Scottish Independence - What say you?

Dyr

Noreen1 wrote: »

After all, if Scotland contributed to the Union for all these years, surely it is entitled to its fair share of the assets of that Union - no?

Don't think the english ever saw the union in that way tbh

Tiocfaidh Armani

Enough of the Scottish subsidy myth 　

Scotland pays its way in the Union - it's time the London commentariat acknowledged that.

The notion that Scottish public services are subsidised by English taxpayers has become so commonplace in UK politics that not even David Dimbleby, the supposedly neutral presenter of BBC Question Time, thinks twice about repeating it. During an exchange on a recent show with Liberal Democrat Jo Swinson about her decision to vote as a Scottish MP to impose tuition fees on English students, Dimbleby said, "You voted for England to have fees, whereas Scotland, as we know, with the amount of money that comes from England, doesn't need to have them."
　
This view is based on the discrepancy between levels of public spending per head of the population in Scotland and England. According to the Treasury's latest Public Expenditure Statistics, Scots gets an average of £10,212 spent on them every year by the UK government, compared with around £8,588 -- £1,624 less -- for people in England.

Rest is here: http://www.newstatesman.com/blogs/the-staggers/2011/11/scotland-12288-union-public

Fratton Fred

Tiocfaidh Armani wrote: »

If I still live in Scotland at the time of the referendum I'm voting 'Yes':)

Why should you get a vote?

What gives you the right to interfere in another country's future?

Fratton Fred

Bambi wrote: »

Don't think the english ever saw the union in that way tbh

Scotland did more than alright out of the union and the empire.

Will they be taking on all the debt though for HBOS and RBS, that's what I'd like to know.

But the Scottish probably don't see independence that way.

Tiocfaidh Armani

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Why should you get a vote?

What gives you the right to interfere in another country's future?

I'm a resident there for seven years and have paid thousands of pounds in taxes to their government and councils and also NI contributing thousands to a health services I've not used. I've earned my vote. I'm also registered to vote and will use it.:)

Tiocfaidh Armani

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Scotland did more than alright out of the union and the empire.

Will they be taking on all the debt though for HBOS and RBS, that's what I'd like to know.

But the Scottish probably don't see independence that way.

Up until 14 months ago I worked within the RBS group. RBS operate under English law, it wouldn't be the responsibility of the Scottish government to help them on iota.

Maybe the English can use the billions upon billions of Scottish oil they've creamed and will continue to cream from Scottish waters.

Fratton Fred

Tiocfaidh Armani wrote: »

I'm a resident there for seven years and have paid thousands of pounds in taxes to their government and councils and also NI contributing thousands to a health services I've not used. I've earned my vote. I'm also registered to vote and will use it.:)

That's very good of you. I'm sure the UK exchequer is very grateful. What about Scots not living in Scotland, will they get to vote?

later12

Goalposts a little to the right.... bit more to the right, there Fred... keep it moving

Stiffler2

dlofnep wrote: »

So I'm sure you're all familiar now with the ongoing issue surrounding an upcoming referendum for Scottish independence. I'm trying to gauge the general vibe of the Irish public.

During the last Scottish national elections, the Scottish National Party won a remarkable majority ahead of the traditional favourites, The Labour Party. Alex Salmond, the leader of the SNP and David Cameron have been at odds over the specifics of the referendum - but nevertheless - it will occur (likely August 2014).

It's important to note that Scotland returned only one Tory MP in the last general elections, and only about 10% or thereabouts in the Scottish national elections. But yet - Scotland is still under the control of the Conservative Party - and this seems to be a contentious issue.

"The days of Tory PMs telling Scotland what to do are over" - Alex Salmond.

So what say AH? Would you in principle favour an independent Scottish state, where the Scottish people alone would control all of their affairs - or would you prefer Scotland to remain in the Union, where some important matters (fiscal affairs and foreign policy) are still controlled through Westminster?

Well I can't speak for the Scottish people, perhaps they know what they're doing but if there's any scots out there reading this I wouldn't recommend it.

Let England continue to rule you as I have learnt my lesson. I think I'm the only Irish person that has learned a lesson though.

If you allow yourselves to rule yourselves you don't have any experience of doing this and would be best to allow England to rule.

If the Scots do get into power with no expierience the following will happen :

You will allow your property market to boom, you'll borrow loads of money, then you'll owe 176 billion and then you will be fuc**d.

Personally I wish England were still ruling us.

Tiocfaidh Armani

Fratton Fred wrote: »

That's very good of you. I'm sure the UK exchequer is very grateful. What about Scots not living in Scotland, will they get to vote?

I doubt it. Unlike them I contribute to Scotland and have earned my right to a vote and use it I shall, as I always do.

It is good of me, unlike the uber Brits at Rangers FC, I don't dodge my taxes.

Fratton Fred

Tiocfaidh Armani wrote: »

Up until 14 months ago I worked within the RBS group. RBS operate under English law, it wouldn't be the responsibility of the Scottish government to help them on iota.

Maybe the English can use the billions upon billions of Scottish oil they've creamed and will continue to cream from Scottish waters.

Aaah, the good old cake and eating it scenario.

You think it is right that a bank based in Scotland decides to go off on some ego fuelled spending frenzy and the English tax payer should pick up the bill?

It wasn't England creaming off the north sea oil money, it was the uk and it was spent on everything from building a new motorway around London, to funding free prescriptions in Northern Ireland to building a gin palace at Holyrood.

Fratton Fred

Tiocfaidh Armani wrote: »

I doubt it. Unlike them I contribute to Scotland and have earned my right to a vote and use it I shall, as I always do.

It is good of me, unlike the uber Brits at Rangers FC, I don't dodge my taxes.

What has Rangers got to do with it???

A Scot living and working in London pays tax to the same person you do. HMRC.

Fratton Fred

later10 wrote: »

Goalposts a little to the right.... bit more to the right, there Fred... keep it moving

??

Dyr

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Scotland did more than alright out of the union and the empire.

Will they be taking on all the debt though for HBOS and RBS, that's what I'd like to know.

But the Scottish probably don't see independence that way.

touchy touchy...I dont think the english ever looked on the scots, welsh or noirish as equal partners in the happy union business so they might find it hard to cope with the scots having the audacity to expect to take some of the family silver with them on their way out the door.

Fratton Fred

Bambi wrote: »

touchy touchy...I dont think the english ever looked on the scots, welsh or noirish as equal partners in the happy union business so they might find it hard to cope with the scots having the audacity to expect to take some of the family silver with them on their way out the door.

Really?

Well you think wrong then.

Dyr

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Really?

Well you think wrong then.

I reckon that I think rightly, the ould english can be very anglocentric about great britain. Youse just don't have your own equivalents of eoghany harris or ruth dudley dedwards to tell yiz .

Fratton Fred

Bambi wrote: »

I reckon that I think rightly, the ould english can be very anglocentric about great britain. Youse just don't have your own equivalents of eoghany harris or ruth dudley dedwards to tell yiz .

Really?

Its a good job we have you then.

Tiocfaidh Armani

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Aaah, the good old cake and eating it scenario.

You think it is right that a bank based in Scotland decides to go off on some ego fuelled spending frenzy and the English tax payer should pick up the bill?

It wasn't England creaming off the north sea oil money, it was the uk and it was spent on everything from building a new motorway around London, to funding free prescriptions in Northern Ireland to building a gin palace at Holyrood.

RBS is an English registered company as far as I know, hence why their group operates under English law when I worked there.

Well don't moan about a Scottish bank then when the UK was happy to take their profits when they came when something exclusively Scottish has helped the UK for decades and will continue to.

Scotland pays its way and has a right to have its stay and as a tax paying resident I'm entitled to a say. If Scot's leave tough titty. I can't vote in Ireland, I don't cry about it. I left.

antoswords

Ellis Dee wrote: »

I wrote (in jest) in a comment in a Daily Torygraph blog that it would all end in tears - with nothing much more than some oil and gas, hydroelectricity, a bit of tourism potential, the whisky industry, some fishing grounds and a few other things to sustain an independent Scotland

You left out Wham bars........

purplepanda

BBC Radio 5 report this evening, sources saying that the SNP & Scottish government officials have been consulting the Guernsey government on their exact constitutional relations with the United Kingdom government.:eek:

It's always seemed very strange to me that the Isle of Man & Channel Islands had more self government than Scotland & Ireland had after their respective parliaments were abolished.

Looks like it's devolution max then, I always believed that they wouldn't be achieving the same level of independence given to the Irish Free State in the Anglo Irish Treaty 1921.

Salmond will soon be caught between a rock & a hard place

Redditor

Interesting that independence is more popular in England than Scotland. Probably all the Scot in England thinking it's a great idea, but all the Scots in Scotland that will have to live there are worried.

Mickey H

Duggy747 wrote: »

If Trainspotting taught me anything it's that they should really get their toilet-cleaning abilities up to scratch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1tJJO_pVvQ

LordSutch

purplepanda wrote: »

Salmond will soon be caught between a rock & a hard place

Indeed, and if Salmond falls short of securing a total break then it will be his head on the block.

Paddy pants down Ashdown put it very well on BBCs Question time last week "This is a very serious issue indeed, these two leaders have put their political lives on the line for this, and when its over, only one of these two will still be standing" or words to that effect . . . . . . .

Cant' see Cameron losing, Devo Max may well win (if its on the ballot paper)?

raymann

edit

LordSutch

Alex Salmond's Hugo Young lecture – (24th/ January).

The Scottish first minister's speech on 'Scotland's place in the world', in which he argues the case for independence . . .

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2091300/England-better-Scots-says-Anglophile-Alex-Salmond.html

AnonoBoy

Where's the 'Och aye dinnae' option?

Batsy

More bad news for those who support Scottish independence.

Scotswoman Michelle Mone, the Ultimo lingerie tycoon, has declared that, should Scotland become independent, she will relocate her business to England as she believes that Scotland will not be able to survive on its own.

Miss Mone’s company, MJM International, turned over £42 million last year. The firm’s gel-filled bra became a sensation after it was worn by Julia Roberts in the hit film Erin Brockovich.

“I am so passionate for Scotland but I have to say that if we do become independent, I will move,” said the businesswoman, who company is based in East Kilbride near Glasgow.

“I will move my business and I will move personally. I’ve refused to relocate because I love Scotland…but under independence, I would have no choice.

“I don’t think we can survive on our own and I think it would be really bad for business. Everything would go up and I really don’t think we need it at the moment. Things are bad enough and we don’t need to be shaking it up even more.”

Miss Mone, who was awarded an OBE two years ago for her contribution to business, said politicians in the Scottish Parliament could not be trusted to make “Scotland PLC” a success.

“MSPs have never run a business in their life. Would you trust them to run Scotland as a business? No is the answer. It’s too much of a gamble,” she concluded.


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scotland/scottish-politics/9047395/Ultimo-lingerie-tycoon-Michelle-Mone-I-will-move-my-business-to-England-if-Scotland-becomes-independent.html

Nodin

Batsy wrote: »

More bad news for those who support Scottish independence.

.................

Yeah, it's just all downhill at the moment for them

A CLEAR majority of people in Scotland now back independence, according to an exclusive poll for the Sunday Express.
In the first such result since the SNP came to power – and using Alex Salmond’s preferred referendum question – the Vision Critical survey found 51 per cent would vote ‘Yes’, with 39 per cent against.

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/298664/Poll-Now-51-back-independence

woodoo

Batsy wrote: »

More bad news for those who support Scottish independence.

Scotswoman Michelle Mone, the Ultimo lingerie tycoon, has declared that, should Scotland become independent, she will relocate her business to England as she believes that Scotland will not be able to survive on its own.

Miss Mone’s company, MJM International, turned over £42 million last year. The firm’s gel-filled bra became a sensation after it was worn by Julia Roberts in the hit film Erin Brockovich.

“I am so passionate for Scotland but I have to say that if we do become independent, I will move,” said the businesswoman, who company is based in East Kilbride near Glasgow.

“I will move my business and I will move personally. I’ve refused to relocate because I love Scotland…but under independence, I would have no choice.

“I don’t think we can survive on our own and I think it would be really bad for business. Everything would go up and I really don’t think we need it at the moment. Things are bad enough and we don’t need to be shaking it up even more.”

Miss Mone, who was awarded an OBE two years ago for her contribution to business, said politicians in the Scottish Parliament could not be trusted to make “Scotland PLC” a success.

“MSPs have never run a business in their life. Would you trust them to run Scotland as a business? No is the answer. It’s too much of a gamble,” she concluded.


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scotland/scottish-politics/9047395/Ultimo-lingerie-tycoon-Michelle-Mone-I-will-move-my-business-to-England-if-Scotland-becomes-independent.html

Its all bluff. Talk is cheap. She is obviously a unionist and that is why she is stirring like this.

dlofnep

There's 1001 businesses that support Scottish independence. You can pick and choose selective quotes all you want, it doesn't change much.

A much more interesting result is the latest poll on Scottish independence, which had a majority support in favour of it at 51%. Only 39% stated that they would vote no. Support for independence is growing, and growing.