Mayo GAA Discussion Thread

keane2097

realweirdo wrote: »

It's a bit more complex than that. Fair enough if people think there is little between the two, I have no problem with that. But the modern game is about inches, small percentages, and key tactics at important times in big games.

Connelly's last big achievement was in 2006 at under 21. The game has changed massively since then. Everything from tactics on the field to coaching, strength and conditioning, sports psychology and preparation off it.

Put it this way.

Let's imagine the Kerry Senior County management job came up. There were two candidates for it. Candidate 1 had a relation on the County Board. Candidate 2 was just as good as candidate 1 but unfortunately doesn't have the same connections.

Candidate 1 gets the job, no interviews of either candidate.

How would you feel about it? As a Kerry supporter would you be happy?

It might be worth taking a look at the Cork thread to see what they think of a selection process where the interview is given priority, where many people feel like Cuthbert's abilities with Powerpoint got him a job he should be nowhere near.

To answer your question, if we had two candidates who are as good as each other I don't think it matters a whole lot how they pick the winner. You are right that it's the 1 or 2% that can make the difference in the heat of an intercounty final etc., but are you going to find out which of the two is 1% better in a three hour interview with a couple of suits? I'm not sure that's a realistic way to look at the whole thing.

Realistically, the fact that Connelly has a good relationship with the county board is more likely to get you your 1% than cost you it.

keane2097

Ironically I find myself disagreeing with what the majority are saying re:McHale, think he seems like an excellent thinker on the game.

realweirdo

I just do not understand the thinking behind this lie from the County Board.

Today Saturday 20th September 2014 the Mayo Senior Football Team Interview Committee met with the Executive of the Mayo County Board where they gave the recommendation that Noel Connolly & Pat Holmes be put forward for the position as Senior Football Team Manager.

At the very least it would be nice to know who drafted and signed off on this statement. I know its the Mayo County Board. They make the FAI look like world class administrators.

But its pathetic that people like this are running Mayo football. I suppose its like all other counties, so long as they get their Croke Park allocation on big match days, they aren't too bothered what happens to the team.

As I read from another post in another forum, the Mayo County Board are the real curse affecting Mayo football.

boosabum

In all fairness to McStay, he deserved a shot at presenting his slide show and getting to present the attributes he believes he has that will make Mayo a winner.
Nothing is guranteed in gaelic football expect failure for all bar one county each year.
Only 5 people would have know what each of the applicants would have presented and if there was only ever going to be winner then at least only the 5 would have full knowledge of the loaded nice. Now everyone knows. So it's a crooked game and everyone knows about the crooked game, double whammy to McStay.

boosabum

In all fairness to McStay, he deserved a shot at presenting his slide show and getting to present the attributes he believes he has that will make Mayo a winner.
Nothing is guranteed in gaelic football expect failure for all bar one county each year.
Only 5 people would have know what each of the applicants would have presented and if there was only ever going to be winner then at least only the 5 would have full knowledge of the loaded dice. Now everyone knows. So it's a crooked game and everyone knows about the crooked game, double whammy to McStay.

km79

this has placed the new management under pressure already in my opinion

Defiler Of The Coffin

Due process should have been followed. McStay at the very least deserved an interview and a chance to pitch them his plan for Mayo football. Wasn't that how James Horan got the job?

Something was definitely off in the way that nominations were announced on Thursday followed by rumours leaking out all day on the Saturday, Mid West being disingenuously told at 6pm that no-one had been appointed, capped off by a rushed statement in the evening, implying that the Executive had given their blessing to the appointment when no such thing had happened. It's not how a serious set up should operate. We don't even know what the official structure is going to be.

It's clear that the higher ups in the County Board wanted Connelly and Holmes and that was that. It's not good enough and not fair on the incumbents.

Fowler87

km79 wrote: »

this has placed the new management under pressure already in my opinion

But in no fault to their own making which isnt fair to them. What a bunch of dinosaurs there are in the county board setup. Big cleanup needed. Question is who wants to get involved...?

jmayo

yop wrote: »

Have said it in many places already in this thread, I am not at all happy with the way its been done.

Fair enough.

yop wrote: »

This is Mayo county board, untouchable and answerable to now one, used it for the last 40 years, it never changes and unless someone figures out how this will be changed, then this wont be the last time this happens.

Maybe we need a Cork style revolt.
I know it is not nice and it can be very devisive, but it can force some changes.
Either that or a sponsor pulls the plug.

yop wrote: »

I can't say I wouldn't have been happy with McStay either, I didn't think McHale was the ideal man to be there though, so my preference was the Connelly/holmes partnership.

My worry about the Connelly/Holmes thing is that it appears to be a
joint management.
Joint management no more than management by committee can be a recipe for disaster.

yop wrote: »

We went through all this with the last appointment of O'Mahoney also, Moran was shafted back in 2006 due to a fallout with the board. So this has the same "smell" about it.
That said I think/hope that Connelly and Holmes can do a job, if they don't then we are back to square one again, like we were after O'Mahoney disastrous spell in 2007.

Unless there is a massive public backlash from Mayo GAA club members then this team will be ratified.

Look we all know it is a done deal.
But to an outsider, this just looks like more Mayo ineptitude.
Even worse they issued a complete and blatant lie as a press release which really should involve people stepping down.
But as you said this is the county board.
I reckon there will be some circling of the wagons and some form of mealy mouthed excuse for outside consumption.
But I have a feeling this whole episode is going to be dragged up in the future and some scores settled.

It is not the type of start anyone wants for any manager and it looks like the guys got it because of being in the tent pi**ing out rather than on merit.

I do think McStay deserved better.
I think he did have an inkling of what he was facing when he stated on the Sunday Game about the fact he would like to be considered and felt he was deserving of at least a call.

Well he got a call alright.
He was called to tell him to not bother showing up. :rolleyes:

Coillte_Bhoy

yop wrote: »

This is Mayo county board, untouchable and answerable to now one, used it for the last 40 years, it never changes and unless someone figures out how this will be changed, then this wont be the last time this happens.
.

Sensationalist nonsense, they are answerable to the full county board and can be challenged every year.

seligehgit

Trying not be too repetitive but the County Board have not covered themselves in glory.At the very least Kevin McStay deserved a fair shot at the job,what should the apparent hostility towards Liam McHale have to do with Kevin McStay's candidature.The next manager is not to be in situ to make friends on the County Board or players for that matter but rather to work with them to get that extra percent to win the All Ireland.It does appear to somebody like myself with no inside knowledge that the County Board got the appointment they seeked,none too convinced by the joint management concept...il duce.

The process was ridiculously hasty even if the argument stands that this was likely to be James Horan's last year,how likely is that if we'd brought back Sam?I highly doubt any preparations were made to put in a manager in place until quite some period of time post the Kerry replay.No proper review of the past 4 years.Truly admire that official that has resigned over this apparent sham.Agree with most posters that probably much separating the candidates but IMO Kevin McStay appears to be a good reader of the game which is what largely cost an All Ireland over the last few years.

Coillte_Bhoy

realweirdo wrote: »

There's too much doubt here. There's a doubt if Holmes can fully committ to the job. I have my doubts he can. There's a doubt who really is the number 1. There's a doubt who has the final say. There's a doubt if joint management works.

Sorry? What doubts are there and by whom? You're way out of order here if you cant back tha up

ColeTrain

I think the concern here is that the county board pushed through the appointment as quickly as they could without the agreed process being adhered to. Why was this?
Do they think Noel Connelly and Pat Holmes will be 'yes men' more so than McStay. Will Noel Connelly be inclined to keep the head down and not make ultimatums given that his brother is on the other side of the wall. It looks that way tbh.

What I can't understand is how they've managed to create such a **** storm. They could have interviewed McStay just to be seen to be doing the right thing and most of this could have been avoided. Bulls in a China shop.

Barlett

Well if they were just going to be 'yes men' why would they even bother with the job in the first place? The only reason they're taking it is because they believe they can do better.

Coillte_Bhoy

ColeTrain wrote: »

I think the concern here is that the county board pushed through the appointment as quickly as they could without the agreed process being adhered to. Why was this?
Do they think Noel Connelly and Pat Holmes will be 'yes men' more so than McStay. Will Noel Connelly be inclined to keep the head down and not make ultimatums given that his brother is on the other side of the wall. It looks that way tbh.

What I can't understand is how they've managed to create such a **** storm. They could have interviewed McStay just to be seen to be doing the right thing and most of this could have been avoided. Bulls in a China shop.

The two boys would have been ratified no bother so i just cant get my head around why it all ended up in such a mess, it makes no sense. I don't buy the line that they will be yes men either, i think thats very disrespectful to the two lads. From what ive heard McStay did have discussions with the co board if not an official interview as such./

ColeTrain

Barlett wrote: »

Well if they were just going to be 'yes men' why would they even bother with the job in the first place? The only reason they're taking it is because they believe they can do better.

You're looking at it from the wrong perspective - the county boards.

Coillte_Bhoy

Discussing it now on Off The Ball

Panrich

ColeTrain wrote: »

I think the concern here is that the county board pushed through the appointment as quickly as they could without the agreed process being adhered to. Why was this?
Do they think Noel Connelly and Pat Holmes will be 'yes men' more so than McStay. Will Noel Connelly be inclined to keep the head down and not make ultimatums given that his brother is on the other side of the wall. It looks that way tbh.

What I can't understand is how they've managed to create such a **** storm. They could have interviewed McStay just to be seen to be doing the right thing and most of this could have been avoided. Bulls in a China shop.

Something obviously happened after the Friday night meeting attended by Gerry Bourke and the other members of the executive that meant the interview process could not go ahead as planned.
While we can speculate (and it wouldn't take Columbo to come up with the likely reasons) we don't have all the facts in the public domain.
The most benign reading is that McStay pulled out himself but that doesn't explain the cloak and dagger approach taken by the county board that led to the resignation and anger.
This is a most unfortunate start for Connelly and Holmes and there will be some people that have been marginalised in this process who might be lurking in the long grass waiting for their opportunity to strike.
None of this is any good for Mayo GAA and the chairman and all concerned with this circumvention of process are totally and solely to blame and have proven themselves unworthy of the offices that they hold.

Coillte_Bhoy

Panrich wrote: »

Something obviously happened after the Friday night meeting attended by Gerry Bourke and the other members of the executive that meant the interview process could not go ahead as planned.
While we can speculate (and it wouldn't take Columbo to come up with the likely reasons) we don't have all the facts in the public domain.
The most benign reading is that McStay pulled out himself but that doesn't explain the cloak and dagger approach taken by the county board that led to the resignation and anger.
This is a most unfortunate start for Connelly and Holmes and there will be some people that have been marginalised in this process who might be lurking in the long grass waiting for their opportunity to strike.
None of this is any good for Mayo GAA and the chairman and all concerned with this circumvention of process are totally and solely to blame and have proven themselves unworthy of the offices that they hold.

McHale was interviewed there on OTB and McStay certainly didnt pull out

km79

Coillte_Bhoy wrote: »

McHale was interviewed there on OTB and McStay certainly didnt pull out

but he was encouraged to do so .....god what an embarrassing shambles.
Holmes and Connelly are blameless in this BUT will be under increased pressure and scrutiny from the get go now DISASTER

seligehgit

Sounds like the County Board Chairman will struggle to survive this fiasco,went on a solo run.Kevin McStay's proposals were too radical for the powers that be.Sounds like just what we needed!

Panrich

Coillte_Bhoy wrote: »

McHale was interviewed there on OTB and McStay certainly didnt pull out

Well there goes the benign reason and we're only left with the cloak and daggers.

Coillte_Bhoy

km79 wrote: »

but he was encouraged to do so .....god what an embarrassing shambles.
Holmes and Connelly are blameless in this BUT will be under increased pressure and scrutiny from the get go now DISASTER

Well thats McHales take on it, he's hardly an uninterested observer. A right mess allright but i dont think the lads will be under any extra pressure, there is a wave of goodwill behind them in the county. This row will blow over in a couple of weeks

Coillte_Bhoy

seligehgit wrote: »

Sounds like the County Board Chairman will struggle to survive this fiasco,went on a solo run.Kevin McStay's proposals were too radical for the powers that be.Sounds like just what we needed!

We didnt even hear what his proposals were for gods sake, how do you know they are what we need? Change for the sake of change isnt necessarily a good thing

Defiler Of The Coffin

The head honchos in the County board wanted Connelly and Holmes. Simple as. Only they bungled the whole scheme.

Liam McHale sounded dejected on air, saying he'll never be involved with Mayo again. His time will come though, if he really wants it.

Panrich

Defiler Of The Coffin wrote: »

The head honchos in the County board wanted Connelly and Holmes. Simple as. Only they bungled the whole scheme.

Liam McHale sounded dejected on air, saying he'll never be involved with Mayo again. His time will come though, if he really wants it.

Who in their right mind would deal with the chancers in charge of the Mayo county board after this?
They have to go en masse.

seligehgit

Defiler Of The Coffin wrote: »

The head honchos in the County board wanted Connelly and Holmes. Simple as. Only they bungled the whole scheme.

Liam McHale sounded dejected on air, saying he'll never be involved with Mayo again. His time will come though, if he really wants it.

Yes very sad,hopefully his time will come and he'll have a change of heart.Mentioned from 18 all he wanted to do was win an All Ireland with Mayo.When it did'nt happen for him as a player he'd love to have put it right via a management role.A Mayo man through and through speaking from the heart whatever his detractors say re his qualifications for such a role.

Coillte_Bhoy

Panrich wrote: »

Who in their right mind would deal with the chancers in charge of the Mayo county board after this?
They have to go en masse.

Oh don't be such a drama queen, they made a complete balls of it, no is one disputing that but no need to go ott, they are decent people who have the best interests of Mayo football at heart. If there is a groundswell of opinion against them they can be challenged at annual convention, that is if some of them havent resigned in the meantime

km79

Coillte_Bhoy wrote: »

Well thats McHales take on it, he's hardly an uninterested observer. A right mess allright but i dont think the lads will be under any extra pressure, there is a wave of goodwill behind them in the county. This row will blow over in a couple of weeks

he has come out on national radio and given a fairly detailed timeline of events.
I'd be inclined to believe him more than any spiel that will have to come from the county boars after Thursdays meeting

Panrich

Coillte_Bhoy wrote: »

Oh don't be such a drama queen, they made a complete balls of it, no is one disputing that but no need to go ott, they are decent people who have the best interests of Mayo football at heart. If there is a groundswell of opinion against them they can be challenged at annual convention, that is if some of them havent resigned in the meantime

No they did not make a balls of it. They have lied and bypassed an agreed process for their own ends. They have to go and anyone who defends them is as bad as themselves. Cronyism at it's worst has been exposed and you want to forgive and forget.