one if consummers stay away in protest if shops are already open..they WILL lose money...that is not in workers best interests coming into January.


If i was an employer and found out my employee was asking people to stay away rather than going through their union or approaching me i would feel they were biting the hand that feeds them and hurting my business.

Contact your union rep ...it is the fair way to do it.

Duggys Housemate

If unions were powerful retail workers would have been able to kee the two days off.

This lost revenue is nonsense. There's a certain amount people are going to spend on sales, and whether they start on the 26th or the 27th is irrelevant.

poeticseraphim

orestes wrote: »

I spent the last couple of years working in the bar trade in mainland Europe, no day off on christmas or good friday, tis 365 days a year. Being stood behind a bar in Belgium at 10 am on christmas morning is not fun, believe me, but it's part of the job so you do it.



Bar staff aren't retail, it's the hospitality industry. Big difference.

Why should bar staff, retail, hairdressers, ESB etc be any different??

They are all staff , they are all people who have families. Just because some preform a service you need more does that mean they should have fewer rights or some should have more?

orestes

poeticseraphim wrote: »

Why should bar staff, retail, hairdressers, ESB etc be any different??

They are all staff , they are all people who have families. Just because some preform a service you need more does that mean they should have fewer rights or some should have more?

I didn't say they should be different. I said it's part of the job, so if that's your job, you do it. If you don't like the hours/days that your job expect you to work, get a different job. Personally I think that shops, bars and the likes (pretty much everything that is open on the weekends) should be open on christmas anyway.

Micky Dolenz

poeticseraphim wrote: »

Why should bar staff, retail, hairdressers, ESB etc be any different??

They are all staff , they are all people who have families. Just because some preform a service you need more does that mean they should have fewer rights or some should have more?

It's simple supply and demand. Blame the general population before you blame service providers.

I want a few pints tomorrow with my mates, many I won't see for a long while. The publican wants our money, everyone wins.

Apply that to all service providers that make the choice to open.

Shinaynay

poeticseraphim wrote: »

Doctors, Nurses , paramedics and many many more work all through the holidays..on CHRISTMAS DAY..the ESB etc....You expect those services to be available to your family over Christmas (I assume you want the lights on) but refuse to work yourself that is hypocrytical.

A centra in town stays open Christmas day as the owners are Hindus. You can if you are religious take religious holidays sometimes. Not everyone is Christian.

I appreciate the services being kept open ...i don't consider myself to be Christian.

My mother runs her own business...she will not stop....

If you want the lights and heat on in your family's home over Christmas people have to work and that is that the country could not function unless people did. And that's CHRISTMAS DAY forget the day after.

I like the shops being open..and I shall be shopping.




Oh and I freelance and work for myself from home now. But before I went to Uni i worked on Christmas Eve and on Stephen's day. And Bloody New years.


If people give you their custom through the year you should respect that custom. People know when they are not respected as customers. Tips for staff in Pubs etc or Hairdressers are huge at this time and many WANT to work.

Some people actually might want to work it.9

Where do you work OP??? I will avoid there if you like.

I'm not 'refusing to work it', my point is there is an unnecessary demand for clothes shops/dept stores etc to only close one day of the year .

This is a recent enough thing.


While I agree that their are many unfortunate people out there who are unemployed, I dont consider myself 'lucky' to be in job, Ive worked very hard to get where I am. However I am under no illusions that my job has little importance when compared to that of doctors and nurses.

Shopping for clothes is not a necessity, especially when on St. Stephens day. Christmas is over before its begun for some due to insatiable human consumption

mikemac1

Shinaynay wrote: »

No double time if youre in on salary.

You get more annual leave so

Unless you're a manager you don't work Stephens Day for your ordinary basic pay & conditions

Shinaynay

mikemac1 wrote: »

You get more annual leave so

Unless you're a manager you don't work Stephens Day for your ordinary basic pay & conditions

I am a manager yes

monkeypants

Whispered wrote: »

Really looking forward to going out tomorrow with my husband for a bit of shopping and lunch.

Why are women so fascinated with shopping and lunch?

mikemac1

Only one place to be tomorrow and that's gambling on the gee gees in Leopardstown :cool:

If you have tips please pm me!

poeticseraphim

Duggys Housemate wrote: »

As has been exhaustively pointed out - there is no extra pay for the extra days. It's just not a holiday.

What's wrong with trying to change an entire industry - a few years ago retail workers did get the two days.

I detest the use if the unemployed to bully the low paid employed, probably most retail workers have spent some time unemployed.

What's wrong with trying to change an entire industry - a few years ago retail workers did get the two days.

When you don't understand the needs of the industry you can't change it. You don't realize what your employer needs and yes they need this business this year trust me. It is huge at this time.

A few years ago people were throwing cash around in retail businesses and a business did not have to entice consumers those days are over. And now they are fighting for survival in many cases.

It is NOT your general working rights you are talking about or your general working conditions. It is one day of work yo are being asked to do that is of sentimental and emotional value to you. I understand that and i know it is unpleasant.

But I assume you do get your workers rights satisfied in your Job as a whole. If you don't then you should take them to court.

You have not mentioned any other conditions that you are unhappy with so I assume it is simply this one issue. And i agree that the low paid employed should not be bullied or badly treated. But I don't think that you are being. I have had in the past done what you are being asked to do myself. I would not have based whether i thought i was being well treated or not on the fact that I was working Christmas Eve and St Stephens day. I was asked to work those days and I have to say my employer at that time was a fair man. e worked those days himself alongside us. And we were in most respects well treated in that job. I have since moved on to working for myself. Being asked to work St Stephens day does not mean you have an unfair job or an unfair employer. You can have great working conditions and be asked to work that day. Or you can have terrible conditions and have that day off.

It is not nice . But employer usually go out of their way to make it as best they can for you.

I think businesses need the trade...it would be ineteresting to see employers comment on this.

poeticseraphim

Shinaynay wrote: »

I'm not 'refusing to work it', my point is there is an unnecessary demand for clothes shops/dept stores etc to only close one day of the year .

This is a recent enough thing.


While I agree that their are many unfortunate people out there who are unemployed, I dont consider myself 'lucky' to be in job, Ive worked very hard to get where I am. However I am under no illusions that my job has little importance when compared to that of doctors and nurses.

Shopping for clothes is not a necessity, especially when on St. Stephens day. Christmas is over before its begun for some due to insatiable human consumption

I notice you don't tell me which establishment you work for to avoid giving them my money.

You know you might not actually speak for all people ..some might want the trade.


It is not fair for you to ask for a total boycott anonymously.

And so you think people who provide necessity have fewer rights than those who provide lesser needed services??

Or is it just that simply they need to do their job it's not nice but there you go??

And what about Bar Staff and Hairdressers and Hotel staff etc?? Airport authorities???

Table Top Joe

poeticseraphim wrote: »

You don't realize what your employer needs and yes they need this business this year trust me. It is huge at this time.

In fairness were all aware of how bad things are,none of us are living in a cave,if all the retailers closed on the 26th and opened on the 27th theyd make the money then instead....like they used to,i think it was Debenhams started this a few years back,the rest felt they had to follow and here we are...


To the people arguing about nurses etc.....thats a ridiculous comparison that really shouldnt need to be explained to anyone

UDP

ilovesleep wrote: »

Is this really true about the Germans? If it is, it sounds really beautiful.

Its not beautiful though. It's a pain in the a$$. It means that if you are working all week and don't get to shops then you have to shop on Saturday morning. Luckily it is getting more relaxed and most large supermarkets are open until 10pm. Also shops will tend to stay open in train stations and airports (which they are allowed to do) so at least there is that but only if you live in a large town or a city. Really annoying if you are looking for a small ingredient for Sunday dinner etc.

P_1

Maybe a 'what the fcuk are you doing shopping get the fcuk home' protest is potentially in order :pac:

Whispered

monkeypants wrote: »

Why are women so fascinated with shopping and lunch?

This morning I was working and then came home to make dinner, so tomorrow I don't want to have to cook and will have lunch out. Shopping, is to catch up on the final few bits before visiting relatives because I was working in the run up to Christmas too. So as tomorrow and the next day are my only full days off I intend to enjoy them.

EDIT: This time of year is one of my employers busiest so I'm happy to do whatever hours I'm asked to do. Considering my employer is very fair to deal with if I need time off or anything.

OP, you don't have it too bad. You're not working tomorrow and you're complaining about something that will happen next year, if your employer is still in business. I think you're complaining about nothing TBH. Boo Hoo, you're not getting an extra day off.

Shinaynay

Whispered wrote: »

This morning I was working and then came home to make dinner, so tomorrow I don't want to have to cook and will have lunch out. Shopping, is to catch up on the final few bits before visiting relatives because I was working in the run up to Christmas too. So as tomorrow and the next day are my only full days off I intend to enjoy them.

EDIT: This time of year is one of my employers busiest so I'm happy to do whatever hours I'm asked to do. Considering my employer is very fair to deal with if I need time off or anything.

OP, you don't have it too bad. You're not working tomorrow and you're complaining about something that will happen next year, if your employer is still in business. I think you're complaining about nothing TBH. Boo Hoo, you're not getting an extra day off.

Your 'if your employer is still in business' comment' has to be the most patronising thing I have ever read on here.


Over & out of this thread.

Fighting Irish

Can we include mondays? cos i hate working mondays

krudler

poeticseraphim wrote: »

Doctors, Nurses , paramedics and many many more work all through the holidays..on CHRISTMAS DAY..the ESB etc....You expect those services to be available to your family over Christmas (I assume you want the lights on) but refuse to work yourself that is hypocrytical.

A centra in town stays open Christmas day as the owners are Hindus. You can if you are religious take religious holidays sometimes. Not everyone is Christian.

I appreciate the services being kept open ...i don't consider myself to be Christian.

My mother runs her own business...she will not stop....

If you want the lights and heat on in your family's home over Christmas people have to work and that is that the country could not function unless people did. And that's CHRISTMAS DAY forget the day after.

I like the shops being open..and I shall be shopping.




Oh and I freelance and work for myself from home now. But before I went to Uni i worked on Christmas Eve and on Stephen's day. And Bloody New years.


If people give you their custom through the year you should respect that custom. People know when they are not respected as customers. Tips for staff in Pubs etc or Hairdressers are huge at this time and many WANT to work.

Some people actually might want to work it.9

Where do you work OP??? I will avoid there if you like.

Can people please stop comparing the emergency services with a retail shop, the clue is in the description, the emergency services. Buying a top in Next or a dvd in HMV on stephens day is not an emergency.

Gyalist

My shops are closed today but we will be open on the 27th. Twenty years ago the norm was for shops to reopen on the 28th and Sunday trading was only in the 6-8 weeks leading up to Christmas. Times have changed though. Urban Outfitters were the first to start opening on the 26th a few years ago.

areyawell

Why not go shopping in the morning and spend rest of the day with family - Christ! stupid thread

kjl

Well I think the OP is forgetting that we are all very busy, I don't always have time before Christmas to get everything I want and it's nice to be able to get something the day after, instead of the entire country shutting down for two days.

This is the career the OP chose and he was well aware of the requirements before he started. I also think he should be grateful that he is getting work and the demand is high. I don't recall shops being open during the boom so surely it must be a good sign to the come back of our economy.

I hope the OP knows there are a lot of people who would love to take his place and work on the 26th, he should stop moaning because he is easily replaced.

My local shop was open from 9am - 5pm on Christmas day and I applaud him for his good business acumen. Made a bit of money and provided a decent service.

poeticseraphim

krudler wrote: »

Can people please stop comparing the emergency services with a retail shop, the clue is in the description, the emergency services. Buying a top in Next or a dvd in HMV on stephens day is not an emergency.

It is not just emergency services. Why are you only concerned about retail staff??? Perhaps because you want the services others provide???

Hoteliers, the ESB, the Airport Authority, RTE staff, Manymaintance staff ,the AA, staff at the races. Even buses like Bus Eireann and Dublin are working.

And saying will people please stop when they bring up a valid point is not an argument.

Anyway afaik, xmas day and stephens day are public holidays, the monday and the tues are bank holidays. your entitlements are to have public holidays off. if you work a public holiday you are entitled to double pay or a day off in lieu.

If in your case you normally work sundays and have built up an entitlement to be paid for that day them imo you should get paid double.

The rules
http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/employment/employment_rights_and_conditions/leave_and_holidays/public_holidays_in_ireland.html


Your rights and entitlements are laid out therein.

Your entitlements are set out by the http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1997/en/act/pub/0020/index.html


Most employees are entitled to paid leave on public holidays. One exception is part-time employees who have not worked for their employer at least 40 hours in total in the 5 weeks before the public holiday.
Employees who qualify will be entitled to either the public holiday off as paid leave or one of the following alternatives:

A paid day off within a month of the public holiday
An additional day of annual leave
An additional day's pay
The nearest church holiday to the public holiday as a paid day off

The Organisation of Working Time Act provides that you may ask your employer at least 21 days before a public holiday, which of the alternatives will apply. If your employer fails to respond at least 14 days before the public holiday, you are entitled to take the actual public holiday as a paid day off......apparently


Staff at the races have had to work it, bt people don't see it because of tradition. People in some parts of Dublin remember local shops opening early Christmas day years ago but it died out.


Not everyone works 9-5 I know someone who works for an online company and every second year they have to work Christmas day. If you work for one of the banks in Bond/Equity pricing, you have to come in every Stephens day to mark the daily prices.

With all the recent jobs lost in retail recently it is not wise to tell people to stay away from shops. The economy needs it. Your business needs the extra day of trade. And it is an EXTRA day it can't be made up the next day they get that too. A lot of the people you are seeing are just employed to cover the xmas rush and would love to be kept on after the holiday period too. The shops will decide this based on the holiday footfall. You should consider that too.


So you think pubs TV stations trains buses etc and other non essential services should let workers off too?? Because watching TV with the family requires people to go and work. You want to watch football or sports?? People have to facilitate those matches. Are you going to boycott watching TV????


And wren boys going around to open pubs has been a tradition for decades...people have to facilitate this

ShooterSF

I work in the bar industry. I finished up at midnight on xmas eve. I start work again in about 12 hours. That's perfect for me. One day packed with over eating, over drinking, games, movies and presents is plenty. If we gave all non-essential staff another day off tomorrow what would I do? I don't want to eat for about 2 days, won't want a drink ever again for 2 or 3 days (:D) and while more movie time or games are always fun I'd rather have them spread out.

mikemac1

poeticseraphim wrote: »

Anyway afaik, xmas day and stephens day are public holidays, the monday and the tues are bank holidays. your entitlements are to have public holidays off. if you work a public holiday you are entitled to double pay or a day off in lieu.

If in your case you normally work sundays and have built up an entitlement to be paid for that day them imo you should get paid double.

When you get to management you're expected to work them.

But then the directors will tell you your salary reflects these days already.

The OP will be the highest paid person in the store tomorrow.
It doesn't mean they are on big money though

Shinaynay

areyawell wrote: »

Why not go shopping in the morning and spend rest of the day with family - Christ! stupid thread

You obviously havent read any of the thread.

Micky Dolenz

Shinaynay wrote: »

You obviously havent read any of the thread.

Shouldn't you be busy?