Are you overweight? Check the facts and you could win €100

Darragh

Hello there

There's a TV advertisement running at the moment that has got a lot of attention, including a thread in the Nutrition & Diet forum.

It's an ad for safefood as part of their "Stop the Spread" campaign, tackling what they call the "overweight and obesity epidemic"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YarpWrLn9Zo

Two in 3 people on the island of Ireland are carrying excess weight, yet only 38% recognise they have a weight problem.

That means a great proportion of the population are in denial, putting themselves at increased risk of well known diseases such as heart disease, diabetes and some cancers.

This campaign issues a wake up call, asking people to take a hard look at themselves, to find out their own waist measurement, and to "stop the spread".

Stop the Spread is an awareness campaign to alert people that being overweight is now the ‘norm’, has become visually and socially acceptable and that we no longer recognise the fact that we are carrying extra weight. The campaign’s call to action is urging people to measure their waist to see if they are overweight.



You can find out more on the website, follow us on twitter or see our Facebook page.

safefood would like you to watch this video - it's less than 2 minutes long and has lots in it that might make you think – like did you know that a 14 year old boy today weighs on average 3 stone heavier than his grandfather at the same age?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2p53C33MO_0

and then they'd like you to post your response as a comment below.

Do you believe it? Are you shocked by it? Are you worried about your weight? Do you think more people should be?

We'd like to hear your comments and get your feedback.

In addition, Dermot from safefood will be answering your (relevant) questions or queries on this thread.

We'll run this thread until June 30. At the end of the thread, the members who post the most interesting comments on the video or on the campaign will be rewarded with a €100 One4All voucher.

All comments will be read and judged by myself, by safefood and with the help of the forum moderators and judged on insight, originality and really just how good a comment it is.

I look forward with considerable interest to reading them.

There is another thread for discussing the science behind the campaign - this one should be just about what you see in the video please

Darragh

Hanley

*grabs popcorn (low fat, non-salted variety of course)

This thread is going to get interesting… There’s a lot of members here who probably think that BMI/measurements don’t apply to them because it doesn’t take account of muscle mass, or because they’re not “average”, but the simple fact of the matter is that for the majority of the population, BMI and waist measurement is a good indicator.

I applaud the guys in charge of the campaign for giving people an easy to use metric against which to asses themselves.

For the record, I've gone from a waist > 41 inches in mid 2009, to 32.5 inches in 2011.

zero19

Very informative video, i had to laugh at the part where he said TV's have gotten smaller while we have gotten bigger!

It's scary to think that a 14 year old boy today weighs on average 3 stone heavier than his grandfather at the same age though, i can't get over that.

phil1nj

So a 14 year year old today is on average three stone heavier than his grandfather was at the same age? fair enough, what's the average difference in height between the 2 generations? What was a typical grandparents diet like comapred with a 14 year old today?

I have real issues with the BMI because it over simplifies the box that we are suppossed to fit in to. I'm technically obese based on my BMI despite the fact that I run 3 miles every other day. I weigh 15 stone, am 5ft 8in height and have a 46in chest . I have a fairly large waist measurement (it fluctuates between 38 to 36 inches depending on the time of year). If I were to hit my ideal weight (140lbs) I'd look pretty sickly compared to how I look now.

Whilst I don't disagree with the fact that there is a problem in general with weight gain I do tend to take any and all arguments made using the BMI with a fairly healthy grain of (sea) salt.

chin_grin

Post a response here or on the youtube video? (ah the internet where everything can be commented on :pac:).

I think it's a slightly dangerous campaign in that it's only recently that the whole anorexia debate was raging on how there are specific groups to help young people not eat!

If this is going to make people more aware of avoiding bad fats and processed foods then I'm all for it. But why can't they take the size issue out of it? Eat, but eat healthily (as organic as possible) and then resulting from that you'll lose weight and feel more energetic.

EDIT: Obviously coupled with an exercise regime...........! (facepalm)

Women are bombarded with weight loss ads (special K to name.....er...one....oh and that one about yer one trying on jeans in a nightmare can't think of the name of the products!). I think the same advertising technique should be geared towards men.

g'em

Hi Dermot

By and large I think this is a great campaign to be running - while I think most people are aware that being overweight isn't a good thing, the boundaries of what constitues 'overweight' are not easily defined and a simple waist measurement gives people an easily measurable guiding point to start out with.

A couple of things though. Since it's launch there have been accusations that the use of terms like "spread" and "catching" in the campaign gives an undertone of a disease-like quality to being overweight and ergo there's an element of dirtiness to it. Was this intentional or was it something that you'd considered?

And second, do you think that the information provided in the public realm about "healthy eating" is really adequate to help support those people who are trying to lsoe weight? I've read a lot of the healthy eating guidelines given on the safefood.eu website and in all honesty they are largely outdated and somewhat misleading e.g. using the old (defunct) food pyramid model, cooking with vegetable oils etc.

Are you confident that the information provided is really the best advice that could be given to people trying to lose weight?

safefood: Dermot

Hi phil1nj and good question - the researchers did find significant increases in height and weight in both boys and girls and in all age groups across the decades. However, the increases in weight were disproportionate to the trends in height. Kg. A substantial proportion of the increase in weight was seen between 1970’s and 2002.

If you're interested, the research is called "The Heights and Weights of Irish Children from the Postwar Era to the Celtic Tiger" by Perry IJ1;Whelton H 2;Harrington J1;Cousins B. (2009)

Well done on the running too.

Darragh

chin_grin wrote: »

Post a response here or on the youtube video? (ah the internet where everything can be commented on :pac:).

Right here - I've clarified that in the thread

Quandary

phil1nj wrote: »

So a 14 year year old today is on average three stone heavier than his grandfather was at the same age? fair enough, what's the average difference in height between the 2 generations? What was a typical grandparents diet like comapred with a 14 year old today?

I think it's safe to assume the average difference in height between a teenager today and a teenager from 2 generations will be a measure of inches. I can't imagine the difference would be more than a couple of inches (based on some brief google powered research :pac:)

A weight increase of an average of 3 stone is staggering though, I don't think this can really be dressed up any way to disguise the fact that people are simply consuming too much food.

Hanley

Quandary wrote: »

I think it's safe to assume the average difference in height between a teenager today and a teenager from 2 generations will be a measure of inches. I can't imagine the difference would be more than a couple of inches (based on some brief google powered research :pac:)

A weight increase of an average of 3 stone is staggering though, I don't think this can really be dressed up any way to disguise the fact that people are simply consuming too much food.

It amazes me the length people will go to to justify their weight. There's been some classic examples in this thread already - "it's ok that my BMI is high because I run" and "yeah sure they're heavier but there's probably another reason other than just eating too much food".

Dieting and weightloss is all about personal responsibility. There's a lot of misinformation out there as to what consitutes a "good" diet (ie the food pyramid), but ultimately people don't seem to be able to break the habits and routines they've formed to allow for weight loss.

phil1nj

Quandary wrote: »

A weight increase of an average of 3 stone is staggering though, I don't think this can really be dressed up any way to disguise the fact that people are simply consuming too much food.

I agree that people today are consuming more food than is necessary. I also think that there is a lot more useful information being made available about what foods people should be taking in moderation (the adverts regarding daily salt intake for one spring to mind).

The reason for my interest in this thread was due to the fact that I have a 15 year old son and my dad is also still with us. I can compare the foods that are/were being consumed by each generation. My dad was never a big man (as in heavy) He was fairly active but his diet when he was younger was shocking - fried soda bread covered in salt was one of his favorite breakfast meals (not uncommon for people of that age). There was never any warnings about salt intake and the only adverts I can remember from the TV why I was yonger (I'm 38) were PSA type ones warning people about being unfit (some woman running for a bus and being out of breath etc). Meals were pretty bland as well (meat, two veg, the odd salad). No pasta or rice or wholegrains.

My son on the other hand has a fairly balanced diet (we try to ensure that the majority of meals are home cooked). He is also signicantly taller than his grandfather was/is but there is no denying that he is heavier. I think this is down to the different lifestyles that both pursued. My dad was working full time when he was 16, my son is still in school and would have a much greater choice of sedentary pastimes (games consoles, internet etc) in addition to his sports activities.

Education is the key in my opinion but the availability and over dependence on junk and poor food needs to be looked at as well.

Hanley

Here's some points I just made in relation to another thread about why just doing more cardio isn't the answer - It was in relation to the calorie consumption of professional cyclists and how lean they are...

"Lets not go crazy here… how many hours a day did Pantani train for? Elite athletes burn far more calories at a given heart rate than average folks do, and they can sustain the effort for longer.

It’s like saying ‘go for a swim’ cos Phelps eats 12,000kcals a day and is as lean as anything.

Pantani’s riding what, 4-6 hours a day 6 days a week maybe? There’s no way an average person has the time or work capacity to do that. It’s especially not relevant given GarlicMayo’s case as he seems to be exercising quite a bit already and not making any progress. Some simple refinements to his diet, an increase in protein, decrease in carbs and increase in healthy fats would on top of the high level of work he’s already doing would put him in a great position for weight loss.

Lyle McDonald has an INCREDIBLY interesting series of articles called ‘Training the obese beginner’ - the 6 parts are almost long enough to make an ebook, but I recommend everyone takes an hour or two to read them. The primary points he makes are:

1) You don’t want to do something to discourage the person as they start (ie work them too hard and have them quit)

2) In obese and over weight people their metabolic pathways are so f*cked from eating a high level of process carbs and sugar that they just aren’t capable of burning fat effectively

3) HIIT, complicated weight programs and all that jazz we love on here isn’t needed if you’re dialing in diet and getting frequent moderate intensity work in.

A lot of what he says in the articles are fairly closely aligned with what Sisson says in The Primal Blueprint. They’re just not as fanatical or dogmatic. If I get time over the weekend I’ll re-read them all and try to put them in a succinct set of bullet points.

Here’s a link to the first part for anyone who wants to read - http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/training-the-obese-beginner.html"

phil1nj

Hanley wrote: »

There's been some classic examples in this thread already - "it's ok that my BMI is high because I run" and "yeah sure they're heavier but there's probably another reason other than just eating too much food".

Keep it friendly there Hanley! The BMI is simply not suitable for everyone. The majority of the Irish Rugby team are technically obese despite the fact that they would leave most non-over weight people standing when it comes to the fitness stakes. Looking at someone who is not over weight does not automatically mean that they have a great diet and are physically active. Just as looking at someone who is deemed to be over weight doesn't mean that that person does not partake in excercise and does not have a pretty good diet as well. Sweeping generalizations don't help anyone.

8 years ago I had a 33 inch waist, I ate three healthy meals a day (no junk) excerised 6 days a week and my weight never went below 14 stone. I was still technically obese when going through the various charts and BMI websites that are out there. The only way I could lose any more weight was to have a limb amputated so calm there please.

safefood: Dermot

g'em wrote: »

Hi Dermot

A couple of things though. Since it's launch there have been accusations that the use of terms like "spread" and "catching" in the campaign gives an undertone of a disease-like quality to being overweight and ergo there's an element of dirtiness to it. Was this intentional or was it something that you'd considered?

And second, do you think that the information provided in the public realm about "healthy eating" is really adequate to help support those people who are trying to lsoe weight? I've read a lot of the healthy eating guidelines given on the safefood.eu website and in all honesty they are largely outdated and somewhat misleading e.g. using the old (defunct) food pyramid model, cooking with vegetable oils etc.

Are you confident that the information provided is really the best advice that could be given to people trying to lose weight?

Hi g'em and thanks for your comments.
On the ad, we're trying to begin to address an effect known as "social contagion" where people spend time together, eat similar foods and undertake similar amounts of physical activity - there's research which shows that amongst adult siblings, if one sibling became obese, the chance that the other would become obese increased by 40%.

On the health information, there is work currently underway on both the food pyramid and a new national nutrition policy. But the fundamentals still apply - more lean meat, more fruit & veg, more wholegrains, be aware of your salt intake and portion sizes, get to know food labels, try to be more physically active....it's adopting smaller changes over time that can hopefully make a difference!

phil1nj

Hanley wrote: »

1) You don’t want to do something to discourage the person as they start (ie work them too hard and have them quit)

2) In obese and over weight people their metabolic pathways are so f*cked from eating a high level of process carbs and sugar that they just aren’t capable of burning fat effectively

3) HIIT, complicated weight programs and all that jazz we love on here isn’t needed if you’re dialing in diet and getting frequent moderate intensity work in.

The first point is the one I would agree with 100%. I've seen people who have joined gyms determined to undo the damage from weight gain over the years only to be put off because the fitness program give to them was totally unrealistic at the point in time.

The weight didn't go on over night so it ain't coming off over night either. Plus the fact, as has been said already physicaly excerise goes hand in hand with diet if people want to get back on track.

Cookie_Monster

I like no5 "Overweight spreads"

Run faster or it'll get you too

The core problem here is education, or lack of it IMO. Schools do not teach nutrition as a subject, PE is sidelined as you get older and hence people tend to go for the quicker, cheaper, easier foods like ready meals which are worse for you, of course there are plenty of other factors but I think this is a key long term one.

It would take a fairly long time but a subject, lets say home economics, being compulsory all the way through school that deals with food, nutrition, personal fitness, personal finance, would have a large positive impact on Irish society.

For the record I finally got off my fat ass this year and have lost 4kg so far by cycling 3,700km to date. I don't think I'd be considered overweight any more but I still feel it and want to remove the tyre around my waist. 178cm, 26 years old, 84.5kg and back down to a 34 waist.


In terms of the campaign, what are the goals apart from getting people to realise the issue?
Are they going to promote any particular initiate or lobby for gov policy on specific issues (like the education side, or getting companies to reduce levels of X in their products etc)
I can't watch the video in work but the website does seem a little vague a the moment on actions to take and such like to actually stop the spread

LEH

phil1nj wrote: »

Keep it friendly there Hanley! The BMI is simply not suitable for everyone. The majority of the Irish Rugby team are technically obese despite the fact that they would leave most non-over weight people standing when it comes to the fitness stakes. Looking at someone who is not over weight does not automatically mean that they have a great diet and are physically active. Just as looking at someone who is deemed to be over weight doesn't mean that that person does not partake in excercise and does not have a pretty good diet as well. Sweeping generalizations don't help anyone.

8 years ago I had a 33 inch waist, I ate three healthy meals a day (no junk) excerised 6 days a week and my weight never went below 14 stone. I was still technically obese when going through the various charts and BMI websites that are out there. The only way I could lose any more weight was to have a limb amputated so calm there please.

While I fully agree with your post about BMI not applying to everyone (specifically athletes and people who excercise a lot/are very active), this campaign is obviously aimed at the general public who tend to excercise a good bit less than the recommended 30 minutes a day, 5 times a week. So in this respect, it is an excellent easily quantifiable way for the average joe to check if he or she is unaware or in denial about their weight/health, as others have pointed out what's considered fat and skinny is all relative!

It should be seen as basic barometer, not a definite diagnosis! Something this simplistic could never be a one size fits all measurement. The Irish Rugby team are not your average punter in terms of eating/excercise, so it is clear to me that BMI/waist size etc would be a little skewed for someone of their activity level, but about right for the average Irish person...

safefood: Dermot

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

I like no5 "Overweight spreads"

In terms of the campaign, what are the goals apart from getting people to realise the issue?
Are they going to promote any particular initiate or lobby for gov policy on specific issues (like the education side, or getting companies to reduce levels of X in their products etc)
I can't watch the video in work but the website does seem a little vague a the moment on actions to take and such like to actually stop the spread

Well done on the cycling Cookie Monster..impressive!

With this campaign, right now we're just trying to get more people aware that excess weight affects more and more of us and that we need to start addressing that urgently. If people become more aware and want to do something, we've also got a weight-loss resource on our website called "weigh2live".

safefood can't lobby on gov policy but we work in partnership with others where possible - we've just finished a healthy recipe competition for secondary school students and got 900+ entries - I was at the finals and the food was superb! We also have an education resource for primary kids called "Tastebuds" teaching them about their food, where it comes from and healthy eating. We've met with the food industry and are open to working with them.

It's fair to say this issue needs a combined approach across lots of different sectors for a sustained period to have an impact - education, transport, planning, retail, etc...

Hanley

phil1nj wrote: »

Keep it friendly there Hanley! The BMI is simply not suitable for everyone. The majority of the Irish Rugby team are technically obese despite the fact that they would leave most non-over weight people standing when it comes to the fitness stakes. Looking at someone who is not over weight does not automatically mean that they have a great diet and are physically active. Just as looking at someone who is deemed to be over weight doesn't mean that that person does not partake in excercise and does not have a pretty good diet as well. Sweeping generalizations don't help anyone.

8 years ago I had a 33 inch waist, I ate three healthy meals a day (no junk) excerised 6 days a week and my weight never went below 14 stone. I was still technically obese when going through the various charts and BMI websites that are out there. The only way I could lose any more weight was to have a limb amputated so calm there please.

I’m being perfectly friendly, I’m stating facts and you’re just reinforcing my point. No one is talking about the Irish rugby team, no one is talking about pro athletes, we’re talking about AVERAGE people - the 90+% of folks in this country. I’m border line obese with abs and body fat of around 10%, so I know where you’re coming from But the fact remains - BMI is a good estimate for the majority of the population.

“I read on the internet that BMI doesn’t matter if you lift weights” is a complete cop out for the vast majority of people who are gym members but still display large amounts of central adiposity. Trying to justify it as being a result of weight training is nothing more than kidding oneself. I can think of a few people right now who I’d be friends with that use the same excuse even tho they’re fat.

Give me a line up of 50 people picked randomly off the street who are obese by the BMI scale and I can damn near guarantee at least 45 of them won’t display a significant amount of muscle mass which would skew their BMI readings, and even for the small majority that may, their body fat percentage would almost certainly not be in ‘healthy’ range.

As for “skinny = healthy”, I totally agree on your point there. I’d rather see a slightly above weight guy with a good level of strength and cardiovascular fitness than a skinny dude who eats nothing but maccyd’s.

SeaSide

For a 30 second TV or radio ad you are only ever really going to be able to transmit one maybe two messages so as far as the ad goes it works and it gets people on Joe Duffy talking. The ad would fail if you started introducing a stream of caveats to the main message.

From observation weight gain is pretty contagious not just in the family but also in a social circle (and the same is true for weight loss).

Some of the figures are not relevant such as the change in weight between grandparents and grandchildren particularly as heights have changed dramatically in the intervening years. My daughter is likely to overtake her grandmother by the age of nine for instance.

If you want to make a difference you have to make it easy and give rewards. I always thought that your life insurance or health insurance company should give you a kickback if you kept within certain targets.

In terms of making it easier its probably the little casual unnoticed bits of exercise that could initially have the greatest impact. I would love to see what a longitudinal study of the impact on health of the Dublin Bikes project will show.

Cookie_Monster

Thanks for the reply Dermot.

Blatter

safefood: Dermot wrote: »

Hi g'em and thanks for your comments.
On the ad, we're trying to begin to address an effect known as "social contagion" where people spend time together, eat similar foods and undertake similar amounts of physical activity - there's research which shows that amongst adult siblings, if one sibling became obese, the chance that the other would become obese increased by 40%.

On the health information, there is work currently underway on both the food pyramid and a new national nutrition policy. But the fundamentals still apply - more lean meat, more fruit & veg, more wholegrains, be aware of your salt intake and portion sizes, get to know food labels, try to be more physically active....it's adopting smaller changes over time that can hopefully make a difference!

Hi Dermot, out of interest, what are your own personal views(and Safefood's views) on saturated fat and it's relationship with obesity and disease?

SeanMadd

Hard to believe but it's true! A new supermacs just opened up in my area and everyone my age is raving about it. Most people will go and get a bag of chips after school each day for study, but if they saw how much they were eating in a week - sick! Obviously more people need to start eating more healthy, but how can exercise be promoted? Many are much too lazy to even go for a walk! I hope the number of obese people in Ireland decreases within the next few years, it's sad to think we're becoming a 'bigger' island.

El_Dangeroso

safefood: Dermot wrote: »

On the health information, there is work currently underway on both the food pyramid and a new national nutrition policy. But the fundamentals still apply - more lean meat, more fruit & veg, more wholegrains, be aware of your salt intake and portion sizes, get to know food labels, try to be more physically active....it's adopting smaller changes over time that can hopefully make a difference!

Hi Dermot,

First of all thanks for engaging us on this thread, I do think the campaign is an important first step in raising awareness of this growing problem.

On the dietary recommendations, are you aware that there is a large balance of evidence now that shows that there is no advantage of lean meat over fatty from a health point of view. The latest analysis by Harvard researcher Ron Krauss is the most comprehensive review to date:

http://www.ajcn.org/content/91/3/535.short

Not only is the recommendation to avoid saturated fat outdated, it was never based upon sound evidence to begin with.

Also, there is no evidence that increasing fruit and vegetables prevents any disease. People who eat lots of fruit and vegetables tend to be healthier generally, but they also do lot of other things to stay healthy at the same time. Controlled trials in this area have yielded very disappointing results.

In my opinion, if you really want to make a difference to the weight of the nation, start looking at strategies to prevent the marketing and availability of junk food to children, because if you think this generation is overweight..

safefood: Dermot

SOCCER4LIFE wrote: »

Hi Dermot, out of interest, what are your own personal views(and Safefood's views) on saturated fat and it's relationship with obesity and disease?

Personally, I don't know one fat from another so asked a colleague who does.

She told me that there's a clear association between saturated fat and heart disease and at a population level, our intakes of sat fat are well above what is recommended.

And because she got me thinking, I asked her what the primary sources of it are...and it's meat and meat products, dairy foods, cakes, biscuits and confectionary...basically what I would eat.

To reduce your consumption of this fat, you can choose leaner cuts of meats, lower-fat versions of dairy and try to limit the cakes, biccies and sweets; sorry if this is depressing reading on a wet Friday!

MarkR

Oh Bother. Both me and my tv are widescreen, covered in peanut butter fingerprints, and a source of entertainment for my son!

Look Mom, I'm in 3D! *waves*

Hanley

safefood: Dermot wrote: »

Personally, I don't know one fat from another so asked a colleague who does.

She told me that there's a clear association between saturated fat and heart disease and at a population level, our intakes of sat fat are well above what is recommended.

Maybe El_dangeroso can chime in here, but I'm pretty sure that was disproven in the framingham study.

There may be a correlation between saturated fat intake and heart disease, but it doesn't imply causation.

magnumlady

It is shocking and I hope it does something to change the eating habits of the nation because that's what needs to happen.

We live in a 'fast food' society but people need to think that fruit and veg are also fast foods and a lot better for you.

I think the schools should encourage not only healthy eating but also exercise. Why not give each child a pedometer to encourage them to walk and if they complete a certain number of steps a week then they get a night off homework. Or something along those lines.

I think a good way to look at food is 'If your Granny wouldn't have known it was food then don't eat it'.

Eric Cartman

While i applaud what this campaign is trying to do i just have to say the facts are a little off , first of all the grandad comment, - what was the height of the grandad vs his grandson at age 14 , what were his parents economic situation ? A big one that people forget is , in the 40s lots of people who didnt have enough to feed their kids , weve gone from mal nourishment to over feeding.

Another thing is, while obesity is definitley preventable and doesnt just 'happen' , being a little overweight is a common part of our society because we now have people doing shift work , people working nights and sleeping during the day , jobs where people spend 95% of their day at a desk , for these its quite hard to allocate a lot of time for exercise or eating right ,and while its no excuse for being heavily overweight / obese it certainly gives a little leeway to being a little overweight

Id also love to see some safe food ads about bullemia and the dangers of trying to be stick thin , this is just as bad as being obese but im aware its mostly an issue for teenage girls

safefood: Dermot

El_Dangeroso wrote: »

Hi Dermot,

First of all thanks for engaging us on this thread, I do think the campaign is an important first step in raising awareness of this growing problem.

On the dietary recommendations, are you aware that there is a large balance of evidence now that shows that there is no advantage of lean meat over fatty from a health point of view. The latest analysis by Harvard researcher Ron Krauss is the most comprehensive review to date:

http://www.ajcn.org/content/91/3/535.short

Not only is the recommendation to avoid saturated fat outdated, it was never based upon sound evidence to begin with.

Also, there is no evidence that increasing fruit and vegetables prevents any disease. People who eat lots of fruit and vegetables tend to be healthier generally, but they also do lot of other things to stay healthy at the same time. Controlled trials in this area have yielded very disappointing results.

In my opinion, if you really want to make a difference to the weight of the nation, start looking at strategies to prevent the marketing and availability of junk food to children, because if you think this generation is overweight..

Thanks El Dangeroso, I'll gladly bring these points up with my colleagues in our nutrition team.

Parents can also make a big impact on their children's food habits through positive role-modelling (I know myself how hard that one is too!) Even something like eating at the table, not in front of the TV, is a good start - when we last surveyed parents about this, almost 20% ate in front of the TV with their kids more than 4 times a week.

Sorry, I wandered off topic...we're hoping this campaign will make adults more aware about their weight and begin to address it.

cc87

safefood: Dermot wrote: »

Sorry, I wandered off topic...we're hoping this campaign will make adults more aware about their weight and begin to address it.

The problem with this is that by the time many of todays teenagers are adults, they will be knee deep in all sorts of metabolic problems, overweight and lacking in the knowledge of how it happened or how to fix it.

If they go to a doctor with various complaints, there is a strong chance medication will be involved in the solution.

The general publics knowledge is sorely limited to various fad diets and poor exercise regimes and many of the current recommendations for nutrition are lacking concrete evidence to support them.

Il try and find it later i get a chance, but the journal "Nutrition" published an article last year sometime about the US food recommendations, basically saying they havent changed since the 70s and the public health is worse than ever, they are fatter and suffer from a wider range of chronic conditions (Heart Disease being the main one).

If the current recommendations are designed to promote health surely there would be evidence that they are working somewhere, if anything the evidence points to the fact that they arent working.

Zamboni

The casting director should get an award for the choice in people used in the ad.
A lot of people would not realise that those actors in the ad are overweight and would regard them as 'normal'.
It is an excellent method of re-setting the barometer of what it is normal.
Also, delighted with the emphasis on the change in food intake over the years and less emphasis on the activity levels.
I am sick to death of lack of activity being used as an excuse for obesity, whilst it is clearly a factor, all factors pale in comparison to the primary cause of excessive calorie intake.

safefood: Dermot

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Another thing is, while obesity is definitley preventable and doesnt just 'happen' , being a little overweight is a common part of our society because we now have people doing shift work , people working nights and sleeping during the day , jobs where people spend 95% of their day at a desk , for these its quite hard to allocate a lot of time for exercise or eating right ,and while its no excuse for being heavily overweight / obese it certainly gives a little leeway to being a little overweight

Hi Eric Cartman and you're right - there are real pressures in society today on people's everyday lives, whether it's hours working/travelling or the kind of work we do.

But what we want more people to realise is that more of our population, both men and women are now carrying excess weight, that your risks of chronic diseases increase with that weight and that more of us are moving from o/weight to obesity and at a faster rate than ever before e.g from 8% to 26% in men since 1990.

Red Cortina

safefood: Dermot wrote: »

Personally, I don't know one fat from another so asked a colleague who does.

She told me that there's a clear association between saturated fat and heart disease and at a population level, our intakes of sat fat are well above what is recommended.

And because she got me thinking, I asked her what the primary sources of it are...and it's meat and meat products, dairy foods, cakes, biscuits and confectionary...basically what I would eat.

To reduce your consumption of this fat, you can choose leaner cuts of meats, lower-fat versions of dairy and try to limit the cakes, biccies and sweets; sorry if this is depressing reading on a wet Friday!

Reading that you, who actually works to promote healthy eating, don't understand the difference between the different types of fat makes for depressing reading on a wet Friday afternoon, not the fact that we shouldn't be eating 'cakes, biccies and sweets'...

The fact that it hasn't registered with your colleagues at Safefoods that saturated fat has been incorrectly vilified, starting with Ancel Keys' 7 countries study, also depresses the heck out of me:(

Did you know that the French have one of the higher rates of consumption of saturated fats yet one of the lower rates of heart disease?

angelfire9

Hanley wrote: »

As for “skinny = healthy”, I totally agree on your point there. I’d rather see a slightly above weight guy with a good level of strength and cardiovascular fitness than a skinny dude who eats nothing but maccyd’s.

I think this ^^^ Is a VERY valid point

I take exception to the statement that a waist of more than 32 inches for women is overweight

I am 6ft tall, weight is 10 stone and I have a 34 inch waist
There is no way in hell's earth that I am over weight


I attach photo of me taken this time last year at 4 months pregnant and even then I didn't look fat!!!!

I think its dangerous to make assumptions about any person's weight or obesity based on generalisations and each individual should be examined as an individual

Saying to a girl or woman "oh your waist is above 32 inches you are therefore overweight" is dangerous and irresponsible!

Note: crappy enough picture for this purpose i'll try and find a better one

time42play

My reaction to the television ad was laughter, I think it’s really very funny based on my own case. I am still around 2.5 stone overweight, but have a waist size of 31” measured as indicated. My partner, who is a healthy weight for his height, eats better, and exercises more, is slightly over. I know that BMI is more complicated to get across in a short ad, but I think that for MOST of us normal, non-athletic people it’s still a better indicator of weight problems. If I weren’t already well into the process of losing weight that ad would certainly not inspire me to do so, but then I see the campaign as being aimed at people who are borderline overweight and not those of us who know beyond any doubt that we’re fat.

I am also rather annoyed that the healthy weights of my family and friends haven’t spread to me!! Or maybe it’s only fat that’s contagious, not thinness (I only vaguely remember that study), although they all seem to have escaped catching it from me over the years despite my feeding them!

The second video was far better than the ad, in my view.

I’ve spent more than 30 years of my life failing to control my weight with the standard high-carb, low-fat diets. Finally with the likes of Gary Taubes are there plans that work for me without starvation, and yes they involve eating saturated fats. I have managed to lose more than 5 stone without feeling like I'm on a "diet", which is more than can be said for the official recommended way of eating.

safefood: Dermot

Red Cortina wrote: »

Reading that you, who actually works to promote healthy eating, don't understand the difference between the different types of fat makes for depressing reading on a wet Friday afternoon, not the fact that we shouldn't be eating 'cakes, biccies and sweets'...

The fact that it hasn't registered with your colleagues at Safefoods that saturated fat has been incorrectly vilified, starting with Ancel Keys' 7 countries study, also depresses the heck out of me:(

Did you know that the French have one of the higher rates of consumption of saturated fats yet one of the lower rates of heart disease?

Thanks Red Cortina. Just to clarify, I have colleagues here with PhDs in Nutrition and I thought it would be best to ask them on the fats issue.

I'll ask them for their thoughts on the other studies in the meantime.

dak

“Stop the spread” is a great idea. The Irish ( including myself) are great at being in denial . How many of us would claim we don’t overeat, don’t binge drink ,maybe smoke a few cigarettes and get enough exercise.

If you do regular exercise and are young then you may keep the spread at bay for a number of years.. As the years roll on the body is less capable of coping with an unhealthy lifestyle and for many who cease being active the weight and waist slowly spreads.

Some day you may look at a picture of yourself from 20 years ago and wonder like me how did I go from being an active fit 11 and half stone (32 inch waist) 20 year old to a 15 and a half stone (36 inch ) relatively inactive person.

The day you start think about this is the day to decide you can make a change. Taking the first step is half the battle . Don’t try to run 5km when you haven’t run in years.

Get out there walking , try to get some other regular exercise every week, reduce the amount of alcohol you drink ( there are about 170 calories in a pint of Guiness) , watch portion sizes , start looking at the amount of calories in what you eat and try not to eat after 6 or 7 at night.

The old saying “ Eat Breakfast like a king “ and “ supper like a pauper “ hold true. Everything in moderation .

Above all set yourself an obtainable goal and a timeframe to achieve it.

12 weeks ago I made the decision to stop the spread . I started to walk at least an hour a day . I joined a gym ( I go once a week) and use the threadmill and resistance weight machines . 6 weeks later I was fit enough to run a 5km fun run in just under 30 mins .

12 weeks into this changed lifestyle I can now run 8 km non stop and I am 1 stone 3 lbs lighter. If I can do it anyone can. Stop thinking about being active …just take that first step and you’ll be amazed at the difference you can make in a short period of time !

Red Cortina

Hanley wrote: »

As for “skinny = healthy”, I totally agree on your point there. I’d rather see a slightly above weight guy with a good level of strength and cardiovascular fitness than a skinny dude who eats nothing but maccyd’s.

I absolutely agree with you, I think skinny does not always mean healthy. Skinny people get diabetes, heart disease and stroke too. I am surrounded by skinny people at work who have the most terrible diets and are not interested in healthy eating as they figure that, as they are not overweight, they can eat what they like.

In fact I think that that is where the whole 'Healthy At Every Size' theory that they talk about here: http://www.nutritionj.com/content/pdf/1475-2891-10-9.pdf has its merits.

Red Cortina

safefood: Dermot wrote: »

Thanks Red Cortina. Just to clarify, I have colleagues here with PhDs in Nutrition and I thought it would be best to ask them on the fats issue.

I'll ask them for their thoughts on the other studies in the meantime.

I have no doubt that your colleagues are well qualified. But my point would be that as you work with them, you would imagine that they would have you well versed in the ins and outs of such an important nutrient. And fat is an important nutrient. And that if you had any question at all, that you of all people, could easily have someone at your fingertips to ask

Also you are working on this campaign yet you have not, so far, taken the
initiative to go and educate yourself on what exactly you are consuming. So if you are not interested, then what hope do we have for anyone else who isn't even working for Safefood

I don't mean to pick on you, just that the comment that you made previously surprised me..

Blatter

safefood: Dermot wrote: »

Personally, I don't know one fat from another so asked a colleague who does.

Thank you for that.

She told me that there's a clear association between saturated fat and heart disease and at a population level, our intakes of sat fat are well above what is recommended.

I've personally done a lot of research on saturated fat over the last number of years, and I (as many others have) concluded that the association between saturated fat and heart disease is anything but clear and is in fact nothing more than a myth.

Also, you mentioned intakes of sat fat are well above what is 'recommended'. The thing is, as your probably well aware, what is 'recommended' is hotly (and rightly) disputed.

And because she got me thinking, I asked her what the primary sources of it are...and it's meat and meat products, dairy foods, cakes, biscuits and confectionary...basically what I would eat.

To reduce your consumption of this fat, you can choose leaner cuts of meats, lower-fat versions of dairy and try to limit the cakes, biccies and sweets; sorry if this is depressing reading on a wet Friday!

Just to note there, an awful lot of cakes, biscuits, sweets and confectionery are not primary sources of sat fat.

And this leads me to the crux of my point.

Saturated fat gets a bad rap, (very wrongly, in my opinion) and is often mentioned in the same breath as trans fats. The advice we are given under our RDA, is to limit sat fats, as you just advised me there.

This advice, in my opinion, causes big problems.

More and more people are eating margarine instead of butter.

People are cutting down on their meat intake at dinner time and increasing their portions of potatoes and homemade 'low fat' chips.

People are eating white toast and highly refined cereals for breakfast instead of scrambled egg, omelettes, bacon and cheese.

Some even shun nuts, salmon and coconut oil because of the high levels of sat fat they contain.

What do people eat instead? They go for low fat biscuits, 3% fat Rolo yogurts, 97% fat free weight watcher's Sherphards Pie, fizzy drinks, oven chips, sweets, fat free ice cream, white bread(it's low fat, right?), sugary cereal bars and the list goes on.

Pure junk and people are shoving it down their throats and many of the same people are avoiding butter, limiting their egg intake and avoiding perfectly good natural foods like nuts, meat and cheese.

Unbelievable, don't you think?

To some up why this country is fat(and getting fatter), I'll just copy and past what I posed a few weeks ago


A) Way, way too much bread, sugary cereals, sugary drinks, ready made meals, biscuits, chocolate, vegetable oil, margarine, takeaways etc. in the diet

Not enough fruit, veg, fresh cuts of meat, fresh fish, healthy oils, butter, eggs, nuts etc. in the diet


In short, just encourage people to eat REAL food, and it will go along way to solving our obesity epidemic.

angelfire9

Ok Voila:

The torso of a 34 inch female i.e. me

Can you honestly say every female with a waist over 32 inches is obese?????

safefood: Dermot

angelfire9 wrote: »

I think its dangerous to make assumptions about any person's weight or obesity based on generalisations and each individual should be examined as an individual

Saying to a girl or woman "oh your waist is above 32 inches you are therefore overweight" is dangerous and irresponsible!

Hi angelfire9. The guidelines quoted are based on World Health Organization (WHO) recommendations of healthy waist sizes for men and women, which take into account people’s different shapes and sizes.
http://whqlibdoc.who.int/publications/2011/9789241501491_eng.pdf

We focused on waist because more and more studies have shown the risks caused by excess weight in that area. And for a mass public awareness campaign, we felt it was a better message to communicate than say, BMI.

Red Cortina

safefood: Dermot wrote: »

We focused on waist because more and more studies have shown the risks caused by excess weight in that area. And for a mass public awareness campaign, we felt it was a better message to communicate than say, BMI.

Just as a matter of interest, was the waist to hip ratio measurement considered at all?

angelfire9

safefood: Dermot wrote: »

Hi angelfire9. The guidelines quoted are based on World Health Organization (WHO) recommendations of healthy waist sizes for men and women, which take into account people’s different shapes and sizes.
http://whqlibdoc.who.int/publications/2011/9789241501491_eng.pdf

We focused on waist because more and more studies have shown the risks caused by excess weight in that area. And for a mass public awareness campaign, we felt it was a better message to communicate than say, BMI.

I don't believe generalisations help people

And i think you could be encouraging bulimic or anorexic behaviour through those generalisations!

I am NOT fat
Anyone who would look at my pic and say that i'm fat has serious body issues
Yet WHO thinks I'm obese based on the size of my waist??

It wouldn't exactly encourage me to listen to their recommendations in other areas now would it! :rolleyes:

Hanley

angelfire9 wrote: »

I don't believe generalisations help people

And i think you could be encouraging bulimic or anorexic behaviour through those generalisations!

I am NOT fat
Anyone who would look at my pic and say that i'm fat has serious body issues
Yet WHO thinks I'm obese based on the size of my waist??

It wouldn't exactly encourage me to listen to their recommendations in other areas now would it! :rolleyes:

Just out of interest, did you measure your waist using the same method they recommended on the add? Like in the same spot?

g'em

@ angelfire - let's be blunt about this. You're 6' right? Not many women are six foot tall. I think it's a reasonable assumption to make to say that you are an outlier where these norms are concerned and to try and allude that the campaign is calling you personally fat is pretty incredulous. For the average Irish woman a 32" inch waist does indivate that she is overweight.

8kvscdpglqnyr4

Here's my 2 cents ...

When you visit your GP for whatever reason (flu, prescription renewal ... etc.), the GP should measure your waste and BMI if they think you look overweight (not just obese). If you are overweight, they should advise you accordingly.

Weight is like a ticking time-bomb and it's plain to see. Think about it like this; if a patient visited a doctor with a flu, but while examining the patient, they spotted something that might be a skin melanoma - they'd investigate and advise the patient. I don't see why weight is not a similar scenario - if a person looks over weight, then the GP should measure the patient. If they are overweight, then the GP should advise the patient.

mcsquiffy

angelfire9 wrote: »

Ok Voila:

The torso of a 34 inch female i.e. me

Can you honestly say every female with a waist over 32 inches is obese?????

This campaign is not saying that anyone with a waist size over 32inches/37 inches is obese..... instead its is an indicator of being overweight. to be more specific it is indicating that a person is carrying excess weight around the abdomen which the most dangerous place to carry excess weight

Hanley

Sullivan Moldy Backspace wrote: »

Here's my 2 cents ...

When you visit your GP for whatever reason (flu, prescription renewal ... etc.), the GP should measure your waste and BMI if they think you look overweight (not just obese). If you are overweight, they should advise you accordingly.

Weight is like a ticking time-bomb and it's plain to see. Think about it like this; if a patient visited a doctor with a flu, but while examining the patient, they spotted something that might be a skin melanoma - they'd investigate and advise the patient. I don't see why weight is not a similar scenario - if a person looks over weight, then the GP should measure the patient. If they are overweight, then the GP should advise the patient.

It's not in the doctor's interest. With most medical conditions it's easy to say X caused Y and if the doctor missed it he's in trouble. But with fat gain, poor dietary choices and the range of problems that can occur as a result, no one can identify a truly causitive factor, so the doctor just ends up insulting a patient who may end up taking their business elsewhere. It's pure self preservation on their behalf (I rather say that than ignorance or apathy!!).

Plus with most medical treatments you take a pill or go somewhere and it's fixed. Losing weight requires discipline and hard work, there's no quick fixes.

Blatter

Sullivan Moldy Backspace wrote: »

Here's my 2 cents ...

When you visit your GP for whatever reason (flu, prescription renewal ... etc.), the GP should measure your waste and BMI if they think you look overweight (not just obese). If you are overweight, they should advise you accordingly.

Weight is like a ticking time-bomb and it's plain to see. Think about it like this; if a patient visited a doctor with a flu, but while examining the patient, they spotted something that might be a skin melanoma - they'd investigate and advise the patient. I don't see why weight is not a similar scenario - if a person looks over weight, then the GP should measure the patient. If they are overweight, then the GP should advise the patient.

The problem is, the majority of GPs have little or no training in nutrition and their advice usually involves trotting out the food pyramid and the general RDA, which are partly responsible for our obesity problems in the first place.