Life outside BR

seanand

irish team for fiji, nice bit of youth and exp there. the backline is very interesting apart from hurley of coarse

The team is:
15 –Denis Hurley
14 - Fergus McFadden
13 – Darren Cave
12 – Luke Marshall
11 – Craig Gilroy
10 – Paddy Jackson
9 - Conor Murray
1 – David Kilcoyne
2 - Sean Cronin
3 - Mike Ross
4 - Donncha O'Callaghan
5 – Dan Tuohy
6 - Iain Henderson
7 – John Muldoon
8 - Jamie Heaslip

eoferrall

seanand wrote: »

irish team for fiji, nice bit of youth and exp there. the backline is very interesting apart from hurley of coarse

The team is:
15 –Denis Hurley
14 - Fergus McFadden
13 – Darren Cave
12 – Luke Marshall
11 – Craig Gilroy
10 – Paddy Jackson
9 - Conor Murray
1 – David Kilcoyne
2 - Sean Cronin
3 - Mike Ross
4 - Donncha O'Callaghan
5 – Dan Tuohy
6 - Iain Henderson
7 – John Muldoon
8 - Jamie Heaslip

While you could argue about Hurley, it's not that big a deal, its a non cap match and I would not expect hurley to get much other "Ireland" gametime.

initially I was disappointed with some of the selections (Ross, DOC etc) but looking again there is an "experienced" player in each unit in the forwards so makes sense to aid the younger/fresher lads.

Front row - Ross
Second row - DOC
Back Row - Heaslip
Halfbacks - Murray

after that it breaks down a little, but that the centres play together provincially so would be familiar so not as much need.

I am looking forward to this and hope we have a good craic at them.

ormond lad

seanand wrote: »

irish team for fiji, nice bit of youth and exp there. the backline is very interesting apart from hurley of coarse

The team is:
15 –Denis Hurley
14 - Fergus McFadden
13 – Darren Cave
12 – Luke Marshall
11 – Craig Gilroy
10 – Paddy Jackson
9 - Conor Murray
1 – David Kilcoyne
2 - Sean Cronin
3 - Mike Ross
4 - Donncha O'Callaghan
5 – Dan Tuohy
6 - Iain Henderson
7 – John Muldoon
8 - Jamie Heaslip

Nothing wrong with Hurley at fb.
great to see youngsters kilcoyne and henderson starting and connachts john muldoon.
Surprised to see Ross start. Why not Bent? Ross doesnt need to start and risk injury ahead of the must win game next weekend against argentina

mar-z

Bench as well
16 - Richardt Strauss
17 - Cian Healy
18 - Michael Bent
19 - Donncha Ryan
20 - Chris Henry
21 - Paul Marshall
22 - Jonathan Sexton
23 - Simon Zebo

Really hope Marshall is brought on for some decent gametime.

As for the starting line-up I'm pretty happy with it. With the injuries we have I'm happy playing Hurley at fb for this game, although if serious consideration is being put to Zebo there I'd like him to get more time there in this match.

Hopefully some of the Ulster backs make an impression.

TheJims

agree that ross is the strangest call, he should be wrapped in bubble wrap for the argie match, not thrown to a big rough pack of islanders lol, I'm happy for Hurley, its not like he will ever threaten for the Test squad but i think zebo should be there to get more gametime in the position. its a shame one of the Ians (Keatley & Madigan) aren't on the bench. don't think sexton would be needed, it is an A game after all

seanand

ormond lad wrote: »

Nothing wrong with Hurley at fb.
great to see youngsters kilcoyne and henderson starting and connachts john muldoon.
Surprised to see Ross start. Why not Bent? Ross doesnt need to start and risk injury ahead of the must win game next weekend against argentina

hes useless and im a munster man. ya im more interested to see how jackson and the centres do against a usually physical fiji team. and did you just call john muldoon young :P.

i doubt bent is going to get much game time till he gets use to the irish way and has a few games with leinster but then will either be getting enough game time with both them at the same club

ormond lad

seanand wrote: »

hes useless and im a munster man. ya im more interested to see how jackson and the centres do against a usually physical fiji team. and did you just call john muldoon young :P.

i doubt bent is going to get much game time till he gets use to the irish way and has a few games with leinster but then will either be getting enough game time with both them at the same club

Hurley isnt useless. Nothing compared to Kearney but how many are?
No i didnt call muldoon young.
Delighted to see Muldoon in the green of ireland. Doesnt get as much praise/recognition as he could have the past few years.
Dont think Bent should have been brought into irish set up until he had played a few games for Leinster as we dont know much about him and he could turn out to be useless

mar-z

TheJims wrote: »

its a shame one of the Ians (Keatley & Madigan) aren't on the bench. don't think sexton would be needed, it is an A game after all

I think there will probably be a switch of both halfbacks at the same time, leaving an inexperienced player (Jackson/Marshall) playing with a more experienced one (Murray/Sexton). It's probably unnecessary for this game but I can see the logic there.

eoferrall

mar-z wrote: »

I think there will probably be a switch of both halfbacks at the same time, leaving an inexperienced player (Jackson/Marshall) playing with a more experienced one (Murray/Sexton). It's probably unnecessary for this game but I can see the logic there.

I think this is the same logic for Ross. Kilcoyne will be starting with a regular enough irish front row (cronin/Ross) so can be compared in performance terms better. then at half time switch in Bent and then you can compare his performance in second half to scrums in first half to assess performance and compare to Ross.

That is my thinking on it, and logical... but not sure if that is how kidney came to the conclusion!

FewFew

No caps for this match? Awww... poor guys. Imagine if this is someone's only match. You think they'd just give them a lil cap to make them happy

ormond lad

Fewcifur wrote: »

No caps for this match? Awww... poor guys. Imagine if this is someone's only match. You think they'd just give them a lil cap to make them happy

No caps as aviva sponsorship deal with IRFU means all full internationals have to be played in the Aviva Stadium.
That is why this is an "Ireland XV" and is uncapped fixture.

FewFew

ormond lad wrote: »

No caps as aviva sponsorship deal with IRFU means all full internationals have to be played in the Aviva Stadium.
That is why this is an "Ireland XV" and is uncapped fixture.

Ah for fecksake... that's a bit unfortunate for the Irish fans around the country. I thought there might be a more established traditional reason, but a sponsorship deal? Boourns.

westman1

what a man:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

l3m0n5

Legendary maybe even Godly agility

flemishgael

Not bad but a good game against Fiji and a lucky try against Argentina doesn't make a legend yet. He needs a few more games to prove himself. A real promise though.

seanand

he does look like the making of a great player but i agree with flemishgeal its too early to tell and i think the irish team is already over hyped after beating a very tired looking Argentinean side

flemishgael

Exactly. Argentina had 3 very tough opponents after a season that was a lot longer than they're used to. Not saying this is a bad Ireland side but the Argentina and South Africa games didn't actually convince me they're worthy of their top 7 position. Look at how Wales or even Scotland are improving and one can only say that changes are needed. Ireland's golden generation is not getting younger and didn't achieve what they should have. A few triple crowns and a grand slam is a poor return from a squad that was he best Ireland ever had. Gilroy, Marshall and Jackson were impressive when playing Fiji but Fiji were very poor. Ulster have put a lot of effort in their academy and it is starting to pay off. Munster and Leinster are already cashing in on their academies and a whole new golden generation is ready to take up the mantle. Gilroy is very promising but so were Bowe and Trimble and I'm still of the persuasion that they didn't exactly set the world stage alight as was clear in the last 6 nations and the World Cup. Tomás O'Leary was to be the biggest thing since sliced bread and so was Luke Fitzgerald but because of injuries neither made it to godly status. I hope the youngsters like Gilroy will though. Zebo is a massive promise and so is Dave Kearney but I'm concerned about the full back position once Rob Kearney is gone. I'm not sure if Ireland have a world class full back yet. Kilcoyne and Ross are great players and the additions of Strauss and Bent are promising but I would prefer more young talent there as well. Ireland needs a steady stream if world class youngsters if they want to dominate European rugby like the Irish clubs do. Let's wait and see what happens before we overhype them again.

FewFew

Lads gonna merge this in with the "Real World Rugby" thread, just to avoid confusion.

flemishgael

Fewcifur wrote: »

Lads gonna merge this in with the "Real World Rugby" thread, just to avoid confusion.

Cool

ormond lad

flemishgael wrote: »

Exactly. Argentina had 3 very tough opponents after a season that was a lot longer than they're used to. Not saying this is a bad Ireland side but the Argentina and South Africa games didn't actually convince me they're worthy of their top 7 position. Look at how Wales or even Scotland are improving and one can only say that changes are needed. Ireland's golden generation is not getting younger and didn't achieve what they should have. A few triple crowns and a grand slam is a poor return from a squad that was he best Ireland ever had. Gilroy, Marshall and Jackson were impressive when playing Fiji but Fiji were very poor. Ulster have put a lot of effort in their academy and it is starting to pay off. Munster and Leinster are already cashing in on their academies and a whole new golden generation is ready to take up the mantle. Gilroy is very promising but so were Bowe and Trimble and I'm still of the persuasion that they didn't exactly set the world stage alight as was clear in the last 6 nations and the World Cup. Tomás O'Leary was to be the biggest thing since sliced bread and so was Luke Fitzgerald but because of injuries neither made it to godly status. I hope the youngsters like Gilroy will though. Zebo is a massive promise and so is Dave Kearney but I'm concerned about the full back position once Rob Kearney is gone. I'm not sure if Ireland have a world class full back yet. Kilcoyne and Ross are great players and the additions of Strauss and Bent are promising but I would prefer more young talent there as well. Ireland needs a steady stream if world class youngsters if they want to dominate European rugby like the Irish clubs do. Let's wait and see what happens before we overhype them again.

I think on potential we are a top 8 side but we havent shown consistency in our performances in quite a while
I wouldnt be that worried about the full back jersey esp when Rob Kearney is only 26 and has many years left if he doesnt get injured. Earls, Zebo can play there
More worrying IMO are centre, 10 and prop. Madigan looks good but will struggle to get enough games while behind Sexton in Leinster.
Fewi, eof i know i asked for the last change to the thread name but it might make things easier on ye if the name isnt as obvious for non Blackout players to join in the thread. Real World Rugby stands out as much if not more than "Ireland Rugby". Thread title related to Blackout but something that we all knew was the real rugby thread would be better dont ye think?
Munster havent really cashed in on their academy enough, we have recently improved it a lot but for quite a while the Munster academy was poor.
Problem with so many of Leinsters young stars is that their is so much talent ahead of them in the queue theyll struggle to get gametime and may need to move

eoferrall

ormond lad wrote: »

I think on potential we are a top 8 side but we havent shown consistency in our performances in quite a while
I wouldnt be that worried about the full back jersey esp when Rob Kearney is only 26 and has many years left if he doesnt get injured. Earls, Zebo can play there
More worrying IMO are centre, 10 and prop. Madigan looks good but will struggle to get enough games while behind Sexton in Leinster.
Fewi, eof i know i asked for the last change to the thread name but it might make things easier on ye if the name isnt as obvious for non Blackout players to join in the thread. Real World Rugby stands out as much if not more than "Ireland Rugby". Thread title related to Blackout but something that we all knew was the real rugby thread would be better dont ye think?
Munster havent really cashed in on their academy enough, we have recently improved it a lot but for quite a while the Munster academy was poor.
Problem with so many of Leinsters young stars is that their is so much talent ahead of them in the queue theyll struggle to get gametime and may need to move

Work better for you?

FewFew

Ah for fecksake, I thought this was the thread where we talk about going for pints and such things.

Damn you Ferrall and your misleading titles!

Now I'm off the the rugby forum in disgust! DISGUST!

:pac:

satory

Have to say I came in here, thinking there was some sort of Boards.ie BR meet up or something similar planned....

Its going to be a long wait till February/March, will this Irish performance be the start of getting some consistency, or is it just another once off. I'd have to say the latter...

Wales play this weekend, right? Will be interesting to see how they get on, as we have them first up in Cardiff in February.

eoferrall

would a meet up be feasible? I get the impression the small number of us are scattered around the country (and world for some!)

I am loath to get excited about the Argentina game, we have seen far too many of these false dawns. the worst to me was when we were attempting the expansive game and then reverted to a kicking game for the Welsh (I think) and didn't look back. Broke my heart.:(

If we continue on the 6 nations, well and good I will be proud. BUT I still think DK has had his time with the Irish set up. another 2 years to the RWC 2015 would be too long IMO. this is the perfect time to bring in a new coach and give them 2 years to get the squad (build their squad) playing how they want it etc.

westman1

the team aint no allblacks but how many times have ireland come up against a team that they should have hammered and only scraped by at least they scored trys against weaker opposition and improved the moral of the squad blooded some possible players when was the last time we blooded so much youth ?was it with b od followed with stringer rog hayes etc and they all went on to be called the golden generation .the won more than any other bunch of irish players ever did not as much as we all hoped but if it was that pridictable sport would be boring so i look forward with hope that these players will stay fit take their chances and thrill us all and not break our hearts too often

TheVoodoo

My viewing on it is; A good opponent is a good opponent, and for that regard it doesn't matter if it was Wales/France/Argentina etc.. What I take from it was the it was a cohesive team performance from 1-15 from start to *near* finish against that good opponent. I know it's only one game, but the XV really came together and fed off each others energy which is hugely positive for the future of Irish rugby. The most important question is if they can keep it up? If they can, they'd most certainly be an actual force to be reckoned with. But i won't get carried away with myself. But the future is maybe looking brighter?

FewFew

I think the whole "golden age" lark reflects on Irish rugby as a whole, in terms of support and youngsters interacting. When you're competing with football and GAA, any amount of upsurge is going to increase your player base and improve the quality of future generations.
I remember going to see Leinster play in Donnybrook and it felt like a little local event, where all the people of a certain age who played rugby knew each other or had a friend of a friend. Now those same matches sell out Aviva Landsdowne. That's not only a huge amount of potential players, that's a huge amount of supporters and well wishers.

Really think it's going to be different from our football golden age, which was a bit of an non-replicable culmination of things like the Celtic Tiger.

So, yeah, bring on the young guns.

Phonehead

I'm not excited about the result at all, Deccie is the biggest spoofer ever and his team will revert to sort come Spring time when other teams actually give a sh1t about games. Frankly every player in green deserves a good kick up the behind for the complete shambles that has been Irish rugby since they collapsed from grace in 09. Wait until Spring when 4th best scrumhalf in Ireland Murray is once again give the 9 shirt to go up against what are some of the best S/H's to play in the 6 nations, England Wales and France will once again stifle Murray into playing more like a flanker than a s/h. Run hard and drop the ball Zebo will continue to get in ahead of Gilroy, O'Connell if he is even 30% fit will be dropped into the second row to do his usual flop on the ground when someone even looks at him. O'Callaghan will continue to make the bench, O'Mahony will be there if Ferris isn't fit (He's not NT standard yet IMO) O'Gara will continue to keep younger guys out despite the fact that he's well past it. D'Arcy will continue at 12, his game was always built on pace and making hard yards, the pace is gone and the hard yards are now hard inches because guys are now so much bigger than him. So no I'm not confident at all, we'll beat Scotland, struggle over Italy lose to Wales, France and probably get stuffed again by England.

ormond lad

satory wrote: »

Have to say I came in here, thinking there was some sort of Boards.ie BR meet up or something similar planned....

Its going to be a long wait till February/March, will this Irish performance be the start of getting some consistency, or is it just another once off. I'd have to say the latter...

Wales play this weekend, right? Will be interesting to see how they get on, as we have them first up in Cardiff in February.

It will be interesting as Wales have all their coaches available for this game as Gatland missed some welsh games this month as he was watching other internationals as part of his role as Lions coach
I think we'll do well in this 6 nations. How well im not to sure..

eoferrall wrote: »

would a meet up be feasible? I get the impression the small number of us are scattered around the country (and world for some!)

I am loath to get excited about the Argentina game, we have seen far too many of these false dawns. the worst to me was when we were attempting the expansive game and then reverted to a kicking game for the Welsh (I think) and didn't look back. Broke my heart.:(

If we continue on the 6 nations, well and good I will be proud. BUT I still think DK has had his time with the Irish set up. another 2 years to the RWC 2015 would be too long IMO. this is the perfect time to bring in a new coach and give them 2 years to get the squad (build their squad) playing how they want it etc.

Only issue is who is the next irish coach if kidney goes. If Kidney goes in 2013 it has to be early and after the 6 nations as we play in the US while the Lions are on tour and that is key in terms of developing those players not in Australia and will be key squad members for the 2015 world cup

Phonehead wrote: »

I'm not excited about the result at all, Deccie is the biggest spoofer ever and his team will revert to sort come Spring time when other teams actually give a sh1t about games. Frankly every player in green deserves a good kick up the behind for the complete shambles that has been Irish rugby since they collapsed from grace in 09. Wait until Spring when 4th best scrumhalf in Ireland Murray is once again give the 9 shirt to go up against what are some of the best S/H's to play in the 6 nations, England Wales and France will once again stifle Murray into playing more like a flanker than a s/h. Run hard and drop the ball Zebo will continue to get in ahead of Gilroy, O'Connell if he is even 30% fit will be dropped into the second row to do his usual flop on the ground when someone even looks at him. O'Callaghan will continue to make the bench, O'Mahony will be there if Ferris isn't fit (He's not NT standard yet IMO) O'Gara will continue to keep younger guys out despite the fact that he's well past it. D'Arcy will continue at 12, his game was always built on pace and making hard yards, the pace is gone and the hard yards are now hard inches because guys are now so much bigger than him. So no I'm not confident at all, we'll beat Scotland, struggle over Italy lose to Wales, France and probably get stuffed again by England.

I think youre being harsh on Kidney. You talk as if teams didnt care for these matches. That is rubbish as these games helped decide seeding for the world cup draw which is in the next few weeks.
Murray is not the 4th best scrum half in Ireland. Zebo should be in the team and has done fine. Maybe Gilroy should get looked at but Zebo hasnt done anything really wrong to deserve being dropped
Phonehead, drop the anti munster crap as nearly every player you criticise is a munster jersey.
O Connell should be in the team in nearly all situations when fit. Donnacha o Callaghan hasnt been the greatest but has improved very recently. POM is Irish standard already but his best position is still undecided IMO.
Things are nowhere near as bad as your doom and gloom post implies

Phonehead

Nowhere near as bad??? we are battling to stay in the top 8, haven't beaten any top sides consistently and yes I think Munster bias is evident in the Irish setup! Munster are the 3rd best province now yet Deccie consistently picks players who wear red. How anyone can think this Irish team has performed well in more than 3 years is living in Frankie Sheehan land