If you are pregnant , don't bother with MY school

Ghost Buster

Nodin wrote: »

We could fill the board with "How can the state......" lets face it. Sure the eejit hasn't even broken a law.

I dont think nay one ever said he was breaking laws but he / the school must be failing on several criteria needed for state funding.
If i win the lotto tonight Im setting up my own school and only allowing red haired nympho maniac 17 year old girls in and i expect state funding

prinz

RainbowRose81 wrote: »

Well this is discrimination of the highest order. The catholic church wouldn't know what Christanity was if it jumped up and bit them. They contradict every christanity is about like compassion humanity, justice, love and acceptance.
They judged this vulnerable young girl and denied her the human right of education. This is wrong, anyone with a working moral compass can see this. .

They didn't. One man did. One man whose so-called Catholic school isn't in the umbrella organisation that represents Catholic schools in the country. I wonder why...

lisasimpson

Ghost Buster wrote: »

So this school is run by one man with full control as a sort of dictatorship.??
Catholic heaven i would have thought;)

But seriously. How can the state fund what essentially is one mans power trip?

you could say that. he is just interested in getting the best leaving cert grades to have on the front page of the tipp star etc. at least two of his sons teach there now. often heard it said the teachers were more afraid of him than students and that discpline was an issue up there

RainbowRose81

RainbowRose81 wrote: »

Well this is discrimination of the highest order. The catholic church wouldn't know what Christanity was if it jumped up and bit them. They contradict every christanity is about like compassion humanity, justice, love and acceptance.
They judged this vulnerable young girl and denied her the human right of education. This is wrong, anyone with a working moral compass can see this.
Nothing surprises me about how far from christanity the catholic church is, they judge a young pregnant girl for having her baby and they judge girls for having abortions. Actually it's not really about them opposing christian teachings, they are opposing humanity being humane to others worse off i.e a vulnerable pregnant teenger.

Lets try to remind ourselves (because quite a lot of people seem to have forgotten, the quote above is only one example) that this is not a Catholic Church vs. the rest of the world situation. This is one man who made the decision. It was the wrong decision, and when he did it he tried to use the excuse of following a Christian ethos - but that isn't what it was. There is certainly no evidence to suggest that the catholic church endorses this, or that he was encouraged to make the decision by any members of the Catholic church. His actions were clearly un-Christian and I think full blame should lie with him, with the possibility of also blaming others involved in the administration of the school.

Just because he's hiding behind the guise of following a Catholic ethos does not mean that an entire religion can be blamed for his cruel actions.

micropig

Ghost Buster wrote: »

Seeing as that problem is infinitesimally small compared to the over 90% Catholic ethos school in the country I think picking ones battle is advisable.
Oh and the 'cool atheist' thing is as boring and cliched as Crucamins 'catholic oppression' line

1 catholic school in the country refused a girl. Not every catholic school. 1 school. So how is this problem infinitesimally larger?


Not every catholic School 1 School in the country

Ghost Buster

micropig wrote: »

1 catholic school in the country refused a girl. Not every catholic school. 1 school. So how is this problem infinitesimally larger?


Not every catholic School 1 School in the country

Yes so why did you bring up the Muslim school thing then?

MagicSean

Stark wrote: »

a) contraceptives aren't 100% effective.
b) The "ethos" of the school probably ensured that kids weren't educated in safe sex and contraception.

You mean the ethos of the school she didn't get in to? Can't see how that would affect her. I think you'll find that both catholic teachings and the law prohibit a 16 year old child having sex, with or without protection.

zara100

lisasimpson wrote: »

you could say that. he is just interested in getting the best leaving cert grades to have on the front page of the tipp star etc. at least two of his sons teach there now. often heard it said the teachers were more afraid of him than students and that discpline was an issue up there

a couple of years back parents complained to him that when first years were entering the boys toilets they were met with older lads jumping on them and yanking down the first years pants when parents complained it was ignored until one parent threatened court action it was only then he addressed the problem

RainbowRose81

true-or-false wrote: »

Lets try to remind ourselves (because quite a lot of people seem to have forgotten, the quote above is only one example) that this is not a Catholic Church vs. the rest of the world situation. This is one man who made the decision. It was the wrong decision, and when he did it he tried to use the excuse of following a Christian ethos - but that isn't what it was. There is certainly no evidence to suggest that the catholic church endorses this, or that he was encouraged to make the decision by any members of the Catholic church. His actions were clearly un-Christian and I think full blame should lie with him, with the possibility of also blaming others involved in the administration of the school.

Just because he's hiding behind the guise of following a Catholic ethos does not mean that an entire religion can be blamed for his cruel actions.

Well there is something radically wrong in the system when they are letting a man of this character have the power to make decisions

micropig

Ghost Buster wrote: »

Yes so why did you bring up the Muslim school thing then?

well, if one religious school is being dictated to about what their ethos should / should not be, shouldn't they all be?

Dboy85

hattoncracker wrote: »

And what? What in your oh so infinite wisdom should happen to her now?

Maybe she should take the time out in her life and learn how to be a mother. She's no different than any other woman who has a child. Her number one priority should be the baby. She's young enough to have time to finish her studies after the kid is in school. This whole idea of passing a child around gets my goat. In my opinion its the right thing for her to do. take it or leave it.

Stark wrote: »

a) contraceptives aren't 100% effective.
b) The "ethos" of the school probably ensured that kids weren't educated in safe sex and contraception.

Stop blaming the education system for anti social behavior. Most of us were sexually active at that age but had the sense to know a baby is the output of a careless attitude to sex.

All I'm saying is that's how her life panned out and the saving grace is to make sure her child is 100% cared for by HER. Not the state or her parents but HER. She can go to college at any time but its hard to undo any damage sustained to a child from neglect. I wish her well but it's not the fault of the principle, school or government policy. It was her decision.

lisasimpson

zara100 wrote: »

a couple of years back parents complained to him that when first years were entering the boys toilets they were met with older lads jumping on them and yanking down the first years pants when parents complained it was ignored until one parent threatened court action it was only then he addressed the problem

there has being a number of issues involving the law or gardai with that school if i remember correctly
at least people have the choice of schools in nenagh thurles and templemore if they dont want their kids going there
i also was talking to a teacher who did an interview there years ago and turned down the job. i dont know how it works but she was told he would be sorting her wage and she wouldnt be getting the full entiltments. another friend of mine said one of his parents thought there and couldnt wait to retire to get away from the place

RainbowRose81

Is it that hard in Ireland to find a few decent people of good character who are intelligent and educated who have humanity to be given the power to manage and make correct discisions in a school.

Ghost Buster

micropig wrote: »

well, if one religious school is being dictated to about what their ethos should / should not be, shouldn't they all be?

Its not about the ethos. That is secondary. It is about being exclusive and discriminatory. Yes this also applies to muslim schools but they are a tiny tiny minority and have virtually zero relevance to most of us.
My kid goes to a catholic ethos school in my parish and i have no problem with the ethos. had they attempted to exclude him that would have been a different matter.

RainbowRose81

Is it that hard in Ireland to find a few decent people of good character who are intelligent and educated who have humanity to be given the power to manage and make correct discisions in a school.

RainbowRose81

RainbowRose81 wrote: »

Well there is something radically wrong in the system when they are letting a man of this character have the power to make decisions

But they're not - was it not disclosed earlier that the school isn't actually an officially backed Catholic school?

RainbowRose81

true-or-false wrote: »

But they're not - was it not disclosed earlier that the school isn't actually an officially backed Catholic school?

I don't understand what you said.

skregs

The fact of the matter is if she wasn't a slut she wouldn't be having this problem

Mod: User banned for this post.

roast

skregs wrote: »

The fact of the matter is if she wasn't a slut she wouldn't be having this problem

Great assumption there mate. :rolleyes:

micropig

Ghost Buster wrote: »

Seeing as that problem is infinitesimally small compared to the over 90% Catholic ethos school in the country I think picking ones battle is advisable.
Oh and the 'cool atheist' thing is as boring and cliched as Crucamins 'catholic oppression' line

'cool ' atheist? What are you on about? Unlike some, I'm not trying to force my beliefs on the catholic church. If you don't like the Catholic ethos, don't go to the school. If you don't agree with what the pope says you are not a good catholic.

So we are selective what religions we prejudice against and try to dictate to?

Why was she trying to change schools between 5th and 6th year, I doubt the disruption would benefit her education? Plenty of other schools she could have and did attend.

Ghost Buster

micropig wrote: »

'cool ' atheist? What are you on about? Unlike some, I'm not trying to force my beliefs on the catholic church. If you don't like the Catholic ethos, don't go to the school. If you don't agree with what the pope says you are not a good catholic.

So we are selective what religious we are prejudice against and try to dictate to?

Why was she trying to change schools between 5th and 6th year, I doubt the disruption would benefit her education? Plenty of other schools she could have and did attend.

Assuming you know about the 90% plus catholic schools in the country which is totally disproportionate to the demand for such then can i assume you realise this is a utterly stupid post...yes?
What beliefs are being forced on to the RCC then?
And as for the rest of your post....What??

skregs

skregs wrote: »

The fact of the matter is if she wasn't a slut she wouldn't be having this problem

Thats a disgraceful attitude to have towards her! Who are you to judge her? :mad:

She is a teenage girl who like any other teenager, be it male or female, wasnt mentally, physically or emotionally developed and consequently had a baby before her time, but she certainly doesnt deserve gombeens on an internet forum who dont know her personally, taking the moral high ground with her and making snide remarks about her.

The thing with teenagers is that they think they are adults and try grow up too fast and sadly sometimes they realise they have committed to something they werent ready for when its too late to turn back. However, thats the challenges parents face in bringing up teenagers. its a particular difficult time in their lives.
But they certainly dont deserve to be judged for their actions whether we approve of them or not.

As a society Irelands attitude to sex needs to change to a more mature one.
We have gone from one extreme to another, from sex being something dirty and something to be ashamed about, to a society thats over sexualised and impressionable to people who are too young to fully grasp what its really about.

This girl, as an Irish citizen, should have the right to attend any educational institution which her parents/guardians see fit to send her too. The only thing a principal or a Board Of Management should need to know when enrolling students in a school is the general behaviour of the student in their previous school and whether it was too disruptive or not to allow enrolment. Another factor could be the engagement in criminal activity of a potential student seeking enrolment.
Anything else quite frankly is irrelevant.

chris2008x

No evidence the girl was a slut. Until you know the persons situation don't pass judgement on someone you don't know.

Dudess

The schools didn't allow her in because of her being a "slut"? How do they figure out which non pregnant girls are sluts so? If that is the criterion that results in refusal of admission?

And objecting to her refusal is pushing a "liberal agenda"? Lol. It gets funnier and funnier...

RainbowRose81

RainbowRose81 wrote: »

Is it that hard in Ireland to find a few decent people of good character who are intelligent and educated who have humanity to be given the power to manage and make correct discisions in a school.

To borrow a phrase which was also quoted on The Savage eye the other night, 'Those who can do, those who can't teach'

micropig

Ghost Buster wrote: »

Assuming you know about the 90% plus catholic schools in the country which is totally disproportionate to the demand for such then can i assume you realise this is a utterly stupid post...yes?
What beliefs are being forced on to the RCC then?
And as for the rest of your post....What??

84% of people in Ireland are Catholics. 90% of schools catholic..so, what's the problem? (or did people lie on the census and actually subscribe to their own version of Catholicism?

RCC does not believe in sex before marriage. People are trying to enforce their belief that sex before marriage is ok (same people probably had the big wedding in the church for the monies, with their child as flowergirl/boy:D)


Seen as you did not seem to understand the question in my previous post, I'll try and break it down for you.

Is it in a childs best interests to change schools at the end of 5th year, from a school her parents were happy with and was sympathetic to her situation, to one which wasn't?

Are we being selective in what religions we dictate to?

Also assuming you know, people get their children christened so they can get them in to the schools and put their religion as Catholic on the census, to skew reality of what is needed in the country, giving the government the perfect excuse not to do anything about it, because after all, we're paperwork indicates 84% of the population are catholic.

micropig

micropig wrote: »

RCC does not believe in sex before marriage.

Yes, according to them it's a sin.

And according to them, if you're a believer, your sins will be forgiven.

If they refused her on the basis of her not being Catholic, that would be fine by me. But there's no mention of her not being Catholic. So she must be a believer. Who has sinned. And should be forgiven.

And what better example of Jesus' teachings could there be to the students of that school than a believer being accepted and nurtured by the school, and it being accepted that her sins are forgiven?

chris2008x

It unfair for the state to subsidise a religious school if they are going to discriminate which most do. Another school in Tipperary. South Tipp the teachers picked on a student (my ex girlfriends brother) because he was openly gay he had to go to a school in another town over it. State funded school this was. We need to separate religion from schools. The churches could still set up there own schools but should receive zero funding from the state. Couldn't they just have classes lets say 30 minutes after school ends with a religion teacher or whatever coming to the school.

micropig

true-or-false wrote: »

Yes, according to them it's a sin.

And according to them, if you're a believer, your sins will be forgiven.

If they refused her on the basis of her not being Catholic, that would be fine by me. But there's no mention of her not being Catholic. So she must be a believer. Who has sinned. And should be forgiven.

And what better example of Jesus' teachings could there be to the students of that school than a believer being accepted and nurtured by the school, and it being accepted that her sins are forgiven?

Nah, she's a fallen women.


Why was she so determined to get to this school? What was the motivation
Any posters who know it do not describe it in the brightest light. What was the attraction?


Why move between 5th & 6th year? Only a couple of months left and then she'd be finished. Her friends wouldn't be by her side then.


Yes the principal was wrong in the manner her reacted to the department, but there is more to this than is being reported. She had already moved schools twice before her junior certificate (why?), a different school in 5th year and she wanted yet another school in 6th year...Is she trying out every school in the country?

micropig

chris2008x wrote: »

It unfair for the state to subsidise a religious school if they are going to discriminate which most do. Another school in Tipperary. South Tipp the teachers picked on a student (my ex girlfriends brother) because he was openly gay he had to go to a school in another town over it. State funded school this was. We need to separate religion from schools. The churches could still set up there own schools but should receive zero funding from the state. Couldn't they just have classes lets say 30 minutes after school ends with a religion teacher or whatever coming to the school.

Where the teachers in this school nuns/priests? How do you know they were picking on him because the catholic church does not accept gays, and not because the teachers themselves were ignorant bigots?