New Dublin Bus GT Class

devnull

Victor wrote: »

In fairness, if stops were of adequate size and weren't obstructed, this argument would stand up a lot more.

If this was a topic where only those such stops are not using the middle doors I'd agree, but most drivers are refusing to use them when this does not apply.

dublinbusdude

River Song wrote: »

Since Ringsend got the GTs, I've been seein the odd R/End AV on the 54a. Any reason?

Also was on GT7* tonight on the 49. Grand as always.

Either it was GT77 or GT78 as I saw both on 49 yesterday.

Sometimes a Donnybrook could take by mistake a Ringsend bus. It happend in August. See here: http://dublinbusstuff.com/PhotoWeek/RV598.html

BlueCam

I was on a new-style 46A bus this evening. Noticed that the driver never once used the middle doors so as I was getting off at Parnell Square (where there was plenty of space on a quiet evening for two doors to be opened safely), I pressed the button and pointedly waited by the middle doors. Of course, they were not opened. As I walked by the driver I asked him why not and he said that he was "not allowed" to use the middle doors. Is there or is there not an order from DB management to not use these doors? If so, this is really beyond stupid. If not, then drivers need to be told to use their vehicles appropriately, or else they should be reprimanded. Seems rather simple.

dfx-

Though I'm not the greatest fan of the GTs yet (they're replacing some excellent AVs and good RVs, AV1 has just been retired:( ), it seems to be prevalent on Donnybrook routes, re: the non-opening of middle doors.

AlekSmart

BlueCam wrote: »

I was on a new-style 46A bus this evening. Noticed that the driver never once used the middle doors so as I was getting off at Parnell Square (where there was plenty of space on a quiet evening for two doors to be opened safely), I pressed the button and pointedly waited by the middle doors. Of course, they were not opened. As I walked by the driver I asked him why not and he said that he was "not allowed" to use the middle doors. Is there or is there not an order from DB management to not use these doors? If so, this is really beyond stupid. If not, then drivers need to be told to use their vehicles appropriately, or else they should be reprimanded. Seems rather simple.

Basically BlueCam,you encountered one of the less motivated Drivers.

If twas myself and I had reservations concerning their use I would say it straight to yer face.

As in....

I am not using them

Saying he's "Not Allowed" simply goes to show this lads reliance on somebody else to do his thinking,however this attitude is far from Busdriver specific in modern Ireland.

To answer your question regarding an "Order"...NO there is not an order,as the issue is covered by a registered judgement of the Labour Court and there the matter rests.

As it currently stands,the Centre Door situation now arises in 80 vehicles out of a total of c.900 so thre is no great focus on the issue.

IF the NTA decide to continue with the Dual Door configuration and future vehicle orders encapsulate it,then the problem will,in traditional Irish style,get significantly greater.

However,if the NTA have a Pauline Conversion,and revert to single-door spec then the problem disappears...simples !!

WE live in a country whose entire Political and Social Administrative systems are based upon Ambiguity...in EVERYTHING !

There is hardly a facet of our everyday lives where we can see clarity of purpose..it will always be .."Ah sure,ye can't be like that...what about if..etc etc.etc"

Whataboutery has left the Country bankrupt,with apparently nobody able to decide on what to do...even about gettin on or off a Bus.

:rolleyes:

dfx-

How long will it take for the double doors to disintegrate to the standard of the ex-Airlink middle doors...which were (/are) essentially piles of rust if they are neglected..

Rock Steady Edy

Fair dues to you, AlekSmart, for using the two sets of doors.

Their use, in general, is haphazard at best. Of all the things you could get a bee in your bonnet about, and a few Dublin Bus drivers decide it is an issue for them to open the middle doors on a bus. It is this kind of daft unionised behaviour that Michael O'Leary was so good at challenging and reforming at Ryanair.

If I am ready to get off the bus, I will always stand by the middle doors. This is usually, but not always enough to induce the driver open them. Other passengers will follow once they are opened.

In London, the driver always used to open the middle doors a few seconds before the front doors, so departing passengers made space for incoming ones. This would be quite a good trick to get people using the middle doors properly, if all drivers did it.

A driver who fails to use the middle doors ought to be reported. I think the reason people don't challenge the drivers is that they know they could see them again on the same route the next day and understandably don't want to fall out with them. Perhaps the thing to do is just keep a note of the date, route, time, place and bus identification number and send to Dublin Bus fortnightly by email for the appropriate manager to deal with persistent offenders rather than create a scene.

hmmm

First time I saw one on the 25 route today, and the middle doors were not used. If they're not used now, it's going to be hard to train people to use them later. If DB are not going to use them, I suggest the NTA issue the buses to private operators.

LordSutch

This middle door issue is like a virus which has been passed from one generation of Dublin bus drivers to the next! The non opening of the exit doors was an issue in Dublin back in the 70s, the 80s, and the 90s, but then middle doors were got rid of (problem solved), or so we thought . . .
And now the GT class has arrived along with middle/exit doors for a new generation, but the doors are kept shut :cool:

So I wonder did Dublin ask for double deckers with middle doors this time? and if so Why? if the drivers have the choice not to use them.

Cookie_Monster

LordSutch wrote: »

So I wonder did Dublin ask for double deckers with middle doors this time? and if so Why? if the drivers have the choice not to use them.

The NTA specced them for DB as they are necessary to speed up (un)loading and reduce dwell times. DB however cannot force drivers to use them because of the court judgement on safety. It's total nonsense but that's the norm in Ireland.

AlekSmart

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

The NTA specced them for DB as they are necessary to speed up (un)loading and reduce dwell times. DB however cannot force drivers to use them because of the court judgement on safety. It's total nonsense but that's the norm in Ireland.

All quite true,however the NTA seemingly thought the Centre Door would be a magic bullet to address Dwell-Time,whereas they simultaneously added significantly to the same Dwell-Time witha steam powered Integrated Ticketing system..one office not connected to the adjoining one I suspect....?

KD345

One step at a time Alek

Having passengers use two doors does speed up dwell times and hopefully when Leap card develops further we will see further improvements.

Don't Dublin Bus have a driver/union design team who have an input into new buses entering service. It's odd that they allowed the dual door issue get this far without flagging potential problems with drivers.

Tow

Starting to see maintenance issues on these new buses already. For example yesterday the internal display had the wrong route number and but driver could/would not change it, despite it causing confusion and a number of people telling him about. Also the Internet while wifi was present would not allocate an IP address.

LXFlyer

If that happens again - take a note of the bus number and email it to customercomment@dublinbus.ie - that way it'll be logged and maintenance will be advised to resolve it (of course the driver should be logging it too).

onlyup

Doubt I'll see these buses on my route for a long time.

I don't really see the need for the monitors and now everyone will be able to see me :eek:

Cookie_Monster

onlyup wrote: »

I don't really see the need for the monitors and now everyone will be able to see me :eek:

and they couldn't before?

onlyup

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

and they couldn't before?

I'm invisible to the naked eye

I meant that people downstairs can see me while I'm upstairs

miller50841

Tow wrote: »

Starting to see maintenance issues on these new buses already. For example yesterday the internal display had the wrong route number and but driver could/would not change it, despite it causing confusion and a number of people telling him about. Also the Internet while wifi was present would not allocate an IP address.

The driver has no access to any of them systems all the driver can do is start the bus and drive simples;)

AlekSmart

Tow wrote: »

Starting to see maintenance issues on these new buses already. For example yesterday the internal display had the wrong route number and but driver could/would not ? change it, despite it causing confusion and a number of people telling him about. Also the Internet while wifi was present would not allocate an IP address.

Drivers have no input or control into or over the display,won't even notice it unless it's reported to him/her...so it's definitely a "Could not",thank you very much

Victor

AlekSmart wrote: »

Drivers have no input or control into or over the display,won't even notice it unless it's reported to him/her...so it's definitely a "Could not",thank you very much

Don't drivers set the route number with the dials in the cab?

AlekSmart

Victor wrote: »

Don't drivers set the route number with the dials in the cab?

After a fashion Victor.

The route number display is set via the TIM rather than the cab-controller,although it can be used if necessary to vary some of the display locations.

The in-bus displays are all programmed into the TIM and as such cannot be altered from the pre-programmed setting.

etchyed

AlekSmart wrote: »

After a fashion Victor.

The route number display is set via the TIM rather than the cab-controller,although it can be used if necessary to vary some of the display locations.

The in-bus displays are all programmed into the TIM and as such cannot be altered from the pre-programmed setting.

As someone who doesn't drive a bus, I don't understand this. Can the driver set the route or not?

rx8

The driver signs on to the ticket machine,programmes in the route details, and the scrolls are set automatically by the machine.If the bus was to be sent out of service for example, the driver can manually change the scrolls by using the display controller over his head,but only to route numbers from that particular garage, or to some specific signs, such as Farmleigh, Aras an Uachtarain, etc.
He can't change the display over the luggage pen that tells you the next stop,.... this is all linked to a gps system that monitors the location of the bus, and is preprogrammed into the system.

etchyed

rx8 wrote: »

He can't change the display over the luggage pen that tells you the next stop,.... this is all linked to a gps system that monitors the location of the bus, and is preprogrammed into the system.

Then how does that internal display know what route it's on in the first place?

LXFlyer

When the driver inputs the departure onto his ticket machine that dictates what happens on the internal equipment.

However if the link between the two is not working he cannot do anything to fix it.

NiallJS99

I went on a GT on route 4 soon after they were introduced and the driver opened the centre doors every stop. Now drivers never open centre doors. It all works very smoothly in London, drivers open centre doors and all passengers exit through them.

We should all complain to DB or sign a petition about the use of the centre doors.

Run_to_da_hills

NiallJS99 wrote: »

I went on a GT on route 4 soon after they were introduced and the driver opened the centre doors every stop. Now drivers never open centre doors. It all works very smoothly in London, drivers open centre doors and all passengers exit through them.

We should all complain to DB or sign a petition about the use of the centre doors.

They are probably afraid of scumbags hopping on through the middle door without paying while the driver is concentrating on collecting fares.

The solution would be to let passengers off first through the center doors first before they take anyone on through the front.

AlekSmart

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

The solution would be to let passengers off first through the center doors first before they take anyone on through the front.

I've tried this and BOY !!!...does it provoke some extreme reactions....:eek:

AlekSmart

AlekSmart wrote: »

I've tried this and BOY !!!...does it provoke some extreme reactions....:eek:

That's the problem. You could do something by the book but the Irish psyche just doesn't understand it.

Rock Steady Edy

AlekSmart wrote: »

I've tried this and BOY !!!...does it provoke some extreme reactions....:eek:

Like what?

It really annoys me when drivers let off 15 odd people out of the front doors without any attempt to open to the centre ones, and no one is able to get on, especially when its pi**ing it down.

I've been monitoring the sitution on my route and I'd say there's about a 25% driver compliance rate. Sometimes I'll challenge the driver as to why they don't open the centre doors - the answer has not in recent times been a defiant one, because, I suspect, they know they should be using them. So far, when I've asked them why they're not using the middle doors I've had "It's my first day on this bus"; "You should have given me a shout", "I didn't notice there were so many people trying to get off the bus" and one gobsmacked driver who couldn't think of what to say at 7.15 in the morning.