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iLikeWaffles

Guess players will continue to Delve in PoE so!

Jerichoholic

ShadowHearth wrote: »

https://kotaku.com/blizzard-says-it-wasnt-expecting-fans-to-be-this-angry-1830204721/amp

Just to continue a little bit more on whole Diablo drama.

They admitted that they knew its going to be a **** show, but did not expected how bad it will be. The only person I feel sorry about is announcer at Blizzcon. He was thrown under the bus knowingly.
So it was clear as day, that it was not a game fans and gamers wanted, but a game share holders wanted. What developer in the right mind would release a game knowing and expecting that fans will be angry about it.
Gaming industry is going really really in to a ****ter and I can't wait for it to crash. And it will crash not, because people dont play games anymore, but because all these share holders will drive it to unreachable profit expectations and then destroy it, when those are not met.

You can't wait for the games industry to crash?

Why?

degrassinoel

Deleted User wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=50KBNQe5hTM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=50KBNQe5hTM

"Do you guys not have phones?"

:eek:

only seeing this today, jaysus..
No wonder so many big names left Blizzard in the last year or two.

At least WoW classic might be worth a look next summer, shame though, i was expecting something decent from the Diablo team, i've no interest in playing an ARPG loot-em-up on my phone, ever.



:P

johnny_ultimate

Just to note, of course:

Modern games take a massively long time to make - there’s a reason there’s such long gaps between many sequels these days. In that sense, you can expect to see more spin-offs, ports, remastered, mobile games etc as publishers work to keep interest alive during the lengthy mainline development process.

Mobile games are lucrative, and while certainly many are riddled with micro transactions or otherwise bad design, at their best they can actually deliver a worthy take on a series and reignite interest in the mainline games - Pokemon Go, for example. There’s plenty of good mobile games outside the crap, even some that have translated surprisingly well (like the Cave bullet hell shooter ports, which are pretty shockingly capable given how exacting the games are).

You can always just ignore and not play the games you’re not interested in

While it’s perfectly reasonable to be disappointed about an announcement, it’s also possible to express that disappointment without acting like a petulant, rude, hyper-consumer brat (I’m saying that based on some of the Blizzcon videos and external forum reactions I’ve seen).

degrassinoel

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

You can always just ignore and not play the games you’re not interested in

I get the impression that was aimed at me - if so, am i not allowed to discuss my opinion on the franchise that i have an interest in here?

It will of course be a huge success despite the outrage

It will of course be a huge success despite the outrage

Dyr

degrassinoel wrote: »

I get the impression that was aimed at me - if so, am i not allowed to discuss my opinion on the franchise that i have an interest in here?

Not without betraying your entitled, privileged toxic fandom and so on and so forth.:D


I mean those poor devs, someone asked them in public if they were joking :eek: expect a Kotaku article demanding that guy have his battle.net account deleted and charges for assault be pressed.

degrassinoel

Bambi wrote: »

Not without betraying your entitled, privileged toxic fandom and so on and so forth.:D


I mean those poor devs, someone asked them in public if they were joking :eek: expect a Kotaku article demanding that guy have his battle.net account deleted and charges for assault be pressed.

Been called much much worse I prefer when it's direct though

the really harsh part is that the people booing and asking those questions paid hundreds to be there, and ye know, they're genuine fans - i completely get it, i'd have been booing too

ShadowHearth

Jerichoholic wrote: »

You can't wait for the games industry to crash?

Why?

Because thats the only way for them to learn something and get wrid of all these "investors", who dont give a feck about games, but only how much more profit they can push up and move to next new thing. They dont give a a flying Feck, that in long term decisions they push developers to do will kill franchises and developers, but it will bring in profit for that time.

As I said, its bonkers, that developer already expects backlash for announcing new game!

Dyr

degrassinoel wrote: »

I get the impression that was aimed at me - if so, am i not allowed to discuss my opinion on the franchise that i have an interest in here?

Not without betraying your entitled, privileged toxic fandom and so on and so forth.:D


I mean those poor devs, someone asked them in public if they were joking :eek: expect a Kotaku article demanding that guy have his battle.net account deleted and charges for assault be pressed.

ShadowHearth

[Deleted User] wrote: »

It will of course be a huge success despite the outrage

Unfortunately it will be, because it will be played by mobile gamers, who never heard of Diablo, but it is a new popular game on app store.
People who basically supported developer and made them so big are just thrown over the board. They are not needed anymore.
Now I am not saying that fans should feel entitled, but spitting in to their face and then telling them: "You all have phones, dont you", is not the way to treat them.

Shiminay

ShadowHearth wrote: »

Because thats the only way for them to learn something and get wrid of all these "investors", who dont give a feck about games, but only how much more profit they can push up and move to next new thing. They dont give a a flying Feck, that in long term decisions they push developers to do will kill franchises and developers, but it will bring in profit for that time.

As I said, its bonkers, that developer already expects backlash for announcing new game!

Do you ever read these things you say out loud to yourself to try and understand just how ridiculous it sounds?

You want a multi-billion dollar entertainment industry to collapse because it's chief participants are doing what they are supposed to do? These are the rules of capitalism, the directors of these companies have a legal responsibility to do what their investors want, getting mad at them for the rules of the game doesn't change the game. They're publicly listed companies on multiple stock exchanges. You'd do well to look up what happened 15 odd years ago when the same thing happened to the various financial services companies who were also publicly listed companies.

What is your long-term plan here? What happens when this industry simply dies and thousands of people are left jobless, massive billions of dollars/euro/yen/etc are taken out of the world economy? What about the complementary businesses that exist to service the industry such as games shops, the hundreds of thousands of websites, magazines and youtube channels, Twitch.tv, etc?

But sure, Activision Blizzard, hungry cnts that they are, want to make a mobile game and made what we all agree is a substantial error in judgement about how it would be received and you think the only sensible solution is an economic disaster? :rolleyes:

ShadowHearth

Shiminay wrote: »

Do you ever read these things you say out loud to yourself to try and understand just how ridiculous it sounds?

You want a multi-billion dollar entertainment industry to collapse because it's chief participants are doing what they are supposed to do? These are the rules of capitalism, the directors of these companies have a legal responsibility to do what their investors want, getting mad at them for the rules of the game doesn't change the game. They're publicly listed companies on multiple stock exchanges. You'd do well to look up what happened 15 odd years ago when the same thing happened to the various financial services companies who were also publicly listed companies.

What is your long-term plan here? What happens when this industry simply dies and thousands of people are left jobless, massive billions of dollars/euro/yen/etc are taken out of the world economy? What about the complementary businesses that exist to service the industry such as games shops, the hundreds of thousands of websites, magazines and youtube channels, Twitch.tv, etc?

But sure, Activision Blizzard, hungry cnts that they are, want to make a mobile game and made what we all agree is a substantial error in judgement about how it would be received and you think the only sensible solution is an economic disaster? :rolleyes:

Ridiculous? Yes, will it happen? Oh yeah, it will, and you dont need to be a rocket scientist to see where it all going.
I am a dick, and I am blunt. Me waiting for it to collapse is waiting for inevitable to happen if they continue with this practice.
I like how you painting me like someone who just going to feed on tears of people losing jobs and industry collapsing. Cool way to paint a vilain here m8. I can assure you that its not the case. It will suck for people involved in industry. Unfortunately it will be the devs who will suffer, not the investors and guys up top floor in suits. As I said, they will move on after destroying it, to a new cash cow.

In a way you right. I should have said it differently, then the way I said it. I am waiting for this industry to crash like a train going too fast and hopefully see them to learn why it happened. My apologies. Crash will happen though, because this whole thing is just not sustainable. And me sounding like an asshole wishing it, will have zero inpact. I am not that powerful m8.

Yes, these are companies that have stock and play by the same rules. Thing is gaming sector was never that big. It became so huge, where it attracted big boys, who interested only in short term profit. Its funny how smaller independent game devs manage to bring out better and more unique games where all big boy developers pretty much copy paste same formula and adding more ways to **** gamer.

As for blizzard activision: its clear as day that bringing this mobile game was not blizzards idea. Its was something they were told in Board meeting. Basically: Just do it, its a trend that makes a lot of money and it will increase profits, we dont care it will piss off someone.

EoinHef

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

Just to note, of course:

Modern games take a massively long time to make - there’s a reason there’s such long gaps between many sequels these days. In that sense, you can expect to see more spin-offs, ports, remastered, mobile games etc as publishers work to keep interest alive during the lengthy mainline development process.

Mobile games are lucrative, and while certainly many are riddled with micro transactions or otherwise bad design, at their best they can actually deliver a worthy take on a series and reignite interest in the mainline games - Pokemon Go, for example. There’s plenty of good mobile games outside the crap, even some that have translated surprisingly well (like the Cave bullet hell shooter ports, which are pretty shockingly capable given how exacting the games are).

You can always just ignore and not play the games you’re not interested in

While it’s perfectly reasonable to be disappointed about an announcement, it’s also possible to express that disappointment without acting like a petulant, rude, hyper-consumer brat(I’m saying that based on some of the Blizzcon videos and external forum reactions I’ve seen).

Ye its best off not to resort to name callling........oh wait:P

Grumpypants

Stop watching Jim Sterling and co. There isn't a bunch of evil investors and execs demanding studios build games to rip off the gamer.

johnny_ultimate

degrassinoel wrote: »

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

You can always just ignore and not play the games you’re not interested in

I get the impression that was aimed at me - if so, am i not allowed to discuss my opinion on the franchise that i have an interest in here?

Genuinely not aimed at anyone in particular and certainly not yourself (apologies if it came across that way), was just responding to the general sentiment I’ve seen online over the last few days - best personified by that guy asking the ‘is this a joke?’ question at Blizzcon.

gizmo

ShadowHearth wrote: »

Unfortunately it will be, because it will be played by mobile gamers, who never heard of Diablo, but it is a new popular game on app store.
People who basically supported developer and made them so big are just thrown over the board. They are not needed anymore.
Now I am not saying that fans should feel entitled, but spitting in to their face and then telling them: "You all have phones, dont you", is not the way to treat them.

No one has been thrown overboard though. As I mentioned in the PC Gaming thread, work on Diablo Immortal in no way precludes work being done on a mainline franchise entry, whether that's Diablo 4, a Diablo 2 Remaster or even another expansion for Diablo 3. The team working on Immortal aren't even the main Diablo team, it's being "co-developed" by NetEase, a Chinese company they have a history partnering with.

Why them? Because these kinds of games on mobile platforms are massively popular in that region. The idea of a mobile MOBA, for instance, may send shudders down my spine but over there, 50m people play Honor of Kings every day and it brought in nearly $2b last year alone. To refer back to your earlier post, fans of Diablo may not be interested in Immortal but I'd wager there's an awful lot of gamers who are.

As for the last comment, think about it like this. A guy in the audience just asked the Principle Game Designer at Blizzard, who will be currently overseeing at least one PC game in the franchise, whether they're going to be doing a PC port of a game they've just said is being specifically designed for mobile.

I mean, there's lots of ways to answer that question, most of which would get the average person fired. I'm more inclined to say congrats for keeping his composure...

EoinHef

Grumpypants wrote: »

Stop watching Jim Sterling and co. There isn't a bunch of evil investors and execs demanding studios build games to rip off the gamer.

Their demanding monetisation at nearly every level now though. Micro transactions have chaged the way games are being developed.

Skippable grind etc.

To say its having no effect is akin to burying your head in the sand.

Sieghardt

Grumpypants wrote: »

Stop watching Jim Sterling and co. There isn't a bunch of evil investors and execs demanding studios build games to rip off the gamer.

There literally is. There are people employed to do this. Data scientists working with monetization specialists to analyze people's behavioural data and see how they can be exploited, addictive habits and frustrating people by design into buying microtransactions. How to tune a grind to make you pay, how to make paying feel good so you pay more.

Gbear

Supply and demand is well and good.

I think you can quite easily navigate the gaming landscape and get value for money. It's a really successful market and I mean that in both directions - consumer included.

That doesn't mean you should swallow the corporate swill from companies like Blizzard whole though.
To some extent, consumers are held in contempt in all industries, and it's quite often not completely undeserved, but when you're caught in the act, so to speak, you don't really deserve much sympathy.

That's what this announcement was. It was thinking "these gibbering monkeys will cheer any ould ****e we peddle out".

Benzino

Gbear wrote: »

That's what this announcement was. It was thinking "these gibbering monkeys will cheer any ould ****e we peddle out".

It's getting good feedback and looks great, yet it's old ****e? Why? Just cause it's on mobile?

If you are a Diablo fan, now you have more options to play the franchise. I don't see what the problem is.

iLikeWaffles

Benzino wrote: »

It's getting good feedback and looks great, yet it's old ****e? Why? Just cause it's on mobile?

If you are a Diablo fan, now you have more options to play the franchise. I don't see what the problem is.

You don't have more options you only have one!

degrassinoel

Interesting read on polygon about Diablo Immortal's development, apparently it's a reskin of an existing free2play game]

chinese site here with actual comparisons

Benzino

iLikeWaffles wrote: »

You don't have more options you only have one!

I don't understand. It's a new game on a new platform for the franchise. Before you couldn't play a Diablo game on mobile, now you can. Therefore more options to play the franchise.

gizmo

degrassinoel wrote: »

Interesting read on polygon about Diablo Immortal's development, apparently it's a reskin of an existing free2play game]

chinese site here with actual comparisons

Calling it a reskin is more than just a tad reductive though. NetEase will have their own engine which they'll more than likely use to build the game client as well as their own back-end infrastructure to handle the online elements. I wouldn't really expect either developer to devote the resources to a full port of the existing Diablo engine onto the mobile platforms.

The design of the UI is also fairly standard for games of that type on mobile too, as can be seen by this screenshot from the aforementioned Honor of Kings.

nix

Benzino wrote: »

I don't understand. It's a new game on a new platform for the franchise. Before you couldn't play a Diablo game on mobile, now you can. Therefore more options to play the franchise.

People who play the majority of blizzard games have spent money on powerful machines to play their games. Playing games on their phone with rigs they have, just isn't something that would be done. For me anyway, I see playing mobile games over PC/console games as a massive waste of time in comparison and a massive step down also gameplay wise, the controls are tedious at best and they are just a massive hindrance on our phones battery life :pac:

So with that, fans would want Blizzard to be spending their resources on games for consoles/PC as it will be of a high quality, the kind of games they want to play, Not what blizzard want them to play, which will be bottom shelf gameplay at best in comparison and nothing more than a means for Blizzard to milk their customers with micro transactions. Cause lets face it, thats all mobile games are, an expensive distraction.

And for people who believe its a separate new team working on this, wake up, there is no way they wont have people with Diablo experience working on this title, it will be a massive money maker if executed properly and fans will be right to think its slowing down the progress time wise on the release of the next blizzard game. They just expect their fan base to be as dumb and compliant as the EA/Ubi fan base. Lets hope they're wrong and that it turns into another battlefront 2 bite in the ass

CatInABox

nix wrote: »

And for people who believe its a separate new team working on this, wake up, there is no way they wont have people with Diablo experience working on this title, it will be a massive money maker if executed properly and fans will be right to think its slowing down the progress time wise on the release of the next blizzard game. They just expect their fan base to be as dumb and compliant as the EA/Ubi fan base. Lets hope they're wrong and that it turns into another battlefront 2 bite in the ass

Blizzard has close to 5000 employees, they're not a one team studio, and haven't been for years. Entirely possible that members of the Diablo team have transferred over, but the idea that the main team is working on this, a mobile game, is a bit silly in my opinion. It's also not really going to slow down development of any main game either, the number of people transferred over would be small, with NetEase doing most of the grunt work.

degrassinoel

gizmo wrote: »

Calling it a reskin is more than just a tad reductive though. NetEase will have their own engine which they'll more than likely use to build the game client as well as their own back-end infrastructure to handle the online elements. I wouldn't really expect either developer to devote the resources to a full port of the existing Diablo engine onto the mobile platforms.

The design of the UI is also fairly standard for games of that type on mobile too, as can be seen by this screenshot from the aforementioned Honor of Kings.

What it looks like is a reskin of an existing game, the characters, weapons, effects, skills, backgrounds, and movement are all a match and if not, they're so close to it as to be a complete knockoff of Diablo

Dyr

CatInABox wrote: »

. Entirely possible that members of the Diablo team have transferred over, but the idea that the main team is working on this, a mobile game, is a bit silly in my opinion. It's also not really going to slow down development of any main game either, the number of people transferred over would be small, with NetEase doing most of the grunt work.

It's possible that it will, they could hold off on releasing a proper Diablo follow up so they can milk this mobile nonsense for as much as possible.