Automatic vs. Manual

alias no.9

On my second auto, soon to be looking for my third as need something with a higher driving position after back surgery. Will never go back but still need to convince Mrs. Alias to convert too, she's distrustful of autos because she thinks she must be missing something, that it can't be that easy. She's been ferrying me about since the op (for which I'm very grateful) and spends most of her time in the wrong gear, negating the efficiency advantage of having a diesel, never mind the manual box, which kind of makes an auto ideal for her despite her reluctance.

btkm8unsl0w5r4

If the car has a proper engine then auto is the way to go. Faster for the normal driver, more economical as your in a better gear more of the time. If your car has a puny engine the you can ring out the merge performance better with a manual.

Then there are performance cars where some purists prefer and manual. But these days most are going to DSG or DCT which is the best of both worlds.

People who have never had a proper auto think their muck or remember what their dad told them about them in 1992. Lot of misconceptions out there. There both the same and it depends on preference.

veetwin

naoise80 wrote: »

I drive a 2006 E220 CDI and spent 6 months waiting for the right manual to come on the market.

It's a personal choice, but I would never like an automatic.

I hope you enjoy it but I'd say it might not be much fun trying to sell/trade in. Cars like the E Class and 5 series are much better and more saleable in auto.

Autos in the past in Ireland were never popular except in executive cars. Thats mostly because we bought small engine petrols which mated to auto boxes are a disaster generally. Now we are buying (or at least we did buy) bigger diesels like the 5 series which are more suited to auto transmission.

Personally I have a 520D auto and my sister has a manual one. The auto is twice the car. I also have a golf manual (TSI) which I also enjoy driving on twisty roads but I'd have the BMW for any long journey.

I'd never say I'd go back to manual but I can't see it happen.

bb12

i've only ever driven auto. on my 5th car/jeep now and can never understand why anybody would want to drive manual! auto is easier, safer, smoother (especially when i'm towing) and all round just plain more comfortable. Why anybody wants to spend their life making gear changes and fiddling around with clutch pedals etc is beyond me.

_Kaiser_

voojeq wrote: »

ok so if we have such a large number of auto enthusiasts then maybe few tips from fellow users on how to spot a problematic auto gearbox, as I'm on the lookout for a nice auto saloon out there ;]

Well my own experience has taught me that if you need:

- Auto
- Diesel
- Saloon
- Decent size engine (around the 2L mark or above)

Then by default you're looking at something from the VAG stable unless you have the cash for a more "premium" BMW or Mercedes

I'm on my second Passat auto. My current 06 has the DSG box which is fantastic, and even though it has a tiptronic mode, I never actually would feel the need to use it as it's more than capable of handling the changes in D on it's own.

My previous 02 version didn't give any issues either, but it had a gear less and was a 1.9TDI rather than my current 2.0 TDI - and that extra 0.1 makes a lot of difference

SeanW

Paparazzo wrote: »

You're not stuck with one forever if you do a test in one! You can do your test again in a manual!

Not true, you have to go through the whole procedure again, do the theory test, eyesight report, get a "clean" learners permit, go through the same hoops as a new learner (minimum driver instruction, 6 months wait before testing) THEN redo the test and claim a new "clean" drivers licesne. Not worth it at all IMHO.

Personally, I'd reccommend the manual licence first so you have the choice.

Agreed.

aujopimur

Motor manufacturers plan on having only auto boxes in the next few years.

Leonard Hofstadter

Kaiser2000 wrote: »

Well my own experience has taught me that if you need:

- Auto
- Diesel
- Saloon
- Decent size engine (around the 2L mark or above)

Then by default you're looking at something from the VAG stable unless you have the cash for a more "premium" BMW or Mercedes

I'm on my second Passat auto. My current 06 has the DSG box which is fantastic, and even though it has a tiptronic mode, I never actually would feel the need to use it as it's more than capable of handling the changes in D on it's own.

My previous 02 version didn't give any issues either, but it had a gear less and was a 1.9TDI rather than my current 2.0 TDI - and that extra 0.1 makes a lot of difference

Soory to be pedantic, but DSG is actually a manual gearbox, electronically controlled yes, but it's basically a computer operating a manual gearbox for you:)! A true auto has a torque convertor and no clutch, DSG has not one but two clutches and no torque convertor.

barone

my mate did the test in an auto and his license isnt limited to autos? did the test bout 8 months ago

coylemj

barone wrote: »

my mate did the test in an auto and his license isnt limited to autos? did the test bout 8 months ago

Either the tester made a mistake filling out the certificate of competency or your mate hasn't spotted the code on the licence which indicates that it's restricted to autos.

pajo1981

captainspeed wrote: »

Soory to be pedantic, but DSG is actually a manual gearbox, electronically controlled yes, but it's basically a computer operating a manual gearbox for you:)! A true auto has a torque convertor and no clutch, DSG has not one but two clutches and no torque convertor.

Does it change gears automatically?

coylemj

I switched to automatic in May, just got tired of always being in the wrong gear pulling away from roundabouts e.g. you're coming up to the roundabout, apply gentle brakes, change down to third for a quick getaway, then you spot the guy on the bike....

CiniO

meoklmrk91 wrote: »

I personally could never see myself driving automatic, they are slower than manual (as long as gear changes are made properly),

I wouldn't be so sure.
Few months ago I was abroad, I rented a car and got Prius with automatic CVT.

A continuously variable transmission (CVT) is a transmission that can change steplessly through an infinite number of effective gear ratios

I can't see how manual with 5 or 6 gears could be better than infinite number of gears.

Engine just accelerates to rev with biggest torque, and transmission chagning steplessy causes car to accelerate.
I was actually impressed with this idea, and I think it's the most economical and ergonomical type of transmission. (at least theoretically).

coylemj

CiniO wrote: »

Engine just accelerates to rev with biggest torque, and transmission chagning steplessy causes car to accelerate.
I was actually impressed with this idea, and I think it's the most economical and ergonomical type of transmission. (at least theoretically).

I think DAF cars had a similar transmission back in the 70s, IIRC it was called Variomatic.

barone

coylemj wrote: »

Either the tester made a mistake filling out the certificate of competency or your mate hasn't spotted the code on the licence which indicates that it's restricted to autos.[


seen it myself,tester must have missed it

Big Nasty

voojeq wrote: »

ok so if we have such a large number of auto enthusiasts then maybe few tips from fellow users on how to spot a problematic auto gearbox, as I'm on the lookout for a nice auto saloon out there ;]

I would say Matt Simms on here would probably be the best man to advise you on that. For starters if the gear change is not smooth, you feel 'clunking' while changing, etc it would probably be best to walk. Give it standing start welly and hard braking too to check for same under hard driving. Also check for leaks underneath. Bring to a fairly steep hill and come to a complete stop, leaving the car in gear. When you lift your foot off the brake it should remain in situ - if it crawls forward in a jumpy fashion there is probably an issue with the torque convertor.

mondeo

Nothing is worse then a slipping auto transmission. It should kick back reasonably quickly when you floor it. If when floored it takes too long to kick back or just revs up and goes nowhere like it's in neutral then the torque converter is probably shot. If you have Tiptronic it's handy as it gives you more control over gear selection.

voojeq

again thanks for answers chaps one more question if ya don't mind, does fixing a torque converter can be more expensive than fixing a clutch, is it possible or do you have to recondition the gearbox (lol?)

mondeo

voojeq wrote: »

again thanks for answers chaps one more question if ya don't mind, does fixing a torque converter can be more expensive than fixing a clutch, is it possible or do you have to recondition the gearbox (lol?)

Ye auto boxes are much more expensive to work on because they have alot more parts in them and more labour costs involved. Probably be more economical to have a reconditioned autobox fitted then to have the torque converter replaced in the existing box.

Paparazzo

SeanW wrote: »

Not true, you have to go through the whole procedure again, do the theory test, eyesight report, get a "clean" learners permit, go through the same hoops as a new learner (minimum driver instruction, 6 months wait before testing) THEN redo the test and claim a new "clean" drivers licesne. Not worth it at all IMHO.

Agreed.

Exactly what I'm saying, you're not stuck with an auto forever!

rabbitinlights

Modern Autos are fantastic - most will have a sport or manual mode if you do want to play on twisty roads.

I'd imagine manuals will be gone in 5 years on normal production cars due to emissions and demand.

S.

eth0

coylemj wrote: »

I think DAF cars had a similar transmission back in the 70s, IIRC it was called Variomatic.

I actually seen one of these cars years ago, wasn't in bad shape as its been kept in a shed for so long. It was a nice looking yoke but I don't like automatics at all, I think they're dull as fcuk a real Celtic Tiger toy for lazy Americanised folk. Part of a truly braindead uninvolved consumer lifestyle. Don't care if I have to buy from some obscure manufacturer in a few years if automatics catch on in a big way over here I'll never buy an automatic.

barura

rabbitinlights wrote: »

Modern Autos are fantastic - most will have a sport or manual mode if you do want to play on twisty roads.

I'd imagine manuals will be gone in 5 years on normal production cars due to emissions and demand.

S.

I don't. Simple as, a manual is cheaper to make than an auto box.

lomb

Matt Simis wrote: »

Thats cos diesels in particular have horrible power delivery that needs to be hidden and removed from the user with a good auto with as many gears as possible (6 minimum).

Agreed, diesel don't like revving at all. There is nothing like a high revving sporty petrol with a mechanical rifle bolt like short shift manual gearbox.
Small petrols also do better with manuals. I personally prefer petrol manuals, I could only drive a diesel with an autobox.

eth0

barura wrote: »

I don't. Simple as, a manual is cheaper to make than an auto box.

They tried to drop the manual gearbox on the newest M5 but there was an uproar over it. Plenty of people who want manual still so they'll keep making it even if the PRNDL box performs slightly better. I'm surprised to see the amount of automatic fanboys in here, must be all from Dublin or some place where traffic is bad. I did drive them before and hated every minute of it

heate

Is an automatic more expensive to produce?
Or is it that manufacturers can make money in Europe charging extra for them?
As for I'll never buy a manual stuff - I used to drive manuals all the time but my current car is not available with a manual gearbox along with s classes and a8's and the like.
I can't fathom how an automatic is for the brain dead or some sort of celtic tiger excess - by that reasoning a car is some sort of Celtic tiger excess.

unkel

eth0 wrote: »

They tried to drop the manual gearbox on the newest M5 but there was an uproar over it.

Uproar yes. From US customers

Over there millions of retards drive V8 petrol autos. A V8 petrol auto BMW 5-series just wouldn't give an enthousiast any credibility over there...

Embrace the future folks. Manuals will be gone soon (at least on higher end cars). Good riddance. Surely none of you manual fans hate the invention of synchromesh too?

eth0

heate wrote: »

I can't fathom how an automatic is for the brain dead or some sort of celtic tiger excess - by that reasoning a car is some sort of Celtic tiger excess.

Driving them is a very passive, isolated and uninvolved experience but then a lot of cars are going that way with more and more gadgets and abstraction layers between the driver and the car itself. I noticed a lot of them were bought during the later years of the tiger as a kind of 'pfft I'm too good for you backward lads changing gears yourselves' thing.

The future of cars as I see it is boring. Diesels, automatics, driverless cars, infotainment, every previously mechanical component needs a little electric motor behind it for lazy folks. In a few years I'll probably buy a kit car cause a lot of the 'living room on wheels' type stuff thats coming out doesn't interest me a bit

eth0

unkel wrote: »

Uproar yes. From US customers

Over there millions of retards drive V8 petrol autos. A V8 petrol auto BMW 5-series just wouldn't give an enthousiast any credibility over there...

Embrace the future folks. Manuals will be gone soon (at least on higher end cars). Good riddance. Surely none of you manual fans hate the invention of synchromesh too?

If the future is as dull as it looks I have no interest in embracing it

ottostreet

I've never been an auto fan...I've had several, but they just don't do it for me.
My most recent is a 97 Mitsubishi FTO GPvR. I had a manual version of the same car at the same time. The difference between the two is astonishing, the manual feels far lighter and more nimble, fuel economy is much better, and being able to select gears myself means no dodgy gearchanges at dangerous moments. However, if I was to buy something like a 530d, then I'd have it in auto, thanks. Any diesel at all...auto.