[2011-2012] What really happened to Madeleine McCann?

Ashbourne hoop

maximoose wrote: »

Are they really though? They looked pretty cosy in their box at Wembley the other day watching the football when if they weren't upper class doctors they'd probably (and rightly so) be in jail for negliglence.

Terrible thing to happen to the child, if it was an abduction (which the joint investigation by the portuguese and british police found zero evidence for) she's more than likely dead as she's far too high profile to be kept alive. There's always struck me as being much more to the case though.

All the football tickets in world wouldn't console anyone who has lost a child. Just because the police haven't found evidence (as yet) for an abduction doesn't mean it didn't happen.

Tomk1

I saw the Mc's on ITV this morning while changing channels. Their words were as you would expect, but the body language was just odd. Like if they had something to do with it, I can't understand why go on TV again? but as I said the body language just didn't seem right, cardboard like.

I am split down the middle, but still leaning to one/both of the parents knowing the truth.

The only other angle is that million € house which was rented to a reclusive group, in which photos of children were found on the walls.

maximoose

I'm just going to throw this in here too:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=72188785&postcount=1124

Best post I've seen on the subject highlighting the serious inconsistencies in the McCann/Tapas 7 stories, and evidence against the abductor theory.

Dontfadeaway

OldNotWIse wrote: »

I often wondered if she left the room herself looking for her parents and ended up falling into the sea or a drain or something?

I don't think she would've been able to open the door, they said the doors were closed and the gate outside too. Also they said the shutters and window was open, there was no way she would've been able to do that.

I don't like that Gerry compared where they were eating out to being the same as being in your back garden. I've seen the pictures and it looks far enough and from the pictures it doesn't look like they would have a clear view at night, and if they had to go back and listen at the windows to check if any of them was crying then it's too far.

When Kate noticed she was gone, instead of shouting from the balcony, she ran back to the table of friends to tell them, leaving the twins there. Was she too far away to shout?

If someone did take her, then they most likely came in the patio door, because i read the front door was locked and only opens with a key, so unless the person had a spare, then they couldn't have left that way.

I've seen pictures of the window and it's pretty low down and wide enough to climb in and out of, so it is possible they came in or left that way. It depends how much the shutters went up though.

Jane Tanner said she saw a man with a child walk across the road while she was on her way to check the kids. She would've walked right past the open window on her way to check the kids, how she did not see it open?

You do have to ask why Madeleine, why not one of the twins? or one of the the kids of the other 7 adults.

If she had an accident and the parents decided to hide the body, if so where? They had very little time to come up with a plan and get their story straight, and then put on an act like nothing happened. It's sad to think the parents could do such a thing, but i wouldn't rule it out. Alot of things don't add up, like the dogs. If the dogs found nothing in any of the other apartments, then i find it very odd that the one place they do, is in their place.

goat2

i am convinced she will be found alive, and also that she will have been well cared for, i would love to see a good psychic brought in on this case and give some positive clues,
i do hope that she is found shortly, or that who ever has her will just drop her off at a police station or hospital,

gbee

goat2 wrote: »

i am convinced she will be found alive, and also that she will have been well cared for, i would love to see a good psychic brought in on this case and give some positive clues,
i do hope that she is found shortly, or that who ever has her will just drop her off at a police station or hospital,

Precedents have already been set, the vast majority are never found and deathbed confessions often reveal how early on the victim's demise came.

A small percentage survive into adulthood where they have made stronger bonds with their abductor than their previous family and so seek no reunion.

A very small percentage survive into adulthood and escape or are discovered as adults.

Mediums have led a merry dance in this case already, tbh, you'd face more questions yourself as to your own involvement, if you accurately visioned the case.

maximoose

goat2 wrote: »

i am convinced she will be found alive, and also that she will have been well cared for, i would love to see a good psychic brought in on this case and give some positive clues,
i do hope that she is found shortly, or that who ever has her will just drop her off at a police station or hospital,

I really hope you are taking the piss.

RoboClam

"Good" psychics like Sylvia Browne? She performed wonders in that Shawn Hornbeck case after all.

Dontfadeaway

goat2 wrote: »

i am convinced she will be found alive, and also that she will have been well cared for, i would love to see a good psychic brought in on this case and give some positive clues,
i do hope that she is found shortly, or that who ever has her will just drop her off at a police station or hospital,

That ain't going to happen now, it's been too long. If someone did take her then i don't think she is dead either, but unless someone spots her, i don't think she will be found.

maebee

http://www.chelseahoffman.com/2012/05/who-killed-madeleine-mccann.html

goat2

im surprised that if this is the truth, that they turned down a polygraph test to prove they are innicent,
then again we are reading on that link the thoughts of someone who know about as much as us, it is all what we read,

i remember some time back a little girl who had been kidnapped she had been held in a back garden and had two children with her capotrs,
yet her stepdad had been blamed for her disappearance and was under some suspicion until she was found alive and well in another state.

so the experts got it wrong then, and of course they can get it wrong again, and in this case it is my openion that they are wrong,
kate and gerry mccanne would not be fighting to have this case opened and brought to the forefront if they were guilty of her disappearance, they would not be drawing attention to themselves and let things lie,
so i do think they are innocent

gbee

goat2 wrote: »

and brought to the forefront if they were guilty of her disappearance,

They are highly intelligent, educated and skilful people.

Dontfadeaway

Did anyone watch the video of Eddie (the dog) finding cuddle cat (madeleine's toy) in the apartment the Mccanns stayed at after Madeleine went missing? In the video he finds the toy and moves it, he doesn't bark. Later the toy is placed in a cupboard, then the dog barks.

Isn't that abit weird, also when he barks at the cupboard, instead of them opening the cupboard to show it is the toy, they move on to next room and then later came back to show it was the toy. I think the police found this odd aswell as i don't believe they tested the toy for DNA at the time.

I agree with what Gbee said above, but even so, it would be very hard not to slip up or crack under pressure.

Tigger

Tom Cruise wrote: »

I would never leave kids in a apartment on holidays while i get drunk.

laid not drunk

the whole x checked on y is a cover for the fact they were playing swinger games and the kid died cos everybody was busy

then she got put in a fridge and the rest is history

Sappa

Those sniffer dogs got a funny whiff from the mccanns car boot and went beserk,why won't they take a polygraph.
I followed this case 5 yrs ago and I still firmly believe the parents know what happened to her.

OldNotWIse

goat2 wrote: »

like you, i would never have left my children unattended for even five minuits in my home, there is not a hope i would leave them unsupervised (sleeping or not) in another country while i would step out even for a moment, but that does not take from the fact, that it was wrong for someone to take anothers child

Good point. I think we all know that it was wrong to leave the children, but it was also wrong to abduct one of them (cue an hysterical onslaught of "if they didn't leave them, she would still be here) - true...but if someone hadn't abducted her she would er...also still be here. The way some people go on, you'd swear that the kidnapper was practically justified in taking her. Just because she was left alone, does not absolve the abductor of his or her crime.

maebee

OldNotWIse wrote: »

Good point. I think we all know that it was wrong to leave the children, but it was also wrong to abduct one of them (cue an hysterical onslaught of "if they didn't leave them, she would still be here) - true...but if someone hadn't abducted her she would er...also still be here. The way some people go on, you'd swear that the kidnapper was practically justified in taking her. Just because she was left alone, does not absolve the abductor of his or her crime.

The thing is, there is no evidence whatsoever of an abductor or kidnapper. This was the opinion of the Portuguese and British police.

OldNotWIse

maebee wrote: »

The thing is, there is no evidence whatsoever of an abductor or kidnapper. This was the opinion of the Portuguese and British police.

Can evidence (or lack thereof) really be relied upon when the crime scene was so badly preserved?

We are all entitled to our opinions and theories of course. I have never believed the conspiracy theories that her parents were involved. I think she was either snatched by a sick predator and was dead within 24 hours of the abduction, or she wandered out looking for parents and drowned.

Tomk1

Sappa wrote: »

Those sniffer dogs got a funny whiff from the mccanns car boot and went beserk,why won't they take a polygraph.
I followed this case 5 yrs ago and I still firmly believe the parents know what happened to her.

Just read 'The Truth of the Lie' this is an absolute must read.

Wasn't just a funny whiff, one dog Eddie specifically for detecting human cadaver odour detected it inside the car boot, the other dog Keela trained to detect Human blood, indicated blood on the floor of the boot and on the key, blood samples were taken. This basically says there was a dead Human body was in the boot of the car, this car was rented by the Mc's from the 27th of May, 3 weeks after Maddie 'disapeared' ?

A substantial amount of hair found in the boot at the time couldn't be tested, but today the Lab-technology can, if tested and found to be Maddies, the mystery ends.

The bedroom abduction? window was cleaned by staff on the 2nd of May, and the only prints & palmprint found on the window belong to Kate, no sign of gloves used, even if the child was abducted then the abductor would have left the same way they accessed the Apt. Only one person opened that window and it wasn't Jane's man/woman George-Harrison/unibomber phantom.

Even apart from the car, there's a funny whiff from behind the coach, the wardrobe in the parents room, some of Kate's clothes and poor Cuddle-cat even after being washed.

OldNotWIse

Tomk1 wrote: »

Just read 'The Truth of the Lie' this is an absolute must read.

Wasn't just a funny whiff, one dog Eddie specifically for detecting human cadaver odour detected it inside the car boot, the other dog Keela trained to detect Human blood, indicated blood on the floor of the boot and on the key, blood samples were taken. This basically says there was a dead Human body was in the boot of the car, this car was rented by the Mc's from the 27th of May, 3 weeks after Maddie 'disapeared' ?

A substantial amount of hair found in the boot at the time couldn't be tested, but today the Lab-technology can, if tested and found to be Maddies, the mystery ends.

The bedroom abduction? window was cleaned by staff on the 2nd of May, and the only prints & palmprint found on the window belong to Kate, no sign of gloves used, even if the child was abducted then the abductor would have left the same way they accessed the Apt. Only one person opened that window and it wasn't Jane's man/woman George-Harrison/unibomber phantom.

Even apart from the car, there's a funny whiff from behind the coach, the wardrobe in the parents room, some of Kate's clothes and poor Cuddle-cat even after being washed.

So where did they hide the body for 3 weeks?

Dontfadeaway

Tomk1 wrote: »

Just read 'The Truth of the Lie' this is an absolute must read.

Wasn't just a funny whiff, one dog Eddie specifically for detecting human cadaver odour detected it inside the car boot, the other dog Keela trained to detect Human blood, indicated blood on the floor of the boot and on the key, blood samples were taken. This basically says there was a dead Human body was in the boot of the car, this car was rented by the Mc's from the 27th of May, 3 weeks after Maddie 'disapeared' ?

A substantial amount of hair found in the boot at the time couldn't be tested, but today the Lab-technology can, if tested and found to be Maddies, the mystery ends.

The bedroom abduction? window was cleaned by staff on the 2nd of May, and the only prints & palmprint found on the window belong to Kate, no sign of gloves used, even if the child was abducted then the abductor would have left the same way they accessed the Apt. Only one person opened that window and it wasn't Jane's man/woman George-Harrison/unibomber phantom.

Even apart from the car, there's a funny whiff from behind the coach, the wardrobe in the parents room, some of Kate's clothes and poor Cuddle-cat even after being washed.

Only Kate's fingerprints were found on the inside, what about the outside? There was partial/unidentified prints on the shutters and patio doors.

I don't think an abducter would leave the same way if he came in the patio doors. I think you can open the main door from the inside.

goat2

who wrote that book, ( the truth of the lie)
i will never beleive that the parents had anything to do with their daughters disappearance,
i beleive they could not keep up pretence for a year, never mind five years since she went missing

Mr. Presentable

goat2 wrote: »

who wrote that book, ( the truth of the lie)
i will never beleive that the parents had anything to do with their daughters disappearance,
i beleive they could not keep up pretence for a year, never mind five years since she went missing

Ah, that's that then.

foxshooter243

OldNotWIse wrote: »

So where did they hide the body for 3 weeks?

Im not going to get heavily involved in this thread, but will say this, ive studied everything to do with this case, the portugese police know that the body was hidden in the garden of a disused house, the Irish family that spotted gerry mc cann carrying the dead child gave him away, he then put the body into the garden of the disused house and hid it in the undergrowth..later on in the early hours of the following morning , gerry and kate moved the body and were spotted by a passing motorist carrying the child , the body was hidden probably on a boat for a few weeks before being moved in the rental car..the dogs evidence was good!

goat2

foxshooter243 wrote: »

Im not going to get heavily involved in this thread, but will say this, ive studied everything to do with this case, the portugese police know that the body was hidden in the garden of a disused house, the Irish family that spotted gerry mc cann carrying the dead child gave him away, he then put the body into the garden of the disused house and hid it in the undergrowth..later on in the early hours of the following morning , gerry and kate moved the body and were spotted by a passing motorist carrying the child , the body was hidden probably on a boat for a few weeks before being moved in the rental car..the dogs evidence was good!

have they got dna evidence to prove that the mccannes were in that place you say the child was lain disused house,
and i am sure the smell of rotting flesh would have brought attention to the boat, as you say it was there for a few weeks and think about, scorching weather body in boad for a few weeks, and if they did go back for said body which in that heat was cooked, where did they put their child,

it does not add up

foxshooter243

goat2 wrote: »

have they got dna evidence to prove that the mccannes were in that place you say the child was lain disused house,
and i am sure the smell of rotting flesh would have brought attention to the boat, as you say it was there for a few weeks and think about, scorching weather body in boad for a few weeks, and if they did go back for said body which in that heat was cooked, where did they put their child,

it does not add up

As said im not getting involved in this thread, I spent several months investigating this case, the evidence is out there go look it up for yourself.

Jesus Wept

foxshooter243 wrote: »

As said im not getting involved in this thread, I spent several months investigating this case, the evidence is out there go look it up for yourself.

In what capacity were you investigating this case?

david75

My ex's sister was on holiday in Turkey and went missing. She was abducted and held in a house in the middle of nowhere being pimped out and raped daily. this went on for three months. She'd still be there only someone reported it. Now she was an adult. This kid wandered out of the apartment and was abducted. That's all there is to it in my view. There's no body and one definitely would have been found by now had she been killed. making a child disappear completely is a lot easier than a body, which will eventually be found.

gnfnrhead

goat2 wrote: »

have they got dna evidence to prove that the mccannes were in that place you say the child was lain disused house,
and i am sure the smell of rotting flesh would have brought attention to the boat, as you say it was there for a few weeks and think about, scorching weather body in boad for a few weeks, and if they did go back for said body which in that heat was cooked, where did they put their child,

it does not add up

Could have been put into a cooler of some sort. I'm guessing she was an average sized kid. Wouldnt be too hard to put the body in a cooler. It would delay the decay a good bit too. Body could have been dumped in the ocean then for all we know. Carried off by the tide or eaten by whatever fish inhabit the area it ended up in. Bodies (or even bones) sometimes dont turn up for 20 or 30 years. It's foolish to think that because a body hasent turned up within 5, she must be still alive.

OldNotWIse

foxshooter243 wrote: »

Im not going to get heavily involved in this thread, but will say this, ive studied everything to do with this case, the portugese police know that the body was hidden in the garden of a disused house, the Irish family that spotted gerry mc cann carrying the dead child gave him away, he then put the body into the garden of the disused house and hid it in the undergrowth..later on in the early hours of the following morning , gerry and kate moved the body and were spotted by a passing motorist carrying the child , the body was hidden probably on a boat for a few weeks before being moved in the rental car..the dogs evidence was good!

Oh...ok then...gawd what paper do you read? I never get that much information from mine