Why Are Irish Rail Failing so badly

road_high

mickydoomsux wrote: »

It was actually a health and safety issue. It's goddamn bedlam and far too dangerous to have hundreds if not thousands of people standing on the platform waiting for the train to come into Kilkenny.

Thought that was mainly to do with the Market Yard area of town? But thye probabaly have more control coming into town on a bus

Victor

Judgement Day wrote: »

FYP

Constructive posts only please

Moderator

bk

It isn't health and safety, it is too leave free travel pass holders pass through.

CIE

Dravokivich wrote: »

Actually just in regards to this comment. They have to leave the gates open when the ticket offices are closed. I think it's to rule out any liability on Irish Rail's part so that in the case of an emergency, they weren't preventing people from leaving the station in the event they fail, as there'd be no-one avail to switch'em off.

Eh? In the past, turnstiles never prevented passengers from leaving a station; only prevented entry. When did this change come about? And why would IE be liable for the product of a contract company (or did they really build turnstiles in-house, which sounds unlikely)?

LeftBlank

CIE wrote: »

Eh? In the past, turnstiles never prevented passengers from leaving a station; only prevented entry. When did this change come about? And why would IE be liable for the product of a contract company (or did they really build turnstiles in-house, which sounds unlikely)?

The "new" exit barriers only open when a valid ticket/smart card is presented. When a station is unmanned, they are typically left open.

Dravokivich

CIE wrote: »

Eh? In the past, turnstiles never prevented passengers from leaving a station; only prevented entry. When did this change come about? And why would IE be liable for the product of a contract company (or did they really build turnstiles in-house, which sounds unlikely)?

They don't have turnstiles any more. Except Drumcondra I think.

They have glass gates that slide open/shut at ticket barriers now.

CIE

LeftBlank wrote: »

The "new" exit barriers only open when a valid ticket/smart card is presented. When a station is unmanned, they are typically left open.

And they wonder why they are losing revenue.

On other systems with open platforms, there is either POP or on-board conductors. Aught else (such as this folly) and you're giving free rides no matter if it's anyone with a free travel pass or not.

foggy_lad

CIE wrote: »

And they wonder why they are losing revenue.

On other systems with open platforms, there is either POP or on-board conductors. Aught else (such as this folly) and you're giving free rides no matter if it's anyone with a free travel pass or not.

The booking office in Cork closes early and anyone getting the 8.30 train to Dublin should be safe enough as there are no checks at Kent station or on the train and when you get to the exit at Heuston which is always manned the gates are always open and tickets are not checked!

This is why they are losing revenue yet they prefer to lose even more by persecuting people who present themselves at the booking office at their destination to pay their fare when they could just as easily walk out the door! These people are not evading any fare and should not be treated as such but in reality it is too late to worry about such things now as the damage has been done!

Hilly Bill

Always foggy? Never checks in Cork and the open gates in Heuston? Is this never when you have used that train or never as in 100% never. For someone who hates IR so much you travel a lot across its network.

Jamie2k9

The booking office in Cork closes early and anyone getting the 8.30 train to Dublin should be safe enough as there are no checks at Kent station or on the train and when you get to the exit at Heuston which is always manned the gates are always open and tickets are not checked!

This is why they are losing revenue yet they prefer to lose even more by persecuting people who present themselves at the booking office at their destination to pay their fare when they could just as easily walk out the door! These people are not evading any fare and should not be treated as such but in reality it is too late to worry about such things now as the damage has been done!

I got the 20.30 to Heuston last Wednesday and Thursday and the ticket office in Cork was open. I had my tickets checked going onto the train and had to pass through barriers in Heuston both nights.

Losty Dublin

Hilly Bill wrote: »

Always foggy? Never checks in Cork and the open gates in Heuston? Is this never when you have used that train or never as in 100% never. For someone who hates IR so much you travel a lot across its network.

Funnily enough Bill, I've a friend who happens works in said ticket office and he works a lot of shifts beyond 20:30

Hilly Bill

I know he likes to spin a good yarn but to be fair to Foggy, there is a chance that the booking office was closed when he went through and wasnt checked on the train or in heuston and he would be right in saying that this would result in lost revenue.
How often this happens is another question and why.

Losty Dublin

Hilly Bill wrote: »

I know he likes to spin a good yarn but to be fair to Foggy, there is a chance that the booking office was closed when he went through and wasnt checked on the train or in heuston and he would be right in saying that this would result in lost revenue.
How often this happens is another question and why.

I suppose you're probably right; sure everything else possible seems to happen the yarns we hear back :rolleyes:

foggy_lad

Hilly Bill wrote: »

I know he likes to spin a good yarn but to be fair to Foggy, there is a chance that the booking office was closed when he went through and wasnt checked on the train or in heuston and he would be right in saying that this would result in lost revenue.
How often this happens is another question and why.

What time does the booking office in Cork close at now? Recently the hours have been cut back and it closes at around 6.30-7pm and even earlier at weekends. Also when the booking office is closed there are very few other staff available apart from the security guard and on the last three times i travelled from Cork to Dublin the booking office has been closed and my ticket was not checked boarding the train, on the train or when i arrived in Heuston station.

Hilly Bill

foggy_lad wrote: »

What time does the booking office in Cork close at now? Recently the hours have been cut back and it closes at around 6.30-7pm and even earlier at weekends. Also when the booking office is closed there are very few other staff available apart from the security guard and on the last three times i travelled from Cork to Dublin the booking office has been closed and my ticket was not checked boarding the train, on the train or when i arrived in Heuston station.

I havent a clue what time the booking office closes in Cork. The next time this happens to you, send an e-mail to IE explaining your concerns and also mention it at the information centre in heuston and ask for a reply.

Capt'n Midnight

Jhcx wrote: »

U know they can throw every gadget under the sun at u. But its how quick can u get home.

Reliability is also an issue. Connections to other transport too.

Back in the day the 90 bus used to leave Connolly at about the same time as the last train from Dundalk arrived. If the train was early or the bus a little late then you didn't have to wait for the next bus.

The last thing you want is to be stuck on a platform because you've missed a connection or waiting for a delayed or cancelled service.

gsxr1

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

Reliability is also an issue. Connections to other transport too.

Back in the day the 90 bus used to leave Connolly at about the same time as the last train from Dundalk arrived. If the train was early or the bus a little late then you didn't have to wait for the next bus.

The last thing you want is to be stuck on a platform because you've missed a connection or waiting for a delayed or cancelled service.

Yeah been caught out like this before.
Seems like CIE could coordinate their services a bit better . I cant see why a train cant slow down to meet a bus or vice versa. They cant speed up .Thats for sure. The line is in such an unsafe state it might fall apart.

LivelineDipso

gsxr1 wrote: »

Seems like CIE could coordinate their services a bit better .

No offense, but that's like asking a murderer to be more humane.

CIE exist to destory public transport connectivity and that's all they know or want.

Hilly Bill

gsxr1 wrote: »

Yeah been caught out like this before.
Seems like CIE could coordinate their services a bit better . I cant see why a train cant slow down to meet a bus or vice versa. They cant speed up .Thats for sure. The line is in such an unsafe state it might fall apart.

Scare mongering again? How come you keep bumping this thread?

Solair

I was on the Cork-Dublin 18:30 service yesterday and it was OK overall.
It arrived on time, there was a pleasant trolley service, someone came along to take my rubbish away and there was a visible train manager walking around occasionally.

Tickets weren't checked in Cork or on-board or at Heuston, but maybe they're just adopting a more continental attitude to it?

It works like that in most countries, i.e. just random spot checks.

I always found Irish Rail's incessant ticket checking bordered on some kind of obsession.

My only complaint is that the MK4 upholstery is looking rather tired and shabby. It was clean, but I am amazed it's looking so worn already. I'd say those coaches are almost due a refurb. The choice of materials used seems quite poor from the point of view of how quickly they are wearing.

They are also WAY too dark on board. They obviously put in early-generation LED spots instead of halogens all along the coaches. Modern LED lamps would solve that problem. You can hardly read they're so dull.

The ride was also really poor from Cork to Mallow, but got OK after that and was relatively smooth through the midlands and beyond.

All in all, it wasn't a bad service at all. Seemed quite professional and well-run to me.

gsxr1

Hilly Bill wrote: »

Scare mongering again? How come you keep bumping this thread?

You want to know why?

Because its sicking that arse holes in IR sit in containers with SKY tv plumbed in with plush sofa's, best of gear , laying asleep in stations . Every day, all day. Check the per-way Connolly anytime for proof. There is a good few up the back road in Heuston. They even lock the gate so no one can see. There is a couple of those containers at the top of Connelly staff car park. Most stations have them. Just look. You know they are there.

While money needs spent on repair.

The customer pay yet more to fund this unionized joke of a company.

Why has nearly all work for track maintenance been stopped . Bridge work on hundred+ year old rusted metal been slashed to one Galway job.(excluding a weekend job this weekend in Dublin) . Permanent Way Works stopped and contractors going to wall .


Why has the work been done on the line been reduced to a fraction of what it was last year. And even more than the year before that.
Has the lines become so safe they are maintenance free?



Instead of asking questions. Tell us all why. Has this essentially safety work no longer necessary . Has Malihide become faded in the public's memory. When potentially tens, maybe hundreds of people could have been KILLED in Malihide.

Work is not getting done, Line speed will go down. More people will stop using the rail to use bus or cars and the problem will worsen.

Im not a shovel man as you stated before. I know whats not being done and what needs done . Wasted money everywhere.

. I just want to see the sh1t you would spue online in defense of the laziest shower of ejits still lucky enough to have a job. I think one person stated that there was a van full of sleeping IR staff one night. This is fairly regular. Sometimes 3 or 4 crew cabs with steamed up windows full of men . Its a disgrace what goes on. Picops and TSC . Sound alseep waking only to give the line back. Simple as that. I know mate. I seen this. Waste of wages. And BIG wages at that.

If you lot where the private sector. You would be gone in a week. There is a few who are very dedicated to the railway in IR and are let down by a majority of clowns...
The biggest joke I seen one night was the hire of an atlas and two rail converted dumpers, six global lads , 2 TSC an ES and PICOP to remove a six foot tall win bush. which looked bad from the road. Costing over 10000 im sure.. I would have done it for a tenner. It was not even in the way.

I out of that scene now . Back in the real world. What I seen in my 4 years working as a skilled contractor took my breath away.

The railway is on a steep slope downwards and I don't think the tax payer should support it anymore. .

Its a joke. And need either sold for scrap or managed privately.

I could go on with specific details about the joke that is IR. But I would hang lads thats are good and I like.

CIE

gsxr1 wrote: »

You want to know why?

Because its sicking that arse holes in IR sit in containers with SKY tv plumbed in with plush sofa's, best of gear , laying asleep in stations . Every day, all day. Check the per-way Connolly anytime for proof. There is a good few up the back road in Heuston. They even lock the gate so no one can see. There is a couple of those containers at the top of Connelly staff car park. Most stations have them. Just look. You know they are there.

While money needs spent on repair.

The customer pay yet more to fund this unionized joke of a company.

Why has nearly all work for track maintenance been stopped . Bridge work on hundred+ year old rusted metal been slashed to one Galway job.(excluding a weekend job this weekend in Dublin) . Permanent Way Works stopped and contractors going to wall .


Why has the work been done on the line been reduced to a fraction of what it was last year. And even more than the year before that.
Has the lines become so safe they are maintenance free?



Instead of asking questions. Tell us all why. Has this essentially safety work no longer necessary . Has Malihide become faded in the public's memory. When potentially tens, maybe hundreds of people could have been KILLED in Malihide.

Work is not getting done, Line speed will go down. More people will stop using the rail to use bus or cars and the problem will worsen.

Im not a shovel man as you stated before. I know whats not being done and what needs done . Wasted money everywhere.

. I just want to see the sh1t you would spue online in defense of the laziest shower of ejits still lucky enough to have a job. I think one person stated that there was a van full of sleeping IR staff one night. This is fairly regular. Sometimes 3 or 4 crew cabs with steamed up windows full of men . Its a disgrace what goes on. Picops and TSC . Sound alseep waking only to give the line back. Simple as that. I know mate. I seen this. Waste of wages. And BIG wages at that.

If you lot where the private sector. You would be gone in a week. There is a few who are very dedicated to the railway in IR and are let down by a majority of clowns...
The biggest joke I seen one night was the hire of an atlas and two rail converted dumpers, six global lads , 2 TSC an ES and PICOP to remove a six foot tall win bush. which looked bad from the road. Costing over 10000 im sure.. I would have done it for a tenner. It was not even in the way.

I out of that scene now . Back in the real world. What I seen in my 4 years working as a skilled contractor took my breath away.

The railway is on a steep slope downwards and I don't think the tax payer should support it anymore. .

Its a joke. And need either sold for scrap or managed privately.

I could go on with specific details about the joke that is IR. But I would hang lads thats are good and I like.

I suspect that things are being set up for a takeover by Deutsche Bahn. (And they won't do any better, because their international focus is far different from their domestic, i.e. German, focus.) Selling the railway for scrap would of course balkanise Ireland in terms of transport; no modern country moves efficiently without rail, or is indeed modern at all.

gobnaitolunacy

foggy_lad wrote: »

What time does the booking office in Cork close at now? Recently the hours have been cut back and it closes at around 6.30-7pm and even earlier at weekends. Also when the booking office is closed there are very few other staff available apart from the security guard and on the last three times i travelled from Cork to Dublin the booking office has been closed and my ticket was not checked boarding the train, on the train or when i arrived in Heuston station.

What do you need it open for? If you need a ticket there are machines, there are arr/dep boards and timetables posted. What more do you want?

The older generation and the unfamiliar may need the comfort blanket of a booking office though.

Hilly Bill

you worked for a contractor on a project that came to a stop due to financial reasons. Your time on the project was always going to end at some point so dont be so bitter about it.North strand bridge is being replaced at the moment so will that do you?

bk

kieran4003 wrote: »

Yes, big challenges remain and it is a very difficult situation for the railway, but it is not the only semi state experiencing difficulties, look at An Post and Eircom in recent days, but they dont seem to attract the level of bizzare posts that CIE related topics does.

Eircom aren't a semi state, they have been fully private for many years and their problems are completely of their own making. In fact Eircom is a lesson on how not to privatise an important semi-state asset.

When Eircom was privatised it had zero debt. But their owners took out massive loans against Eircom to pay off the money they used to buy the company. As Eircom changed hands 5 times, each new owner did the same until the debt hit almost 5 billion!!! Meanwhile they invested almost nothing in their network and infrastructure, while UPC spend €500 million in theirs and started stealing Eircoms customers in large numbers.

If Irish Rail is ever privatised, I would hope the government are wise enough to avoid a repeat of this situation. I think a Luas/NTA/Veoila model might be an appropriate alternative.

LeftBlank

bk wrote: »

Eircom aren't a semi state, they have been fully private for many years and their problems are completely of their own making. In fact Eircom is a lesson on how not to privatise an important semi-state asset.

They still have legacy semi-state issues though, such as old civil service staff.

shamwari

bk wrote: »

Eircom aren't a semi state, they have been fully private for many years and their problems are completely of their own making. In fact Eircom is a lesson on how not to privatise an important semi-state asset.

Agree 100% that this and other recent state privitisations were handled abysmally, and no doubt that the same mistakes may welll be made again. I disagree that all of the problems were of Eircom's own making. The carpet baggers like the Bean Baron's crew started the rot. They borrowed to buy the company, flogged as many assets as they could, pocketed the lucre, and sold it on to the next gang.

But, and to agree with you, I could never understand why the flogged Eircell to Vodafone only to go and buy Meteor a few years later. Not the smartest of strategic decisions that one.

bk wrote: »

If Irish Rail is ever privatised, I would hope the government are wise enough to avoid a repeat of this situation. I think a Luas/NTA/Veoila model might be an appropriate alternative.

Funnily enough, one of the lessons learned from Eircom was that infrastructure should remain in state control. This will apply to Bord Gais and the ESB as their respective transmission networks will remain in state ownership whilst the rest of their business is sold on. The same has been mooted as applying to Irish Rail with their track infrastructure for the same obvious reasons.

gsxr1

kieran4003 wrote: »

If you were, you should know there are notices up in CIE depots across the country asking staff NOT to criticise the group on the internet.


Im not. So this is not my problem. I have 4gb of pics to follow if pushed.

I disagree with 100% of your post and I will deal with a few points specifically.

The Permanent Way are kept quite busy.


ARE YOU SERIOUS.. ARE YOU BLIND!!!!!!!!!! I know a good few staff who work in other departments and they are always flat out. The per way rule IR. When IR get the balls to do something about this then I will travel on the rails again. They do nothing . really. If you are IR. inspect this. Although you well know whats going on but are to afraid of the union to stir the pot.


Freight is faster by road.
Car and BUS travel is cheaper and faster by road.

Why are you even here.

IR need new management and all works to be tendered for. Get rid of wastful perway opps. All IR staff to be made redundant and people who work hard to be rehired and new staff brought on board.


CIE. good luck . You will need it.

I loved working on the railway and hope to God it can be saved.

CIE

gsxr1 wrote: »

Freight is faster by road. Car and BUS travel is cheaper and faster by road

Not the case at all. Unless of course the operations are under the thumb of a government that dictates the speed of such operations on the railway, but to the railway's detriment deliberately by not only underinvestment but also fixing uncompetitive rates. Are there buses in Germany that travel faster between Berlin and Hamburg than the ICE-T (or even the IC) trains? Something tells me not.

corktina

in fairness you can't compare rural Ireland to Berlin to Hamburg, you can't even begin to compare Dublin to Cork or Belfast to routes such as those, never mind lines to Tralee or Sligo!. I would bet that on a rural route in Germany, the bus and car would also be quicker and cheaper.

For the traffic available and the money available, we have just about the rail service we can afford and need (and there's some bits we wouldn't even miss)