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Why would an Irish person wear a poppy ?

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    #1502
    summerskin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭summerskin


    Nodin wrote: »


    My, we do love to over-speculate and rant, don't we?

    My my, we do love to patronise and deflect when we have no answer, don't we?


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    #1503
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    summerskin wrote: »
    My my, we do love to patronise and deflect when we have no answer, don't we?

    There was a question?


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    #1504
    GRMA
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,417 ✭✭✭GRMA


    Fratton Fred wrote: »



    Nice to see you belittle an act of blatant terrorism.

    http://www.historiccoventry.co.uk/articles/s-shaw.php

    Hmmm? I was talking about your friend Lordsutch wanting the wolfe tones baned from a hotel... he went in to use the toilet or something


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    #1505
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Fratton Fred wrote: »
    yes, as I have already pointed out.



    in other words, it is acceptable to kill innocent people if it is in the name of Ireland.

    I mean, after all, what's a few dead Brits :rolleyes:

    ....

    Hardly that simple Fred. The fact is that - for example - 20,000 French people were killed in the liberation of France. In a war the innocent will die regardless of what care is taken to avoid harming them. The question is really whether its justified to take up arms in the first place, given thats the consequence.

    Now which sounds more justifiable to you - removing a foreign occupation, or continuing one? removing racism or keeping it in place?


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    #1506
    Big Bottom
    Registered Users Posts: 346 ✭✭Big Bottom


    Fair play to anyone Irish to wear a Poppy.

    Anyone who has an issue with Irish people wearing one has issues themselves and need to look at why they feel like that (Irrational!)


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    #1507
    Fratton Fred
    Closed Accounts Posts: 26,567 ✭✭✭✭Fratton Fred


    Nodin wrote: »
    Hardly that simple Fred. The fact is that - for example - 20,000 French people were killed in the liberation of France. In a war the innocent will die regardless of what care is taken to avoid harming them. The question is really whether its justified to take up arms in the first place, given thats the consequence.

    Now which sounds more justifiable to you - removing a foreign occupation, or continuing one? removing racism or keeping it in place?

    aaah, the good old collateral damage argument. nice one.

    The bombing of Coventry, in fact the entire S-Plan was not legitimate though. It was contrary to the wishes of the Irish people and the democratically elected Irish government. So it wasn't really a liberation campaign, was it?


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    #1508
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    Nodin wrote: »
    Hardly that simple Fred. The fact is that - for example - 20,000 French people were killed in the liberation of France. In a war the innocent will die regardless of what care is taken to avoid harming them. The question is really whether its justified to take up arms in the first place, given thats the consequence.

    Now which sounds more justifiable to you - removing a foreign occupation, or continuing one? removing racism or keeping it in place?
    Oh dear, you still persist with your notion that Ireland was under foreign occupation.


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    #1509
    gurramok
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭gurramok


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    Oh dear, you still persist with your notion that Ireland was under foreign occupation.

    Yes it was. Not to planter Unionists though.


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    #1510
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    gurramok wrote: »
    Yes it was. Not to planter Unionists though.
    No it wasn't. Ireland wasn't "under" occupation, it was the second largest of the four constitute divisions of the united kingdom and had representation in parliament. Hyperbole doesn't help things.


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    #1511
    gurramok
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭gurramok


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    No it wasn't. Ireland wasn't "under" occupation, it was the second largest of the four constitute divisions of the united kingdom and had representation in parliament. Hyperbole doesn't help things.

    Under foreign rule administratively and militarily, for a few centuries. If Britain is not a foreign country to you then setup up a local branch of the DUP to campaign for Ireland's independence to be abolished and to rejoin the UK, good luck.


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    #1512
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    Nodin wrote: »

    Hardly that simple Fred. The fact is that - for example - 20,000 French people were killed in the liberation of France. In a war the innocent will die regardless of what care is taken to avoid harming them. The question is really whether its justified to take up arms in the first place, given thats the consequence.

    Now which sounds more justifiable to you - removing a foreign occupation, or continuing one? removing racism or keeping it in place?

    Neither 1916 or 1921 removed anybody. Political effort in the Commons is the only reason that Ireland is independent. Most people did not want 1916 or the 1921 "war of independence".


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    #1513
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    gurramok wrote: »
    Under foreign rule administratively and militarily, for a few centuries. If Britain is not a foreign country to you then setup up a local branch of the DUP to campaign for Ireland's independence to be abolished and to rejoin the UK, good luck.
    Ireland was part of the UK and not a minor part either, it was the second most important of the eponymous three kingdoms. On rejoining the UK, you mistake me. As long as I live in a free country where my rights are respected I couldn't give two fudges about the colour of it's flag. I just want to dispel the myth that we were under foreign occupation.


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    #1514
    Jimoslimos
    Registered Users Posts: 4,930 ✭✭✭Jimoslimos


    Right so, looking like our annual poppy madness thread is coming to a close (aside from a few stragglers intent on stirring a bit of trouble).

    Many thanks to all involved and let us return same time next year (or probably earlier) to come together and remember the fallen banned who gave their lives posting privileges in defence of free speech inflammatory trolling.


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    #1515
    Aodh Rua
    Closed Accounts Posts: 71 ✭✭Aodh Rua


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    I just want to dispel the myth that we were under foreign occupation.

    You're not doing a good job of it. Entertaining troll nonetheless.


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    #1516
    gurramok
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭gurramok


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    Ireland was part of the UK and not a minor part either, it was the second most important of the eponymous three kingdoms. On rejoining the UK, you mistake me. As long as I live in a free country where my rights are respected I couldn't give two fudges about the colour of it's flag. I just want to dispel the myth that we were under foreign occupation.

    Ireland was a colony. So you've no problem us joining lets say France or perhaps Germany, Italy, Spain etc to be ruled by them, none of them are foreign countries in your view?


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    #1517
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    gurramok wrote: »
    Ireland was a colony. So you've no problem us joining lets say France or perhaps Germany, Italy, Spain etc to be ruled by them, none of them are foreign countries in your view?
    You're comparing apples and oranges. The culture of Spain and Italy is totally alien to us. On the other hand we share many similarities with Britain.


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    #1518
    gurramok
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭gurramok


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    You're comparing apples and oranges. The culture of Spain and Italy is totally alien to us. On the other hand we share many similarities with Britain.

    Oh, the language? Perhaps we should be ruled by Malta? India?


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    #1519
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    gurramok wrote: »
    Oh, the language? Perhaps we should be ruled by Malta? India?
    If Malta and India had a presence here for centuries along with shared culture and values. Unless you start making sense I'm going to ignore you.


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    #1520
    gurramok
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭gurramok


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    If Malta and India had a presence here for centuries along with shared culture or value. Unless you start making sense I'm going to ignore you.

    From occupation of course. You're the one not making sense, you seem to like disrespecting this country's ability to self determination at the expense of our neighbour yet you wouldn't entertain a union with any other country but Britain. Speaks volumes alright, you should try that DUP option that was mentioned.


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    #1521
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    No it wasn't. Ireland wasn't "under" occupation, it was the second largest of the four constitute divisions of the united kingdom and had representation in parliament. Hyperbole doesn't help things.

    ....dear o dear o dear. There really is no hope for you at all.
    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    The culture of Spain and Italy is totally alien to us. On the other hand we share many similarities with Britain.

    ...and how did that happen...? Hmmm?
    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    ......had a presence.... .

    ..like an embassy?


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    #1522
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    philologos wrote: »
    Neither 1916 or 1921 removed anybody. Political effort in the Commons is the only reason that Ireland is independent. Most people did not want 1916 or the 1921 "war of independence".

    1916 laid the ground for the 1918 election, which led to the war of independence. You'll find it had quite a bit to do with independence. Not that you can acknowledge that, because you're quite happy to fund those who helped keep similar efforts down across the globe.


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    #1523
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    gurramok wrote: »
    From occupation of course. You're the one not making sense, you seem to like disrespecting this country's ability to self determination at the expense of our neighbour yet you wouldn't entertain a union with any other country but Britain. Speaks volumes alright, you should try that DUP option that was mentioned.
    Ok, you're putting words into my mouth so let's get a few things straight.

    1. I don't doubt this county's ability to self determination. 4.6 million odd people and 70,000 km^2 is plenty big enough for a country. Smaller then most but not overly so.

    2. I don't want Ireland to rejoin with the UK, I'm not a unionist. I couldn't give two figs what colour the flag is as long as I live in a free country.

    Hopefully now that's out of the way we stay away from generalisations ad mud slinging i he future? I doubt it but it would be nice to try.
    Nodin wrote: »
    ....dear o dear o dear. There really is no hope for you at all.
    That feeling seems to be mutual.


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    #1524
    end of the road
    Registered Users Posts: 28,986 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    Big Bottom wrote: »
    Fair play to anyone Irish to wear a Poppy.
    yeah, shur british army loving and sweaping things under the carpet are definitely a couple of things the irish poppy wearers are good at.
    Big Bottom wrote: »
    Anyone who has an issue with Irish people wearing one has issues themselves and need to look at why they feel like that (Irrational!)
    really? so someone who has a problem with somebody wearing something that along with remembering those who faught in the world wars remembers and raises money for the likes of the bluddy sunday butchers has issues? those who were involved in the likes of bluddy sunday deserve nothing from nobody.

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



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    #1525
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    Ok, you're putting words (......)mutual.

    Why do we "share many similarities with Britain"?

    What kind of "presence" did Britain have here?


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    #1526
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    Nodin wrote: »
    Why do we "share many similarities with Britain"?

    What kind of "presence" did Britain have here?
    Oh Britain's presence in Ireland derives from expansionist policies, I have no doubt about that. It's just no different to the expansion of German, French, Spanish, Italian, Chinese or any other country you can think of. All these countries were built with blood. We aren't immune to invasion just because we are an island you know.

    I think you're main problem with the UK is that it was never a homogeneous nation. But it's not supposed to be. The UK was originally envisioned as a multi-ethnic multi-cultural union of three separate kingdoms and a principality with England as the first among equals. And while the ideal was not always put into practice, England often looked down it's nose at the other countries, I attribute that to human pettiness and narrow mindedness. The idea itself was still sound.


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    #1527
    Curly Judge
    Registered Users Posts: 2,708 ✭✭✭Curly Judge


    GRMA wrote: »
    Of course... the evil wolfe tones playing in a hotel... should be banned

    Definatly should be banned, on the grounds of impersonating musicians.


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    #1528
    LordSutch
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,078 ✭✭✭✭LordSutch


    Talking of GRMA/Nodin "Whats all this wolfe tones malarkey you are talking about"?


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    #1529
    Curly Judge
    Registered Users Posts: 2,708 ✭✭✭Curly Judge


    Jimoslimos wrote: »
    Right so, looking like our annual poppy madness thread is coming to a close (aside from a few stragglers intent on stirring a bit of trouble).

    Many thanks to all involved and let us return same time next year (or probably earlier) to come together and remember the fallen banned who gave their lives posting privileges in defence of free speech inflammatory trolling.


    Okay. Just to finish up.
    Everybody.... All together now......

    We'll meet again,
    Don't know where,
    Don't know when,
    But I know we'll meet again
    Some sunny day.............


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    #1530
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    Oh Britain's presence in Ireland derives from expansionist policies, I have no doubt about that. It's just no different to the expansion of German, French, Spanish, Italian, Chinese or any other country you can think of. All these countries were built with blood. We aren't immune to invasion just because we are an island you know. .

    Yep invasion and - what do we call what happens after that?
    Iwasfrozen wrote: »

    I think you're main problem with the UK ............

    My main problem is with imperialism. Being a linguistic cripple, I'm not active on boards where the French, Belgians, Spaniards, Portugese, Russians and whoever else crap on about how glorious their bit of international mugging was, and they don't come on here, thus, I deal with the fanboys we have.
    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    The UK was originally envisioned as a multi-ethnic multi-cultural union of three separate kingdoms and a principality with England as the first among equals. ............

    ....which is logically why they enforced laws against the populace in Wales and here. Who did this "envisioning" and when did they do it?


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    #1531
    GRMA
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,417 ✭✭✭GRMA


    LordSutch wrote: »
    Talking of GRMA/Nodin "Whats all this wolfe tones malarkey you are talking about"?
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056494251

    You're wonderful contributions in there.

    As an aside there's some excellent songs on there which is how I came across it


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