Andy Lee v Julio Cesar Chavez Jnr in El Paso, June 16

slapbangwallop · 03-04-2012 6:32pm #1

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=URQ33kzXbU0

Andy Lee to face Julio Cesar Chavez Jr in El Paso for WBC World title

http://www.boxing-ireland.com/news/andy-lee-to-face-julio-cesar-chavez-jr-in-el-paso-for-wbc-world-title/

makl · 03-04-2012 7:20pm

thats a ridiculous video.

anyway fair play to andy goin to el paso though he might as well go to mexico city itself, gona be near impossible to get a decision out of this.

Daroxtar · 03-04-2012 7:49pm

To hell with decision, let Andy knock him out !!:)

makl · 03-04-2012 8:17pm

Daroxtar wrote: »

To hell with decision, let Andy knock him out !!:)

what a show that'd be.

couple of things going against andy outside of it being in el paso, chavez has a good chin, partly as he comes into the ring 20 pounds heavier than his opponent, and he is a good body puncher which will test andy's stamina.

i don't know what andy's fightweight usually is but he walks around pretty big so hopefully there won't be a sizeable weight difference and he can take chavez out.

(mind you i won't believe this fight is really going ahead til hear the bell for the first ring)

barney4001 · 03-04-2012 8:21pm

Draw

Daroxtar wrote: »

To hell with decision, let Andy knock him out !!:)

the only way he wins

Henno30 · 03-04-2012 9:08pm

The Lee by decision option

Would be great if he did it, but Uncle Bob and Sr must be pretty confident to let it happen in the first place. Looking forward to it though.

Boooourns · 04-04-2012 11:58am

Draw

Andys stamina

cowzerp · 04-04-2012 12:06pm

Draw

Lee could KO him and will be as big as him i feel-as said above his stamina is a real issue and could be the difference between a win or loss, I'm saying loss by late stoppage.

walshb · 04-04-2012 12:43pm

Draw

cowzerp wrote: »

Lee could KO him and will be as big as him i feel-as said above his stamina is a real issue and could be the difference between a win or loss, I'm saying loss by late stoppage.

I see it like this too. Lee has power, but JCC takes a good shot, is fitter, busier, and is a big guy too. Lee won't hear the final bell I feel, giving a very good account, troubling JCC a whole lot, but failing to maintain the pace needed.

NikNak8 · 04-04-2012 1:13pm

Chavez points win

This is great news, two big middleweights has to end in a stopage/knock-out.

Maravilla33 · 04-04-2012 4:51pm

Chavez stoppage win

Lee looks good when he's given time and space to get into a rhythm. However he never looks remotely comfortable when put under sustained pressure and this is one thing JCC will bring. Be a bit worried that someone as ordinary as Brian Vera can ask all sorts of questions of him.

Not sold on Chavez by any means but hes by far the best fighter Lees fought and think he'll win by UD. Hope I'm wrong.

themandan6611 · 04-04-2012 9:34pm

Chavez points win

IF it happens, Lee will win.

Henno30 · 04-04-2012 10:34pm

The trouble for Lee in El Paso is that if he does get wobbled (which he is liable to), he might find that the ref is very quick to stop the fight.

He was on OTB this evening, spoke about the business side of the game getting him down over the last few years but also that maybe that he's more ready now than he would have been before. The thing about this match is that even if he does get robbed, everyone will be expecting it and it won't hurt his reputation.

Obviously Jr isn't rated as highly as Sergio, but like Macklin Andy has everything to gain from the platform will give him. If he performs, then it can only open more doors for him.

Spazdarn · 05-04-2012 10:33am

This goes down one of a few different ways... he gets wobbled and the ref jumps in far too early. It's a close fight on points but Chavez wins by a large margin due to WBC or hometown bias

Lee really has to knock him out and even then, I wouldn't be surprised if WBC found a way of having Chavez retain the title!

RiseToTheTop · 05-04-2012 1:34pm

I say the heat could affect Lee. I have looked at the map of North America many times, and El Paso is on the same distance to the equator as many parts of Mexico.

I hope Lee can train much in the hot weather beforehand.

walshb · 05-04-2012 1:39pm

Draw

Is it outdoors during a hot time? If so, then that is another Chavez advantage.

NikNak8 · 05-04-2012 2:06pm

Chavez points win

pity it couldn't be on a cold autumns evening in the pissing rain in Castleconnell! :-)

walshb · 05-04-2012 2:15pm

Draw

NikNak8 wrote: »

pity it couldn't be on a cold autumns evening in the pissing rain in Castleconnell! :-)

It could be. I'm sure if Lee wins JCC will demand a rematch. Champion has the say then.

Big Ears · 05-04-2012 2:48pm

Chavez points win

walshb wrote: »

It could be. I'm sure if Lee wins JCC will demand a rematch. Champion has the say then.

Not if there's options he doesn't, and you can bet with Arum in charge options on Lee should he win are very likely.

NikNak8 · 05-04-2012 3:02pm

Chavez points win

thought this is being billed as a Winner V Martinez (The real champion) fight

rebelomar · 05-04-2012 4:03pm

Andy needs to improve his conditioning wholesale to last the distance. If his stamina holds up then he could very well outbox Chavez Jnr...Think Lee mighn't have enough power to stop him but def has eough to earn his respect and make Chavez have to think more than he usually does.. By far and away both boxers toughest fight to date. Trying to get a decision is Texas is also going to be an absolute nightmare. Lets go Andy....

walshb · 05-04-2012 4:06pm

Draw

Not just his stamina, but his creativity too. He needs an inside game, more volume and a more complete array of shots. This is a big ask, as a work rate improvement and inside game will need a fitness improvement. Lee needs to become a pro fighter for this one. He has been for far too long an amateur fighter in a pro game.

barney4001 · 05-04-2012 4:28pm

Draw

walshb wrote: »

Is it outdoors during a hot time? If so, then that is another Chavez advantage.

You can bet everything will be in Chavez'es favour

barney4001 · 05-04-2012 6:59pm

Draw

Sergio Martinez Signs: Says Chavez-Lee is 50-50 Bout
By Rick Reeno

BoxingScene.com reached out to boxing adviser/promoter Sampson Lewkowicz, and spoke directly to middleweight king Sergio Martinez (49-2-2, 28KOs), who confirmed that he officially signed, at 7PM PST, an agreement to face the winner of Julio Cesar Chavez Jr. vs. Andy Lee - on the tentative date of September 15th. Lewkowicz, along with his wife, held a meeting with Martinez at the Bel Air Hotel in Beverly Hills, California.

As BoxingScene first reported on Tuesday, a deal was reached for Chavez Jr. (45-0-1, 31KOs) to defend his WBC middleweight title against Lee (28-1, 20KOs) in an HBO televised fight on June 16th at the Sun Bowl in El Paso, Texas.

The World Boxing Council positioned Martinez as the mandatory challenger at last December's convention in Las Vegas. The sanctioning body expects all of the required parties to sign this agreement.

"I have officially signed the agreement. [WBC President] Jose Sulaiman expects everyone involved to sign this agreement - including Chavez, Lee, [Top Rank CEO Bob] Arum and [Martinez/Lee promoter] Lou DiBella. If they don't sign the document [prior to June 16th], Jose Sulaiman has made a promise that the WBC title will not be on the line on June 16, because they will take the title away," Martinez said to BoxingScene.com.

Martinez, who plans to sit ringside at the Sun Bowl, expects a very close fight.

"It's going to be a very tough fight for both of them. I think it's a 50-50 fight," Martinez said.

Henno30 · 05-04-2012 11:12pm

Has anyone ever rocked Jr properly? I know people say Carlos Molina beat him twice but that guy (as anyone who watched him against Kirkland recently will know) has a very awkward style and would be very different to Lee. As someone has pointed out already Andy will need to show a lot of craft on the inside to win this one. Don't think he's going to be able to hold Jr off.

Jayob10 · 05-04-2012 11:56pm

I think people are vastly overrating JCC. Andy is more than capable to keep him at range. And its not as if JCC is a deadly dangerous fighter on the inside anyways.

Lee has the skills to do damage, and yes he does have the power. JCC may have a good chin but feeling Andy's power may send him into his shell.

I admit, Andy may need to win 10 rounds convincingly to get a decision here. But a moral victory will be rewarded too. Nobody expects Lee to win this, most probably expect him to get robbed.

He will get big fights off the back of this.

boxer.fan · 06-04-2012 12:11am

Lee stoppage win

I am a bit surprised by the amount of compliments on here for Chavez jnr. He usually gets nothing but criticism. As far as I remember he got the better of John Duddy in the later rounds, but John's defense was always going to be found wanting.

Lee has decent skills & there is no reason why he cant dominate Chavez jnr. Chavez jnr has more to be concerned about with this fight than Andy IMO.

Good luck to him anyway.

barney4001 · 06-04-2012 8:45am

Draw

Andy Lee 9/4
Draw 30/1
Julio Cesar Chavez Jr 1/3

Paddy Power odds

Boooourns · 06-04-2012 9:44am

Draw

barney4001 wrote: »

Andy Lee 9/4
Draw 30/1
Julio Cesar Chavez Jr 1/3

Paddy Power odds

Only 9/4! Very mean odds, i'd have Andy at least 5-1. I hate saying it but i just can't see where Andy wins this.

barney4001 · 06-04-2012 11:32am

Draw

Lee will be a bigger price in El Paso or Mexico maybe 5/1 or 6/1

Spazdarn · 06-04-2012 11:36am

walshb wrote: »

Not just his stamina, but his creativity too. He needs an inside game, more volume and a more complete array of shots. This is a big ask, as a work rate improvement and inside game will need a fitness improvement. Lee needs to become a pro fighter for this one. He has been for far too long an amateur fighter in a pro game.

He can leave learning an inside game for the next fight, he needs to stick to his tried and tested, by staying on the outside. Getting inside with Chavez would be a bad idea. It'll be won from distance.

cowzerp · 06-04-2012 11:39am

Draw

boxer.fan wrote: »

I am a bit surprised by the amount of compliments on here for Chavez jnr. He usually gets nothing but criticism. As far as I remember he got the better of John Duddy in the later rounds, but John's defense was always going to be found wanting.

Lee has decent skills & there is no reason why he cant dominate Chavez jnr. Chavez jnr has more to be concerned about with this fight than Andy IMO.

Good luck to him anyway.

I don't think its all about complimenting Chavez jr, I think people just don't rate Lee that highly-If he can't beat Chavez jr then he will never go any further.

barney4001 wrote: »

Lee will be a bigger price in El Paso or Mexico maybe 5/1 or 6/1

Exactly, for real money go that route if you feel Lee can win.

walshb · 06-04-2012 11:44am

Draw

cowzerp wrote: »

I don't think its all about complimenting Chavez jr, I think people just don't rate Lee that highly-If he can't beat Chavez jr then he will never go any further.

Exactly, for real money go that route if you feel Lee can win.

Exactly. I like Lee, but he just is not all that good. Very ordinary, ordinary game. He is missing a few things that I think will fail him vs. JCC.

Lee comes to fight, is tough, good chin, power and a brain. It stops there, and in pro boxing what he has is not enough for the top level.

Henno30 · 06-04-2012 1:39pm

cowzerp wrote: »

I don't think its all about complimenting Chavez jr, I think people just don't rate Lee that highly-If he can't beat Chavez jr then he will never go any further.

This. Also a lot of the resentment towards Chavez comes primarily from the ridiculous level of protection he receives from Sulaiman and the rest of the WBC cronies. The fact that he gets this treatment because of who his father is makes him and easy and justified target.

That's not to some people just don't rate him full stop. I read a great interview with Nacho Beristain a while back where he derided Chavez as an awful fighter.

nacho libre · 09-04-2012 2:25pm

Hopefully the nights are cold in El Paso at that time of year. Andy is a much better fighter than John Duddy, so i don't see this being a one sided fight, but unfortunately I fear his stamina issues will let him down in the late rounds.

walshb · 10-04-2012 1:14pm

Draw

nacho libre wrote: »

Hopefully the nights are cold in El Paso at that time of year. Andy is a much better fighter than John Duddy, so i don't see this being a one sided fight, but unfortunately I fear his stamina issues will let him down in the late rounds.

Better boxer than Duddy, not sure about fighter. Duddy could box and Duddy could brawl, and had bags of stamina, and a solid beard too. Lee is more one dimensional as a pro. What Lee has is size and power and a slightly better defence compared to Duddy, who really was not a MW fighter. Duddy also had little pop.

Pabzzz · 11-04-2012 11:36am

Chavez points win

Its definitely happening anyway

t has been confirmed that Limerick boxer Andy Lee will take on Julio Cesar Chavez Junior on 16 June.
The Limerick man, who fights out of Emmanuel Steward's Kronk gym, will challenge the current World Boxing Council (WBC) champion at the Sun Bowl Arena in Texas.
Lee, with just one defeat in 29 bouts as a professional to his name, last fought in March when he secured a two-round knockout over club fighter Saul Duran.
For his part, Chavez is unbeaten in 46 contests, including just one draw. He won the WBC title from Seb Zbik last June and has successfully defended twice so far, most recently defeating Marco Antonio Rubio in February.
He beat Derry boxer John Duddy in June 2010.

http://www.rte.ie/sport/news/2012/0403/316057-lee-to-take-on-wbc-champion-chavez-in-june/

slapbangwallop · 11-04-2012 2:10pm

Chavez points win

RiseToTheTop wrote: »

I say the heat could affect Lee. I have looked at the map of North America many times, and El Paso is on the same distance to the equator as many parts of Mexico.

I hope Lee can train much in the hot weather beforehand.

I think it is on at 10 at night their time. It wont be another McGuigan-Cruz effort

NikNak8 · 11-04-2012 2:11pm

Chavez points win

Pabzzz wrote: »

Its definitely happening anyway

http://www.rte.ie/sport/news/2012/0403/316057-lee-to-take-on-wbc-champion-chavez-in-june/[/QUOTE]

I think we can all agree that based on recent events just because RTE say its true is no guarantee, they dont exactly have a good track record!:eek:

nacho libre · 11-04-2012 5:01pm

walshb wrote: »

Better boxer than Duddy, not sure about fighter. Duddy could box and Duddy could brawl, and had bags of stamina, and a solid beard too. Lee is more one dimensional as a pro. What Lee has is size and power and a slightly better defence compared to Duddy, who really was not a MW fighter. Duddy also had little pop.

Yes. I should have said boxer, as that's what i meant:). Duddy could go to war as they say, Andy doesn't look like he can. He was almost undone by Mc Ewan a while back, an opponent like Chavez would, you get the impression, have taken Andy out in a similar situation. While Andy does have a decent punch, it's a pity he doesn't have the power of a guy like Pavlik, to compensate for his stamina issues

walshb · 11-04-2012 6:01pm

Draw

If he connects as flush as he did on Carl Daniels then stamina may not be an issue. Would love to see that. Kevin Keegan love it.

nacho libre · 11-04-2012 6:20pm

walshb wrote: »

If he connects as flush as he did on Carl Daniels then stamina may not be an issue. Would love to see that. Kevin Keegan love it.

While it was a good punch, Daniels was a journeyman. Lee has ok power, but he definitely was flattered somewhat in that Daniel's fight. I doubt he'll be able to replicate that against Chavez, unfortunately.

mark renton · 23-04-2012 12:26pm

Chavez points win

Great to see Andy getting a shot - IMHEO Andy was always the best of our middles, Macklin, Duddy etc

shame its in mehico but I hope Andy takes the opportunity

Henno30 · 25-04-2012 10:36am

Bit of trouble with the venue at the moment.

mark renton · 25-04-2012 11:37am

Chavez points win

Link??

yabadabado · 25-04-2012 11:41am

Lee stoppage win

They have been refused permission to fight in the Sun Bowl but the fight is still scheduled to go ahead on the 16th June,looking like it will now be in either Houston or San Antonio.