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Learner/Newbie Sticky **All Learner/newbie/Starter Questions Go here!!****

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    #332
    bitburger
    Registered Users Posts: 364 ✭✭bitburger


    should get insured on a 250 at your age no bothers and it will be well under 35kw, as far as i can work out though, you cannot do your test on it unless it will be over 25kw which few 250 sportsbikes are,


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    #333
    Speedy199
    Closed Accounts Posts: 103 ✭✭Speedy199


    bitburger wrote: »
    should get insured on a 250 at your age no bothers and it will be well under 35kw, as far as i can work out though, you cannot do your test on it unless it will be over 25kw which few 250 sportsbikes are,


    Was looking at a hornet 250 man, definetly be able do the test on that id say. Im not going for sports bikes. CBR 250s etc are out of the question.


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    #334
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users Posts: 34,230 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    Speedy199 wrote: »
    Would i not get insured on a 250?

    Probably but it'll cost. Get some quotes first before you get your heart set on any bike.

    When I started, I really wanted a CBR600. I could only get a 125cc licence due to my age and even on a 100cc (a good bit cheaper than a 125) the insurance was crazy. Was a lot better in year two, halfway through that I was able to get an A provisional and got myself a GS500 twin, passed my full A test on that, did a European tour on it, then three years to the day of buying my first bike I finally bought a CBR600 which was what I'd wanted all along :) Learned a lot along the way and the cost of dropping a smaller/cheaper bike (which we all do) is a lot less, and there's less chance that you'll be going fast enough to kill yourself :cool:

    would they be suitable for learning to drive? Ya my brother said to go for a 600(restricted) but i know id be in idiot on it and wouldnt trust myself.

    Yeah and is too powerful/big/heavy/ and expensive to insure. A 250 Ninja is a great bike and not just for learning on, but even that might not be affordable to you with zero experience and very young age.
    Time to pick up the phone and ring for a few bikes id say haha

    After you recover from the shock, post back here and we'll try to help :)

    Fingal County Council are certainly not competent to be making decisions about the most important piece of infrastructure on the island. They need to stick to badly designed cycle lanes and deciding on whether Mrs Murphy can have her kitchen extension.



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    #335
    bitburger
    Registered Users Posts: 364 ✭✭bitburger


    insurance shouldnt be so bad these days, i was getting quotes in and around the 500 euro mark there as a 21 year old without any experience for mates, and that was on pretty much anything 250-700cc. under 21 im not so sure since 21 is the year they allow you to drive a lot more, id be expecting to pay a grand for my first years insurance, thats with liberty, who by and large are not really very good

    hornets are nice and fall nicely into the A2 bracket now come january. checkout parts availibility first though,broke the right side hanger on my cb500 and it was very hard to find another one so look at things like that which will break in a crash


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    #336
    Speedy199
    Closed Accounts Posts: 103 ✭✭Speedy199


    ninja900 wrote: »
    Probably but it'll cost. Get some quotes first before you get your heart set on any bike.

    When I started, I really wanted a CBR600. I could only get a 125cc licence due to my age and even on a 100cc (a good bit cheaper than a 125) the insurance was crazy. Was a lot better in year two, halfway through that I was able to get an A provisional and got myself a GS500 twin, passed my full A test on that, did a European tour on it, then three years to the day of buying my first bike I finally bought a CBR600 which was what I'd wanted all along :) Learned a lot along the way and the cost of dropping a smaller/cheaper bike (which we all do) is a lot less, and there's less chance that you'll be going fast enough to kill yourself :cool:




    Yeah and is too powerful/big/heavy/ and expensive to insure. A 250 Ninja is a great bike and not just for learning on, but even that might not be affordable to you with zero experience and very young age.



    After you recover from the shock, post back here and we'll try to help :)


    thanks man for the reply. I have alot of research to do with these bikes. Hoping to get the IBT done fairly soon. Looks like itll be a hornet 250 id say. Love the look, insurance friendly(kinda) and is 4 stroke :)


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    #337
    Speedy199
    Closed Accounts Posts: 103 ✭✭Speedy199


    bitburger wrote: »
    insurance shouldnt be so bad these days, i was getting quotes in and around the 500 euro mark there as a 21 year old without any experience for mates, and that was on pretty much anything 250-700cc. under 21 im not so sure since 21 is the year they allow you to drive a lot more, id be expecting to pay a grand for my first years insurance, thats with liberty, who by and large are not really very good

    hornets are nice and fall nicely into the A2 bracket now come january. checkout parts availibility first though,broke the right side hanger on my cb500 and it was very hard to find another one so look at things like that which will break in a crash

    got a quote on the hornet alright and it comes out as €863 TPO. It would be about €721 with the IBT discount :) so happy days. Thats good enough for me if im honest!


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    #338
    jay92
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 155 ✭✭jay92


    Decided to do my theory, when I decide on what bike to get after I complete my IBT am I right in saying that as long as the bike is 125/250cc I wont have to get it restricted?

    I will probably opt for the 250cc as I read somehwere here that you should only get a 125cc if your 18 and weigh less than 9 stone lol Im 20 so I think Id get bored with a 125 anyway fair quick..


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    #339
    Faith+1
    Registered Users Posts: 3,674 ✭✭✭Faith+1


    jay92 wrote: »
    Decided to do my theory, when I decide on what bike to get after I complete my IBT am I right in saying that as long as the bike is 125/250cc I wont have to get it restricted?

    I will probably opt for the 250cc as I read somehwere here that you should only get a 125cc if your 18 and weigh less than 9 stone lol Im 20 so I think Id get bored with a 125 anyway fair quick..

    There's all new rules for bikes begining this 'January 19th' Jay. Check out these links for more info :)

    http://www.rsa.ie/Documents/Learner%20Drivers/Third%20Directive/Link%203.pdf

    http://www.magireland.org/category/campaigns/training/


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    #340
    jay92
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 155 ✭✭jay92


    Faith+1 wrote: »
    There's all new rules for bikes begining this 'January 19th' Jay. Check out these links for more info :)

    http://www.rsa.ie/Documents/Learner%20Drivers/Third%20Directive/Link%203.pdf

    http://www.magireland.org/category/campaigns/training/

    Thanks alot...I,ll have a gander as soon as the kettle boils ;)


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    #341
    pigman2000
    Registered Users Posts: 87 ✭✭pigman2000


    Right lads, stupid question n' all. But can i ride around with my fab new learner permit - before doing the IBT? or during it?

    How difficult is the practical parts of the IBT? will i need to supplement my learning with lessons prior to doing each module of the IBT?


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    #342
    Damien_d12
    Registered Users Posts: 40 ✭Damien_d12


    i've done the ibt last wend- its worthwhile and although i've been on the road for 1 month before the ibt i found it worthwhile. you will be illegal on the road without the IBT but cops won't ever ask you for your ibt (fingers crossed)


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    #343
    Pipz
    Registered Users Posts: 183 ✭✭Pipz


    pigman2000 wrote: »
    Right lads, stupid question n' all. But can i ride around with my fab new learner permit - before doing the IBT? or during it?

    How difficult is the practical parts of the IBT? will i need to supplement my learning with lessons prior to doing each module of the IBT?


    Your learner permit isnt valid without an IBT; so no, you cant ride around before or during the IBT. You have to wait until after. Not only would it be illegal to ride without doing it, but you also won't be insured.

    The IBT isnt an exam, it's there to teach you how to ride your bike properly and safely both for you and other road users. So you don't need other lessons, because the IBT IS the lessons.

    It's not difficult at all, it's all things you will possibly already know, coupled with more things that you need to/should know.

    I was reserved about having to do it, but after I did it, I completely understood the reasons why it's compulsory.


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    #344
    daenerysstormborn3
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,213 ✭✭✭daenerysstormborn3


    I think there should be a site wide rule against people perpetrating these myths about insurance becoming "void".


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    #345
    Pipz
    Registered Users Posts: 183 ✭✭Pipz


    Sorry if I was wrong, but I've always been told no IBT means no insurance.

    Just the same as car insurance now being void if there's no licenced driver with you and you only have a learner permit (which was stated to me in a letter from my insurance company).


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    #346
    minidazzler
    Registered Users Posts: 14,739 ✭✭✭✭minidazzler


    pixiebean22 wrote: »
    I think there should be a site wide rule against people perpetrating these myths about insurance becoming "void".

    I'd disagree, if it stops lads who have no clue what they are doing riding on public roads pre-IBT then it's probably good to make them think they aren't insured.


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    #347
    daenerysstormborn3
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,213 ✭✭✭daenerysstormborn3


    Pipz wrote: »
    Sorry if I was wrong, but I've always been told no IBT means no insurance.

    Just the same as car insurance now being void if there's no licenced driver with you and you only have a learner permit (which was stated to me in a letter from my insurance company).

    It's not as simple as that. Search the motors forum and you'll see the topic has been done to death.


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    #348
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users Posts: 34,230 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    All motor insurance is invalid if you do not hold a valid licence or learner permit.
    There is an exemption in most policies that covers you if you forget to renew your licence, provided you weren't disqualified, but you have to have had one in the first place.
    No IBT, no licence.

    Fingal County Council are certainly not competent to be making decisions about the most important piece of infrastructure on the island. They need to stick to badly designed cycle lanes and deciding on whether Mrs Murphy can have her kitchen extension.



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    #349
    eurofoxy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 440 ✭✭eurofoxy


    i think its more a matter of time before this comes before a judge in a court case, as to be quite honest if you have to appear before a court and explain to a judge that you knowingly rode on a public road without having a valid licence and caused an accident etc, he will have a bit of a field day with that... correct me if i am wrong but i have not heard of a case like this since the ibt requirement came in..
    now he could equally find in your favour but i am sure the likelyhood of that is very slim..
    oh and imagine what size civil case your insurance company will take against you if the judge ruled against you.. not really worth it to be...


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    #350
    daenerysstormborn3
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,213 ✭✭✭daenerysstormborn3


    eurofoxy wrote: »
    i think its more a matter of time before this comes before a judge in a court case, as to be quite honest if you have to appear before a court and explain to a judge that you knowingly rode on a public road without having a valid licence and caused an accident etc, he will have a bit of a field day with that... correct me if i am wrong but i have not heard of a case like this since the ibt requirement came in..
    now he could equally find in your favour but i am sure the likelyhood of that is very slim..
    oh and imagine what size civil case your insurance company will take against you if the judge ruled against you.. not really worth it to be...

    There is a difference between causing an accident while driving without fulfilling the terms of your licence, being involved in an accident, not your fault, while driving without fulfilling the terms of your licence and just driving without fulfilling the terms of your licence.

    All insurance companies are obliged to pay out on third party claims, it is then up to them to recover their money from you if they find you were not fulfilling your licence terms at the time of the accident - this happens very very rarely. There is no magical law that makes insurance void full stop. There are conditions etc. to be taken into account.

    There are many many precedent cases of learner drivers driving without properly fulfilling the terms of their licence, being involved in accidents and no action being taken against them.

    I am speaking from experience in the legal profession.


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    #351
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users Posts: 34,230 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    pixiebean22 wrote: »
    All insurance companies are obliged to pay out on third party claims, it is then up to them to recover their money from you if they find you were not fulfilling your licence terms at the time of the accident

    This is semantics. If you're insured then the insurer pays valid claims. If the insurer can pay out and then sue you, you weren't insured.
    this happens very very rarely. There is no magical law that makes insurance void full stop. There are conditions etc. to be taken into account.

    Such as a condition in every policy that you must have a valid licence.
    They'd go after people a lot more often if it wasn't so expensive to sue people (and most people couldn't afford to pay up anyway)

    There are many many precedent cases of learner drivers driving without properly fulfilling the terms of their licence, being involved in accidents and no action being taken against them.

    Gardai don't always ticket people they catch speeding, it doesn't make speeding legal.

    Fingal County Council are certainly not competent to be making decisions about the most important piece of infrastructure on the island. They need to stick to badly designed cycle lanes and deciding on whether Mrs Murphy can have her kitchen extension.



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    #352
    daenerysstormborn3
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,213 ✭✭✭daenerysstormborn3


    In other words, there's no such thing as "YOU'RE NOT INSURED!!!!!!" scare mongering.


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    #353
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users Posts: 34,230 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    If the insurance company can pay out and then sue you for their loss then no, you weren't validly insured.

    Fingal County Council are certainly not competent to be making decisions about the most important piece of infrastructure on the island. They need to stick to badly designed cycle lanes and deciding on whether Mrs Murphy can have her kitchen extension.



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    #354
    Keen2win
    Registered Users Posts: 153 ✭✭Keen2win


    Interesting thread, I'd be happy if someone could answer this...

    I have a full license for a car, but I would really like to start riding bikes! Anyway, I don't have anything done to get my bike license.

    Hopefully I will be in America for the summer. Anyone have any idea if I would be able to go about getting a license over there, that will be then valid when I come back home?

    Maybe it's a stupid question, does anyone know anything about the ins and outs?


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    #355
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users Posts: 34,230 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    American licences aren't recognised here (except for tourists for a limited time) and you can't swap it for an Irish one.

    Fingal County Council are certainly not competent to be making decisions about the most important piece of infrastructure on the island. They need to stick to badly designed cycle lanes and deciding on whether Mrs Murphy can have her kitchen extension.



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    #356
    Faith+1
    Registered Users Posts: 3,674 ✭✭✭Faith+1


    ninja900 wrote: »
    American licences aren't recognised here (except for tourists for a limited time) and you can't swap it for an Irish one.

    Thank god, I thought our test was a joke until I seen the American one in action :eek:


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    #357
    SouthTippBass
    Registered Users Posts: 1,292 ✭✭✭SouthTippBass


    Hello, so I drove a 125cc for a few years back in early 2000's. In that time I got the A1 license, which is still valid for another year. Been driving a car ever since, but now would love to get a bike again, engine size 650cc I was thinking.

    But where do I start? Motorbike laws and licenses have changed dramatically since I was last driving. Do I have to do this training they have now if I already have years of experiance driving the old 125cc? Do I have to re-do my eye test, or theory test? Should I buy a bike first, and do the full A test later? Or vice versa?

    It used to be so easy, go to the tax office, buy your license and away you go. :D

    So, what I need to know is, how do I get from here to driving my 650cc?!

    Thanks for your help!


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    #358
    minidazzler
    Registered Users Posts: 14,739 ✭✭✭✭minidazzler


    You'll have to get a new A Learner Permit and do an IBT now. You could ride a 125 if you want, but to go for anything bigger you'll need a different licence.


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    #359
    Roadskill
    Registered Users Posts: 356 ✭✭Roadskill


    SouthTippBass wrote: »
    Hello, so I drove a 125cc for a few years back in early 2000's. In that time I got the A1 license, which is still valid for another year. Been driving a car ever since, but now would love to get a bike again, engine size 650cc I was thinking.

    But where do I start? Motorbike laws and licenses have changed dramatically since I was last driving. Do I have to do this training they have now if I already have years of experiance driving the old 125cc? Do I have to re-do my eye test, or theory test? Should I buy a bike first, and do the full A test later? Or vice versa?

    It used to be so easy, go to the tax office, buy your license and away you go. :D

    So, what I need to know is, how do I get from here to driving my 650cc?!

    Thanks for your help!
    I presume you mean you have a full A1 licence.
    If that's the case you have a couple of options. In both cases you will need to complete an ibt.
    1. Apply for an A2 (35kw) learner permit and do ibt modules 1, 3 & 5. Instructor can sign you off for full licence in A2.
    2. Apply for category A learner permit (unrestricted) do ibt modules 1, 3 & 5 take a test after permit held for 6 months. Done

    I would go with option 2 personally.


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    #360
    SouthTippBass
    Registered Users Posts: 1,292 ✭✭✭SouthTippBass


    Roadskill wrote: »
    I presume you mean you have a full A1 licence.
    If that's the case you have a couple of options. In both cases you will need to complete an ibt.
    1. Apply for an A2 (35kw) learner permit and do ibt modules 1, 3 & 5. Instructor can sign you off for full licence in A2.
    2. Apply for category A learner permit (unrestricted) do ibt modules 1, 3 & 5 take a test after permit held for 6 months. Done

    I would go with option 2 personally.

    Hey, thanks very much for the info. Yes, its the full A1 I have, which I presume is useless now. So do I apply for this A learner permit in the tax office still?
    Once I have this A learner permit, I can get insured and start driving straight away? Or do I have to complete the IBT before I go on the road?

    Should I get a cheap old 250cc for learning on, and then sell on after a few months when my test is passed, or should I just buy the bike I want straight away?

    Sorry for all the questions, your help is appreciated!


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    #361
    Roadskill
    Registered Users Posts: 356 ✭✭Roadskill


    SouthTippBass wrote: »

    Hey, thanks very much for the info. Yes, its the full A1 I have, which I presume is useless now. So do I apply for this A learner permit in the tax office still?
    Once I have this A learner permit, I can get insured and start driving straight away? Or do I have to complete the IBT before I go on the road?

    Should I get a cheap old 250cc for learning on, and then sell on after a few months when my test is passed, or should I just buy the bike I want straight away?

    Sorry for all the questions, your help is appreciated!
    If your full A1 is in date (10 years since passing) then it's still ok. If it's out of date by less than 10 years you can get it back.
    You apply for the A permit at the motor tax office then do the ibt. You may need to do a theory test if not done before. Ibt and test must be done on a bike of at least 595cc & over 40kw power. There's a few threads on here about it all. Have a read and get familiar with it all.


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