Parades commission is useless and toothless

Fenian Army

Border-Rat wrote: »

This stuff doesn't really anger me anymore. Parades will cease to be a problem for us within 50 years. Certainly within a hundred. The people here with the uphill battle are the hatemongers, like the Orange Lodge. Loyalism is Counter-Cultural. It feeds off discontent and attention. Its lifeline in the North in he past 50 years has been a) An insecure Catholic minority and b) Outright conflict. These two feeding elements have been removed from the picture. Obviously, the conflict has ended. But more importantly Catholics in the North are beginning to find confidence, not least due to growing demographics (And a heightened status thanks to the IRA).

Never again will Catholics in the North be victims. This is a result of the ceasefire Downing St agreed to and the aforementioned demographics shift. The majority of people under 27 here now are Catholic. We are slowly taking over the institution and nerve centre of the 06 Counties. This means growth in relaxation, confidence and power - the exact antithesis to Loyalism. With that change in demography means change in culture. The overall body will eventually kill off germs - this is completely natural.

The future greening of Northern Ireland means death to Loyalism. Their hegemony is gone and next to go will be Catholics giving a damn about their protests. Eventually we'll own the Police, the civil service and anything else of importance.

All we have to do is wait - and astute Unionists who nowadays indulge in victimhood know it.

At the end of the September there is a massive parade going to Stormont - remembering the Ulster covenant, and it will pass by the church in question. This should not happen imo. Find an alternative route.

southsiderosie

George Walker wrote: »

Bands have been going for centuries. There will always be Ulster Protestants in Bands and celebrating the Protestant culture they have. You might not like it but you have to get over it.

Well done on this band sticking up for their rights as a people.

George Walker wrote: »

What have you got against George Walker? Stick to the topic.

George Walker wrote: »

No. They will march past the Church. You won't be able to stop them fenian.

MOD NOTE:

Permabanned

woodoo

Originally Posted by George Walker
Bands have been going for centuries. There will always be Ulster Protestants in Bands and celebrating the Protestant culture they have. You might not like it but you have to get over it.

Well done on this band sticking up for their rights as a people.


______________________________________________________

They may join bands but the days of them bothering ordinary decent people in their neighbourhoods, homes and churches is going to be a thing of the past soon. Especially as Northern Ireland continues on the road to civilisation. All down hill from here on George/Kieth.. the glory days are over.

junder

woodoo wrote: »

Originally Posted by George Walker
Bands have been going for centuries. There will always be Ulster Protestants in Bands and celebrating the Protestant culture they have. You might not like it but you have to get over it.

Well done on this band sticking up for their rights as a people.


______________________________________________________

They may join bands but the days of them bothering ordinary decent people in their neighbourhoods, homes and churches is going to be a thing of the past soon. Especially as Northern Ireland continues on the road to civilisation. All down hill from here on George/Kieth.. the glory days are over.

Band membership is on the increase and more bands are starting up the length and breadth of the uk. Even in towns and villages were Protestants are very much the minority there are bands being formed.

woodoo

junder wrote: »

Band membership is on the increase and more bands are starting up the length and breadth of the uk. Even in towns and villages were Protestants are very much the minority there are bands being formed.

There is an increase in bands in the south too. But they are not a problem. It is the antagonistic loyal and orange bands up north that cause the problems. I still believe the days of them closing down roads and neighbourhoods they are not welcome in from June to August is going to be a thing of the past.

Someone some day is going to say to the likes of that loyalist band that marched outside the catholic church - no more, thats it. You won't march there again. And the organs of the state will enforce it.

woodoo

By the way what the hell was Pat Doherty of Sinn Fein doing helping one of those bands from castlederg apply for money.

junder

woodoo wrote: »

junder wrote: »

Band membership is on the increase and more bands are starting up the length and breadth of the uk. Even in towns and villages were Protestants are very much the minority there are bands being formed.

There is an increase in bands in the south too. But they are not a problem. It is the antagonistic loyal and orange bands up north that cause the problems. I still believe the days of them closing down roads and neighbourhoods they are not welcome in from June to August is going to be a thing of the past.

Someone some day is going to say to the likes of that loyalist band that marched outside the catholic church - no more, thats it. You won't march there again. And the organs of the state will enforce it.

I guess you didn't understand what I said, loyalist / unionist flute bands are on the increase the length and breadth of the uk even in towns and villages where Protestants are very much the minority there are new loyslist / unionist bands forming and lets not forget my band that's 130 years old and still going strong.

woodoo

junder wrote: »

I guess you didn't understand what I said, loyalist / unionist flute bands are on the increase the length and breadth of the uk even in towns and villages where Protestants are very much the minority there are new loyslist / unionist bands forming and lets not forget my band that's 130 years old and still going strong.

Thats fine but you haven't understood the point i'm making. Nobody gives a damn if these bands march in non contentious areas. I don't see them having carte blanche to just march where they please in future. They will be stopped from going to places they are not welcome. Its the only way things can progress peacefully in the north.

junder

woodoo wrote: »

junder wrote: »

I guess you didn't understand what I said, loyalist / unionist flute bands are on the increase the length and breadth of the uk even in towns and villages where Protestants are very much the minority there are new loyslist / unionist bands forming and lets not forget my band that's 130 years old and still going strong.

Thats fine but you haven't understood the point i'm making. Nobody gives a damn if these bands march in non contentious areas. I don't see them having carte blanche to just march where they please in future. They will be stopped from going to places they are not welcome. Its the only way things can progress peacefully in the north.

Define not wanted, as I have said before on the road my band is from we are the minority, there are many nationalists and republicans that would like to see us put of the road, problem is we still live there to, it's still as much out road as thiers, are we going to get put of the road? Is it right that we could put of our road?

woodoo

junder wrote: »

Define not wanted, as I have said before on the road my band is from we are the minority, there are many nationalists and republicans that would like to see us put of the road, problem is we still live there to, it's still as much out road as thiers, are we going to get put of the road? Is it right that we could put of our road?

If the majority in an area don't want it then it shouldn't happen. If you are in a minority on your road and the majority don't want your band marching there then you should not be allowed march there imo. Ordinary people should not be hemmed into their houses so you can get dolled up like something from the 17th century to plod up and down the road all through the summer.

Chuck Stone

junder wrote: »

loyalist / unionist flute bands are on the increase the length and breadth of the uk

Could you provide a source for this please.

junder

woodoo wrote: »

junder wrote: »

Define not wanted, as I have said before on the road my band is from we are the minority, there are many nationalists and republicans that would like to see us put of the road, problem is we still live there to, it's still as much out road as thiers, are we going to get put of the road? Is it right that we could put of our road?

If the majority in an area don't want it then it shouldn't happen. If you are in a minority on your road and the majority don't want your band marching there then you should not be allowed march there imo. Ordinary people should not be hemmed into their houses so you can get dolled up like something from the 17th century to plod up and down the road all through the summer.

So it's majorty rule then is it, what if a black Jamaican steel band wanted to parade and the majority didn't want them parading with thier steel drums, should they get put of the road?

Moreover innour case Who exactly gets hemmed in? We have two police bikes and a handful of police officers on foot and in normal uniform to escort us up
The road, shops dont close, traffic still moves(all be it slower then usual until we pass) people come and go from thier houses

junder

Chuck Stone wrote: »

junder wrote: »

loyalist / unionist flute bands are on the increase the length and breadth of the uk

Could you provide a source for this please.

Sorry chum it's anecdotal evidence, it comes from going to band parades and talking to members of new bands and hearing of other new bands

Chuck Stone

junder wrote: »

Sorry chum it's anecdotal evidence, it comes from going to band parades and talking to members of new bands and hearing of other new bands

Well in fairness you made the claim as if it were an fact. Anecdotal evidence is unreliable.

The expression anecdotal evidence refers to evidence from anecdotes. Because of the small sample, there is a larger chance that it may be unreliable due to cherry-picked or otherwise non-representative samples of typical cases. Anecdotal evidence is considered dubious support of a claim; it is accepted only in lieu of more solid evidence. This is true regardless of the veracity of individual claims.

Source

Dubhlinner

woodoo wrote: »

If the majority in an area don't want it then it shouldn't happen. If you are in a minority on your road and the majority don't want your band marching there then you should not be allowed march there imo. Ordinary people should not be hemmed into their houses so you can get dolled up like something from the 17th century to plod up and down the road all through the summer.

That doesn't work somewhere like north belfast where you have enclaves of catholic & protestant areas interspersed how is a band supposed to get from their base to the city centre

Fenian Army

Dubhlinner wrote: »

That doesn't work somewhere like north belfast where you have enclaves of catholic & protestant areas interspersed how is a band supposed to get from their base to the city centre

You compromise and let them march in silence with no paramilitary flags etc while they are in contested areas.

There wasn't that much of an issue with the route in question till the band acted the dick, that has snowballed and you had a whole parade march pass the church playing sectarian songs. When you take the piss like that the local community understandably will want no bands marching at all.

Dubhlinner

Fenian Army wrote: »

You compromise and let them march in silence with no paramilitary flags etc while they are in contested areas.

There wasn't that much of an issue with the route in question till the band acted the dick, that has snowballed and you had a whole parade march pass the church playing sectarian songs. When you take the piss like that the local community understandably will want no bands marching at all.

of the same opinion myself.that band should be banned marching anywhere they're not wanted next year to discourage that kind of behaviour

woodoo

Fenian Army wrote: »

You compromise and let them march in silence with no paramilitary flags etc while they are in contested areas.

There wasn't that much of an issue with the route in question till the band acted the dick, that has snowballed and you had a whole parade march pass the church playing sectarian songs. When you take the piss like that the local community understandably will want no bands marching at all.

That is hard to avoid as many are more interested in the confrontation that the culture.

Fenian Army

Dubhlinner wrote: »

of the same opinion myself.that band should be banned marching anywhere they're not wanted next year to discourage that kind of behaviour

They are due to march again at the end of this month AFAIK, be interesting to see what happens.

Chuck Stone

Fenian Army wrote: »

They are due to march again at the end of this month AFAIK, be interesting to see what happens.

I think the concerned locals are going to talk with representatives of the marchers (it was on the news). The Locals came out and said they are not seeking to stop the march and that they are just asking that the marchers exercise a bit of control when they pass the church.

Very dignified.

(this is from memory - I can't find the clip)

A body supporting loyalist marches has accepted an offer to engage in talks with a north Belfast priest, after violence erupted outside his church during Saturday's Black Institution Parades.

u.tv/News

Edit.

Residents of Carrick Hill said at a public meeting they wanted respect from the Loyal Orders, not re-routing.

bbc.co.uk/news

Dubhlinner

Chuck Stone wrote: »

I think the concerned locals are going to talk with representatives of the marchers (it was on the news). The Locals came out and said they are not seeking to stop the march and that they are just asking that the marchers exercise a bit of control when they pass the church.

Very dignified.

(this is from memory - I can't find the clip)



Edit.

it was a very dignified and reasonable response it must be said. I wonder is it over-appeasing though. I think for the parades commission system to work there needs to be a dynamic in place that misbehavior like playing the famine song has a proportionate response.

junder

What the actually want is that no band plays from carlise circus until the end of donegall street which is not as unconditional as that are making out. Should this matter be dropped I believe that the loyal orders wil refrain from playing past the chapel on donegall street. The choice to play on Black Sunday was done as a protest against the parades commission and no other reason

Fenian Army

Over appeasement imo.

They flouted the rules, so did numerous other bands and were supported by Unionist politicians in doing so. The book needs to be thrown at them, it's no time for the croppies to lie down, so to speak.

Fenian Army

junder wrote: »

What the actually want is that no band plays from carlise circus until the end of donegall street which is not as unconditional as that are making out. Should this matter be dropped I believe that the loyal orders wil refrain from playing past the chapel on donegall street. The choice to play on Black Sunday was done as a protest against the parades commission and no other reason

What do you think of the bands actions? Good, or bad?

They protested against the parades commission by playing the Sash outside a church? Was the PC not correct in banning the band for playing sectarian songs outside a church? If not, why?

junder

Fenian Army wrote: »

junder wrote: »

What the actually want is that no band plays from carlise circus until the end of donegall street which is not as unconditional as that are making out. Should this matter be dropped I believe that the loyal orders wil refrain from playing past the chapel on donegall street. The choice to play on Black Sunday was done as a protest against the parades commission and no other reason

What do you think of the bands actions? Good, or bad?

They protested against the parades commission by playing the Sash outside a church? Was the PC not correct in banning the band for playing sectarian songs outside a church? If not, why?

What actually is sectarian about the sash?

Fenian Army

junder wrote: »

What actually is sectarian about the sash?

I never said the Sash was Sectarian, I was referring to the famine song. Care to address the rest of my post?

Fenian Army

Regardless the Sash is clearly provocative and is used as such to stir things up - hence why it was sung.

getzls

Fenian Army wrote: »

Regardless the Sash is clearly provocative and is used as such to stir things up - hence why it was sung.

Provocative? Who too? Not any reasonable person imo.

Fenian Army

getzls wrote: »

Provocative? Who too? Not any reasonable person imo.

Lets not get bogged down in talking about the sash, I was referring to the famine song, but fwiw many nationalists think the Sash is provocative. Regardless they were not supposed to play ANY music outside the church.

junder

Fenian Army wrote: »

junder wrote: »

What actually is sectarian about the sash?

I never said the Sash was Sectarian, I was referring to the famine song. Care to address the rest of my post?

You mentioned the sash, not the famine song