STOVES questions and answers here(see mod note in post 1)

Stove Fan · 08-01-2012 10:00pm

Deedsie wrote: »

This is just two more pics from outside Stove Fan. I want to build out the wall and raise the chimney if at all possible. Sorry the pics are a bit crap.

Hi:) If my understanding is right you want to build a recess outside for the stove to fit into, like a external chimney so the wall inside is flat with an opening for the stove to fit in it?

Building a recess really depends if the original wall is a cavity wall or solid. It's the damp proofing that would be the awkward part for the cavity wall, ie linking the new chimney cavity with the house wall cavity. I'm sure it could be done by a builder and it would look great.

I think though you may be better and easier to re install the stove using all twin wall insulated flue. Use 1 45 degree elbows through the wall from the rear exit flue. Then externally use a 45 degree T piece and then continue the flue at least 1m or more above the roof depending on the proximity of other taller structures.

If you don't want to use the top of the stove for cooking I prefer to use the stoves top flue exit. In this case I would have the chimney going up vertically for 600mm and then use double walled insulated flue a 45 degree elbow then the 45 degree Y piece and then vertical.

The horizontal runs over 150mm breach building regulations and can block up with soot.

I was looking online at a professional stove installers photos and I was quite shocked at the standard of fluing and distance to combustibles:eek:

Stove Fan:)

fiestaman · 09-01-2012 10:33am

Hi i have one of these installed. anyone else ere have one, just woundering what you burning,coal, sticks,briquetts?? to get the best value from it.

theduke1 · 09-01-2012 10:11pm

Stove Fan wrote: »

Hi, Unfortunately the stove can't heat the underfloor heating direct as the water would be too hot for the underfloor circuit , you would need to plumb in a thermal store or possibly may be able to control the water temperature to the underfloor in some way? I would really have to see a picture of the location of the proposed flue to the rest of the house/roof. It would need to be 600mm above the extension roof or higher depending if the flue is near the main house. For your sized room 3-4kw would be plenty. Adding a radiator would be a good idea depending on the pipework route difficulty.

Stove Fan:)

cheers stove fan
can all that work in conjunction with a pressurised system that i have

Stove Fan · 09-01-2012 11:14pm

theduke1 wrote: »

cheers stove fan
can all that work in conjunction with a pressurised system that i have

Yes, the existing gas/oil boiler circuit to the coil can be pressurised and use one of the indirect coils on the open vented thermal store and the stove boiler would be direct to the store without coil, this side would be open vented. There would then be a circuit from the store to the underfloor heating.

Stove Fan:)

john_cappa · 10-01-2012 11:16pm

Hi stove fan/or anyone lol!

If I wanted to install a stove on an external wall of the house I currently live is it as simple as drilling through the external wall and venting the "chimney" out? How far up the external wall does it have to go? Assuming there are no windows on the external gable wall?

Stove Fan · 11-01-2012 1:53am

john_cappa wrote: »

Hi stove fan/or anyone lol!

If I wanted to install a stove on an external wall of the house I currently live is it as simple as drilling through the external wall and venting the "chimney" out? How far up the external wall does it have to go? Assuming there are no windows on the external gable wall?

Hi:) The best way would be to install the flue through the wall at 45 degrees using either the top flue or rear flue outlet on the stove and then this would go through the wall at 45 degrees to a 45 degree T piece and pipe base wall support. The pipe should never go horisontal through the wall more than 150mm or 6 inches as it would block with soot and cause possible smoke into room as chimneys should be as near vertical as possible with no sharb bends of more than 45 degrees.

As your wall is a gable depending on the flue position it should at least be above the roof by 1m or more depending on location. The installer who views will know more when he visits.

You can't just stop the flue part way up the gable as it has to go above the roof line. You may be better to fit the flue not on a gable wall as it wouldn't have to be as tall, but still above gutter level. It depends on roof pitch and flue location as to how far above the gutter or roof the flue needs to be.

Stove Fan:)

doniepony · 11-01-2012 2:46pm

Stovefan and others

I was looking for some independent advice about two stoves for my new build. I have been to alot of stove showrooms over past few weeks and still finding it difficult to choose stoves which best suit my house. Every person tells you they have the best stove so its hard to tell really.

My house has underfloor heating and should be quiet airtight (hopefully

). In my sitting room (16 x 16) I am looking to put a 5 or 6 KW stove with an external air supply. I am putting it into a firebrick chamber which a marble fireplace. What would be my best bet here do you think? Also what distance should I leave between sove and firebrick to allow air to circulate (some say 5'', some say 8'')

The second stove (if I can afford it) will be used less often and is in the sunroom which is (18 x 16 and double 1 1/2 storey). Was looking at a 4 KW inset stove for this. Again just looking for advice as to what people think would work best here.

Finally I would also appreciate any advice as regards what size of opening I should leave in both situations (I realise this depends on the chosen stove but wondering are there standard openings)

Many thanks for any feedback.

john_cappa · 11-01-2012 5:34pm

Stove Fan wrote: »

Hi:) The best way would be to install the flue through the wall at 45 degrees using either the top flue or rear flue outlet on the stove and then this would go through the wall at 45 degrees to a 45 degree T piece and pipe base wall support. The pipe should never go horisontal through the wall more than 150mm or 6 inches as it would block with soot and cause possible smoke into room as chimneys should be as near vertical as possible with no sharb bends of more than 45 degrees.

As your wall is a gable depending on the flue position it should at least be above the roof by 1m or more depending on location. The installer who views will know more when he visits.

You can't just stop the flue part way up the gable as it has to go above the roof line. You may be better to fit the flue not on a gable wall as it wouldn't have to be as tall, but still above gutter level. It depends on roof pitch and flue location as to how far above the gutter or roof the flue needs to be.

Stove Fan:)

So ideally the flue goes up past the guttering so. I was thinking as much to be honest. Expensive stuff per metre though!

Another couple of "stupid" questions for you to save me calling into a show room and looking like a fool.

Firstly if installing a stove for a new build is it best to drill out the hole for the chimney afterwards or should the pipe be installed at the same time as the block work?

Secondly.

If I wanted install a stove in the back of the single story extention of a house similar to the one below does the chimney just need to come above the gutter of the single storey? or should it go higher?

http://c1.dmlimg.com/2e5c93fc5fcb277c88837e18ff8cc045f6462f5abbaf73390e43f3667c2dad17.jpg

Thirdly

When someone mentions an external air supply for a stove does this just mean a chimney through a wall basically?

Thanks alot!

Stove Fan · 11-01-2012 6:24pm

doniepony wrote: »

Stovefan and others

I was looking for some independent advice about two stoves for my new build. I have been to alot of stove showrooms over past few weeks and still finding it difficult to choose stoves which best suit my house. Every person tells you they have the best stove so its hard to tell really.

My house has underfloor heating and should be quiet airtight (hopefully ). In my sitting room (16 x 16) I am looking to put a 5 or 6 KW stove with an external air supply. I am putting it into a firebrick chamber which a marble fireplace. What would be my best bet here do you think? Also what distance should I leave between sove and firebrick to allow air to circulate (some say 5'', some say 8'')

The second stove (if I can afford it) will be used less often and is in the sunroom which is (18 x 16 and double 1 1/2 storey). Was looking at a 4 KW inset stove for this. Again just looking for advice as to what people think would work best here.

Finally I would also appreciate any advice as regards what size of opening I should leave in both situations (I realise this depends on the chosen stove but wondering are there standard openings)

Many thanks for any feedback.

Hi:) As your building a new build I would as you say buy a stove with an external air supply option. This can be piped under the floor while the floor is being laid if the stove/chimney is on an internal wall. This has a duct from outside to the stove and so then does not need an air vent in the room if over 5kw. This air vent would be needed even if the stove is below 5kw in a house thats very airtight, but not as the stove comes with air supply option.
I think a 4 kw stove would be adequate especially if the insulation is good. If you want to have the stove to warm up other rooms then a 6 kw stove would be ideal. The nice thing with charnwood is they are very controllable and have varying heat outputs.

Stoves need air to circulate round them to dissipate the heat when freestanding in a fireplace opening. You wouldn't have to build the fireplace out of firebrick as any brick would do as there wouldn't be as intense heat as the fire isn't in direct contact with the brick.
For building regulations you must have 150mm on each side of the stove and 300mm above the stove, more if you can. This applies to all stoves freestanding in a fireplace opening.
The stove that I would highly regard is the charnwood Island 1 see: http://www.charnwood.com/range/stove/island-i.aspx
or charnwood Cove 2. See:
http://www.charnwood.com/range/stove/cove-2.aspx
Both come with external air option.
Or Clearview vision 500
http://www.clearviewstoves.com/vision500.htm
Again an external air kit is available.

For your inset stove I presume fully built into the wall, have a look at the woodwarm fireview 4k or 6.5kw.
http://www.woodwarmstoves.co.uk/products/fireview-range/4kwinsetfireview.ashx
or Clearview vision 500.
http://www.clearviewstoves.com/visioninset.htm

Woodwarm stoves are very well made but not as well known here compared to charnwood. Both are excellent brands.

Clearview stoves are excellent too, as well as Morso.
http://www.stovesonline.co.uk/wood_burning_stoves/Morso-stoves.html

For stove reviews on both these stoves by owners see.
www.whatstove.co.uk

Stove Fan:)

Stove Fan · 11-01-2012 6:45pm

john_cappa wrote: »

So ideally the flue goes up past the guttering so. I was thinking as much to be honest. Expensive stuff per metre though!

Another couple of "stupid" questions for you to save me calling into a show room and looking like a fool.

Firstly if installing a stove for a new build is it best to drill out the hole for the chimney afterwards or should the pipe be installed at the same time as the block work?

Secondly.

If I wanted install a stove in the back of the single story extention of a house similar to the one below does the chimney just need to come above the gutter of the single storey? or should it go higher?

http://c1.dmlimg.com/2e5c93fc5fcb277c88837e18ff8cc045f6462f5abbaf73390e43f3667c2dad17.jpg

Thirdly

When someone mentions an external air supply for a stove does this just mean a chimney through a wall basically?

Thanks alot!

Hi:) there is no such thing as a stupid question:) The twin wall flue is quite expensive:( With regards to installing the pipe through the wall it would be easier to fit the flue pipe while the wall was being build paying particular attention to getting the flue at a 45 degree angle. It would save a big job of cangoing out the hole afterwards.

On the single storey on the right of the picture the stove fluepipe would need to be as far too the right for regs and the higher the better. Fitting the flue Internally would look the neatest in this case. If the chimney/stove was against the main high gable wall in the single storey room the flue would need to go the full house hight and above the gutter. Placing the stove to the far right would be best as the flue wouldn't need to be as high and so cheaper on the materials.

When someone is talking about an external air supply they are talking about the air vent needed in the room for combustion air for the stove/fire. If your stove is under 5kw you wont need an air vent in the wall with the stove unless the house is very airtight.

You can also buy some makes of stove with a ducted air supply to the stove. This stops the drafts associated with having an air brick/vent in the wall as this duct is sealed to the stoves air system so no drafts.
This is called an external air kit or some manufacturers refer to it as a room sealed air supply.

Stove Fan:)

JMSE · 11-01-2012 7:50pm

Anyone find that their stove is actually almost to good to bear. We have an inset 14kw boiler in a 3 bed semi and its roasting me alive. I know the weather is mild but holy flip, we all normally have the heating on from Sept to Apr anyway or near enough. I'm thinking that we'll just be unable to use this thing once we get out of the heavy winter months each year. The idea of actually adding a rad in the shed just to dispel the over-capacity has come into my head, or some sort of energy conversion invention to take the heat from a rad somewhere and convert it into a sort of stored energy, I suppose thats what a hot water tank is though, so maybe a I need a bigger one, how about a 5000ltr one!!!!!!!!!

Melting in mild January,
JMSE.

doniepony · 11-01-2012 10:12pm

Thanks stove fan for your help

Great to get some independent advice. Had a look at the stoves and I am very impressed by them- there is even local supplier who has some in stock.

Few other small questions? Do I definitely need a foundation If i want to build a chimney breast in the sunroom-to be honest I was going to go with a free standing stove in the sunroom but now the foundations are in and i can see the shape of the room I would love to put an insert stove 500mm from the ground and maybe put toughened glass hearth on the tiles below it. Is this impossible now from a structural point of view?

Also would those stoves you recommended work in this scenario.

Finally, a fitter recently quoted me €1100 to fit a free standing stove in a fireplace opening (38"wide,40"high and 18" deep).this includes fire bricking the chamber (including all materials) and setting up the stove as well as fitting a fireplace surround? Essentially he said it's ready to light when he is finished. Is this excessive??

regards

Donie

Stove Fan · 11-01-2012 10:21pm

JMSE wrote: »

Anyone find that their stove is actually almost to good to bear. We have an inset 14kw boiler in a 3 bed semi and its roasting me alive. I know the weather is mild but holy flip, we all normally have the heating on from Sept to Apr anyway or near enough. I'm thinking that we'll just be unable to use this thing once we get out of the heavy winter months each year. The idea of actually adding a rad in the shed just to dispel the over-capacity has come into my head, or some sort of energy conversion invention to take the heat from a rad somewhere and convert it into a sort of stored energy, I suppose thats what a hot water tank is though, so maybe a I need a bigger one, how about a 5000ltr one!!!!!!!!!

Melting in mild January,
JMSE.

Yep it is certainly mild:). We lit our boiler stove this morning and had all the vents closed and flue damper half closed, soon after lighting, and have just opened the velux window:D. At least it saves fuel:) We lit it mainly because it's so grey and miserable out and it looks so welcoming.

We have ours lit for 7 months of the year but wouldn't want to run it all year, we would be too hot.:eek:

Stove Fan:)

Stove Fan · 11-01-2012 10:38pm

doniepony wrote: »

Thanks stove fan for your help

Great to get some independent advice. Had a look at the stoves and I am very impressed by them- there is even local supplier who has some in stock.

Few other small questions? Do I definitely need a foundation If i want to build a chimney breast in the sunroom-to be honest I was going to go with a free standing stove in the sunroom but now the foundations are in and i can see the shape of the room I would love to put an insert stove 500mm from the ground and maybe put toughened glass hearth on the tiles below it. Is this impossible now from a structural point of view?

Also would those stoves you recommended work in this scenario.

Finally, a fitter recently quoted me €1100 to fit a free standing stove in a fireplace opening (38"wide,40"high and 18" deep).this includes fire bricking the chamber (including all materials) and setting up the stove as well as fitting a fireplace surround? Essentially he said it's ready to light when he is finished. Is this excessive??

regards

Donie

Hi:D Yes the chimney breast would need a foundation. Building a block clay lined chimney would be the best for the insert. Yes the insert is fine to be raised off the ground. You would need to have a small projecting hearth raised out from the fireplace opening as you say 500mm above the ground for the inset stove front to sit on. You could also install strips of marble / polished granite etc around the inset stove for it to fit against to match the projecting hearth this would look good and depending on projecting hearth depth could also have a glass hearth below. This glass hearth wouldn't be needed if the projecting marble/granite hearth was 9 inches deep in front of insert. It would give a very sleek look and leave all the floorspace free.

With regards to the price it's very hard to say, it depends on the prices of the bricks and the surround and time taken. I would ask him how long it would take and how much his labour is and materials. To me it doesn't sound exxcessive if he does a top job.

Stove Fan:)

DizzyOC · 12-01-2012 6:20pm

Hello all.
I have a fairly simple little question for the experts out there but i'm not inclined to do a thing at home until I have an answer that i can relax around.

Basically, if i park the stove pipe into the flue collar on the back of the stove, what happens to the tar/liquid/gunk that will eventually roll back down the pipe? Will it just collect there until i clean it? will it eventually leak? Force a crack in the pipe? I don't know! Can you help? Once it makes its way down the pipe there is nowhere else for it to go. I'm fierce vexed, so I am.

Also, that join - the flue collar to the stove pipe - it's hardly a perfect fit but both are 5 inch pieces. Is it ok to stuff it with fire rope and/or fire cement? Seems a bit botch to me, no?

Any & all help greatly appreciated.

best regards...

john_cappa · 12-01-2012 8:53pm

Stove Fan wrote: »

Hi:) there is no such thing as a stupid question:) The twin wall flue is quite expensive:( With regards to installing the pipe through the wall it would be easier to fit the flue pipe while the wall was being build paying particular attention to getting the flue at a 45 degree angle. It would save a big job of cangoing out the hole afterwards.

On the single storey on the right of the picture the stove fluepipe would need to be as far too the right for regs and the higher the better. Fitting the flue Internally would look the neatest in this case. If the chimney/stove was against the main high gable wall in the single storey room the flue would need to go the full house hight and above the gutter. Placing the stove to the far right would be best as the flue wouldn't need to be as high and so cheaper on the materials.

When someone is talking about an external air supply they are talking about the air vent needed in the room for combustion air for the stove/fire. If your stove is under 5kw you wont need an air vent in the wall with the stove unless the house is very airtight.

You can also buy some makes of stove with a ducted air supply to the stove. This stops the drafts associated with having an air brick/vent in the wall as this duct is sealed to the stoves air system so no drafts.
This is called an external air kit or some manufacturers refer to it as a room sealed air supply.

Stove Fan:)

Awkward enough for the blocklayer to install when building i would have thought? Though I suppose just a matter of leaving out a 1/2 brick on one side then a 1/2 brick one brick higher on the otherside and drilling out any extra required.

With regards to the image of house above with the single storey extension the plan would be to install the stove prob at the centre of the end gable wall at the far right (or else in the far right back corner). So we could vent out the wall and up the gable end above gutter level which might not look the best. You say fitting it internally would be neatest. By this I assume straight up through the ceiling and out through the slates with some type of a roofing kit to seal? Again this would be an easy install either at the time of the roof going on or afterwards?

Also if you wanted to have a stove with a back boiler do you need a chinmey or can you use the flue vented out the wall.

Stove Fan · 12-01-2012 10:27pm

DizzyOC wrote: »

Hello all.
I have a fairly simple little question for the experts out there but i'm not inclined to do a thing at home until I have an answer that i can relax around.

Basically, if i park the stove pipe into the flue collar on the back of the stove, what happens to the tar/liquid/gunk that will eventually roll back down the pipe? Will it just collect there until i clean it? will it eventually leak? Force a crack in the pipe? I don't know! Can you help? Once it makes its way down the pipe there is nowhere else for it to go. I'm fierce vexed, so I am.

Also, that join - the flue collar to the stove pipe - it's hardly a perfect fit but both are 5 inch pieces. Is it ok to stuff it with fire rope and/or fire cement? Seems a bit botch to me, no?

Any & all help greatly appreciated.

best regards...

Hi, so long as the flue pipe fits inside the flue collar of the stove and all joins are socket end up you won't get any tar leaking out, it will just run internally and get evaporated by the heat of the fire.
Yes you can use stove rope and fire cement to join if the gap is large.

If your flue is clay lined your installer should join the stove pipe to the clay lined flue with an adapter if possible. This stops tar/condensation leaking out at the point of the clay liners base and directs it to the inside and will evaporate by the heat of the fire. Joining the stoves flue pipe to the clay liner makes sweeping easier as the soot would fall down into the stove rather than having to remove the stove to sweep the chimney and shovel up the soot.

So long as you burn well seasoned firewood with a moisture content less than 20% you shouldn't have a problem with tar formation. Try not to slumber burn for too long and have a good fire going for 20 minutes twice a day, or just have a normal fire. It's when people refuel the fire and straight away shut the air supply and then leave it to smoulder overnight is the greatest risk of tar especially with unseasoned wood. Let it burn for 15 minutes prior to shutting down.

Stove Fan:)

Stove Fan · 12-01-2012 10:38pm

john_cappa wrote: »

Awkward enough for the blocklayer to install when building i would have thought? Though I suppose just a matter of leaving out a 1/2 brick on one side then a 1/2 brick one brick higher on the otherside and drilling out any extra required.

With regards to the image of house above with the single storey extension the plan would be to install the stove prob at the centre of the end gable wall at the far right (or else in the far right back corner). So we could vent out the wall and up the gable end above gutter level which might not look the best. You say fitting it internally would be neatest. By this I assume straight up through the ceiling and out through the slates with some type of a roofing kit to seal? Again this would be an easy install either at the time of the roof going on or afterwards?

Also if you wanted to have a stove with a back boiler do you need a chinmey or can you use the flue vented out the wall.

Hi the far right is fine:) What I would do is while the roof was being slated is to get the roofer to fit the flashing kit for the stove fluepipe if going through the roof. Going through the roof would be the neatest and involve less fittings and give a very vertical flue with no bends. Definately a plus for sweeping. All the twin wall flue manufacturers have their own flashing kit for various roof pitches and for either slate or tile.

If you wanted though you could go out through the wall and up past roof height.

A back boiler stove would need the same type and height of an insulated flue as an ordinary stove. Either through the roof or out through the wall and up past roof.

Stove Fan.:)

john_cappa · 12-01-2012 10:51pm

Stove Fan wrote: »

Hi the far right is fine:) What I would do is while the roof was being slated is to get the roofer to fit the flashing kit for the stove fluepipe if going through the roof. Going through the roof would be the neatest and involve less fittings and give a very vertical flue with no bends. Definately a plus for sweeping. All the twin wall flue manufacturers have their own flashing kit for various roof pitches and for either slate or tile.

If you wanted though you could go out through the wall and up past roof height.

A back boiler stove would need the same type and height of an insulated flue as an ordinary stove. Either through the roof or out through the wall and up past roof.

Stove Fan.:)

Thats a good idea re installing the flashing kit. Makes sense.

Going through the roof would be best for that i think also. I thought a perfectly straight chimney was a bad thing? or is that just for an open fireplace?

Deedsie · 12-01-2012 10:52pm

Stove Fan wrote: »

Hi:) If my understanding is right you want to build a recess outside for the stove to fit into, like a external chimney so the wall inside is flat with an opening for the stove to fit in it?

Building a recess really depends if the original wall is a cavity wall or solid. It's the damp proofing that would be the awkward part for the cavity wall, ie linking the new chimney cavity with the house wall cavity. I'm sure it could be done by a builder and it would look great.

Sorry i am so late getting back to you and thanks for your comments so far. Ya, a recess outside is exactly what i was hoping to do. It is an extension at the back of the house built about 16 years ago. I am fairly sure it is a cavity wall.

Stove Fan wrote: »

I think though you may be better and easier to re install the stove using all twin wall insulated flue. Use 1 45 degree elbows through the wall from the rear exit flue. Then externally use a 45 degree T piece and then continue the flue at least 1m or more above the roof depending on the proximity of other taller structures.

If you don't want to use the top of the stove for cooking I prefer to use the stoves top flue exit. In this case I would have the chimney going up vertically for 600mm and then use double walled insulated flue a 45 degree elbow then the 45 degree Y piece and then vertical.

The horizontal runs over 150mm breach building regulations and can block up with soot.

I was looking online at a professional stove installers photos and I was quite shocked at the standard of fluing and distance to combustibles:eek:

Stove Fan:)

I think it will end up just being a reinstall without the recess. How much do you think that would cost? Ballpark?

Stove Fan · 13-01-2012 1:02am

Deedsie wrote: »

Sorry i am so late getting back to you and thanks for your comments so far. Ya, a recess outside is exactly what i was hoping to do. It is an extension at the back of the house built about 16 years ago. I am fairly sure it is a cavity wall.

I think it will end up just being a reinstall without the recess. How much do you think that would cost? Ballpark?

I certainly think a re install is best.

Hi I would say 1 and a half days labour tops and whatever extras are needed. Very hard to tell without seeing the job and measuring. Ie 2 45 degree bends and an extra couple of lengths of twin wall. I being a telescopic adjustable length for going through the wall

around 550-800 allowing 350 for labour at a very rough guess:(.

I would get at least three quotes and see what twin wall flue pipe is reusable.

Stove Fan:)

Stove Fan · 13-01-2012 1:10am

john_cappa wrote: »

Thats a good idea re installing the flashing kit. Makes sense.

Going through the roof would be best for that i think also. I thought a perfectly straight chimney was a bad thing? or is that just for an open fireplace?

No, A perfectly straight flue is the most ideal, even for an open fire. It's an old wives tale that you need a bend in the flue to stop downdraught, ie smoke blowing down and rain.

Straight is the best:)

Stove Fan:)

DizzyOC · 13-01-2012 10:28am

Stove Fan wrote: »

Hi, so long as the flue pipe fits inside the flue collar of the stove and all joins are socket end up you won't get any tar leaking out, it will just run internally and get evaporated by the heat of the fire.
Yes you can use stove rope and fire cement to join if the gap is large.

If your flue is clay lined your installer should join the stove pipe to the clay lined flue with an adapter if possible. This stops tar/condensation leaking out at the point of the clay liners base and directs it to the inside and will evaporate by the heat of the fire. Joining the stoves flue pipe to the clay liner makes sweeping easier as the soot would fall down into the stove rather than having to remove the stove to sweep the chimney and shovel up the soot.

So long as you burn well seasoned firewood with a moisture content less than 20% you shouldn't have a problem with tar formation. Try not to slumber burn for too long and have a good fire going for 20 minutes twice a day, or just have a normal fire. It's when people refuel the fire and straight away shut the air supply and then leave it to smoulder overnight is the greatest risk of tar especially with unseasoned wood. Let it burn for 15 minutes prior to shutting down.

Stove Fan:)

Hi Stove Fan!
Have been reading through this thread. Your knowledge-base is superb & the time you take to work through peoples questions is extraordinary. Thank you very much for your answers to my questions and also to everyone else's - you have given me & many others so much information - and with a safety aspect prevalent too.
Once again, many, many thanks & a very happy new year to you!
/d

Deedsie · 13-01-2012 12:56pm

Stove Fan wrote: »

I certainly think a re install is best.

Hi I would say 1 and a half days labour tops and whatever extras are needed. Very hard to tell without seeing the job and measuring. Ie 2 45 degree bends and an extra couple of lengths of twin wall. I being a telescopic adjustable length for going through the wall

around 550-800 allowing 350 for labour at a very rough guess:(.

I would get at least three quotes and see what twin wall flue pipe is reusable.

Stove Fan:)

Do you know any installers in Ireland with websites? Or better yet anyone in the Midwest?

john_cappa · 13-01-2012 5:22pm

Stove Fan wrote: »

No, A perfectly straight flue is the most ideal, even for an open fire. It's an old wives tale that you need a bend in the flue to stop downdraught, ie smoke blowing down and rain.

Straight is the best:)

Stove Fan:)

Really? lol!!

Had an convo with a builder who swore you needed a bend. He didnt know why but he said he has always been told a bend is need to stop smoke blowing out etc.

Reyman · 13-01-2012 6:25pm

Stove Fan wrote: »

Hi:) As your building a new build I would as you say buy a stove with an external air supply option. This can be piped under the floor while the floor is being laid if the stove/chimney is on an internal wall. This has a duct from outside to the stove and so then does not need an air vent in the room if over 5kw. This air vent would be needed even if the stove is below 5kw in a house thats very airtight, but not as the stove comes with air supply option.
I think a 4 kw stove would be adequate especially if the insulation is good. If you want to have the stove to warm up other rooms then a 6 kw stove would be ideal. The nice thing with charnwood is they are very controllable and have varying heat outputs.

Stoves need air to circulate round them to dissipate the heat when freestanding in a fireplace opening. You wouldn't have to build the fireplace out of firebrick as any brick would do as there wouldn't be as intense heat as the fire isn't in direct contact with the brick.
For building regulations you must have 150mm on each side of the stove and 300mm above the stove, more if you can. This applies to all stoves freestanding in a fireplace opening.
The stove that I would highly regard is the charnwood Island 1 see: http://www.charnwood.com/range/stove/island-i.aspx
or charnwood Cove 2. See:
http://www.charnwood.com/range/stove/cove-2.aspx
Both come with external air option.
Or Clearview vision 500
http://www.clearviewstoves.com/vision500.htm
Again an external air kit is available.

For your inset stove I presume fully built into the wall, have a look at the woodwarm fireview 4k or 6.5kw.
http://www.woodwarmstoves.co.uk/products/fireview-range/4kwinsetfireview.ashx
or Clearview vision 500.
http://www.clearviewstoves.com/visioninset.htm

Woodwarm stoves are very well made but not as well known here compared to charnwood. Both are excellent brands.

Clearview stoves are excellent too, as well as Morso.
http://www.stovesonline.co.uk/wood_burning_stoves/Morso-stoves.html

For stove reviews on both these stoves by owners see.
www.whatstove.co.uk

Stove Fan:)

Hi Stovefan,

I notice above you say it is useful it is to have an external air supply to the stove even if it's only 5kw!
Question: If I have a void of 2-3ft under my floorboards and it's a bungalow. Is it enough to vent from the stove into the void or does a duct have to be run right out to an external wall?
Thanks

Stove Fan · 13-01-2012 6:29pm

Deedsie wrote: »

Do you know any installers in Ireland with websites? Or better yet anyone in the Midwest?

Hi:) many thanks for the very kind comments and Happy New Year to all!! I try my best to give good advice:D Unfortunately I dont know of any installers and couldn't recommend any installers websites here:(

J,C. I love your builders comments an absolute classic:D LOL!!

Stove Fan:)

Stove Fan · 13-01-2012 6:42pm

Reyman wrote: »

Hi Stovefan,

I notice above you say it is useful it is to have an external air supply to the stove even if it's only 5kw!
Question: If I have a void of 2-3ft under my floorboards and it's a bungalow. Is it enough to vent from the stove into the void or does a duct have to be run right out to an external wall?
Thanks

Hi:) You only need a vent in the room if the house is very airtight under 5kw. If its not airtight you only need a vent on a stove rated over 5kw.
See. http://www.stovesonline.co.uk/stove-ventilation.html
See the table with no draught stabiliser.

If you were to fit a stove with the external air kit duct it would be best to run the duct straight from the stove through the outside wall with grill. If you just left it dangling under the floor it could get blocked by nesting mice:) and getcreepie crawlies through when not lit.

Stove Fan:)

Officer Giggles · 13-01-2012 6:44pm

I currently have a 4 bed semi D approx. 155m2 with an old wall mounted non condensing gas boiler and open fire with no back boiler. There are 9 radiators in the house. I'm in the process of planning an extension that will take the house to approx 200m2 with 12-14 rads. I want to upgrade the gas boiler, install solar panels and put in a stove. Now my question is can all these three be linked into a triple coil cylinder. I want to be able to have hot water and heat in the rads from either the gas or the stove depending on what I have on. Iv had a few "gasmen" from rgii.ie to get a quote but a few of them don't seem too enthusiastic about linking a gas boiler and a solid fuel heat source. Are they just not able to do the job or have the a right to be concerned.

Thanks

Stove Fan · 13-01-2012 11:32pm

Officer Giggles wrote: »

I currently have a 4 bed semi D approx. 155m2 with an old wall mounted non condensing gas boiler and open fire with no back boiler. There are 9 radiators in the house. I'm in the process of planning an extension that will take the house to approx 200m2 with 12-14 rads. I want to upgrade the gas boiler, install solar panels and put in a stove. Now my question is can all these three be linked into a triple coil cylinder. I want to be able to have hot water and heat in the rads from either the gas or the stove depending on what I have on. Iv had a few "gasmen" from rgii.ie to get a quote but a few of them don't seem too enthusiastic about linking a gas boiler and a solid fuel heat source. Are they just not able to do the job or have the a right to be concerned.

Thanks

Hi:) Linking the three heat sources is a very basic job for a plumber. You can as you say use a triple coil cylinder but if it was me I would consider a thermal store available in many different sizes. The thermal store is more expensive but it's super insulated and looses very little heat. It can also allow all three heat sources to be connected.

The very big plus if your water pressure is good, is mains pressure hot water. The thermal store has a coil through it and the hot water inside the store heats the domestic hot water going through the coil. Thermal stores are quite efficient and are worth considering.
http://www.accumulatortanks.co.uk/

If cost is a factor either go triple coil or a bit better a systemlink. If cost is your priority I think system link would give the best value as it comes with zoning options too, especially if saving space is important. The system link would go in the hotpress.
http://www.systemlink.ie/

So the 3 main ways to plumb in the three heat sources are:
1 Triple coil cylinder.
2 Thermal store.
3 Systemlink

Stove Fan:)

STOVES questions and answers here(see mod note in post 1)

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