UPC Cisco EPC3925: Enabling True Bridge Mode - A Simple How-to Guide

ED E

Thats my point, the onboard SoC falls over when doing no work never mind actually directing packets and doing FWing.

BTW in bridge mode it still routes private SIP and management traffic so it does a bit more than say a dumb modem.

DECEiFER

Hi all,

I thought I should post a message here given that it could be an end of an era. What some of you might be aware of already, and some will soon be aware of, Virgin Media are keeping up with their annual tradition of offering us loyal customers a fantastic deal of Sh1t-Fúck-All for the low-low price (increase) of €2.50 per month (for Broadband only customers, and €4 if you have TV and Broadband). Emails are being rolled out to customers on a phased basis, depending on when your billing date is. I got mine in today. In the email, if you have 240Mb and haven't already upgraded to the new Hub, they are offering you the opportunity to get it without penalty (apart from the price increase, that is). The reason I said "Sh1t-Fúck-All" before was it doesn't matter whether you had the Hub or not before the email came in and for reasons I'll explain below, it might not be a good idea to take the plunge.

I finally said goodbye to my EPC3925 earlier this week, coincedentally enough, and got the Hub in Modem (Bridge) mode before I knew of any price increase. I rang them up to see if I was eligible to get it, and the (Irish) lady on the phone was very quick to tell me I was (she was a breath of fresh air compared to dealing with the Filipinos; she knew exactly what she was talking about). So I ordered the Hub at 4:30pm on Monday evening and it was delivered by Nightline the following morning with a redirect to my work address. Fantastic, right? Debatable, because I'm not 100% happy with it. It's slow as all hell to boot up. It doesn't seem to allow IP changes based on your third-party router's / PC MAC address, so it probably uses the internal switch's one regardless of whether it's in Router or Modem mode. Those are little niggles, for sure, but the modem also shows more stats in relation to the channels and I'm getting a fúck of a lot of Pre RS Errors (the 3925 never showed any RS error stats, as you know). It's worrying, even though those are corrected errors, because it could be a symptom of a bigger problem - which may be completely unrelated to the modem and just in the area. To highlight, I get about a million per channel after only a few minutes uptime and it rapidly climbs from there. A friend in another part of the city is on the Hub as well and he's getting lots of Pre and Post RS Errors. Another issue is that pinging Google.ie ends up being closer to 20ms rather than 10ms for both of us with a notable amount of spikes to over 100ms per 100 pings done. Could it be related? I couldn't tell you. The lack of stats in the 3925 could merely have been masking a problem, but I cannot ignore the increase of latency to Google with the odd spikes. I wish I could test my 3925 alongside it - it was fine when I last checked a week or more ago - but naturally they deactivated it (and did so before I'd even connected my Hub, long before I got home). The 3925 I use in the office still pings Google at the normal 9-12ms. They're in different areas of the city but only 5-6km by road (not as the crow flies) apart. All said, though, speeds seemed fine when I last checked on the night of installation, and I'm not getting any disconnections (so far) and I did a few hours of GTA Online last night as well without incident.

I doubt there's any going back even though I still have the 3925. Besides, I think the 3925 was misbehaving a bit as it would often throw the LAN port down to 100Mbps (Orange LED) which required a plug out and back in to restore it to 1Gbps (Green LED), so I decided it was time for a change based on that. In the office this has never happened, so I figured it might be fault with my own - which on Saturday last kicked me out of two Heist setups in GTA Online (and for anyone who knows how tedious it is due to the snail's pace at which one (re)connects to the game, will feel the pain). Could it be my router? I got an ASUS RT-AC68U earlier this year and it did happen the odd time when my WNDR3700 was plugged into it as well (though not as frequently as in the last few weeks). Either way, I decided to get the Hub figuring that it would be for the best. I'm on the fence still, and wanted you all to hear of my experiences before making the choice yourselves. It's an enticing offer because they don't impose a charge or change to your contract for taking them up on it, so just be aware of it.

Oh, the setup process is absolutely bollixed. The amount of times I had to reboot the thing (and as noted earlier, it takes fairly long to do so) because it wouldn't accept the initial password change (which is mandatory) but instead flipped you back to the login and made you do it again and again until you finally reboot and try again - and this was a cross-browser issue. I'm sure the software is buggy but since it's no longer a brand-new device, you'd have expected these things to be sorted by now. Maybe it was just me? Again, I don't know. It happened when I set it up at work and after I factory reset it at home. It's worth noting, though.

DECEiFER

Did a reboot nearly 20 minutes ago where there was 6 billion+ Pre RS Errors per channel. Less than 20 minutes in, there is 32 million+. Post RS Errors before the reboot were in the tens of thousands on some channels but not all. I forgot to take a screenshot but the ones you see in the below screenshot are from the boot process and have been steady since.

DECEiFER

Did a reboot nearly 20 minutes ago where there was 6 billion+ Pre RS Errors per channel. Less than 20 minutes in, there is 32 million+. Post RS Errors before the reboot were in the tens of thousands on some channels but not all. I forgot to take a screenshot but the ones you see in the below screenshot are from the boot process and have been steady since.

Good SND (RxMER) and the power levels are no higher than 5db per channel down to 0dB. So it all looks well, therefore, with so many errors it is difficult to comprehend why.

killswitx

i think the ping issue has to do with network as such not with the modem...the lines are getting upgraded to 240mb as base and that just a too much and gets the pings up but even though the dl speeds are still ok...thats happenning regularly.

well i was googling a bit and i could find that the pre RS error is not of big deal, while post error should we be worried at. i have this hub and have netgear behind it and it works ok....even though i dont play games and other latency very sensitive things so i cant tell much

DECEiFER

killswitx wrote: »

i think the ping issue has to do with network as such not with the modem...the lines are getting upgraded to 240mb as base and that just a too much and gets the pings up but even though the dl speeds are still ok...thats happenning regularly.

well i was googling a bit and i could find that the pre RS error is not of big deal, while post error should we be worried at. i have this hub and have netgear behind it and it works ok....even though i dont play games and other latency very sensitive things so i cant tell much

You could be right and the timing of this could be off. I just never had an issue before this week. Pity about not being able to test both modems on rotation!

I read the same about Pre RS Errors as well but when you see a ton of them compared to what others are getting around the world one can't help but be a bit worried about it. Funnily enough, when I ping hosts from other countries I'm not seeing as much of an increase. It's not just Google.ie at home. Even Boards.ie is slightly higher than the usual. I'm willing to see if it gets corrected in the next while before bringing it to VM's attention.

I figured I best make a post about it all the same. My recommendation is to keep the 3925 unless it's giving you hassle. Someone PM'd me last night and said the LAN port is constantly orange for him, so he's effectively capped at 100Mbps as a result. If it's because of a fault in the 3925, then you should absolutely replace it with the Hub. So if there are no issues with your 3925s, I'd hang onto them for as long as it's feasible (so long as you're on packages of less than 300Mb, where the modem would top out).

cruhoortwunk

Any reason why it would keep switching back to routing mode? I set it to bridge, apply and when I go back to check it has reverted.

DECEiFER

cruhoortwunk wrote: »

Any reason why it would keep switching back to routing mode? I set it to bridge, apply and when I go back to check it has reverted.

Unless the modem just needs a kick in the hole (a factory reset) then it sounds as though the DOCSIS config file is making it do so, which is in the hands of Virgin Media. They made an "error" over a year ago that made all our 3925 modems revert but soon after "fixed" it with an apology given and we were back in business.

You have two options. You can post over in the Virgin Media Talk To forum and see if they can help you there (don't bother with phone support - they possibly won't have a clue what you're on about), or you can opt to take on the new Hub. I believe they'll give you it for free with no contract extensions. I took advantage of it at the end of 2016 and it's working out good. My concerns noted above aren't really concerns. I've had good stability and in "Modem Mode" I still get to use my router as intended. I got one for my folks as well to replace that awful Horizon box modem/router and it's working out great for them, too. If you're really set on keeping the 3925 then go to the Virgin Media Talk To forum or PM Virgin Media: Reps and ask about the issue you're having directly.

Tinder Surprise

DECEiFER wrote: »

Unless the modem just needs a kick in the hole (a factory reset) then it sounds as though the DOCSIS config file is making it do so, which is in the hands of Virgin Media. They made an "error" over a year ago that made all our 3925 modems revert but soon after "fixed" it with an apology given and we were back in business.

You have two options. You can post over in the Virgin Media Talk To forum and see if they can help you there (don't bother with phone support - they possibly won't have a clue what you're on about), or you can opt to take on the new Hub. I believe they'll give you it for free with no contract extensions. I took advantage of it at the end of 2016 and it's working out good. My concerns noted above aren't really concerns. I've had good stability and in "Modem Mode" I still get to use my router as intended. I got one for my folks as well to replace that awful Horizon box modem/router and it's working out great for them, too. If you're really set on keeping the 3925 then go to the Virgin Media Talk To forum or PM Virgin Media: Reps and ask about the issue you're having directly.

Selfish I know ...but I'm delighted you've moved over to the new hub.

I've still got my 3925 running and you where a great help with me setting it up way back when - least now i know if/when the inevitable occurs and i need to change over then you've trail blazed for all us mere numpties.:pac:

degsie

Still have my trusty 3925 running in bridged mode @ 120Mb/s. Would this be able to handle 240Mb if I were to upgrade?

DECEiFER

degsie wrote: »

Still have my trusty 3925 running in bridged mode @ 120Mb/s. Would this be able to handle 240Mb if I were to upgrade?

Yup. It'd take nearly 300 (on 8 downstream channels). I had 240Mb/s for the last few years on it until late last year when I got the Hub.

DECEiFER

Tinder Surprise wrote: »

Selfish I know ...but I'm delighted you've moved over to the new hub.

I've still got my 3925 running and you where a great help with me setting it up way back when - least now i know if/when the inevitable occurs and i need to change over then you've trail blazed for all us mere numpties.:pac:

Ahahaha. It was the only reason why I was open to changing. I felt that it was possible my 3925 was beginning to show its age due to the odd time the LAN port jumping to 100Mbps (orange light) out of nowhere. It was only happening the odd time (and increasing slowly in frequency) but before it got out of hand and while there was a free upgrade, I went ahead and took the plunge. I still have a 3925 at the office and it never jumps to 100Mbps (though it is flashed with their special SME firmware for bridge mode rather than triggering it with the menu in ours).

On the Hub, I still note that the domestic ping times are higher and more erratic than on the 3925. I honestly can't say why. Take Google.ie, for one example; you'd get the odd jump but it'd be 10-12ms most of the time. It's more like 12-20ms with the Hub, with regular enough spikes into the 20s. International ping times don't appear affected and are very consistent. Like BBC.com or some servers I ping'd in Sweden - I haven't noticed any major increase and the consistency is much better. Not a big deal as domestic ping times are low enough to notice no difference in reality and gaming-wise, most servers aren't in Ireland (at least that I know of) so a ping of 30-50ms is quite acceptable. Still, I have no idea why it only affects domestic servers...but I'm happy overall and have no plans to cry about it as is.

Tinder Surprise

DECEiFER wrote: »

Ahahaha. It was the only reason why I was open to changing. I felt that it was possible my 3925 was beginning to show its age due to the odd time the LAN port jumping to 100Mbps (orange light) out of nowhere. It was only happening the odd time (and increasing slowly in frequency) but before it got out of hand and while there was a free upgrade, I went ahead and took the plunge. I still have a 3925 at the office and it never jumps to 100Mbps (though it is flashed with their special SME firmware for bridge mode rather than triggering it with the menu in ours).

On the Hub, I still note that the domestic ping times are higher and more erratic than on the 3925. I honestly can't say why. Take Google.ie, for one example; you'd get the odd jump but it'd be 10-12ms most of the time. It's more like 12-20ms with the Hub, with regular enough spikes into the 20s. International ping times don't appear affected and are very consistent. Like BBC.com or some servers I ping'd in Sweden - I haven't noticed any major increase and the consistency is much better. Not a big deal as domestic ping times are low enough to notice no difference in reality and gaming-wise, most servers aren't in Ireland (at least that I know of) so a ping of 30-50ms is quite acceptable. Still, I have no idea why it only affects domestic servers...but I'm happy overall and have no plans to cry about it as is.

Hi,
I finally taken the plunge and took Virgin up on a great offer.
I'm going to receive their new Hub and Horizon Tv stb (using just for tv) during the week.
I have the option just to stick with the Cisco3925 but feck it, may as well bridge the new Hub and use that instead.

So question if you don't mind....
At present my Cisco 3925 is bridged to my Asus router.
Is it just a case putting the new Hub into bridge mode and hot swapping the 3925 out?
Or is there some LAN configuration (I.p's) to be completed first?

Sorry it's just been so long since I bridged the 3925 into the Asus... I'm a bit rusty!

Tinder Surprise

Tinder Surprise wrote: »

Hi,
I finally taken the plunge and took Virgin up on a great offer.
I'm going to receive their new Hub and Horizon Tv stb (using just for tv) during the week.
I have the option just to stick with the Cisco3925 but feck it, may as well bridge the new Hub and use that instead.

So question if you don't mind....
At present my Cisco 3925 is bridged to my Asus router.
Is it just a case putting the new Hub into bridge mode and hot swapping the 3925 out?
Or is there some LAN configuration (I.p's) to be completed first?

Sorry it's just been so long since I bridged the 3925 into the Asus... I'm a bit rusty!

The change in modem may result in you being moved to DS-Lite, which will require you to request a change back to IPv4. One you're on v4, bridging the hub is all you need to do.

Tinder Surprise

Karsini wrote: »

The change in modem may result in you being moved to DS-Lite, which will require you to request a change back to IPv4. One you're on v4, bridging the hub is all you need to do.

Thanks!

Yea I will be keeping a close eye on my IPv4 address and make sure there's no change.

sulc84

modem3925.jpg


Any chance I can bridge this one ?

54and56

First of all thanks @DECEiFER and others who have gone to the trouble of putting this together.

I'm going to have a go at setting up Bridge Mode on my Virgin business UPC Cisco EPC3925 and note the need for a web browser or browser extension that is capable of live manipulation of a website's HTML source code.

I have both Chrome and Firefox installed. Will either of those do the trick or do I need to install Opera?