The 80's Recession V's this one?

mikemac1

That must be before my time

It was called Network 2 when I was a lad. I do remember RTE 2 but realy I think what I remember was Zig and Zag and Ian Dempsey and this was more nineties then eighties

That's incredible that station only starting at 6.30pm

Babybuff

seven pages, did anyone mention punks and mods yet?

Biggins

...then I think was a bit younger and youngsters don't have many worries or might not be aware of the problems and difficulties at home

When you were young, depending on your age, many things would happen all around you and at the time you would not gather or even see what was really going on. You just wouldn't grasp many things that simply would go right over your head.
Kids a lot more, didn't know any better in a lot of ways for their age then. My, how thats changed alone now in awareness and sharpness of kids these days. They can pick up a lot more faster, skills learned oft times through various visual media.

The ushering out of the room as a kid in those years back, the quiet corner sofa conversations and your mother trying to hide that she was crying as she was talking to a friend or sister there.
The slipping of a fiver for bread and milk between one to the other.
Kids just didn't think twice about seeing such things and went about carrying on playing, knowing nothing of the mental stresses alone of big people have to face huge bills as we now know as adults.
It was a complete world of innocence to a good degree.

iguana wrote: »

The tv consisted of 1 station in most of the country. Then one and a half stations as RTE 2 only started at 6.30pm each day.

We were lucky to live at times along the border so we got some of NI transmissions.
The rest of the country in places wasn't so lucky.

useeme

That One,

Christmas savings clubs: Mchugh Himself, Tony Kealy, Paddy Whelan, etc

Phone tapping, not the GUBU stuff, but how to make free calls on a landline.

Brown paper on school books.

HTV, BBC Crymu, depending on the season & weather.

Milk Bottles

The Black Economy.

A shure ill get dat round, youre working.

This one, personal and state debt.

mikemac1

General Motors wrote: »

HTV, BBC Crymu, depending on the season & weather.

Haha, I know on the East coast it's easier to pick up the British channels and stations, just tonight I was in a Dublin taxi and he was listening to the Arsenal-Newcastle match on BBC radio

When I lived in Galway it was a right struggle to get BBC radio and that was just a few years ago

And we could get Channel 4 but only at certain times and it wasn't reliable
It was better at night for some reason, better reception at night?

Youngsters these days with their UPC and Sky
In my day we had two channels and we were glad to have them

Pandora2

I left school in '83, there was no conversation about me leaving to look for work, it was just a given!! No Joe to discuss my plight! My parents gave me Twenty Pounds when I left and I just knew that they would go without food for that gesture. Failure to thrive was not an option;)

Getting hand me down clothes from a cousin in Oz that were always out of season when they fitted me, Summer - Canary yellow Dresses in Winter, Kilts & Polo necks in winter hues for the Summer and don't dare complain, not because you would get in trouble but, because you would see the hopelessness in your Mother's eyes.

The whole family with the same bowl haircut......between the clothes and the haircut, I was tortured at school.

Going to the local supermarket and asking for scraps for the dog and hoping there was an end of chicken and ham in there that would make lunches for school, a bone for soup, I'm sure the lady at the counter knew, there was always something useful in there. I still have a rotten diet, I just became accustomed to a diet of eggs, bread, chips, mash & beans. Christmas Dinner was always a Capon (a big chicken)!

My domestic science teacher would make vat's of soup and mountains of brown bread in the morning for those kids who didn't have a lunch......the kitchen was swamped at lunchtime.

Joining the local majorettes and having to leave because the cost of "America Tan" tights was above and beyond the family budget.

And that Christmas when I was 8 when my Mum took me aside and gently explained that there was no Santa and as I was the eldest I would have to understand - I did, I got a knitted jumper but certainly no hope of anything that might have featured in any letter to Santa.....It was nothing for my Dad to go out to work and return jobless by lunchtime, the last in first out trap! He took the boat and I always cry when I hear Dolores Keane, My Love is in America.....it summed up my poor Mam's life...they never got it together when he eventually made it back.

I don't suppose that I thought it was "Angela's Ashes" territory, it was just the norm. But it marked me, to this day I break out in a cold sweat if I have less than 6 toilet rolls in the house...I used to be so embarassed when anyone came to the house and was faced with squares of newspaper in the bathroom......I don't think I saw actual loo roll in there before I was 20:eek: And they weren't our newspapers either....my Dad would get them from the neighbours and read them before they were recycled.

But for one thing I am grateful, elections may have been more frequent but at a young age this was more entertainment than anything else however, there was not the constant drip, drip, drip of bad news coming at you from every direction.......The News was on a couple of times a day and reported facts but rarely editorialised, a daily newspaper was a luxury few could afford.....current affairs programmes were much less prevalent, given that we had only 2 stations I suppose. The all pervasive news that we experience everyday is a bit like a scary movie for me right now.....no sooner is one fear realised than we're off on another....I am as guilty as anyone else, I can't turn it off....right now Ivan is in my ear while I type this and I am incapable of turning it off, I am afraid of what's going to happen next and forewarned is forearmed!!

My Mam died just a year into the recession and God help her, was on Disability Allowance due to years in cleaning jobs and back breaking hotel work never paying a stamp, as it was the only jobs she could get. If there was one blessing that came from her early passing it was that she did not have to live through this!!

44leto

Babybuff wrote: »

seven pages, did anyone mention punks and mods yet?

That was more 70s. The early 80s was "two tone" and "Ska"then the "new romantics".

Then music died:(

whatdoicare

I'm not sure which is worse - my mother insists this recession is worse but maybe she's forgotten what it was like before.

I grew up in the eighties and my hubby is a 70's child - and we believe we were far luckier than our younger siblings born in the late 80's/90's who don't remember what it was like- this whole not having money situation is beyond them, they have never had to save or cut back!

Whereas myself & hubby went straight from the whole lucky to get a pound for toys from the pound shop to scraping by in college to living abroad to finally saving for wedding and buying our home. We have always had to scrimp and save for everything we have and were well into our twenties before we got a credit card - and it's like handling a bomb everytime we use it. :rolleyes:

As as result, we never got a taste for having everything - we thought euro2, Aldi and penneys were a god send and people laughed at us for shopping there - we genuinely thought that shopping in Dunnes or Superquin as "Luxury" shopping (and still do). We just couldn't justify it -Euro2 is fantastic for shampoo and personal items, Aldi food is lovely, fills up the belly and Penneys clothes does the job of saving us from nakedness. My siblings shopped nowhere only Superquin and wore only designer gear! We thought they were stone mad for wasting so much money!:eek:

Long story short - we continued our 80's way of life and our only debt is the mortgage. Life is not so hard for us-don't get me wrong, it's hard but not unbearable.

Anyway, my point is that those born late 80's onwards are having the tough time - they have never had to tell themselves "no, I should shop around or save up" or "No way am I paying that, I'll do without!" It's a shameful thing for them to shop in Aldi or Penneys or anywhere similar - they don't know how to make do or go without. (I realise this is a generalisation - I don't mean everyone but obviously a majority)

So, looking at it like that - this recession would be the worse one - hands down but it will get better - there's always hope and the next generation (our kids) will hopefully find it easier to cope.

44leto

I think the chief difference in this recession is what we lost.
In the 80s we had nothing so nothing to lose, we were never going to be turfed out of our corpo houses.

But with this recession people are losing everything and still having the debt for those things.

There is also, we are unsure that we have not seen the bottom of this yet. We are still very vulnerable to outside factors beyond our control.

So this recession is far worse, there is a hopelessness with it.

iguana

mikemac1 wrote: »

That must be before my time

It was called Network 2 when I was a lad. I do remember RTE 2 but realy I think what I remember was Zig and Zag and Ian Dempsey and this was more nineties then eighties

That's incredible that station only starting at 6.30pm

RTE 2 was originally broadcast to show British shows that people who couldn't pick up UK signals were missing out on. It started in 1978 and used to have Coronation street on every night of the week as they started with the episodes from 1960 and went through them fast to catch up with the UK (though it still took them about 6-7 years to catch up). The channel only broadcast for 4 hours or so a night, starting at 6.30pm and ending around midnight. I can remember sitting watching the clock on the screen that meant the channel was going to start soon and counting down to when it would start as I was bored of the news (which lasted an hour) on RTE 1.

Dempsey's Den was on RTE 1 for the first few years. It came on after Live At 3 which was an absolute torment of a show cause it started around the time you got out of school when you really needed to see some cartoons. And Zig and Zag weren't originally on Dempsey's Den they were only introduced after the first year or so. In 1988 RTE rebranded RTE 2 as Network 2 and moved all the kids shows over there as they started broadcasting earlier in the day.

Babybuff

44leto wrote: »

So this recession is far worse, there is a hopelessness with it.

maybe because back in the day we had a bit of soul, and solidarity. Can't say either of those attributes are in abundance anymore. Irish are more likely to fup each other over if it helps them get ahead thesedays.

whatdoicare

Everyone needs to turn on "The Van"/"the snapper"/"The commitments" bit of a sense of hope in those films We need more films like those nowadays!

K-9

Inflation was near 20% in the early 80's, unemployment was high but the black economy was rife, interest rates of 10% were seen as low, reached 18/19% in the early 90's.

People give out about FG/Labour now, these were the FG/Lab income tax rates in 1986, the lowest rate was 35% IIRC and quickly rose in steps to 65% with PRSI on top. Governments loved overtime.

K-9

Pandora2 wrote: »

I left school in '83, there was no conversation about me leaving to look for work, it was just a given!! No Joe to discuss my plight! My parents gave me Twenty Pounds when I left and I just knew that they would go without food for that gesture. Failure to thrive was not an option;)

Getting hand me down clothes from a cousin in Oz that were always out of season when they fitted me, Summer - Canary yellow Dresses in Winter, Kilts & Polo necks in winter hues for the Summer and don't dare complain, not because you would get in trouble but, because you would see the hopelessness in your Mother's eyes.

The whole family with the same bowl haircut......between the clothes and the haircut, I was tortured at school.

Going to the local supermarket and asking for scraps for the dog and hoping there was an end of chicken and ham in there that would make lunches for school, a bone for soup, I'm sure the lady at the counter knew, there was always something useful in there. I still have a rotten diet, I just became accustomed to a diet of eggs, bread, chips, mash & beans. Christmas Dinner was always a Capon (a big chicken)!

My domestic science teacher would make vat's of soup and mountains of brown bread in the morning for those kids who didn't have a lunch......the kitchen was swamped at lunchtime.

Joining the local majorettes and having to leave because the cost of "America Tan" tights was above and beyond the family budget.

And that Christmas when I was 8 when my Mum took me aside and gently explained that there was no Santa and as I was the eldest I would have to understand - I did, I got a knitted jumper but certainly no hope of anything that might have featured in any letter to Santa.....It was nothing for my Dad to go out to work and return jobless by lunchtime, the last in first out trap! He took the boat and I always cry when I hear Dolores Keane, My Love is in America.....it summed up my poor Mam's life...they never got it together when he eventually made it back.

I don't suppose that I thought it was "Angela's Ashes" territory, it was just the norm. But it marked me, to this day I break out in a cold sweat if I have less than 6 toilet rolls in the house...I used to be so embarassed when anyone came to the house and was faced with squares of newspaper in the bathroom......I don't think I saw actual loo roll in there before I was 20:eek: And they weren't our newspapers either....my Dad would get them from the neighbours and read them before they were recycled.

But for one thing I am grateful, elections may have been more frequent but at a young age this was more entertainment than anything else however, there was not the constant drip, drip, drip of bad news coming at you from every direction.......The News was on a couple of times a day and reported facts but rarely editorialised, a daily newspaper was a luxury few could afford.....current affairs programmes were much less prevalent, given that we had only 2 stations I suppose. The all pervasive news that we experience everyday is a bit like a scary movie for me right now.....no sooner is one fear realised than we're off on another....I am as guilty as anyone else, I can't turn it off....right now Ivan is in my ear while I type this and I am incapable of turning it off, I am afraid of what's going to happen next and forewarned is forearmed!!

My Mam died just a year into the recession and God help her, was on Disability Allowance due to years in cleaning jobs and back breaking hotel work never paying a stamp, as it was the only jobs she could get. If there was one blessing that came from her early passing it was that she did not have to live through this!!

I mind being singled out for being rich by the national teacher, apparently being the son of the local guard made me rich.

Never knew what a steak was until I was 25, stewing steak was irish stew to me, a luxury, though a fresh salmon from Killybegs and watching Dad gut it was a treat. Shame Mum boiled it to death!

He struggled on for years on a Sergeants salary, used to have a good car, his pleasure, eventually that went when he retired.

Paid Health insurance all his life , meant nothing when he passed away, died on a public ward, 6 or 7 people in the same ward, apologies from other patients not understanding he had passed away. Through the care and diligence of public hospitals we know he died in comfort. Shame all the health insurance counted for nothing.

If it was up to private nursing home care, he'd have died in agony and we'd have known no better.

Can't fault the care he had in public hospitals, if it was up to the private nursing home he'd have died in excruciating pain and we'd have been none the wiser.

mikemac1

Well with Leas Cross we are a bit more ready to speak up and question compared to the eighties
What happened in nursing homes should never happen again

There is no longer an unquestioning attitude to authority

K-9 wrote: »

I mind being singled out for being rich by the national teacher, apparently being the son of the local guard made me rich.

This makes me angry, rich or poor a child should never ever be shamed and put on the spot
I was a poorer student in so far as I shared books and my siblings had the other books I needed but I was never singled out and other students were the same. Teachers knew the score and what parents could afford
Just because you work for the State and are a garda sergeant does not make you well off

It is not a teachers job to look down on children and call them out, humiliation can last a lifetime

K-9

mikemac1 wrote: »

This makes me angry, rich or poor a child should never ever be shamed and put on the spot
I was a poorer student in so far as I shared books and my siblings had the other books I needed but I was never singled out and other students were the same. Teachers knew the score and what parents could afford
Just because you work for the State and are a garda sergeant does not make you well off

It is not a teachers job to look down on children and call them out, humiliation can last a lifetime

Ah LOL, he was a character, I avoided the picking up by the ears thing, out of the desk, he'd a few scraps with parents outside the classroom and he brought the wireless in for Cheltenham, Uncle Buck or something like that still rings a bell, no interest in horse racing.

He probably had an ould naggin of whiskey in his coat. Put manners on a few.

Ironically the teacher was probably better paid and respected, just the Guard didn't care if he was a teacher or not!

The Scientician

I had a conversation there lately with a sales rep about the death of pubs. One of the things he pointed out was that in the early '80s recession the pubs were busy. He reckoned it was because a) they were heated and b) they typically had televisions and other entertainment, two things that may not have been present in your home at the time. I was only born in '81 so I can't comment as to the accuracy or yer man's reasoning but I thought it an interesting idea nonetheless, and perhaps indicative of how much worse things were then, at least for those on the lower economic rungs of Irish society.

Nowadays there are lots of empty retail units and office space. However the total for square footage still in use is likely vastly more than at the nadir of the '80s.

I was in Dublin City Centre on Sunday for a while, I'm rarely in during the day, and I was amazed at how many people were about, I think the mild weather helped but it didn't feel like a town that's suffering. Maybe this recession's worst suffering is just better hidden than previous ones.

mikemac1

Once upon a time a parent never ever questioned the parish priest, the local garda or the school principal

Nowadays in the private sector a parent may have more qualifications and be better paid then those three

The unquestioning attitude to authority needs to go and progress has been made

K-9

mikemac1 wrote: »

Once upon a time a parent never ever questioned the parish priest, the local garda or the school principal

Nowadays in the private sector a parent may have more qualifications and be better paid then those three

The unquestioning attitude to authority needs to go and progress has been made

As long as the teacher and guard can still give them a flick across the ear?

Unfortunately the questioning attitude to authority now means some taking the piss out of Guards and teachers, so it has gone the other way. Far too much deference, to a total lack of respect in some areas.

upandcumming

I didn't live through the 80's recession but I think this one is worse. This time round we had so much to lose in comparison.

LH Pathe

Duuuude the 80s recession was way more fun. always sunny, always colourful.. and gi joe the animated series was busy predicting today's top-down illuminati device

JupiterKid

I was a kid in the 80s but I think the 80s were worse - there was absolutely no credit available, no "China effect" of affordable and cheap (in real terms) toys, household appliances and other things.

Inflation was out of control in the 80s and interest rates were sky high. People in this country literally went hungry. Many rural houses still lacked indoor sanitation, hard as it is to bleieve today.

And I lived in a pretty comfortably off environment compared to many in Ireland - but my Dad had to go back up North to find a decent job and bills were a constant worry. Hand me downs from friends and family were the norm.

There was no infrastructure to speak of - the roads were appalling, dangerous narrow twisty goat tracks with potholes everywhere. No bypasses to speak of, no motorways except a tiny stretch at Naas and at Dublin Airport. You could be waiting several years to get a telephone installed and telecommunications were sh*te state - so much so that several industries that came to Ireland in the 60s and 70s pulled out of the country because of poor infrastructure.

Young adults all seemed to look gloomy (as so many were unemployed) and wear these horrible faux brown leather jackets and blue drainpipe jeans - it was drab, drab, drab. A still powerful Catholic church that commanded mass attendance rates of 85%. No divorce, limited contraception, being gay was illegal, many books and films censored/banned.

Yes, there was far less indebtedness in the 80s but people really struggled with the basics to an extent that isn't (yet) the case today. This recession seems harsh because we came off a dizzying high of a house price bubble, rampant consumerism, one-upmanship with the neighbours, crass materialism and living beyond our means.

In the 80s few people had the "means" to live beyond. Ireland was poor.

okioffice84

Biggins wrote: »

The 80's depression (even a few years up to it) was far worse in a number of ways (to me anyway).
There was not as much avenues that could be seen, as to how to stimulate the economy back again.
We were still fairly new to the mechanisms of the EU and how things were done, on that alone sometimes we were feeling in the dark, having hit and miss opportunities and disasters till we slowly learned better.

There was also not (and this cannot be understated) so many charities and/or organisations that were willing, never mind able, to help out - even government help to those that were really down and broke - and I mean broke (I remember one day my mother, god bless her, having to bring food to a friend of hers who was heartbroken and depressed at not being able to provide for her children. The 4 kids the next morning really didn't have anything in the home to eat - not even a form of breakfast cereal.), so broke we shared shoes with other families and some clothing.
- I remember the provincial town hall center in my town having to hand out EU unbranded tinned food in plastic bags. All those that had nothing, took these tins and hoped for the best it was eatable. Oft times it wasn't. It was worse than dog food, looked and smelled like it.

My father bordered on the line of becoming an alcoholic at the time, such was the real stress and strain of trying daily to find work just to feed and clothe us.
The schools somehow managed to find money to feed some of the 'special' kids that had nothing - again, oft times not even books or pencils, things was that bad.
(School books was shared a lot more. It was normal to see class rooms with two desks shoved together, sharing books)
One of the first things a teacher would ask daily on entering a class would be "Ok, who's got a book? Do you mind sharing?"

There was no such thing as school trips/holidays away. I couldn't understand at the time why some kids got to go away for school trips and others had to stay at home on a regular basis. Be it one day trips or week trips abroad.
The money was just not there.

My father (electrician) we eventually said goodbye to, what seems like years.
He ended up down in the construction of the Channel tunnel, he ended up in Bermuda for a year on a construction site. He rarely came home during the times but always sent home what money he could.

Everyone we knew in our family was down and broke - and I mean everyone.
It was a terrible, terrible grey depressing time and it breaks my heart to see vestiges of it returning yet again so that in fear, my own kids might suffer from touches of a depression once again.

I am a man. I'm as stubborn and thick as any man can be at the grumpiest of times but will still admit to occasionally having tears in my eye when I look back at the previous times when things were really, really bad, when I look back at how my mother and father suffered - yet amazingly sacrificed food and clothes for themselves so my parents younger offspring could eat.

It was a truly awful time and for many, there seemed no way out. Our local river took many lives and with news of each death, everyone got more depressed.

Long story short, we (Ireland) didn't have the more means, resources, avenues, contacts, experience and much more, to be able to better our economy for some time.

I could go on but I've said enough for now.
The memories are still too painful.

Ah boo hoo. I grew up in the '80's too in a small rural town in the West- feck all money but and it wasn't that bad.
Jesus.:rolleyes:

Balmed Out

Less then half the amount of people working compared to know and they earned way less. This meant there was no where near the same amount of businesses. In Cork I reckon there is propably 150 % more retail space in the centre alone then now, and this at a time where there were f all shopping centres (Wilton and only one of the Douglas ones on south side).

Looked through some old photos last night and hilarious to see us all aged 3 wearing the same cowboy outfit. What caught my attention though was the BRILLIANT WEATHER. All summer long it was shorts and t-shirts playing outside.

Biggins

okioffice84 wrote: »

Ah boo hoo. I grew up in the '80's too in a small rural town in the West- feck all money but and it wasn't that bad.
Jesus.:rolleyes:

Thanks for the understanding.

Many grew up as kids in the 70/s/80's.
As as mentioned and alluded to a few times, kids then weren't as aware of some things that was happening around them.
We tended to shield our offspring away from a lot more.
To many kids it appears (thankfully) that things was not that bad but as I learned, the pressures on adults was enormous daily, each day being sometimes a fight to find, keep even small money in one pockets and the mental stress of it all hidden away behind the faces of our parents.

What did young kids of the time really know? As far as many was aware, we could run the streets and fields, the weather was it seems a lot better then and we could do more that we wanted, with careless disregard more so for lurkers and perverts around every corner...
It was a different time for the young and a greater world of protected innocence and bliss. If you were lucky, you never saw the worst of the bad cases.

You okioffice, sounds like that. Your lucky. Appreciate it.
Other however was not so lucky, they saw it daily and sometimes they were part of those hard times.
Have bit of understanding and don't be so quick to mock - we are not out of the present woods with this recession and it hasn't touched on others lives yet, maybe including yours (or your future children some day?) !
I suspect it will - but I gladly hope I'm wrong.

Ellis Dee

The 1980s recession wasn't quite as bad as the present one for several reasons that include:

1. People didn't have really fat years in the recent past to look back on and wonder. "How did we manage to fcuk everything up so fast?":rolleyes:
2. There was no Internet in the 1980s and therefore no one posting shite about the recession on forums like this.:D:D

Wibbs

Milk & Honey wrote: »

Foreign holidays were for the uber rich.

Ah I dunno about that. My family were OK in that they were employed, but hardly "uber rich" and we had foreign holidays

smash wrote: »

Sure we'll be due another one in 20 years

Quite the opposite IMHO. Mark my words, we'll have another boom in 15 to 20 years and again housing will be a biggy and for much the same reasons. Why? Demographics. Ireland had a baby boom in the early 70's and that wave ran through the 80's and into the 90's when they needed jobs, homes, products and services for their adult life. Those babyboomers are in turn having their own kids(we've one of the highest birth rates in Europe) and those kids will be looking for jobs, homes, products and services so demand will go through the roof again.

phil1nj wrote: »

I was very young for the 80's recession but what I do remember from it was the fact that the price of ordinary things went up very, very quickly.

Yea and it started in the 70's. When I first attended primary school a coke was some thing like 5 pence, by the time I left secondary it was close to 50 pence in just over a decade.

I dunno the 80's and 70's seemed to depend on where you lived. IMHO there was a much bigger gulf between the urban and rural compared to now. Growing up in Dublin I didn't know any one of my peers who didn't have a telephone, though I recall a couple who had no telly. People I knew from rural Ireland were often without both. I remember being in a house in the west(late 70's) that had only gotten "the electric" recently. Even things like fashion and musical tastes seemed to lag a year behind beyond the bigger urban centres, not just Dublin. I had a great aunt that had married a Galwegian and we used to visit her in Galway city and her and her neighbours were the same as in Dublin as far as the "stuff" they had. Looking back there were some not so obvious things that reflected our economic state. EG cars. Like has been noted Mercs and the like were very rare to see. Fords, Opels and Renaults were much more in evidence. Low end basic models with it. There were even Irish market cars that had all the trimmings of high end models but with smaller engines compared to the UK

lazygal

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPICQwHnhOs

MidlandsM

lazygal wrote: »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPICQwHnhOs

ughhhh...depressing,and that was just Mary Black:D

iguana

Biggins wrote: »

Many grew up as kids in the 70/s/80's.
As as mentioned and alluded to a few times, kids then weren't as aware of some things that was happening around them.
We tended to shield our offspring away from a lot more.
To many kids it appears (thankfully) that things was not that bad but as I leaned, the pressures on adults was enormous daily, each day being sometimes a fight to find, keep even small money in one pockets and the mental stress of it all hidden away behind the faces of our parents.

My parents always kept us completely abreast of what was going on financially. We knew roughly what my dad earned what our rent and other outgoings were, how hard my parents were saving to buy a house and get us out of Moyross. We knew why they were desperate to get out of what was at the time a brand new and very nice estate as they explained to us how social problems tended to arise in those estates. We knew about how credit worked and why it was a false economy in most cases. When the time came to buy a house we knew how much it cost, how much the mortgage was, how for years and years they would be paying nothing but interest and how it would mean we had even less money than we were used to. We discussed it as a family.

As for so much of what is described on this thread as the great hardship of the 80s, I just don't get it. Sharing clothes with relatives was brilliant. Every year or so I'd get a bag of stuff from my mother's cousin, who was a few years older than me and it was fantastically exciting. Those EEC food parcels were great, bags of random free food, how could it not be fantastic. Feck it, my dad was a binman so a huge amount of the things we had were things he nabbed at the dump and restored. Whenever there was some thing that kellogs/weetabix were doing that involved collecting tokens my dad would go through the rubbish bins he was collecting and cut the tokens off for us, so we'd have cereal bowls or atlases. And we thought he was a genius. I mean why the hell would anyone pay for something that could be got for free or cheap?

And my family was in the odd position of being much poorer in the 90s than we were in the 80s as my dad became incredibly ill and was pensioned off at 33. So while others around us were starting to have a lot more we had a lot less. But it was fine as we knew what was happening and were able to adjust to it. When I started babysitting I paid my brothers pocket money so they'd have money for things they wouldn't otherwise have and save for school tours, etc.

The fact we always knew about finance and making the most of very little is something that has benefited me enormously. As an adult I've always been relatively well off but I'm not a money waster. Apart from a mortgage I've never touched credit, nearly all my clothes are second hand, all my books/dvds/computers/tv/etc are. I either go to those super cheap hairdressers or cut my own hair, my bike is one my dad pulled out of a canal and fixed up for me. I've been shopping in Aldi/Lidl for over 10 years, in regular supermarkets I always check the nearly out of date stuff first (long before it's sudden popularity). I get most toiletries in pound/euro shops. If I wear make-up, which I usually don't, I get it in Aldi. I've always chosen the same financial lifestyle as that my parents lived in the 80s because it's a bloody sensible one.