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Muslims asked to remove headscarves for new Garda card

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    #212
    Coriolanus
    Registered Users Posts: 4,879 ✭✭✭Coriolanus


    A ffs. It's a fúcking headscarf not a niqab. If people think the lanky streak of templemore piss can't identify someone using their FACIAL FEATURES then those people need to get a grip.


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    #213
    Galwayguy35
    Registered Users Posts: 16,285 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    Im no expert here but from what i see on television dont western women visiting some muslim countries have to wear a scarf whether they like it or not as its a rule of these countries. Shouldnt muslims do the same when they live in western countries. France being a case in point. If you are moving to a country accept the laws there.


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    #214
    Chuck Stone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,030 ✭✭✭✭Chuck Stone


    Galwayguy35 wrote: »
    Shouldnt muslims do the same when they live in western countries. France being a case in point. If you are moving to a country accept the laws there.

    Copy the intolerance of these countries is it?


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    #215
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    KeithAFC wrote: »
    So you think it would be OK for me to dress as a Ninja and walk about tesco and just say it is because of my new Ninja religion which came to me in a dream from the Ninja god who told me to spread the message of Ninjaism?

    ...if it keeps you from parading up and down outside my gaff in a pinstripe and bowler while your mates bang drums and blow on flutes....


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    #216
    KeithAFC
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,239 ✭✭✭✭KeithAFC


    Nodin wrote: »
    ...if it keeps you from parading up and down outside my gaff in a pinstripe and bowler while your mates bang drums and blow on flutes....
    Nothing wrong with that. ;)


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    #217
    Galwayguy35
    Registered Users Posts: 16,285 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    Chuck Stone wrote: »
    Copy the intolerance of these countries is it?

    If you want to live somewhere respect the laws of that country.


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    #218
    CajunPenguin
    Registered Users Posts: 126 ✭✭CajunPenguin


    KeithAFC wrote: »
    So you think it would be OK for me to dress as a Ninja and walk about tesco and just say it is because of my new Ninja religion which came to me in a dream from the Ninja god who told me to spread the message of Ninjaism?

    haha i wat to try that now


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    #219
    Born to Die
    Closed Accounts Posts: 830 ✭✭✭Born to Die


    dlofnep wrote: »
    Proper order. Religion is not a get out of jail free card when it comes to observing law.

    Depends on the crime.


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    #220
    alphanine
    Closed Accounts Posts: 146 ✭✭alphanine


    Paddy Samurai wrote: »
    http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2012/0321/1224313640645.html

    Seems pointless taking a ID photo if you can't see the persons face.So I assume that only the hair and neck are covered?.


    Fúck 'em


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    #221
    smokedeels
    Registered Users Posts: 2,883 ✭✭✭smokedeels


    keithclancy wrote: »
    Fine then, non muslims should be allowed to wear a Balaclava, keeps the tea in your mouth warm

    The Hijab covers the hair, you can't wear a balaclava but you can shave your head after the photo is taken. There's no difference.

    I'm a secularist and I don't get this ban.


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    #222
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    Chuck Stone wrote: »
    Copy the intolerance of these countries is it?
    It's nothing to do with copying intolerance.
    Somewhere along the line Muslim values became more sacred and unquestionable than western social norms, to the point where now anyone asking for Muslims to make an effort to fit in with the western society they have chosen to live in is painted as a fascist.


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    #223
    frozenfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 7,881 ✭✭✭frozenfrozen


    ;DG<

    See that poor little man above? His name is Yuseeme. If I were to call him Muhammad, the people insisting on wearing this headgear would *have* to kill me. Absolute mad cun*s when you think about it.


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    #224
    Chuck Stone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,030 ✭✭✭✭Chuck Stone


    Galwayguy35 wrote: »
    If you want to live somewhere respect the laws of that country.

    People should be allowed to wear whatever the hell they want on their heads.

    I wear a 4 ft tall top hat, a ski mask and a mankini myself.


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    #225
    gozunda
    Registered Users Posts: 18,996 ✭✭✭✭gozunda


    hondasam wrote: »
    Considering they are taking fingerprints the photograph is not as important.

    My sister was attacked whilst walking down a street in london at 8.30 in the morning by a large woman wearing a full lenght Burqa with face covered except for the eyes. Now as my sister did not know any women who dressed like this and is Irish btw. She had never met this individual or knew anyone who dressed in this type of clothing or otherwise. The deranged woman attacked my sister and dug dirty fingernails into her neck and tried to throttle her. The woman was pulled off by some passers by and ran off screaming into the crowd. When my sister was asked to describe her attacker - well you can fill in the report sheet yourself....

    It did not matter that the police ever knew what this cookie looked like because on the street nobody could identify her. All my sister could give the police an approximate description of was the womans eyes and percieved ethnicity. And guess what they said they could not persue the matter as they had not enough to go on...


    AND before I am jumped upon - NO I am not saying that women who wear Burqua etc are particularly violent but this woman was AND because she was covered from head to toe she could not be either described by the victim or found afterwards....

    So end of story anyone is that anyone imo who goes around with a disguise whahtever it be a hoody or face covering for whatever the alleged reason is there is a problem waiting to happen. How the hell do airports manage with these customs, I dont know


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    #226
    Ellis Dee
    Registered Users Posts: 2,512 ✭✭✭Ellis Dee


    Galwayguy35 wrote: »
    If you want to live somewhere respect the laws of that country.

    I bet you'd have been a hoor to the kaffirs black-skinned people in Apartheid South Africa. :rolleyes::rolleyes:


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    #227
    smokedeels
    Registered Users Posts: 2,883 ✭✭✭smokedeels


    gozunda wrote: »
    My sister was attacked whilst walking down a street in london at 8.30 in the morning by a large woman wearing a full lenght Burqa with face covered except for the eyes. Now as my sister did not know any women who dressed like this and is Irish btw. She had never met this individual or knew anyone who dressed in this type of clothing or otherwise. The deranged woman attacked my sister and dug dirty fingernails into her neck and tried to throttle her. The woman was pulled off by some passers by and ran off screaming into the crowd. When my sister was asked to describe her attacker - well you can fill in the report sheet yourself....

    It did not matter that the police ever knew what this cookie looked like because on the street nobody could identify her. All my sister could give the police an approximate description of was the womans eyes and percieved ethnicity. And guess what they said they could not persue the matter as they had not enough to go on...


    AND before I am jumped upon - NO I am not saying that women who wear Burqua etc are particularly violent but this woman was AND because she was covered from head to toe she could not be either described by the victim or found afterwards....

    So end of story anyone is that anyone imo who goes around with a disguise whahtever it be a hoody or face covering for whatever reason the alleged reason is a problem waiting to happen. How the hell do airports manage with these customs, I dont know

    You can wear bike helmets in the street too, what's your point?


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    #228
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    Chuck Stone wrote: »
    People should be allowed to wear whatever the hell they want on their heads.

    I wear a 4 ft tall top hat, a ski mask and a mankini myself.
    And they are allowed! But shouldnt be allowed obscure any part of themselves for a state id photo.


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    #229
    gozunda
    Registered Users Posts: 18,996 ✭✭✭✭gozunda


    smokedeels wrote: »
    You can wear bike helmets in the street too, what's your point?

    What do you think my fracking point is! You have to take bike helmets off for photographs, inside shops & banks and you cant get on a plane wearing one either and even where they are worn they dont disguise the person to the resemblance of a bin bag...

    So what you are saying that thats all right then I suppose....


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    #230
    Chuck Stone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,030 ✭✭✭✭Chuck Stone


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    Somewhere along the line Muslim values became more sacred and unquestionable than western social norms

    They did? What are Muslim values? We're not talking about a rare species of bee here with a one purpose hive mind.

    Also, what are western societal norms? Wouldn't respect for minorities be a principle western value?
    to the point where now anyone asking for Muslims to make an effort to fit in with the western society they have chosen to live in is painted as a fascist.

    By 'fit in' do you mean look and act like the majority? That's not asking to make an effort - that's asking them to become like the majority.


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    #231
    Marcin_diy
    Registered Users Posts: 464 ✭✭Marcin_diy


    One day when applying for an Irish ID card I'll go there with a toilet seat around my neck and kettle on the head and tell gards that this is my religion called kettlecism..

    Law here and other european countries is too soft. Try for example kiss your partner inpublic in saudie arabia I.e... u will be jailed straight away..


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    #232
    Hootanany
    Registered Users Posts: 5,477 ✭✭✭Hootanany


    They don't want to show off their Ronnies.


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    #233
    Chuck Stone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,030 ✭✭✭✭Chuck Stone


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    And they are allowed! But shouldnt be allowed obscure any part of themselves for a state id photo.

    Not even the vag?:eek:

    I think it's not an unreasonable request myself fwiw.


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    #234
    smokedeels
    Registered Users Posts: 2,883 ✭✭✭smokedeels


    gozunda wrote: »
    What do you think my fracking point is! You have to take bike helmets off for photographs, inside shops & banks and you cant get on a plane wearing one either and even where they are worn they dont disguise the person to the resemblance of a bin bag...

    So what you are saying that thats all right then I suppose....

    You said the incident happend in the street...


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    #235
    gozunda
    Registered Users Posts: 18,996 ✭✭✭✭gozunda


    smokedeels wrote: »
    You said the incident happend in the street...

    So if when something happens on a plane or in a hotel etc thats ok is it? All because anyone adopting what effectively a disguise can get away with without being identifiable!

    And btw I dont remember seeing anywhere that wearing a bike helmet was a religous duty.

    Look to save faffing around further just go back and read the concluding remarks - maybe just maybe you will get the point the second time around. But I am not holding my breath....


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    #236
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    Chuck Stone wrote: »
    They did? What are Muslim values? We're not talking about a rare species of bee here with a one purpose hive mind.

    Also, what are western societal norms? Wouldn't respect for minorities be a principle western value?



    By 'fit in' do you mean look and act like the majority? That's not asking to make an effort - that's asking them to become like the majority.
    Western social norms like not wearing religious headgear in a state id photo.
    By 'fit in' I mean make yourself properly visible in a state id photo like everyone else has to.


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    #237
    Chuck Stone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,030 ✭✭✭✭Chuck Stone


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    Western social norms like not wearing religious headgear in a state id photo.
    By 'fit in' I mean make yourself properly visible in a state id photo like everyone else has to.

    I don't think it's too much to ask myself.


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    #238
    keithclancy
    Registered Users Posts: 9,222 ✭✭✭keithclancy


    If it makes no difference then why not have the same rule for everyone, I dont see why I should be made take my hat off if it makes no difference to identifying someone.

    http://www.dfa.ie/home/index.aspx?id=257
    Only head coverings worn for religious reasons are permitted. Hair bands are not allowed.

    Just because my relgion doesnt bang on about wearing something over your head shouldn't mean that I have to take off my hat if it makes no difference.

    If it does make a difference then by all means admit that but make everyone follow the same rule.

    One rule for all, I don't give a sh*t what color you are or where your from but I expect for everyone to follow the same rules in society, especially if you come to a country that is not your own, if you don't like the rules then don't f*cking move there in the first place.

    E.G. I wouldn't move to Saudi simply because of the lack of booze, that wouldn't mean I would go spastic saying its my right and the monks invented the stuff, the Saudis would have my balls for breakfast.


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    #239
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    I don't think people should be forced to remove hijab. You can still see someones face and identify them that way.

    It seems like these issues are mostly fuelled by people who long for yet another culture war.


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    #240
    keithclancy
    Registered Users Posts: 9,222 ✭✭✭keithclancy


    philologos wrote: »
    I don't think people should be forced to remove hijab. You can still see someones face and identify them that way.

    Then fine, I shouldn't be forced to remove a hat as long as it doesn't cover my face.


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    #241
    El Guapo!
    Registered Users Posts: 12,427 ✭✭✭✭El Guapo!


    I think they should have to remove it. It's a joke, there shouldn't even need to be a discussion on this.



    Just as a matter of interest.........if a woman is wearing the full head gear that covers the face, and she is getting on a plane, surely she would have to remove that when showing her passport. So why would this be different? I know the head-dress in question only covers the hair but still.....


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