Waterford GAA Discussion Thread 2011-2012

newyork4sam

I've seen this ballinacourty side in action this season and by the sounds of things they won't be loosing to much to the seniors. I would nearly put them down as a cert to win the west intermediate as the opposition seems very week, Ballnameela who were a kick of a ball away from the senior final 2 years ago may be there only threat. in the coming years the west intermediate football championship could come to resemble the second strings of senior clubs as the the likes of clashmore and stradballys junior teams would easily dispose of the likes of Ballyduff and sliabh Gcua. surely not a good sign for football in the county. However from results in the east, the competition seems competitive though the standard of football may be questionable

Black Suir

newyork4sam wrote: »

I've seen this ballinacourty side in action this season and by the sounds of things they won't be loosing to much to the seniors. I would nearly put them down as a cert to win the west intermediate as the opposition seems very week, Ballnameela who were a kick of a ball away from the senior final 2 years ago may be there only threat. in the coming years the west intermediate football championship could come to resemble the second strings of senior clubs as the the likes of clashmore and stradballys junior teams would easily dispose of the likes of Ballyduff and sliabh Gcua. surely not a good sign for football in the county. However from results in the east, the competition seems competitive though the standard of football may be questionable

In the west I would add Colligan and Geraldines that might be out of their debt playing Intermediate football and in the east Kill and Saint Mollerans are playing above where they possibly should be. I dont know how much Tramore have improved in the last year or two, but i saw them playing Senior a few times a few years back and they were very poor and would struggle at Intermediate grade. I saw John Mitchells playing last year and they too were very poor. Maybe I am a bit harsh in saying that these clubs are out of their debt as are the ones you mentioned, but i am basing things on how good some of the Intermediate Clubs were in the late 80's and early 90's when you could win an Intermediate championship and hold your own for a few years in a 16 team Senior Football Championship after coming up.

deisebhoy17

unfortunately football is well and truly fcuked in this county and will continue to get worse the way things are going for a long time to come

Black Suir

deisebhoy17 wrote: »

unfortunately football is well and truly fcuked in this county and will continue to get worse the way things are going for a long time to come

As someone that enjoys a good game of football, but who dont get to see it in this county, I have to agree with you. Unless there is a mass clean out of the administrators we have its going know place. Waterford have possibly lost a real gem in John Owens because of the administrators we have and what they done to him over the past year. Sometimes they are beyond belief.

Deise Hurler

Black Suir wrote: »

I hope Waterford County Board are getting paid by the company that runs the website and not the other way around, because the website is a disgrace this year.

Some shambles but the waterford gaa website is brutal this year after being excellent last year. Not one result from the weekend updated on it. Very frustrating for those of us with interest in club matters.

solarith

Have to click the Servasport link in results -> http://people.gaa.ie/club/waterford/

They're all there but it's shocking nonetheless

Deise Hurler

The blue blaa wrote: »

I haven't seen the N & S yet but the format of this years juvenile hurling is a joke with under 13,14,15,16 all being played at same time the 13 an 14's are week on week off, then you have eastern championships(NO NEED FOR THESE) U14 and U16 aswell as all county championship, then development squads there is no need for these to be training every week at this time of the year for u-13 with no competition to train for, this could be done in winter when no hurling or football is on, u-14 dev squads are stepping up their training now rightly so, were in a situation where a good 13 yr old will be playing in an average week

Monday- U13/14 championship game
Tuesday- U14 County dev. training
Wed- U16 championship game
Thur-U15 if not on saturday
Fri- development squad training
Sat- U15 if not on Thursday
Sun-

Nearly every night a talented upcoming hurler has to play a game or train now this is most weeks not all but last 4 weeks has been crazy, how has this happened.. Also these development coaches IMO should be alternated every week take 1 or 2 coaches from each club(IMPORTANT THESE COACHES LOOK AFTER THAT AGE GROUP WITHIN THEIR CLUB) who will give their time to do a session and keep things fresh do 2 sessions an leave another set of coaches do next 2 sessions an so on,this can be done in the off season the Games Development Officer could assess these coaches an make it easier to pick a backroom team to look after the county team, which would consist of defence coaches and attacking which in few years would greatly improve our development of teams, instead of some fella's putting their hand up at a meeting an gettin an u-13 development squad and going the whole way to minor with them, the system currently is a failure..

I think this year they brought it in that the football be played to mid june and the hurling from mid june on. Problem is with mid june to september to play the under 13, under 14, under 15 and under 16 hurling championships it gives lots of games, which is a good thing, but not enough time to play them. Hopefully next year bord na og will look at extending the hurling championships to may and early june which would allieviate this problem.

Black Suir

Deise Hurler wrote: »

I think this year they brought it in that the football be played to mid june and the hurling from mid june on. Problem is with mid june to september to play the under 13, under 14, under 15 and under 16 hurling championships it gives lots of games, which is a good thing, but not enough time to play them. Hopefully next year bord na og will look at extending the hurling championships to may and early june which would allieviate this problem.

Does anyone know if it is true that County Adult Board are about to abolish Bord na nÓg as it is in the County, it might even be a Croke Park thing. I saw someplace a while back that the officers of Adult County Board might get the right to pick the best people to run underage activities in the county. If it is correct it should be a welcome move because as it is Bord na nÓg in this county is a bit of a joke. There is some good Bord Bord na nÓg Officers in the county, so wont tar them all with the one brush, but in the main most of them are of a liability rather than an assett.

mccarthy37

Half time in the minor Semi Final its turning out to be a very good game although I'm finding it hard to watch after we beat Clare in the first round of the Munster Championship this year and that was in Ennis. Whoever wins this game it will be well deserved but I can see a bright future for both of these counties as they are making great strides at underage. Now how am I going to watch the senior game without thinking what if.

deisebhoy17

mccarthy37 wrote: »

Half time in the minor Semi Final its turning out to be a very good game although I'm finding it hard to watch after we beat Clare in the first round of the Munster Championship this year and that was in Ennis. Whoever wins this game it will be well deserved but I can see a bright future for both of these counties as they are making great strides at underage. Now how am I going to watch the senior game without thinking what if.

Was at the game today and I was thinking the same but if Im honest I dont think we would have beaten Galway. Traditionally we dont fear them but they are a different team this year. Theres a hunger and resilience about them that they didnt have in the past. They would have been bulling to get one over us this year given their record against us in the past. Their defence is outstanding and I really dont think we would have the forwards to break them down outside of Mullane. They were never going to replicate the performance against Kilkenny so in a way it was a lose lose situation for them. I think theyve finally turned the corner.
It was still a big opportunity missed for us this year though. I dont really think Cork and JBM are going anywhere. They have big hopes for all these young players but I dont see a Sean Og, Ben or Jerry O'Connor or Joe Deane in any of them. JBM has got as much as he can out of them imo

jupiterjack

anyone know if stradbally won tonight..

HelloYoungBoy

newyork4sam wrote: »

I've seen this ballinacourty side in action this season and by the sounds of things they won't be loosing to much to the seniors. I would nearly put them down as a cert to win the west intermediate as the opposition seems very week, Ballnameela who were a kick of a ball away from the senior final 2 years ago may be there only threat. in the coming years the west intermediate football championship could come to resemble the second strings of senior clubs as the the likes of clashmore and stradballys junior teams would easily dispose of the likes of Ballyduff and sliabh Gcua. surely not a good sign for football in the county. However from results in the east, the competition seems competitive though the standard of football may be questionable

I spose youre saying Ballinameela should be down in junior now aswel? Seeing as Sliabh gCua beat them today to claim a place in the Western Semi Final. Youve got to laugh at some of the comments on this page. Half of ye clearly dont got to any of these games. Just make assumtions based on God knows what

jupiterjack

HelloYoungBoy wrote: »

I spose youre saying Ballinameela should be down in junior now aswel? Seeing as Sliabh gCua beat them today to claim a place in the Western Semi Final. Youve got to laugh at some of the comments on this page. Half of ye clearly dont got to any of these games. Just make assumtions based on God knows what

have to agree with you there it is so laughable some of the posts. have seen both clashmore and stradbally juniors playing this year as well as other junior teams and they would come no way near beating any of the intermidiate teams in the west.

Black Suir

jupiterjack wrote: »

anyone know if stradbally won tonight..

Heard on the radio that they won by something like 3-11 to 6 or 7 points.

solarith

The top Intermediate club of the year would always give the bottom 2-3 in Senior a run for their money. That's why they get promoted if they win it..........................

Mountainlad

solarith wrote: »

The top Intermediate club of the year would always give the bottom 2-3 in Senior a run for their money. That's why they get promoted if they win it..........................

I'd agree, and while I haven't seen Stradbally and Clashmore's Junior teams play, there's a reason Ballinacourty and The Nire have intermediate teams and they don't. That said, the fact remains that the standard of football in the Intermediate championship is poor. I guess that's to be expected though, lowest population in Munster, you could hardly expect us to have competitive structures like Cork do. It is competitive, don't get me wrong, but not a competitive quality.

Plenty of poor Senior teams too, and even the big 3 aren't as strong in Munster now as they were a few years ago.

solarith

Mountainlad wrote: »

I'd agree, and while I haven't seen Stradbally and Clashmore's Junior teams play, there's a reason Ballinacourty and The Nire have intermediate teams and they don't. That said, the fact remains that the standard of football in the Intermediate championship is poor. I guess that's to be expected though, lowest population in Munster, you could hardly expect us to have competitive structures like Cork do. It is competitive, don't get me wrong, but not a competitive quality.

Plenty of poor Senior teams too, and even the big 3 aren't as strong in Munster now as they were a few years ago.

Well as we've said before the intermediate standard is diluted in both hurling and football because of this east/west nonsense.

newyork4sam

if sliabh gcua beat ballinameela I would suggest that Balinameela are not far off junior standards themselves, Sliabh Gcua have never been any great shakes and struggled to make progress at junior until last year, by the looks of thing it's going to be a catwalk for Ballinacourty

Black Suir

solarith wrote: »

The top Intermediate club of the year would always give the bottom 2-3 in Senior a run for their money. That's why they get promoted if they win it..........................

Dungarvan are not proving this true in 2012. Maybe in their last two games they will turn things around prove you right.

Mountainlad

solarith wrote: »

Well as we've said before the intermediate standard is diluted in both hurling and football because of this east/west nonsense.

Yeah but like most counties don't have an all-county championship, or certainly not straight into an all-county championship. Tipp have 4, Cork have like 6, and while I know they're bigger than Waterford, we only have 2. I'm not saying that an all-county system wouldn't work better, but I think it's too easy to blame a really horrific standard of football on the east/west divide.

newyork4sam wrote: »

if sliabh gcua beat ballinameela I would suggest that Balinameela are not far off junior standards themselves, Sliabh Gcua have never been any great shakes and struggled to make progress at junior until last year, by the looks of thing it's going to be a catwalk for Ballinacourty

That's not really allowing for the fact that Sliabh gCua might have made big improvements in the last year, or that Ballinameela may have been short a number of players on the day. I don't think Ballinacourty will walk it, though they should win it.

A big problem for adult teams though is the fact that they only have half (or less) they're underage teams available to them because of being joined up at underage. That can be said for Geraldines, Colligan, Ballinameela, Sliabh gCua, all of whom are in the second tier. Then you look at The Nire and Ballinacourty who are second string teams, and is it really any wonder it's that bad? Ballyduff are the only team without any of these inhibitions but they've poor underage teams, and to be honest I think they're the weakest team in that division.

Twixaroo

Mountainlad wrote: »

Yeah but like most counties don't have an all-county championship, or certainly not straight into an all-county championship. Tipp have 4, Cork have like 6, and while I know they're bigger than Waterford, we only have 2. I'm not saying that an all-county system wouldn't work better, but I think it's too easy to blame a really horrific standard of football on the east/west divide.



That's not really allowing for the fact that Sliabh gCua might have made big improvements in the last year, or that Ballinameela may have been short a number of players on the day. I don't think Ballinacourty will walk it, though they should win it.

A big problem for adult teams though is the fact that they only have half (or less) they're underage teams available to them because of being joined up at underage. That can be said for Geraldines, Colligan, Ballinameela, Sliabh gCua, all of whom are in the second tier. Then you look at The Nire and Ballinacourty who are second string teams, and is it really any wonder it's that bad? Ballyduff are the only team without any of these inhibitions but they've poor underage teams, and to be honest I think they're the weakest team in that division.

Ballyduff are without inhibitions? Are you kidding? Just because they refuse to join another club to form a stronger underage team doesn't mean they are without inhibitions. Tallow are joined with Knockanore underage, Lismore with Ballysaggart, Cappoquin with Tourin. There is nobody for Ballyduff to join with. I can assure you Ballyduff do not have big numbers underage and rely on absolutely everybody available for that age group to tog out, be they good, bad or indifferent. I'm sure that some of those other teams that are combined could do the same if they wished to but don't, that's their perogative! Can hardly make excuses for them if that's what they choose to do.

As for your opinion of Ballyduff being the weakest team in the Intermediate Championship; perhaps you should take a look at the table. Ballyduff finished with 5 points, beating Sliabh gCua and the Geraldines (who both made the semi finals) and drawing with Colligan. How that makes them worse than the team that finished on 2 points is beyond me!

*Not attacking you Mountainlad, in general I agree with a lot of your opinions on this site but found this to be a strange one!

Mountainlad

Twixaroo wrote: »

Ballyduff are without inhibitions? Are you kidding? Just because they refuse to join another club to form a stronger underage team doesn't mean they are without inhibitions. Tallow are joined with Knockanore underage, Lismore with Ballysaggart, Cappoquin with Tourin. There is nobody for Ballyduff to join with. I can assure you Ballyduff do not have big numbers underage and rely on absolutely everybody available for that age group to tog out, be they good, bad or indifferent. I'm sure that some of those other teams that are combined could do the same if they wished to but don't, that's their perogative! Can hardly make excuses for them if that's what they choose to do.

As for your opinion of Ballyduff being the weakest team in the Intermediate Championship; perhaps you should take a look at the table. Ballyduff finished with 5 points, beating Sliabh gCua and the Geraldines (who both made the semi finals) and drawing with Colligan. How that makes them worse than the team that finished on 2 points is beyond me!

*Not attacking you Mountainlad, in general I agree with a lot of your opinions on this site but found this to be a strange one!

I don't mean they've no inhibitions at underage, in fact I agree the other teams have an advantage. That generally shows, St.Olivers and Naoimh Brid/St Pats have had good teams in my own experience. They're at a disadvantage as adult clubs, but that is their own doing so I'm not making excuses for anyone. My point was just that it's no real surprise the Intermediate championship is poor.

Fair enough, I can't argue with results, I probably wasn't being fair to them basing the evaluation on one game.

No worries, mightn't always come across but I know I can be as wrong as anybody else

Mountainlad

HelloYoungBoy wrote: »

As ive already said none of ye go to the games so ye shouldnt be commenting on things ye know nothing about!

I've been to 3 intermediate games this year, so I've seen most of the teams. The standard is terrible, that's my point. Are you saying it's not?

newyork4sam

I've seen the majority of teams in action, the only ones I didnt were Geraldines and collgain, Ballinacourty are far an away superior to the rest they gave Ballyduff and sliabh gcua trouncings in Fraher Field.

newyork4sam

Standard of intermediate football in the west is terrible FULL STOP!!

newyork4sam

regardless of the club size, It's true colours are measured by the ability of the lesser members of its panel. 9 games should be the minimum amount of games played imo, in other counties clubs can play up to 15 if not more competive football matches a year (league and championship) I commend you for sticking up for the small club which your from, But size of clubs and emmigration is still no excuse for the standard of football being played, the clubs are at fault as much as the county board's

jive

Football is bad in this county because there is

1) a _severe_ lack of underage games
2) a lack of games for all adult teams

Each division is about a minimum of 5 games short of getting even a decent amount of football. Underage is an absolute joke I'm not even going to get into it. The junior attached leagues and whatever else are a joke as well, most the games aren't competitive at all. The championship should be made so that more games are played, maybe even split the east/west divide to A and B divisions lower down so that there are more competitive games, although the east is competitive the west appears to be a cake walk with one team 6 from 6.

Underage is the real issue though, with all the focus being on hurling and many u21 teams would be lucky to get more than one game a year in football. 3 games at u21 will win you a county championship some years, says it all. This topic could be discussed at length but it boils down to the fact that hurling is very much the focus of the county. I'm sure some kerry people talk about how crap the standard of hurling is there, too. Unless you have the population of a Cork or Dublin then realistically one will be fairly shíte because there simply isn't enough emphasis on it.

Black Suir

newyork4sam wrote: »

I've seen the majority of teams in action, the only ones I didnt were Geraldines and collgain, Ballinacourty are far an away superior to the rest they gave Ballyduff and sliabh gcua trouncings in Fraher Field.

Do you have any idea what round that Ballinacourty played both Ballyduff and Sliabh gCua. I was talking to a Ballinacourty club man last night, one of the most honest you can meet, and i said to him that they will walk away with the I.F.C. He said not at all. He said early in the championship they did have a very strong team but has the championship went on it got weaker and weaker. He was saying that this past weekend alone they lost something like 3 or 4 of the Intermediate panel to the Seniors. Another thing that should be asked, the day that the two clubs you mentioned played Ballinacourty, where these clubs at full strength, or near full strength.

Black Suir

newyork4sam wrote: »

Standard of intermediate football in the west is terrible FULL STOP!!

Cant imagine that it is much better in the East. John Mitchells won it last year and they played Dungarvan in the County Final and were very poor. They must be even worse then they looked that night because this year, Dungarvan are the worst club i have seen play in the grade in a number of years, even taking in a poor Tramore side I saw play a few times and an even worse Saint Brendan's group side.

Black Suir

jive wrote: »

Football is bad in this county because there is

1) a _severe_ lack of underage games
2) a lack of games for all adult teams

Each division is about a minimum of 5 games short of getting even a decent amount of football. Underage is an absolute joke I'm not even going to get into it. The junior attached leagues and whatever else are a joke as well, most the games aren't competitive at all. The championship should be made so that more games are played, maybe even split the east/west divide to A and B divisions lower down so that there are more competitive games, although the east is competitive the west appears to be a cake walk with one team 6 from 6.

Underage is the real issue though, with all the focus being on hurling and many u21 teams would be lucky to get more than one game a year in football. 3 games at u21 will win you a county championship some years, says it all. This topic could be discussed at length but it boils down to the fact that hurling is very much the focus of the county. I'm sure some kerry people talk about how crap the standard of hurling is there, too. Unless you have the population of a Cork or Dublin then realistically one will be fairly shíte because there simply isn't enough emphasis on it.

Have to agree with you in what you have to say about the amount of games played in each grade within the county. I did i gave a link to Deise Tom's blog http://deiseabu.blogspot.ie/ last week where he too was saying that something has to be done. This however will not happen while the preset divisional and county board officers are in place because they will loose out if the divisional boards were to be done away with. At least the county board made a good move this year allowing for two extra games in the S.F.C. I am sure however that some of them will be looking for it to go back to groups of four (three games) as they had to call off games twice this year already, once through their own fault for fixing a round of games the same weekend that the first round of the qualifiers were on in football. Maybe they will come back and tell us that they expected us to beat Limerick and that was the reason that the games were pencilled in for that weekend.