Garda safety campaign for Dublin

buffalo

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2012/1001/breaking42.html

One of the State’s most high profile road safety campaigns kicked off in Dublin this morning.

The city which now has the safest roads among EU capitals will see a new ‘Casualty Reduction Plan’ target vulnerable road users over the next eight weeks.

I like how the Casualty Reduction Plan means "increased garda street enforcement of cycling and pedestrian rules". Surely there should be enforcement of road rules? Though I'd support fining of cyclists with no lights, footpath cycling, etc.

The early hours of the morning at weekends were identified as the times of high risk of single vehicle collisions often involving speed and alcohol

Are speeding and drunk drivers now included in the "vulnerable road user" grouping? This is news to me.

Jawgap

BostonB

THE VAST MAJORITY of serious accidents on Dublin’s roads involve cyclists, pedestrians or motorcyclists, Gardaí have said.

Traffic Fatalities up to 9am on 1st October 2012
Pedestrians:
18
Drivers: 64
Passengers: 24
Motorcyclists: 15
Pedal Cyclists: 07
Pillion Passenger/Other 04
Total Year to Date: 130

http://www.thejournal.ie/dublin-casualty-roads-617881-Oct2012/
http://www.garda.ie/Controller.aspx?Page=1368&Lang=1

Something wrong there, I know its accidents vs fatalities so I don't have the figures for accidents. But Drivers + Passengers 88 out of 130? Considering this http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056740608

Personally I've seen very little on the street Garda presence for dangerous and/or aggressive driving. And you see it in every queue and junction almost constantly around the city. Does the media seem to have an agenda to vilify cyclists? That said I don't see why they don't confiscate bikes off cyclists with no lights at night, or the promotion of reflective gear.

buffalo

They would be national statistics, and the statement is about Dublin, where there would obviously be a higher concentration of pedestrians and cyclists.

Chips Lovell

Threads merged

boiledsweets

Are speeding and drunk drivers now included in the "vulnerable road user" grouping? This is news to me.

Its sickening to think that they are now seen as some sort of victim,this is ridiculous to do this,if anything they are perpetrators,they are committing a criminal act that can get someone killed,they have an awareness of this before they take that first drink and second drink and so on,and step into a car with the keys,they know its wrong,they know they can get someone killed but carry on regardless..

trad

It might have something to do with the Garda fleet being clapped out and the only mobile offenders they can catch are pedestrians and cyclists.

BostonB

buffalo wrote: »

They would be national statistics, and the statement is about Dublin, where there would obviously be a higher concentration of pedestrians and cyclists.

ah, I'm still suspicious of these stats any links to them?

buffalo

BostonB wrote: »

ah, I'm still suspicious of these stats any links to them?

I just followed your link! :pac:

BostonB

The journal talks about them but doesn't link to them. Maybe I'm missing it?

buffalo

BostonB wrote: »

http://www.garda.ie/Controller.aspx?Page=1368&Lang=1

I don't see them on the journal site... do you mean you missed them on the right hand side at the link above? Which then links to http://www.garda.ie/Controller.aspx?Page=138

BostonB

My point was the stats the Journal is talking about don't make a lot of sense. Maybe if they'd said % of accidents, it would. But it makes no sense to mix cyclists with motorbikers never mind the other groups.Its doesn't seem to tally with any stats we've discussed here in the past. My point about the Garda stats is simply is that's what you expect, cyclist to be quite low with regard to other groups. Drivers and passengers to be the highest, by a big margin. One of the main reasons is there's simply a lot less cyclisst. It doesn't tally with the journals story either, even if they are based on different areas you expect some correlation, not them to be chalk and cheese different.

Seems to be written to focus on negatively on cyclists, and the comments underneath reflect that.

hardCopy

Free Hi-Viz?

buffalo

BostonB wrote: »

Seems to be written to focus on negatively on cyclists, and the comments underneath reflect that.

The comments reflect what they always do, the amount of muppetry on the Internet.

I think it's more of a case that the piece reflects the Garda statement, which is probably a bit of a 'scare' campaign: "Cyclists and pedestrians - be more careful or you'll get run over!"

opti0nal

buffalo wrote: »

I think it's more of a case that the piece reflects the Garda statement, which is probably a bit of a 'scare' campaign: "Cyclists and pedestrians - be more careful or you'll get run over!"

Maybe or maybe not...for the first time in a very long time, I saw a driver pulled over by a Garda traffic car for driving in the bus/cycle lane in on the Howth Road inbound at Killester. Abuse of that lane is near full time, so hopefully passing drivers took notice.

It's good the campaign starts now, people need to get their lights in order before the dark mornings and evenings.

Cookie_Monster

target vulnerable road users

how about targeting the types of road users most likely to cause accidents, rather than those who are likely to be the victim of such people.

Cars with only one headlight, learners driving by themselves, people blocking cycle lanes and clearways, taxis parking everywhere and anywhere, those kind of things.

The campaign really sounds like it's trying to blame cyclists, bikers etc for getting hit in the first place...

Not to mention the terrible road / cycle lane surfaces that probably cause many of the cycling injuries that occur anyway

Undercover Elephant

opti0nal wrote: »

Maybe or maybe not...for the first time in a very long time, I saw a driver pulled over by a Garda traffic car for driving in the bus/cycle lane in on the Howth Road inbound at Killester. Abuse of that lane is near full time, so hopefully passing drivers took notice.

Delightful stretch that. I was once almost sideswiped there ... by an ambulance.

kingoffifa

Undercover Elephant wrote: »

Delightful stretch that. I was once almost sideswiped there ... by an ambulance.

at least the response time would have been quick

monument

Lumping serious injuries and deaths together, as well as lumping cyclists, peds, and motor cyclists together mainly seems to be an RSA thing. Sadly few question it.

I'd only be happy when zero people are killed on the road, but there was one single cyclists killed in Co Dublin in 2010.

Here's the stats: http://cyclingindublin.com/dublin-cyclist-deaths-and-injuries/

tomasrojo

From what I recall of the last such Garda campaign, the cycling fatality totals are actually rather low*, so they lump them in with the much larger pedestrian and motorcyclist figures. Probably because they know in their hearts that cycling is really dangerous, so they need to create some figures to reflect that "reality".

*About 1 a year in Dublin for the last few years, as monument points out.

RobertFoster

monument wrote: »

Lumping serious injuries and deaths together, as well as lumping cyclists, peds, and motor cyclists together mainly seems to be an RSA thing. Sadly few question it.

I'd only be happy when zero people are killed on the road, but there was one single cyclists killed in Co Dublin in 2010.

Here's the stats: http://cyclingindublin.com/dublin-cyclist-deaths-and-injuries/

Not always. I was watching something on the BBC a few months back about paramedics or something. They were tending to some poor chap who'd taken a header off his bike and landed on his face. The voice over dropped in a statistic along the lines of "Every year over 12,000 cyclists are killed or injured in the UK." I had to rewind it as I'd missed the "or injured" part and thought there was a cull on.

Silly statistics to add together when you think about it. A lot more injuries occur than deaths, but you're only going to think the worst if they're lumped together.

You never hear the two together for car accidents. Or even in football... "Every year over 100 players are killed or injured in the Premier League."

tomasrojo

The paramedic show wasn't Helicopter Heroes, was it?

BostonB

I assume you've all seen this lego kit...

http://systemicfailure.wordpress.com/2012/06/04/lego-bike-accident/

kerry4sam

I saw this through the RSA on facebook (here):

Road Safety Authority Ireland
Today we announce the start of An Garda Síochána’s Casualty Reduction Implementation plan in the Dublin Metropolitan Region, running for the next 8 weeks. This follows a decline in the number of road deaths in the Capital over the last number of years; which has resulted in Dublin’s streets becoming the safest of all EU Capital cities. Together, we continue to reduce the number of road users killed and seriously injured, our pedestrians, cyclists, motorcyclists and drivers.

They really have upped their promo work in recent times so Well Done to them for that

Cookie_Monster

RSA wrote:

our pedestrians, cyclists, motorcyclists and drivers.

fuck the horse riders though! :pac:

ednwireland

anyone want togo after hours on this, real quality discussion (even the motors one isnt that bad)

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056769944

buffalo

RobertFoster wrote: »

"Every year over 100 players are killed or injured in the Premier League."

If I was drinking tea, this would've made me spit it out on my keyboard.

morana

didnt see a yellow clad protector of the public anywhere on my 3km commute from North strand to Merrion Sq!

Cookie_Monster

morana wrote: »

didnt see a yellow clad protector of the public anywhere on my 3km commute from North strand to Merrion Sq!

probably parked up keeping the motorway free of the two wheeled menaces

Ole Rodrigo

So I got accosted last night by a guard outside Wongs in Clontarf. He waved me down with one of those neon stick things. I had no idea what was going on. Turned out my front light was too dim and he couldn't see me approach ( it was dipped for the oncoming traffic ). Although I was legally compliant with a front and back light, he said, for Gods sake would I ever put on a hi vis jacket and wear a helmet. And then he sniffed rather haughtily at the torch strapped to the handlebar - a TK11 - and suggested I use somethin a bit less cobbled together, maybe one of those LED ones that were good value and can be seen by people pulling out of their driveway, and then I might not get creamed. It was all I could do but thank him for his advice and off I went.

ThisRegard

Head garda guy was on just before 5 on The Last Word this evening, pretty sad listening. He's coming down hard in this intelligence lead crack down for one, plus he talks about how cyclist are getting better at wearing their high vis clothing.

You can bet that gardai involved in this will be stopping cyclists purely because they're not wearing high vis vests.

Lumen

ThisRegard wrote: »

You can bet that gardai involved in this will be stopping cyclists purely because they're not wearing high vis vests.

I'm sure a quick "I pay your wages" will be enough to settle that argument.

manwithaplan

ThisRegard wrote: »

You can bet that gardai involved in this will be stopping cyclists purely because they're not wearing high vis vests.

But how will they see them?

morana

Just one patrol cAr on th north strand but completely ignored cars parked in wrong place, wheels on path etc. but i made sure i didnt scratch myself just in case they were cracking down on that as well!

BostonB

manwithaplan wrote: »

But how will they see them?

LOL.

Zyzz

Will they be pulling people over for breaking red lights?

Edit: Re-read the Irish Times Article, and yes they are. Thank the lord, I have better things to be doing than passing cyclists and telling them that we stop at red lights aswel.

OssianSmyth

http://www.herald.ie/news/garda-blitz-on-daredevil-city-cyclists-3248034.html

Hare-dild wrote:

Garda blitz on daredevil city cyclists
By Clodagh Sheehy
Tuesday October 02 2012

CYCLISTS who break lights and road laws will be saddled with harsh penalties after gardai launched a new offensive in the capital.

The clampdown comes as part of the Casualty Reduction Implementation Plan was launched.

Figures showed three quarters of those killed or seriously injured in city road accidents were cyclists or pedestrians....

Wishbone Ash

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

how about targeting the types of road users most likely to cause accidents

In fairness though, many cyclists put themselves in danger and are likely to cause accidents.

ror_74 wrote: »

He waved me down with one of those neon stick things. I had no idea what was going on. Turned out my front light was too dim and he couldn't see me approach

If he couldn't see you approach, how did he know you existed?

Ole Rodrigo

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

If he couldn't see you approach, how did he know you existed?

I think that neon stick might be a magic wand, or something

monument

ror_74 wrote: »

So I got accosted last night by a guard outside Wongs in Clontarf. He waved me down with one of those neon stick things. I had no idea what was going on. Turned out my front light was too dim and he couldn't see me approach ( it was dipped for the oncoming traffic ). Although I was legally compliant with a front and back light, he said, for Gods sake would I ever put on a hi vis jacket and wear a helmet. And then he sniffed rather haughtily at the torch strapped to the handlebar - a TK11 - and suggested I use somethin a bit less cobbled together, maybe one of those LED ones that were good value and can be seen by people pulling out of their driveway, and then I might not get creamed. It was all I could do but thank him for his advice and off I went.

That would have been priceless if recorded on camera. But brilliant all the same.

tomasrojo

OssianSmyth wrote: »

http://www.herald.ie/news/garda-blitz-on-daredevil-city-cyclists-3248034.html

Figures showed three quarters of those killed or seriously injured in city road accidents were cyclists or pedestrians....

They've decided to target the group that makes up at most about 5 percentage points of the 75%. So if they get cyclist KSIs down to zero, they can re-apply the same logic next year, "cyclist and pedestrians make up 70% of those killed or seriously injured in city road accidents", and target cyclists again.

BostonB

I don't see the point of newspapers that don't report news or facts. But simply jumble nonsense together to make a story.

BostonB

The number of Irish road deaths fell to 212 in 2010, the lowest level on record, down 26 from 2009. The Government’s road safety target of achieving no more than 252 deaths per annum by the end of 2012 was achieved three years ahead of schedule.

The 212 who died consisted of 44 pedestrians, 5 cyclists, 91 drivers, 55 passengers and 17 bikers.

Who do they target, who do they put in the headlines, the cyclists.

opti0nal

BostonB wrote: »

I don't see the point of newspapers that don't report news or facts. But simply jumble nonsense together to make a story.

You're describing the Indo and the Herald to a tee. Junk media. Some people like that sort of thing.

The bit about 'unofficial crossing points' is questionable. You're only obliged to use a crossing if you're within 15 metres of one. Hopefully, the Gardai won't be inventing another fictitious law like the 'wear a high vis' law.

ednwireland

how come the rest of us arent subject to the garda waving there "wands" at us bloomin dubs hogging all the good stuff (although here they would have to stop me - every time they see me cos i'm pretty much the only person cycling into work) i'd love them to tell me my 1.5 watts of rear lights and 2500 lumens between 2 front lights wasnt enough

DirkVoodoo

Very disappointed.

Went out to Belfield to collect my lock, then cycled back into town to go to Nassau street.

Not. A. Single. Garda.

Plenty of law breaking from all corners, I felt like I was taking my life in my own hands. People breeze through red lights, cars change lanes or take turns aggressively and without indicating and pedestrians walk like lemmings onto the road.

Had a (good looking) girl walk out in front of me at the top of Stephen's Green, shouted and tried to brake, of course the bike straightened up from it's turning arc and made a beeline for her. Shouted "Jesus Christ!" more at the inevitable impact which never came and got a hoity-D4 "Jesus You!" in reply.

Thankfully most of my journeys in rush hour are on quieter roads than Leeson street.

smackyB

Campaign off to a good start yesterday, was coming up to the crossroads at Donnybrook church heading south. Car comes up behind and cuts across me trying to turn left - she would have wiped me out had I not shouted and braked heavily. Turned around to give out to her and she's looking sheepishly at me with her f*cking phone in one hand. Moron. Was too shocked to clock her reg, time to get a helmet cam I think.

M1XR

Quick Question: Are bicycle lights obliged to be used under law? Where is this written?

Surveyor11

M1XR wrote: »

Quick Question: Are bicycle lights obliged to be used under law? Where is this written?

Yes, relevant legislation is here: http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1963/en/si/0189.html


Flashing lights legal since 2009

Zyzz

Im sure there will be a lot of 'wand waving' in the next few weeks..



..unfortunately not the signal type wands :pac:

Surveyor11

Do you mean http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Nescafe%20bean%20shaker ?