Champion Hurdle, 13-03-12

ft9

Zarkandar

Google.

hucklebuck

Binocular

ft9 wrote: »

Google.

Touche, handy for ticket prices too.

On Zarkandar Nicholls said he came back on Friday with a cough and dirty nose, he must have had it in the race as I am not sure symptoms would come on that quick.

I had a sneaking suspicion after the way the Saturday string ran.

Got stuck in again at 6/1, very impressive if he was sick and he will come on for the run too.

ft9

Zarkandar

It's very hard to believe though Huckle isn't it?

To go on and win a race sick, I really cannot see it

hucklebuck

Binocular

"The one highlight of last week was Zarkandar'sperformance in the Betfair Hurdle. Especially as he was one who came back from Newbury with filthy nose and cough. Add that to the fact the race was not run at a pace to suit, his performance has me even more excited about his chances come the festival! Zarkandar be back out cantering on Wednesday once he has finsihed his course of antibiotics."

Strong words from the Champion, gonna go in again

hucklebuck

Binocular

ft9 wrote: »

It's very hard to believe though Huckle isn't it?

To go on and win a race sick, I really cannot see it

It is, but, I have been saying to my mates since his first win that he is a horse to follow, he looks a powerhouse, he finds loads for pressure and strikes me as a Lough Derg in attitute. I was talking so much about him a guy I work who isn't in to racing went to the bookies and stuck €50 on Zarkandar for the Triumph, he had heard me lavishing praise on the horses in numerous who are you backing chats with racing fans in work.

I was chatting on here can't remember what thread but someone was saying he is no Hurricane Fly and as I have been so taken by him I dug down into it. Two beautifully bred horses, Hurricane Fly at 5 and after 5 hurdles races was rated 157, even after 4 races at 5 and possibly being sick Zarkandar should be 156/7. I was expecting him to have improved similar to Grandouet so in theory he should have won 10 lengths on Friday, the fact Nicholls has him entered in the Champion Hurdle has me summising that he rates his as a mid 160 horse or better(he would hardly prep a CH horse in a handicap unless he was expecting him to win doing handstands). Over the last few years Nicholls only entered Celestial Halo who was rated 165ish so he doesn't seem like a trainer to throw a horse in.

I know there is plenty of summising but and hold on to your hat, I would not be surprised if he wins this year and if he doesn't I expect him to turn the tables on a 9 year old Hurricane Fly next year. I am up to my shoulders in ew ante post slips as to me he looks the real deal, if he doesn't win this year I think he will next year.

RichieLawlor

Zarkandar

hucklebuck wrote: »

I was chatting on here can't remember what thread but someone was saying he is no Hurricane Fly and as I have been so taken by him I dug down into it. Two beautifully bred horses, Hurricane Fly at 5 and after 5 hurdles races was rated 157, even after 4 races at 5 and possibly being sick Zarkandar should be 156/157

Your leaving out a lot of the facts here.

Hurricane Fly was a group winner on the Flat, he beat the French Derby winner.
As a 5yo he was favourite for the Supreme but missed it thru injury. He had beaten the winner ( Go Native ) out of sight before and after.

As a 6yo he again missed the festival because of injury but hacked up in the Punchestown version.

At 7 he finally made it to Cheltenham and duly won the Champion Hurdle.

His grade 1 wins are into double figures despite all the setbacks.

With a bit of luck on his side he would probably be a triple festival winner and have 20 grade 1s.

He is probably the best hurdler we have ever seen (I include Istabraq in this)

The horse doesn't get nearly enough respect IMO

Colonel Sanders

Zarkandar

I'd be happy enough to say best 2m hurdler SINCE Istabraq but not sure about best INCLUDING Istabraq

Obviously not HF's fault but I actually think bar him & unless one of last years 4yo crop proves a top notcher the 2m division is relatively weak

RichieLawlor

Zarkandar

Colonel Sanders wrote: »

I'd be happy enough to say best 2m hurdler SINCE Istabraq but not sure about best INCLUDING Istabraq

Obviously not HF's fault but I actually think bar him & unless one of last years 4yo crop proves a top notcher the 2m division is relatively weak

I think the 2m division would be very competitive without HF in there. They are all very good horses but HF looks a cut above.

And ya, the Istabraq comment was made to draw some debate.

UrbanSea

Grandouet

Hi everyone. I got a tip off of a friend. He knows the jockey Ruby Townend and he said that each way on HURRICANE RUN is the bet of the festival thank me after

premierstone

Zarkandar

Colonel Sanders wrote: »

I'd be happy enough to say best 2m hurdler SINCE Istabraq but not sure about best INCLUDING Istabraq

Obviously not HF's fault but I actually think bar him & unless one of last years 4yo crop proves a top notcher the 2m division is relatively weak

Thats because Hurricane Fly has frightened them all to go off novice chasing

Also on the Istabraq issue, look at the fields in he's champion hurdles success, hardly vintage! But like Hurricane Fly the opposition is irrelevant as the performances are/were so dominant.

premierstone

Zarkandar

UrbanSea wrote: »

Hi everyone. I got a tip off of a friend. He knows the jockey Ruby Townend and he said that each way on HURRICANE RUN is the bet of the festival thank me after

Reverse forecast with Pat Flynns new recruit Binocular in the Novice Chase??

UrbanSea

Grandouet

Probably man. I don't know if Binocular is going for the Arkle though. I heard whispers about going for the Champion Chase.

RichieLawlor

Zarkandar

None of last years 'superstar' 4 year olds will be placed in the Champion Hurdle

Discuss

UrbanSea

Grandouet

Well Richard.


I think they will only be racing for third. I think Hurricane Run (my each way tip) will win by a neck to Binocular. I don't think Zarkandar will be in the frame. Perhaps Grandouet for the final place.

RichieLawlor

Zarkandar

UrbanSea wrote: »

Well Richard.


I think they will only be racing for third. I think Hurricane Run (my each way tip) will win by a neck to Binocular. I don't think Zarkandar will be in the frame. Perhaps Grandouet for the final place.

Well I think Binocular will be 2nd but he won't see which way HF went.

For third, Oscars Well, Rock on Ruby maybe I dunno.

RichieLawlor

Zarkandar

And if you say Hurricane Run once more ill hunt you down and harm you

newuser89

Other (please specify)

Rock on ruby should a beat binocular so if yas have confidence in binocular yous should share it equally with rock on ruby.
They beat overturn better than grandouet had beaten overturn
So it could have been better than first looked

premierstone

Zarkandar

RichieLawlor wrote: »

None of last years 'superstar' 4 year olds will be placed in the Champion Hurdle

Discuss

Are you of the opinion that last years Triumph has been greatly overrated??

Quite possible and their is evidence to suggest it, however I personally think it was a vintage renewal and as I have always stated Grandouet was the one to take from the race for me, I think the first three home will be Hurricqane Fly, Grandouet and Binocular in that order.

newuser89

Other (please specify)

Hurricane fly ,zarkander and rock on ruby in that order

mdwexford

Spirit Son would have smashed them all, maybe.

The two mile hurdling division hasnt had strength in depth for as long as ive been watching racing, there is rarely a vintage field in any of the championship races. Few with chances, few hoping for prize money, few bums in there to give their owners a day out.

Without injury HF would have won a lot more and be mentioned up there with Istabraq perhaps. Beating Solwhit twenty times and winning at the over the top festival every year wont improve his legacy. Cheltenham is all that matters.

premierstone

Zarkandar

mdwexford wrote: »

Beating Solwhit twenty times and winning at the over the top festival every year wont improve his legacy.

Hope this is tounge in cheek??

Hurricane Fly has won 10 grade ones for a start, secondly Solwhit is a damn good horse and was rated as high as 168. Hurricane Fly has also beaten everything that has been put in front of him and some of he's more illustrious victims include Binocluar, Kyber Kim, Oscar Whiskey, Peddlars Cross, Dunquib, Punjabi, Thousand Stars, Medermit, Go Native, Menorah etc etc all rated well over 160

RichieLawlor

Zarkandar

For some reason md refuses to give HF any credit at all for anything. He had been the same for the last few years so id play little attention to what he says on this matter.

He's has had the same blinkers on when it comes to lots of horses, he can't be objective

hucklebuck

Binocular

RichieLawlor wrote: »

He is probably the best hurdler we have ever seen (I include Istabraq in this)

The horse doesn't get nearly enough respect IMO

I think you misunderstood me Richie, I am sure I said I think he would have beaten Istabraq in another thread. Hurricane Fly is the best hurdler I have seen.

I was just restating what I said in another thread when someone wrote off Zarkandar and was comparing their hurdling careers at the same stage. Zarkandar only had a small number of runs on the flat too.

I think Zarkandar could be very, very special and would not be overly surprised if he beats Hurricane Fly. I feel he is the only horse that might be able to.

What do you think of Zarkandars performance bearing in mind the cough and work being left in him? If he did that sick he could be anything.

mdwexford

premierstone wrote: »

Hope this is tounge in cheek??

Hurricane Fly has won 10 grade ones for a start, secondly Solwhit is a damn good horse and was rated as high as 168. Hurricane Fly has also beaten everything that has been put in front of him and some of he's more illustrious victims include Binocluar, Kyber Kim, Oscar Whiskey, Peddlars Cross, Dunquib, Punjabi, Thousand Stars, Medermit, Go Native, Menorah etc etc all rated well over 160

To some degree but point stands.
Winning at Cheltenham is what matters.
Beating Solwhit is doable for the real top notchers and winning at Punchestown means little when some horses are well done for the season.

HF is still the most consistent hurdler we have seen since Istabraq.

RichieLawlor wrote: »

For some reason md refuses to give HF any credit at all for anything. He had been the same for the last few years so id play little attention to what he says on this matter.

He's has had the same blinkers on when it comes to lots of horses, he can't be objective

Erroneous.

hucklebuck wrote: »

I think you misunderstood me Richie, I am sure I said I think he would have beaten Istabraq in another thread. Hurricane Fly is the best hurdler I have seen.

I was just restating what I said in another thread when someone wrote off Zarkandar and was comparing their hurdling careers at the same stage. Zarkandar only had a small number of runs on the flat too.

I think Zarkandar could be very, very special and would not be overly surprised if he beats Hurricane Fly. I feel he is the only horse that might be able to.

What do you think of Zarkandars performance bearing in mind the cough and work being left in him? If he did that sick he could be anything.

Writing off Zarkander is silly although as of yet all hes done is won a hot novice grade 1 and a handicap off a nice mark.

RichieLawlor

Zarkandar

hucklebuck wrote: »

I think you misunderstood me Richie, I am sure I said I think he would have beaten Istabraq in another thread. Hurricane Fly is the best hurdler I have seen.

I was just restating what I said in another thread when someone wrote off Zarkandar and was comparing their hurdling careers at the same stage. Zarkandar only had a small number of runs on the flat too.

I think Zarkandar could be very, very special and would not be overly surprised if he beats Hurricane Fly. I feel he is the only horse that might be able to.

What do you think of Zarkandars performance bearing in mind the cough and work being left in him? If he did that sick he could be anything.

I was impressed. But he was one of the first of the bridle, and found tons for pressure. It was similar to his runs last year.

To beat Hurricane Fly he will have to travel with him and find more than HF does. For me Zarkandar doesn't travel well enough to be a top notcher. Maybe he simply needs further than 2 miles.

If he is off the bit and being scrubbed along 3 out you have done your money in the Champion. HF will still be swinging coming down to the last. And we know he finds.

hucklebuck

Binocular

RichieLawlor wrote: »

I was impressed. But he was one of the first of the bridle, and found tons for pressure. It was similar to his runs last year.

To beat Hurricane Fly he will have to travel with him and find more than HF does. For me Zarkandar doesn't travel well enough to be a top notcher. Maybe he simply needs further than 2 miles.

If he is off the bit and being scrubbed along 3 out you have done your money in the Champion. HF will still be swinging coming down to the last. And we know he finds.

I know its a huge task but I think he is a horse that needs scrubbing. He might need to head for home a bit earlier to try get the others off the bridle.

You are a tough man, sure he was off the bridal earliest but given he will come on for the run and will have had his lemsips he is a lot better than Friday. Did you notice Nicholls is getting bullish about him, always like to hear that

RichieLawlor

Zarkandar

hucklebuck wrote: »

I know its a huge task but I think he is a horse that needs scrubbing. He might need to head for home a bit earlier to try get the others off the bridle.

You are a tough man, sure he was off the bridal earliest but given he will come on for the run and will have had his lemsips he is a lot better than Friday. Did you notice Nicholls is getting bullish about him, always like to hear that

Nicholls has to be bullish. But Nicholls already knows if Zarkandar has a chance. Ruby will have filled him in. Ruby already knows who is the better horse. That's information that we don't have obv.

premierstone

Zarkandar

mdwexford wrote: »

Beating Solwhit is doable for the real top notchers

Well he has only been beaten 7 times and Hurricane Fly inflicted 4 of those, 2 others were the fighting fifth and a Champion hurdle where he was found to be sick afterwards.

Its not the fact that Hurricane has beaten him 4 times either its the manner in which Hurricane has done it, they tried every tactic with soowith, held up from the front, a crawl, strong gallop, it didnt matter the only time they beat him Hurricane Fly was clearly not race fit.

premierstone

Zarkandar

hucklebuck wrote: »

I know its a huge task but I think he is a horse that needs scrubbing. He might need to head for home a bit earlier to try get the others off the bridle.

You are a tough man, sure he was off the bridal earliest but given he will come on for the run and will have had his lemsips he is a lot better than Friday. Did you notice Nicholls is getting bullish about him, always like to hear that

I have no doubt he will improve from Friday and alot aswell but if Hurricane Fly runs hes true race, Zarkandar needs to improve a minimum of 17lbs and realistically probably in excess of 20lbs, because I very very much doubt we have seen the bottom of Hurricane Fly. Infact Zarkandar needs to improve over a stone to finish ahead of Binocular.

He may get the others off the bridle but Hurricane Fly will not come off the bridle untill after the last if he comes off it at all.

hucklebuck

Binocular

I cant see Ruby getting off Hurricane Fly whatever happens.

For me the likely result is:

Hurricane Fly
Zarkandar
Binocular

Three weeks today they will have just jumped off. Cant wait!!