Bus Eireann routes 109/109A Changes

Commuter109

kerosene wrote: »

Im guessing it might go up to the roundabout at supervalu in johnstown and back down onto dublin road.

Absoloute madness that the dpt service is cancelled. I was on the 5.45 bus one day last week and after 45 mins we still were not as far as the Halfway house pub.

Is there a stop to serve between the roundabout and the ardboyne stop?

In any case looks like Garlow Cross is still been served by every single XN , so its a still poor result for the vast vast majority of people.

Why are they so reluctant to provide proper detail?

gazzer

I wonder when the 109x will start to operate. I have to travel to Dublin for work twice next week to be in Adelaide Road for 9.30am.

AlekSmart

Commuter109 wrote: »

"A new stop will be provided before the bridge at the Ardboyne Hotel to facilitate customers at this location"

So assumedly then nothing has really changed, except an extra stop for Johnstown?

I'm assuming the idea is now the "XN" will service the new stop and still go around the world.

So still no true expresses and No DPT in the evenings. Joke shop

Need to have a look at the Sillian option I think

The absolutely incredible decision of a Public Transport Operator (and it's Supervisory Authority) to studiously ignore the provision of Strategic Infrastructure,when that has been proven to offer very significant benefits to both Public Transport customers,other road users,and the greater environment,should surely be the stuff of censure ?

At this stage,I am fairly confident it will take direct Ministerial Instruction to the Board of Bus Éireann to ensure it's vehicles use the DPT.

I would be hopeful,that a direct approach to Shane Ross on the issue of BÉ's refusal to utilise the DPT,might at least prompt a site visit to the place...It may well be that they regard the DPT as only being relevant to Dublin Airport related services

sofireland

Absolutely baffling that they aren't using Dpt more. I assume this spells the end of the direct buses from Navan at 0705 and 720 and the ones out of town at 1730 and 1830.

Wayno717

Hi guys,

Small question regarding the 109 and the blanchards town SC Slip road stop. Does anyone know if the bus stops there between the times of 7am - 9am from kells. I'm asking because i've gotten reports from people saying completely different things like the bus does and dosnt stop there, and it only stops if you ask the driver.

I just want to know as looking at the timetable, it looks like it completely ignores blanchards town all together. I was wondering if anyone cold help me on that front

Thanks in advance

tom23

AlekSmart wrote: »

Anybody intending to engage with Bus Eireann,or more appropriately,the NTA,really needs to focus on this reality.

This form of routing really does underline the purpose of the DP Tunnel and how effective it actually is WHEN it is utilized.

Quite why the players in the 109 saga continue to be so reluctant about utilizing it,and more worryingly,why they shy away from further developing it's use remains baffling in the extreme.

It's worthwhile recalling that old Radio Advert Slogan...."Only an Hour from Dublin" and then recognizing that it remains possible even in the 21st Century....but only IF the infrastructure is used.

Doubling the current peak time 109 DPT useage would be an eminently sensible starting point ?

This is an excellent point Alex, i for one would love to know why the DPT is completely ignored. Does not make sense.

AlekSmart

tom23 wrote: »

This is an excellent point Alex, i for one would love to know why the DPT is completely ignored. Does not make sense.

At this juncture,Bus Eireann or more properly,the NTA,cannot be forced into using the DPT,however there may be an opportunity to force them to outline what consideration they gave that routing,followed by a detailed reasoning as to why they choose not to utilise it ?

Things making sense to ordinary people,is not quite the same,as things making sense to senior Public Administrators

Commuter109

AlekSmart wrote: »

At this juncture,Bus Eireann or more properly,the NTA,cannot be forced into using the DPT,however there may be an opportunity to force them to outline what consideration they gave that routing,followed by a detailed reasoning as to why they choose not to utilise it ?

Things making sense to ordinary people,is not quite the same,as things making sense to senior Public Administrators

In any of these consultations, I have submitted feedback looking for statistics,

Why does Johnstown need circa 400% more stops than the entire rest of Navan,

Test times and when the routes were tested, i.e. how will a bus do South side to Bersford place in 4 minutes.

How does every journey take the same time regardless of the time of day or night it travels or the route.

How is the Finglas route quicker than DPT.

But not a chance of getting any sort of proper reply.

Maybe one for the Freedom of Info act me thinks!

AlekSmart

Commuter109 wrote: »

In any of these consultations, I have submitted feedback looking for statistics,

Why does Johnstown need circa 400% more stops than the entire rest of Navan,

Test times and when the routes were tested, i.e. how will a bus do South side to Bersford place in 4 minutes.

How does every journey take the same time regardless of the time of day or night it travels or the route.

How is the Finglas route quicker than DPT.

But not a chance of getting any sort of proper reply.

Maybe one for the Freedom of Info act me thinks!

It's a great pity some significant Politican cannot be persuaded to take an active interest in this.

When one thinks of the HUGE investment in the DPT and the reasons for it's planning and construction,it's tantamount to sabotage for a State Sponsored Public Transport Authority to continue with the pretence that it was never completed at all !

It is truly bizzarre.

horseburger

AlekSmart wrote: »

It's a great pity some significant Politican cannot be persuaded to take an active interest in this.

When one thinks of the HUGE investment in the DPT and the reasons for it's planning and construction,it's tantamount to sabotage for a State Sponsored Public Transport Authority to continue with the pretence that it was never completed at all !

It is truly bizzarre.

I understand what you are saying, that elected public representatives should get involved in issues like changes to bus routes, but I think that, very often, when politicians make comments about bus services, they reveal, unwittingly, that they don't really know what they are talking about.

I think the bus users, who write in this discussion, give far more insight and speak with more authority, than local public representatives, because they are far more familiar with how the services operate. Bus users, can give better arguments to Bus Éireann and the National Transport Authority, regarding bus routes, than local public representatives.

For example, on Friday 15th January 2016, Regina Doherty TD, Fine Gael, Ratoath, issued a press statement saying how terrible it was that the 105, which operates through Ratoath, would no longer serve Kentstown or Duleek, if the proposed changes to the 105 service were implemented, which proposed that the 105 would no longer serve Dublin City Centre, but instead serve Connolly Hospital Blanchardstown.

(This was when proposals were announced, that the 105 would no longer go into Dublin City Centre, but operate to Blanchardstown Connolly Hospital instead.)

http://reginadoherty.blogspot.ie/2016/01/doherty-calls-for-reversal-of-proposed.html.

"Fine Gael TD for Meath East, Regina Doherty, has called on Bus Eireann to reverse proposed changes to Route 105 which will see the new terminus at Connolly Hospital and will no longer bring commuters from Duleek, Kentstown, Ashbourne, and Ratoath to the city centre".

Until the recent timetable changes for the 105 and 103, which started on 3rd April 2016, the 105 did not serve Kenstown or Duleek. When Regina Doherty issued that statement, Kentstown was served by the 107 bus route, and Duleek by the 103. When she issued that statement neither Kentstown or Duleek were served by the 105 bus.

What she said would be like releasing a press statement, complaining about the changes to the 109 route, by saying how terrible it is that the 109 no longer serves Oldcastle.

Here is a link to a post I wrote about it in March, I included a link to the then current, but now old, 105 and 103 timetables, to indicate that her statement about the 105 serving Duleek and Kentstown was incorrect. (These old timetables are no longer on the buseireann.ie site, but I included them as attachments, for reference purposes and to be able to compare them to the new 105 and 103 routes).

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=99201918&postcount=23

Basically, I think that the bus users can give greater insight, observations and recommendations than elected public representatives, considering the example where Regina Doherty showed that she wasn't even familiar with the route taken, by the Bus Éireann service that passes through her own local area.

Al_Coholic

Not sure if this was posted before but Sillan Tours have a new bus schedule since last Monday
More services during week and weekend might suit more people

gazzer

I hope this new service starts soon. 2 hours 10 minutes to get to Virginia from Dublin on Saturday. Rediculous. Dont get me started on that bloody one way system that is in operation in Kells. Stuck in traffic for ages.

Banjoxed

At the risk of stating the bleedin' obvious, why hasn't the Navan - M3 Parkway rail project been activated? Failing that, why hasn't Navan - Drogheda - Dublin been put forward, when clearly the 'paths through Connolly' issue is now a dead duck with the Phoenix Park Tunnel services imminent?

Failing both those options, why does BÉ go out of its way to NOT stop buses at the M3 Parkway station except for one Trim bus each way?

I suspect candidates for the next GE are dusting down Noel Dempsey's "Dempsey Delivers" nonsense for reuse.

LXFlyer

Banjoxed wrote: »

At the risk of stating the bleedin' obvious, why hasn't the Navan - M3 Parkway rail project been activated? Failing that, why hasn't Navan - Drogheda - Dublin been put forward, when clearly the 'paths through Connolly' issue is now a dead duck with the Phoenix Park Tunnel services imminent?

Failing both those options, why does BÉ go out of its way to NOT stop buses at the M3 Parkway station except for one Trim bus each way?

I suspect candidates for the next GE are dusting down Noel Dempsey's "Dempsey Delivers" nonsense for reuse.

Lack of public funds is the primary reason for the non-delivery of the rest of the rail line to Navan.

No demand - all 111 services were routed via the station initially but people didn't use it. People would have to pay two separate fares to use the 111 and train, with no significant time saving.

Using the Navan-Drogheda railway route for additional trains really isn't on the cards as with the 10 minute DART, outer suburban paths on the Northern Line (apart from one per hour) become far slower and would offer no benefit over the proposed bus services from Navan. Add to that the fact that there is no rolling stock to deliver it.

Whatsdastory

Dear Bus Eireann, please use common sense
24 buses a day from Kells to Airport on 109a Bus route and obviously 24 on return journey?
50 seater buses * 24 equals 1200*2 =2400?
Is there 2400 people travelling daily from Kells to Airport?

Never more than 5 people on these buses in my experience!
How about running only 20 buses a day on this route, and use the other 4 buses for following route
Cavan - Virginia - Kells to Dublin via M3 & DPT 4 times in morning and 4 in evening!?
Not via gridlock Blan/Phisboro. New buses are going via Finglas!!? wtf?
Even if you had one bus starting in Kells say at 715 and get go direct to O Connell St arriving at 815, trust me it would be full every day just with Kells customers.


Kells Town Hall to O Connell St takes roughly 60 minutes via M3&DPT. Thats what majority of customer's want who get on a bus in the morning in Cavan/Virginia/Kells.


Common sense please!

Vic_08

Whatsdastory wrote: »

Dear Bus Eireann, please use common sense
24 buses a day from Kells to Airport on 109a Bus route and obviously 24 on return journey?
50 seater buses * 24 equals 1200*2 =2400?
Is there 2400 people travelling daily from Kells to Airport?

Never more than 5 people on these buses in my experience!

Leaving Kells maybe but the 109a also picks up in Navan, Dunsaughlin, Ratoath and Ashbourne as well as stops along the route. It also drops off at DCU. It is a well used route, particularly in the peaks.

Whatsdastory wrote: »

How about running only 20 buses a day on this route, and use the other 4 buses for following route
Cavan - Virginia - Kells to Dublin via M3 & DPT 4 times in morning and 4 in evening!?

Honestly, how much thought did you put into that? You can't just pluck 4 random departures on one route and place them on another when it suits you.

The 109a does not run 24 BUSES it runs 24 departures. In total the route currently uses 4 buses, if you did as you asked there would be no 109a from Kells between 05.40 and 10.40 am and from Dublin Airport between 15.15 and 20.15, how much use do you think that service would be then?

In fact quite the opposite is happening, as of yesterday 2 extra peak departures in each direction are running on the 109a to cope with the heavy demand for travel to/from DCU in particular.

http://www.buseireann.ie/timetables/1473263565-109A.pdf

horseburger

Vic_08 wrote: »

Leaving Kells maybe but the 109a also picks up in Navan, Dunsaughlin, Ratoath and Ashbourne as well as stops along the route. It also drops off at DCU. It is a well used route, particularly in the peaks.




Honestly, how much thought did you put into that? You can't just pluck 4 random departures on one route and place them on another when it suits you.

The 109a does not run 24 BUSES it runs 24 departures. In total the route currently uses 4 buses, if you did as you asked there would be no 109a from Kells between 05.40 and 10.40 am and from Dublin Airport between 15.15 and 20.15, how much use do you think that service would be then?

In fact quite the opposite is happening, as of yesterday 2 extra peak departures in each direction are running on the 109a to cope with the heavy demand for travel to/from DCU in particular.

http://www.buseireann.ie/timetables/1473263565-109A.pdf

I think it is very good that the 109A is 24 hours now, and that at night it serves Bus Aras to and from Kells.

A lot of people who get the 109N on Friday and Saturday nights at 12.30am and 3.30am, would often state that there should be a 109N service from Dublin in between 12.30am and 3.30am.

They mustn't have realised that the 12.30am and 3.30am services are the same bus, that after it arrives in Navan around 1.40am, does a return service at 1.45am and then after the 3.30am service gets to Navan, does another return service from Navan to Dublin at 4.45am.

I wonder, in time, considering the 109A is - since Sunday 31st July 2016 - hourly from Bus Aras throughout the night, to and from Ratoath, Dunshaughlin and Navan as well as Kells, Ashbourne and the airport, will the need for the 109N on Friday and Saturday nights, lessen?

I can't understand why Bus Éireann doesn't promote and advertise this new 24 hour service between Kells and Dublin, a lot more.

srsly78

These new double-decker buses are quite luxurious. Tables, also plugs and usb ports!?

tom23

Got the four o'clock departure and it will be night on two hours getting to Navan, god love anyone going Kells. There really has to be a better and more quicker to commute. It's back to pre 2006. What was the point of the M3?

Banjoxed

tom23 wrote: »

Got the four o'clock departure and it will be night on two hours getting to Navan, god love anyone going Kells. There really has to be a better and more quicker to commute. It's back to pre 2006. What was the point of the M3?

That is a very good question and here's another one. What was the land purchase costs for the M3, versus estimated land purchase costs for rebuilding the railway between M3 Parkway and Navan?

horseburger

Banjoxed wrote: »

That is a very good question and here's another one. What was the land purchase costs for the M3, versus estimated land purchase costs for rebuilding the railway between M3 Parkway and Navan?

The M3 will be used on the proposed XN services. Bus Éireann clearly intends using it throughout the day - and not just on particular services between Navan and Dublin - on the proposed Navan- Dublin XN service.

http://buseireann.ie/pdf/1471362174-Summary-Timetable--Dublin-Navan.pdf

Did anyone really believe that the railway line between Navan or Dublin, or between Navan and the M3 Parkway, was ever goin to happen.

It was talked about for years, as far back as 16 years ago that a Navan Dublin rail line was going to be built. It was stated that it'd be built by 2010. Then in 2010, it was stated by then Minister Noel Dempsey that it'd be built by 2015.

Here is an article, on the Meath Chronicle site dated 28th July 2010:
http://www.meathchronicle.ie/news/navan/articles/2010/07/28/3998833-dempsey-insists-rail-project-still-on-track/

Someone included this article in a discussion on the Irish Railway News site. The post was written on 31st July 2010, but in the post, a link to the article on the Meath Chronicle site, or a scan of the article in the paper was not included:

http://irnirishrailwaynews.yuku.com/sreply/42349/Infrastructure-investment-20102016-impact-Rail-projects#.V9wJh-TrvIU

http://irnirishrailwaynews.yuku.com/forum/getrefs/id/42349/type/0

http://irnirishrailwaynews.yuku.com/reply/43899/t/-Infrastructure-investment-2010-2016-impact--Rail-projects.html#.V9wEv-TrvIU

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/minister-insists-dublin-navan-rail-line-will-go-ahead-127090.html

http://www.meathchronicle.ie/sport/navan/articles/2008/01/12/23217-navan-rail-line-100-certain-says-dempsey/

http://www.politics.ie/forum/transport/134698-noel-dempsey-insists-navan-rail-line-will-operating-2015-a.html

Banjoxed

horseburger wrote: »

The M3 will be used on the proposed XN services. Bus Éireann clearly intends using it throughout the day - and not just on particular services between Navan and Dublin - on the proposed Navan- Dublin XN service.

http://buseireann.ie/pdf/1471362174-Summary-Timetable--Dublin-Navan.pdf

Did anyone really believe that the railway line between Navan or Dublin, or between Navan and the M3 Parkway, was ever goin to happen.

It was talked about for years, as far back as 16 years ago that a Navan Dublin rail line was going to be built. It was stated that it'd be built by 2010. Then in 2010, it was stated by then Minister Noel Dempsey that it'd be built by 2015.

Here is an article, on the Meath Chronicle site dated 28th July 2010:
http://www.meathchronicle.ie/news/navan/articles/2010/07/28/3998833-dempsey-insists-rail-project-still-on-track/

Someone included this article in a discussion on the Irish Railway News site. The post was written on 31st July 2010, but in the post, a link to the article on the Meath Chronicle site, or a scan of the article in the paper was not included:

http://irnirishrailwaynews.yuku.com/sreply/42349/Infrastructure-investment-20102016-impact-Rail-projects#.V9wJh-TrvIU

http://irnirishrailwaynews.yuku.com/forum/getrefs/id/42349/type/0

http://irnirishrailwaynews.yuku.com/reply/43899/t/-Infrastructure-investment-2010-2016-impact--Rail-projects.html#.V9wEv-TrvIU

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/minister-insists-dublin-navan-rail-line-will-go-ahead-127090.html

http://www.meathchronicle.ie/sport/navan/articles/2008/01/12/23217-navan-rail-line-100-certain-says-dempsey/

http://www.politics.ie/forum/transport/134698-noel-dempsey-insists-navan-rail-line-will-operating-2015-a.html

O yes Mr Burger I'm well aware of the shenanigans around the Navan rail project. I think the consensus is now it was a diddycoy to sneak the M3 Outdoor Relief Scheme through. Handy to have those links in one place though.

gazzer

Still no word on when these changes are coming in? I presume they will give us a bit of notice I have to get the bus from Cavan to Dublin on Thursday.

Banjoxed

gazzer wrote: »

Still no word on when these changes are coming in? I presume they will give us a bit of notice I have to get the bus from Cavan to Dublin on Thursday.

I googled that for you, hope it helps

https://national.buseireann.ie/?originStop=13586&destinationstop=13500&ticketType=2&departdate=26-sep-2016&departtime=0400&returndate=26-sep-2016&returntime=1200&adult=1&child=0&student=0&family=0

gazzer

Banjoxed wrote: »

I googled that for you, hope it helps

https://national.buseireann.ie/?originStop=13586&destinationstop=13500&ticketType=2&departdate=26-sep-2016&departtime=0400&returndate=26-sep-2016&returntime=1200&adult=1&child=0&student=0&family=0

You are too good ;);) I checked the timetable before I posted but I just thought I would double check in case somebody "In the know" here had an update

LXFlyer

gazzer wrote: »

Still no word on when these changes are coming in? I presume they will give us a bit of notice I have to get the bus from Cavan to Dublin on Thursday.

They are obliged to give 10 days notice of any changes to timetables, routes or bus stop locations.

Nekarsulm

The 109 from Cavan to Dublin is a head wrecker. Crawling over the M3 into the Blanch. and back out again.
Also full of sick people with a Bus Pass heading to the Mater. Most of whom never heard of covering their mouth as the hack up phlegm all the way to Dublin.
Luckily, early commuters (6.55am in Cavan) can usually get on a 30 that runs from Donegal to the Airport, and on to Bus Aras.
This is a quicker service and always has happier people on it.
Its also more than Euro 4 cheaper for a one way to Bus Aras.

gazzer

lxflyer wrote: »

They are obliged to give 10 days notice of any changes to timetables, routes or bus stop locations.

Thanks for that info. I didnt realise that was the case. Looks like it wont be until October so that the changes take place.

horseburger

gazzer wrote: »

Thanks for that info. I didnt realise that was the case. Looks like it wont be until October so that the changes take place.

It is stated in the press release issued by Bus Éireann on Monday 29th August 2016 that:

"No changes will be implemented until approved by the Authority. Once approved, customers will be notified a minimum of 10 days prior to any changes to our services on this corridor".

http://www.buseireann.ie/news_timetable.php?id=2123&month=Aug

Commuter109

http://www.buseireann.ie/news.php?id=2152&month=Sep

Never like to see any entity in difficulty, but it really is no surprise with BE