Karting General Discussion -All Karting questions in here

stedabee

Hi I'm wondering if anyone can help me? I'm interested in getting into karting for a Hobbie and was wondering if there's any age limit? I'm 25 and done trails biking for 5 years and now I'm looking for something different!

From what I've came across it doesn't look like anyone races over 18? Any help would be great!

SouperComputer

No idea where you came across that info!
Mix is usually around 50/50. 50% juniors and 50% seniors, give or take. Senior meaning 18+. As lightning said good few drivers in their 50's and some in their 60's still karting.

This fella in the number 2 kart is well over 18 but still pretty quick

stedabee

Many thanks for the replys, that's great news as I really want to get involved. We're could I get more info on this and do you think it would be good to go to a race meeting and see what's involved? I have around €2,500 to spend on a car and say €1,000 for gear etc. is the maintaince of the cars pricey?

ScumLord

This is something me and two friends have been talking about. One of them is mad to buy an old car and go racing with that but I think karting would be a much cheaper and better option all round. We're all in our 30s.

We'd be looking at half your budget though. I've seen karts going for around €750.

SouperComputer

Best get to a track and start chatting to people. Where are you located? €750 sounds a bit too cheap to me. But I'm also 3,600 miles away. I think I'd budget €1500ish for a good, used kart. The classes that are around today arent a lot of maintenance. I would reccomend either Rotax Max or the Super 4 class. I don't think you'll get a super4 for €1500 though so really you are left with Max or KZ as your choice for kart. KZ (gearbox) is not a good idea starting out.

Expenses wise you will want to factor in travel and accommodation costs. Testing and race fees. To get started off you can run throwaways for tyres so they dont have to cost much if anything at all. Can of good chain lube (xermaic is my fave), oil (racing two stroke oil) to mix with the petrol for the kart. Then some money for stuff like chains and sprockets. They last a good while but a trip off the track can ruin them pretty quick if you are unlucky. Of course you'll need suit, helmet, gloves and boots with ankle protection. Other things that come in useful are jets for the carb (adjust according to air density), onboard laptimer/data acqusition system, wet tyres on rims, rib vest/protector. The more of these you can get bundled with your kart the better.

All totally doable on the budget you outlined though. Take a spin out to Tullyallen (whiteriver park) and have a chat with the folks there. Be warned though, once you start racing you mightn't want to stop!

ScumLord

SouperComputer wrote: »

Best get to a track and start chatting to people. Where are you located?

I'm in Galway so my nearest track is Tynagh, I'm not sure how they cater for pro level karting I've gone there twice to do the GP season with a group of friends.

Of course you'll need suit, helmet, gloves and boots with ankle protection.

As there's 3 of us in it I suppose we'll each need a helmet and suit, I assume the rest can be used by all of us. How much would a suit and helmet cost?

All totally doable on the budget you outlined though. Take a spin out to Tullyallen (whiteriver park) and have a chat with the folks there. Be warned though, once you start racing you mightn't want to stop!

I'm already addicted to kart race pro the karting simulator. I don't know whether it's just a good sim but it's easily one of the more enjoyable racing sims I've played so far and I've just spent most of my time on it in testing mode.

SouperComputer

Tynagh\Pallas Karting is one of the best. Czech out this oldschool stuff.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uIE8hveJJ74

Had some great races there in FA back in the day. I took a look on irishkarting.com and they have an MI round on in September 30th. Call the track and see if they have non national races that you can stop by and chat to people at.

Suit wise, kart suits are different to cars. You cannot use a nomex/car suit for karting at least not under MI. Kart suits are abrasion resistant, car suits are not. Depending on your head sizes you might be able to share a helmet too. I'd say you could score a used suit for 100quid handy enough, just check with whatever club you plan racing with to see if they require a certain homologation date/year before you hand over any dough.

Think I might need to type out a "Souper's Guide to Starting Karting" sometime....

ScumLord

SouperComputer wrote: »

Think I might need to type out a "Souper's Guide to Starting Karting" sometime....

That would be great! Maybe a guide on racing for beginners, what's the cheapest way to get into racing. Reading around on karting "to win championships" I've heard of people spending €30,000 euro and others saying it would be cheaper to get into racing actual cars rather than karts.

I think there may be a bit of a stigma around karting though, that it's just for kids or maybe it's to hard for older people to get anywhere in it. I certainly wouldn't be all that competitive weighing 90kg. But I can get just as much enjoyment from beating personal bests and just getting faster. Racing can confuse me and I chase the car in front rather than race the track.

SouperComputer

Buddy of mine weighs 90KG was was running top three at Tullyallen a couple of weekends ago on his €1500 Rotax Max that he pulled out of the back of his Mondeo and slapped it on the track. It can be done, don't listen to the begrudgers! Just because someone else wants to or can spend €20K or more doesn't mean you have to. Back when I raced FA there were stories of some guys spending 60K+ (Punts), but there were also racing on the continent too and that pushed the budget up big time. There are minumim weight limits for the classes so its not a case of "johnnymc20kilios" running away with the race. There are usually heavier classes for more, err, "statured" drivers too.

For sure there's a stigma with the size and age for karts, but at the end of the day its hard to find anything that for the money is....

As fast
Offers as many places to race
Is as easy to transport
Is as competitive (many top drivers come back to karts and stay there)

Age is only one factor. There's guys over here that are quick in their 40's and 50's and some in their 20's that are slower than guys in their 60's LOL.

(Said in my best Mike Strutter Voice) My advise to anyone considering karting is simple...
1) Buy a kart.
2) Do it.

antodeco

Wish I hasn't read this! Now I'm thinking of taking up Karting!

SouperComputer

antodeco wrote: »

Wish I hasn't read this! Now I'm thinking of taking up Karting!

See my advise above. Two simple steps!

antodeco

SouperComputer wrote: »

antodeco wrote: »

Wish I hasn't read this! Now I'm thinking of taking up Karting!

See my advise above. Two simple steps!

I know. That's the issue!

Robbo

SouperComputer wrote: »

Tynagh\Pallas Karting is one of the best. Czech out this oldschool stuff.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uIE8hveJJ74

Had some great races there in FA back in the day. I took a look on irishkarting.com and they have an MI round on in September 30th. Call the track and see if they have non national races that you can stop by and chat to people at.

Memory lane again there Souper. Broken chains wasn't it for Niall and Gary Coby?

SouperComputer

Robbo wrote: »

Memory lane again there Souper. Broken chains wasn't it for Niall and Gary Coby?

Yeah both threw chains. Not sure what it was about the track back then but its seemed to be hard on chains. Its changed a fair bit since then though.

Robbo

SouperComputer wrote: »

Yeah both threw chains. Not sure what it was about the track back then but its seemed to be hard on chains. Its changed a fair bit since then though.

If memory serves, you'd be using all the concrete runoff at the 180 before the main straight to get a good run. The runoff was a bit lower than the main track so I'd imagine the chain could have taken a whack. I think it even happened to me.

Must have been some height differential too as you would have been using maybe a 72 or 74 sprocket?

ScumLord

SouperComputer wrote: »

Yeah both threw chains. Not sure what it was about the track back then but its seemed to be hard on chains. Its changed a fair bit since then though.

When we did the GP session at Tynagh one of their own karts popped a chain on one of the lads.

Charlie-Bravo

Thread hijack: Coverage of Irish Karting Championship is shown on Setanta Ireland at 11am tomorrow morning. Might have a peek at it after F1 FP3.

mick993

Karting is a relatively cheap form of Motorsport. But if you're thinking of getting into it, just don't jump at the first kart you see sub €1500.
There are some genuine bargains out there, but there's also lots of "manure"

Tullyallen karting seems to be the best place to have cheap fun with a kart. They run a Summer & Winter race series, with normally 35 or so seniors entered each race day, spread over 3 classes. They also have bambinos & cadets, along with juniors & super pro classes.

The next race is in Athboy on 12th August. Why not come along to get an idea before you jump & buy something.

SouperComputer

Mick made a good point, there are good karts for 1500, but that doesn't necessarily mean that a 1500 kart is a good one.

Robbo I remember hopping many a chain off going over the original kerbs. The kerbs in the first turn used to be brilliant, you could hold it on two wheels nearly all the way to the second turn. Then they ground the kerbs down Used to love hopping over the original one's with the rusty but trusty '94 CRG. I think what would happen too was the cement dust from the kerbs would dry up a lot of the chain lube.

Here's a quick vid of some of the junior classes earlier this year... http://vimeo.com/41321933

Timmaay

mick993 wrote: »

Tullyallen karting seems to be the best place to have cheap fun with a kart. They run a Summer & Winter race series, with normally 35 or so seniors entered each race day, spread over 3 classes. They also have bambinos & cadets, along with juniors & super pro classes.
.

Are the engines in the Rotax class sealed, like the MSI? I've heard good thinks about Tullyallen, I'm interested in starting out, I've lots of experience with spannering on 2stroke motocross bikes anyways, and would be on a shoestring budget so having to send off the engines is a pain in the hole!

mick993

Timmaay wrote: »

Are the engines in the Rotax class sealed, like the MSI? I've heard good thinks about Tullyallen, I'm interested in starting out, I've lots of experience with spannering on 2stroke motocross bikes anyways, and would be on a shoestring budget so having to send off the engines is a pain in the hole!

Yeah the engines are sealed for points & podium places to be given out.
You could run an un-sealed engine just for "fun" as one or two guys do.

The seals are normally insisted upon to prevent fettling of the engines to give unfair advantage as can happen I'm sure you are aware.

Some classes aren't sealed either way such as KZ (gearbox) & KF3

Next race is in Athboy on 12th August, why not drop over for a look?

stedabee

Many thanks supercomputer! Great advise, I'm searousily considering this as I miss having a Hobbie, I would be willing to go as high as 4k to get a good car and gear, would a kart fit into the back of a range rover or would you need a trailer? I'll be doing this on my own and I'm wondering are all the others that do it friendly, wouldn't want to be sitting there each race day chatting to no one haha!

What do you think is the next step for me? Should I go to a race meeting? How do I decide what class or car I get? I'm 25 weight 100kg mostly muscle haha! Also is it your choice to have a kart with gears?

SouperComputer wrote: »

Buddy of mine weighs 90KG was was running top three at Tullyallen a couple of weekends ago on his €1500 Rotax Max that he pulled out of the back of his Mondeo and slapped it on the track. It can be done, don't listen to the begrudgers! Just because someone else wants to or can spend €20K or more doesn't mean you have to. Back when I raced FA there were stories of some guys spending 60K+ (Punts), but there were also racing on the continent too and that pushed the budget up big time. There are minumim weight limits for the classes so its not a case of "johnnymc20kilios" running away with the race. There are usually heavier classes for more, err, "statured" drivers too.

For sure there's a stigma with the size and age for karts, but at the end of the day its hard to find anything that for the money is....

As fast
Offers as many places to race
Is as easy to transport
Is as competitive (many top drivers come back to karts and stay there)

Age is only one factor. There's guys over here that are quick in their 40's and 50's and some in their 20's that are slower than guys in their 60's LOL.

(Said in my best Mike Strutter Voice) My advise to anyone considering karting is simple...
1) Buy a kart.
2) Do it.

SouperComputer

I would be willing to go as high as 4k to get a good car and gear, would a kart fit into the back of a range rover or would you need a trailer?

That's a decent budget I would say, however be sure to put test & race fees, fuel, accomodation and soforth in there as well. Here's an excel sheet you can use to help: http://www.overt.ie/files/racing/Budget%20Spreadsheet%20blank%20.xls

I recon a range rover would be fine, I've shoved mine in the back of a V70 after pulling the wheels and a sidepod off it and you can shove one into a Mondeo too it seems. Trailer can be handy alright, but its not a necessity.

I'll be doing this on my own and I'm wondering are all the others that do it friendly, wouldn't want to be sitting there each race day chatting to no one haha!

Usually plenty of people to help you at the track. Be sure to let people and the club know you are new so they can keep an eye out for you. Don't be afraid to ask for help.

What do you think is the next step for me? Should I go to a race meeting? How do I decide what class or car I get? I'm 25 weight 100kg mostly muscle haha!

Yep, get to a race and talk to some people. Even with all that muscle I gurantee you'll find muscles you never knew you had when you start kart racing, Your weight might influence the class you run too. But I wouldn't make a no-go decision based on your current weight.

Also is it your choice to have a kart with gears?

I race a KZ2 gearbox and I have non-gearbox kart that I try to get out in whenever I can afford it. That said, I wouldn't reccomend a gearbox kart unless you have previous motorsport experience. Even Schumacher ended up in the weeds when he got into one a few years ago. Initially at least stick with the non-gearbox classes: Rotax Max, Superpro or Bilands and go from there, or indeed stay there as many do.

mick993

I'll suggest to anybody thinking of buying a race kart that maybe the best thing to do is to come along to a race first, introduce yourself and get an idea of what it would be like.
Almost everybody will help you out and it's like a family fun day as we have everything from Bambinos to Grandads out racing.
I often let people out in one of my karts (FOC) just to get a feel for things and am happy to advise on what safety equipment is needed etc and likely costs incurred.
100kg wouldn't be a barrier (I'm more myself & I'm not the biggest guy racing)

Next race day.
Athboy 12th Aug
Probably, Kart City, Santry 26th August.

KylieWyley

I race in a class called Super4 (previously called Biland but we now also run with Swiss Auto). I'm 24 and I'm actually one of the youngest in the class. There are a few second-hand Bilands floating about for sale. The Swiss Autos are newer and so are harder to come by second hand. Prices range from €1500 - €3000 for a second-hand Biland/Swiss Auto.

We're racing this Sunday in Kiltorcan, Kilkenny. It's a round of the national championship and there'll be lots of classes racing. The best thing to do is come down, see what it's all about and ask lots of questions!

You can find out more info here:
www.irishkarting.com

SouperComputer

KylieWyley is that price including a chassis or just engine alone?

stedabee

SouperComputer wrote: »

Yep, get to a race and talk to some people. Even with all that muscle I gurantee you'll find muscles you never knew you had when you start kart racing, Your weight might influence the class you run too. But I wouldn't make a no-go decision based on your current weight.


I race a KZ2 gearbox and I have non-gearbox kart that I try to get out in whenever I can afford it. That said, I wouldn't reccomend a gearbox kart unless you have previous motorsport experience. Even Schumacher ended up in the weeds when he got into one a few years ago. Initially at least stick with the non-gearbox classes: Rotax Max, Superpro or Bilands and go from there, or indeed stay there as many do.

Thanks a mill for all this advise, it's good to hear that classes can depend on weight etc, ye I'll deffo head to a race as soon as I can. Was out with a group of friends at the zone a while ago and my time was 25,678 and the quickest time was 25,300 an that was by my friend who in only 9 1/2 stone which means I was carrying a extra 6 stone more. So annoyed ! Really can't wait to get into this, less drinking at the weekends the liver will be happy haha! I'd say when I jump into a rotax or super I'll be ****ting myself until I get use to it as I'm use to the little slow ones in the zone and kylmore!

stedabee

KylieWyley wrote: »

I race in a class called Super4 (previously called Biland but we now also run with Swiss Auto). I'm 24 and I'm actually one of the youngest in the class. There are a few second-hand Bilands floating about for sale. The Swiss Autos are newer and so are harder to come by second hand. Prices range from €1500 - €3000 for a second-hand Biland/Swiss Auto.

We're racing this Sunday in Kiltorcan, Kilkenny. It's a round of the national championship and there'll be lots of classes racing. The best thing to do is come down, see what it's all about and ask lots of questions!

You can find out more info here:
www.irishkarting.com

No way I'm actually in kilkenny at the mo and will be here for a while, what time would be best to head up?

stedabee

mick993 wrote: »

I'll suggest to anybody thinking of buying a race kart that maybe the best thing to do is to come along to a race first, introduce yourself and get an idea of what it would be like.
Almost everybody will help you out and it's like a family fun day as we have everything from Bambinos to Grandads out racing.
I often let people out in one of my karts (FOC) just to get a feel for things and am happy to advise on what safety equipment is needed etc and likely costs incurred.
100kg wouldn't be a barrier (I'm more myself & I'm not the biggest guy racing)

Next race day.
Athboy 12th Aug
Probably, Kart City, Santry 26th August.

Hi mick

Cheers for the reply, never know I might be racing against you soon enough ha! Ye I'll deffo take a trip out to a race meeting as soon as, might try get to Kilkenny this week and if not I'll get to santry as I live in Dublin!

KylieWyley

stedabee wrote: »

No way I'm actually in kilkenny at the mo and will be here for a while, what time would be best to head up?

It'll be on all day. We have 2 heats in the morning and 2 finals in the afternoon. Racing usually runs from about 10am - 4pm(ish) with a break at lunch time. Come along whenever suits !

Most people are quite friendly and happy to explain what you need to do to get started. I run a 4-stroke Biland and work from a trailer hitched to a Honda HR-V. Feel free to say hello if you see me

KylieWyley

SouperComputer wrote: »

KylieWyley is that price including a chassis or just engine alone?

Price range quoted is for a 2nd hand ready-to-race package - chassis and engine. (Of course, you could spend that alone on a brand new Swiss Auto engine). The lower end of that price scale would net you a decent Biland running on Saxon chassis. There are Bilands gathering dust across garages in Ireland, either because people don't have the time or money to race. These are still competitive (last years champion ran with this setup). However, our regs permit any chassis so some of the lads are beginning to try out different chassis.

The Swiss Autos are on the higher end of that price scale and they only pop up on the second-hand market in the UK from time to time. The Swiss Autos actually have more power when taken directly off the shelf but the Super4s running with Swiss Autos use a restrictor and, as a result, the performance level with the Biland is actually very even.

mick993

Good man Kyle I have watched you race several times and the super four is certainly a good class alright, though a bit light on numbers at national level as all the classes are.
I'll probably drop down myself to watch the racing as a few of our Cadets have progressed to National level and they are great racing to watch.
I personally feel that anybody just jumping into a race kart for more or less the first time (any class) will completely struggle at National level and probably throw their hat at it very quickly.
Club racing at any club and in any sporting discipline is the breeding ground for the National and International competitors of tomorrow and ought to be encouraged and supported much more vigorously by the powers that be.

KylieWyley

mick993 wrote: »

Good man Kyle I have watched you race several times and the super four is certainly a good class alright, though a bit light on numbers at national level as all the classes are.
I'll probably drop down myself to watch the racing as a few of our Cadets have progressed to National level and they are great racing to watch.
I personally feel that anybody just jumping into a race kart for more or less the first time (any class) will completely struggle at National level and probably throw their hat at it very quickly.
Club racing at any club and in any sporting discipline is the breeding ground for the National and International competitors of tomorrow and ought to be encouraged and supported much more vigorously by the powers that be.

Hey Mick, depending on what the individual is looking to get out of it, you may be right. I can see pluses to both club and national level. As regards struggling, I don't see it as a struggle. I see it as a challenge to develop. Some of the lads in my class have up to 20 years experience and when you are behind them, you find that you push yourself beyond the speeds you thought you were capable of achieving.

I can't speak for the other classes but I chose Super4 because, although we compete under MSI, there's a great clubman ethos about the group. I've encountered a couple of problems along the way where I doubted I would get out onto the track but the lads will always do their best to help get you going. Re: numbers, we started the season with 13 and generally have a steady 11/12 for each race with interest being shown from newcomers and past racers as our numbers are starting to increase. (Sometimes, too large a grid on a small kart track can be just a little manic !)

This season we had 4 black plates so even the less experienced racers can find themselves having some decent action. I have struggled at a couple of tracks but the pace of the leaders only drives me on (no pun intended) to go faster - I've even been lucky enough to find myself in the mix with the more experienced lads and setting fairly competitive laps for a couple of rounds also!

What I would say to the OP is to go along to as many meetings (both national and club) and talk to as many people as you can. Many people (perhaps myself included) will have their own slanted view of what's best and, at the end of the day, it will be up to you to decide what best suits your circumstances. Either way, you'll be guaranteed to have some great fun in a kart. It's a fantastic sport - definitely a great alternative to boozing at the weekends

stedabee

KylieWyley wrote: »

It's a fantastic sport - definitely a great alternative to boozing at the weekends

This is exactly why I want to get into it! Getting excited just thinking about it! Where abouts online is the best place to find karts up for sale?

stedabee

KylieWyley wrote: »

It'll be on all day. We have 2 heats in the morning and 2 finals in the afternoon. Racing usually runs from about 10am - 4pm(ish) with a break at lunch time. Come along whenever suits !

Most people are quite friendly and happy to explain what you need to do to get started. I run a 4-stroke Biland and work from a trailer hitched to a Honda HR-V. Feel free to say hello if you see me

Brilliant I'll do my best to get up! I think it only a 30 drive from Kilkenny town. If I spot you I'll say hello, cheers man!

KylieWyley

stedabee wrote: »

Brilliant I'll do my best to get up! I think it only a 30 drive from Kilkenny town. If I spot you I'll say hello, cheers man!

No probs! If you haven't seen real karts in action before, you're in for a treat

mick993

KylieWyley wrote: »

Hey Mick, depending on what the individual is looking to get out of it, you may be right. I can see pluses to both club and national level.

What I would say to the OP is to go along to as many meetings (both national and club) and talk to as many people as you can. Many people (perhaps myself included) will have their own slanted view of what's best and, at the end of the day, it will be up to you to decide what best suits your circumstances. Either way, you'll be guaranteed to have some great fun in a kart. It's a fantastic sport - definitely a great alternative to boozing at the weekends

Yeah, drop the booze and the economics stack up very easily.

Memories are better than dreams so get out & do it either way.

iamtony

Hi stedabee, Tony from the kart store here, nice talking to you yesterday!
I'll try give as much info as possible for anyone interested in getting out racing.

Firstly here are a few sites to check out, some are our competitors so look but don't buy anything from them ha ha.
Www.irishkarting.com
Www.kartstore.org (our site)
Www.clama2003.com (tullyallen kart club)
Www.motorsport.ie
Www.murraymotorsport.ie
Www.motorsportireland.com
All above have useful info or race reports in there.

All the advice given by the lads is spot on but there are some things I can advise on that they haven't covered.
Don't fool yourself into thinking karting is cheap cause it ain't! It's not the cheapest form of Motorsport either but it's definitely one of the cheapest.
Initial start up costs are high and yes you can pick up a kart for less than a grand but it will probably break your heart and you will end up spending more than you had originally intended on spending.
Things you can't do without(and prices):
Kart inc. engine(I always recommend Rotax)
Trolley prices start from about €130
Lap timer inc. water temp sensor and rpm sensor €350
Fuel handling equipment funnel, mixing jug, measuring beaker €50
Helmet from about €150 for anything that might actually protect you I recommend Arai and they start at €390
Rib protector from €80 again for anything worth buying although cheaper ones are out there.
Suit from €100
Boots from €50
Gloves from €15
Rain suit €40
Tyres €160 for new but lots of lads use ex race team tyres for a fraction of the cost.
Range of sprockets €9.00 each
Range or different length chains from€25.00
Transponder(for lap timing) €275.00 or rent from €10 per race
spare parts your going to want to carry:
Track rods from €5.00
Axle from €70
Differnt tooth front sprocket and drum €50.00
Spark plugs for different temperatures €12.00
Different main jets for different temps and altitudes €5.65
Set of wet tyres from €180 again seconds can be used but harder to find than slicks.
Set of wet rims €97.50
Oil from €10.00 per litre
Chain lube €10.00
Carb cleaner €3.50
Brake cleaner €2.99
Spare set of brake pads €30
Spare brake disk from €60

Or course all the above are not essential but your not going to want your days racing ruined because you cracked a brake disk and can't get one on track.

Engine rebuilding doesn't have to be done very offer but beware when buying used that it isn't already rebuild time and ask to see the log book which will be stamped by the engine sealer of which there are two very competent ones in Ireland who are Brennan's racing in Kilkenny and tred up north. I can courier to both of these guys for €15.00 on anyone's behalf from our Dublin based shop.

Accommodation isn't nessisary when doing the tullyallen championship and you live on the east coast as all there events are local enough(at present) and you just show up on the Sunday morning.

Transporting the Kart isn't to difficult in a decent sized car you basically need to measure your boot opening and see have you got 1050mm(length of back axle with wheels off or about 1450mm needed with wheels on) for the kart to go in although a van or trailer is preferred. I've also seen karts on roof racks which is a good option.
On race day your entry fee will be €60-70 for Tullyallen(depending if you need to rent a transponder or not) or 90-100 for national championship.
For the national championship you will need a race licence which will cost about €100.00

That's all I can think of right now hope I didn't scare anyone! Bottom line is your going to spend anywhere from 2-4k getting set up and from then on its pretty cheap.
If anyone would like to visit our shop and have a chat with us feel free to pm me for details or visit our site for directs and call up.
And finally I'd just like to say karting is a great hobby and fully of very helpful and friendly folk who will be more than happy to help you get going, but don't expect any help of them once you get quick;-)

stedabee

Thanks a mill tony, some great info there. Unfortunately I didn't make it to the Kilkenny meeting as I was very busy in the b&b so hopefully the next meeting I can. I'll definently head out to your shop over the next two weeks to have a look so I can make up my mind and I'll call you to let you know.

From what Ive heard and read the rotax class seems to have a good few people in it so I'm pretty sure that's the class ill enter. I'll be buying a suit,gloves,boots,helmet, transponder, trolley, and of coarse a kart just wondering which chassis to get? Then any other tools, spares that are essential or needed I'll buy too.

iamtony

No problem! Regarding which chassis to choose, there are many makes out there and all are proven to be capable of winning races but in Ireland most tend to go for Tonykart or one of the sister brands in the otk range which include Kosmic, redspeed and a few others I can't think of. Be warned though otk stuff is very expensive!! On the plus side it's widely available and we stock most common items but just to give a comparison on price an otk brake disk is €200 and a brake disk for a lesser known chassis is about €60 or a rear 50mm axle is about €190 for otk and about €60 for other brands, I could go on all day with that.
Another myth bandied around is otk karts require little set up to be quick compared to other karts but the truth is all karts need to be set up differently for different tracks, weather conditions, different tyres, how much rubber is on the track etc. etc.
I'd personally recommend a new engine as it will be trouble free and come with a warranty and this will give you more if an advantage than any chassis you can find. But that's not to say used engines aren't as quick, in fact in some cases quicker but you just don't know especially if your just starting.
Here's some tools you will need or should have:
Good set of Allen keys from 2-8mm t bars are usually the karters choice we sell beta €40 a set but it doesn't have an 8mm
Spanner set and a socket set wouldn't hurt halfords or aldi will do fine make sure it has an extension bar to reach wheel nuts.
Rotax specific tools include
Clutch pullers €30.00
Clutch locking tool €15.00
38mm socket halfords
Brake bleeding tool €35.00
Steering locking tool €25.00
Rubber hammer €16.00
Tyre tools, bead breaker, tyre lever etc. From €50
Something to blow up tyres a 12v tyre inflator can be used of ideally a compressor
Good tyre pressure gauge€35.00

stedabee

Brilliant! Ye I'll have to get all the tools too, feel like I'll never get started...can't wait! Have money sitting there waiting to be spent haha, So annoyed I missed the Kilkenny meeting! Another thing I was wondering was how do the transponders work? Is it gps or does it hook up with the track ur on? How does it know where the start/finish line is?

SouperComputer

Transponders basically work by passing over an induction loop on the track at the start/finish line. Each transponder has a unique code that is assigned to you in the software.

iamtony gave a good comprehensive list of stuff you might need, but keep in mind that when you are starting out, many of those things you might get bundled with the Kart you buy (Mychon onboard lap timer for example) and others you mighn't use often enough to justify buying and might be better off bumming off someone once in a while (clutch puller). Other things are nice to have for sure, but you can usually figure out something (brake bleeder, steering locking tool). I admit im an aweful fellah for trying to make tools up to a fault. Luckily a lot of this stuff we have in the team trailer now but I've still been known to "McGruber" a thing or two when I'm running by myself.

Good tyre pressure gauge is a must though. When you gain experience you will find yourself adjusting pressures by as little as a quarter of a psi.

In terms of the kart chassis, overall condition and availability of spares are much more important than the year, make or model. There's a lot to be said for someone who is willing to spend some time with you at the track to get you started as well, so bear that in mind.

stedabee

SouperComputer wrote: »

Transponders basically work by passing over an induction loop on the track at the start/finish line. Each transponder has a unique code that is assigned to you in the software.

But what I was wondering is how does it know where the start/finish is? Is there a chip or antenna on the line sending the signal to the transponder?

Good tyre pressure gauge is a must though. When you gain experience you will find yourself adjusting pressures by as little as a quarter of a psi.

Wow thats crazy! Ye tony mentioned I need a decent gauge so I'll spend the money on a good one!

In terms of the kart chassis, overall condition and availability of spares are much more important than the year, make or model. There's a lot to be said for someone who is willing to spend some time with you at the track to get you started as well, so bear that in mind.

When u say there's a lot to be said for someone who is willing to spend time with me do u mean I'll find it hard on my own to get up and running?

Cheers supercomputer

SouperComputer

stedabee wrote: »

When u say there's a lot to be said for someone who is willing to spend time with me do u mean I'll find it hard on my own to get up and running?

Cheers supercomputer

No no, I just mean jimmy rigging stuff to hold the steering central if you are doing an aligment, or making your own brake bleeder or whatever rather than borrowing or buying thats all. Karts nowadays are pretty user friendly, between that, the helpful people at the track and the plethora of info on the web you'll be fine.

ScumLord

What is a C-plate race?

I was looking on http://www.irishkarting.com/ at upcoming races and I saw there's a C-plate race on this Sunday at Whiteriver. I wanted to go for researching buying a kart but I don't really know what c-plate is and if they'll be racing the kind of karts I'll be looking to buy.

The other question is what time do these races start? It gives the date but no start times.

If it's completely unrelated to beginners there's a championship race at Pallas karting at the end of next month that I could go to.

mick993

ScumLord wrote: »

What is a C-plate race?

I was looking on http://www.irishkarting.com/ at upcoming races and I saw there's a C-plate race on this Sunday at Whiteriver. I wanted to go for researching buying a kart but I don't really know what c-plate is and if they'll be racing the kind of karts I'll be looking to buy.

The other question is what time do these races start? It gives the date but no start times.

If it's completely unrelated to beginners there's a championship race at Pallas karting at the end of next month that I could go to.

The "C" plate is the champions race meeting.
I'm pretty sure it will entitle the winner in each class on the day the right to wear "C" as his race number for the year.

Sunday will be the day to attend, probably on track from 10AM, but try get there by 12 at latest.

There will be the class you are looking for out racing.

There are a few karts about for sale at the moment that would be good packages for somebody to buy. As in, fully documented engine build history etc, without being mad over priced.

I'll be there for a while both Saturday & Sunday along with a few other mates if you want a heads up on anything.

PM me for my number if you like.

mick993

iamtony wrote: »

No problem! Regarding which chassis to choose, there are many makes out there and all are proven to be capable of winning races but in Ireland most tend to go for Tonykart or one of the sister brands in the otk range which include Kosmic, redspeed and a few others I can't think of. Be warned though otk stuff is very expensive!! On the plus side it's widely available and we stock most common items but just to give a comparison on price an otk brake disk is €200 and a brake disk for a lesser known chassis is about €60 or a rear 50mm axle is about €190 for otk and about €60 for other brands, I could go on all day with that.
Another myth bandied around is otk karts require little set up to be quick compared to other karts but the truth is all karts need to be set up differently for different tracks, weather conditions, different tyres, how much rubber is on the track etc. etc.
I'd personally recommend a new engine as it will be trouble free and come with a warranty and this will give you more if an advantage than any chassis you can find. But that's not to say used engines aren't as quick, in fact in some cases quicker but you just don't know especially if your just starting.
Here's some tools you will need or should have:
Good set of Allen keys from 2-8mm t bars are usually the karters choice we sell beta €40 a set but it doesn't have an 8mm
Spanner set and a socket set wouldn't hurt halfords or aldi will do fine make sure it has an extension bar to reach wheel nuts.
Rotax specific tools include
Clutch pullers €30.00
Clutch locking tool €15.00
38mm socket halfords
Brake bleeding tool €35.00
Steering locking tool €25.00
Rubber hammer €16.00
Tyre tools, bead breaker, tyre lever etc. From €50
Something to blow up tyres a 12v tyre inflator can be used of ideally a compressor
Good tyre pressure gauge€35.00

Delighted to see you out racing with TKC on Sunday Tony. Hope you had good craic and that you'll be in Santry on the 26th for another go?

As you probably witnessed yourself, there's a very helpful atmosphere at our race meetings. This includes lending out tools and gauges and generally helping other racers to get ready for action. Of course as soon as the karts hit the track...............

I think I was karting 7 months before I even bought my own fuel funnel, so I wouldn't let a big list of equipment put anyone off as a lot of it can easily be borrowed.

ScumLord

mick993 wrote: »

As in, fully documented engine build history etc, without being mad over priced.

On engine rebuilds, both my other friends are amateur mechanics, do you need to have some registered guy rebuild the engines, we've been looking in to that too and it seems straight forward enough to rebuild them.

mick993

ScumLord wrote: »

On engine rebuilds, both my other friends are amateur mechanics, do you need to have some registered guy rebuild the engines, we've been looking in to that too and it seems straight forward enough to rebuild them.

Ideally, don't buy any kart without a properly sealed engine. You will find it next to impossible to sell on again & most race series wouldn't let you out to race.

They are relatively easy to repair, but also to "Fettle" and for this reason they are sealed so as to be as equal and legal as possible to allow the testing of pure driver skill which is what racing is about.

There are dedicated sealing agents who are reasonable €€€ enough to re-build engines.

ScumLord

Would it be possible to do the engine rebuilding personally during the learning phase and then send the engine to the official agents for rebuild and confirmation everything is as it's supposed to be before entering the first race?

Or is it a case of once the seals been broke outside of an official agents garage the engines ruined from an official point of view. If we don't tamper with the engine I don't see how they'd know unless the agent won't stand over it and work on it.

mick993

The engines aren't that temperamental or soft that they need re-building every race. Depending on the hours on an engine when you get it, you should get a whole season out of one before partial re-building.

Typically, a refresh (piston & ring) would be about €130 including re-sealing & updating the log book.
A full re-build (piston, ring, con rod & bearings etc) maybe €550.

You would get 15Hrs between changing the piston & ring and 45Hrs out of the con rod & bearings.

That's a lot of racing.

If the seal had been broken, the component parts would possibly have to be sent to the UK for weighing & verification before the engine could be re-sealed and that would be quite costly.