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Japanese earthquake / tsunami discussion

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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,078 ✭✭✭Hal Emmerich


    Ficheall wrote: »
    If that website is reliable, then we're all ****ing screwed...
    Radioactive Mushrooms (From Bulgaria, found in England--->By accident!) How much gets in that isin't detected? And it's from Chernobyl.

    Radiation highest yet from Reactor 1 (Yesterday Fuku)


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,020 ✭✭✭Ficheall



    That's already been surpassed. 260 now as opposed to 251.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,009 ✭✭✭✭Run_to_da_hills


    The Fukushima dinner plate.

    http://nilsferber.de/fu.html


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,654 ✭✭✭shadowninty


    I hope those workers are not staying there too long.. poor guys, what a job :(


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,009 ✭✭✭✭Run_to_da_hills




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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,388 ✭✭✭gbee


    Hopefully this will put an end to them killing whales.

    Maybe not, as the contamination levels in the sea would be expected to diminish faster than on the land, it may in fact put more pressure on the whales to provide even more food.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,776 ✭✭✭up for anything


    Is this a faked video or merely a fog bank as someone suggsted? What the feck is going on there if it's not?



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,838 ✭✭✭theboss80


    Does anybody else think Oh Si#t somethings happened in Japan again everytime they see this thread pop up randomly?


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,020 ✭✭✭Ficheall


    It's the same thing happening. It's never really stopped... just fallen out of the news to some extent.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,776 ✭✭✭up for anything


    Ficheall wrote: »
    It's the same thing happening. It's never really stopped... just fallen out of the news to some extent.

    Oh that's alright then! :eek::D


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  • Posts: 6,025 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Theres a problem with a Nuclear plant in Nebraska too. Airspace closed over the plant. They say its safe though.



    http://www.omaha.com/article/20110617/NEWS01/706179913/0

    http://www.businessinsider.com/faa-closes-airspace-over-flooded-nebraska-nuclear-power-plant-2011-6


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-13819767
    Operators of Japan's Fukushima nuclear plant have suspended an operation to clean contaminated water hours after it began due to a rapid rise in radiation.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,463 ✭✭✭Solnskaya


    Overheal wrote: »
    For yourselves though just monitor radiation levels. But I do think they are nothing life threatening. Not more so life threatening that anything else, really. It's out of your hands at this point, aside from opposing nuclear policies. You can choose not to eat sodium nitrates, but it's hard to avoid a trace increase in background radiation, so I find it hard to imagine losing sleep over it. Up next: more oil-related conflicts around the world, with millions killed directly. And people still get into mass panic about radiation-related complications, birth defects and cancers. I guess because it's happening in your backyard, not Abdul's.

    Jon
    Gotta laugh. In the same breath as an admission that supporting the theory that an early meltdown had not occurred was wrong, you now state that the release of radiation is not life threatening. Any slight(ie massive) chance you may be hopelessly, totally wrong about this as well?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,654 ✭✭✭shadowninty


    Solnskaya wrote: »
    Gotta laugh. In the same breath as an admission that supporting the theory that an early meltdown had not occurred was wrong, you now state that the release of radiation is not life threatening. Any slight(ie massive) chance you may be hopelessly, totally wrong about this as well?
    Overheal does not work in Fukumshima, nor is he someone with involvement in the situation.
    He can only go by what info he has and his understanding of that info means. And that goes for all of us.
    I don't find your gleeful tone at him being wrong nice either, I could swear there are people in this forum who want the place to break the laws physics and turn into an A-bomb.

    We can only hope that the workers in the plant will not suffer long term consequences, and the same for the environment.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,029 ✭✭✭shedweller


    Overheal does not work in Fukumshima, nor is he someone with involvement in the situation.
    He can only go by what info he has and his understanding of that info means. And that goes for all of us.
    I don't find your gleeful tone at him being wrong either, I could swear there are people in this forum who want the place to break the laws physics and turn into an A-bomb.

    We can only hope that the workers in the plant will not suffer long term consequences, and the same for the environment.
    +1

    My guess is that from the beginning, it was downplayed big time, and thats fair enough. We are all guilty of downplaying things while they were going pear shaped, at some time or other. But this was a concerted effort from many posters here to downplay this. OK, we had very little information to go on so speculation was rife. But those that downplayed it have gone quiet, for the most part. It's almost as if they got mud on their face(and i don't wish to throw mud in peoples faces), but it's mud on our planets face "at the end of the day"
    It sickens me to see this happening and it also sickens me to see people saying that nuclear power is safe. Ok, stats say x no. of people die from coal etc. but y no. of people are going to have deformed babies in the near future and z sq km of land in Japan is now uninhabitable for a very long time (how long?), including any mineral wealth that may lie under the surface, due to it having to be mined from the surface.
    Nuclear could be made safe im sure but the cost would be massive to say the least, if all scenarios were to be factored in. Of course, there are many many vested interests (cough* DU cough*) at stake here so i don't expect nuclear power to go away any time soon. Unfortunately.
    Meanwhile, Japan is fcuked, for a very long time, many generations in fact. Prove me wrong by all means but use scientific and medical data while you're at it!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,654 ✭✭✭shadowninty


    ^I don't see how that's a +1 to my post
    Id well rather have a 1960s minimally designed plant like Fukushima in Cork Harbour, compared to what's there now.

    And nuclears plenty safe - did you see what happened to the North East coast of Japan for ffs!
    I welcome the next generation of nuclear, hopefully lessons will be learnt and the public will see its benefits.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,029 ✭✭✭shedweller


    Because i'm not gleeful at Overheal being wrong and i DON'T want to see Fukushima ruined.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,029 ✭✭✭shedweller


    And i know that the place isn't going to turn into an A bomb but it has turned into something almost as ugly. You cannot deny that. The place is messed up for a very long time. Was nuclear worth it in this case? Was nuclear safe for an earthquake prone location? Is Fukushima a safe place to be right now? Would you bring up your children there? Would you live there and conceive them, rear them and live there?

    I don't mean to be confrontational and i apologise if you feel like i'm attacking you. Thats not my intention. But i do feel nuclear is not safe or at least fully safe. Nothing is i suppose but radiation doesn't mess about and there is very little we can do to protect ourselves against it. At least with particulates in the air we can filter them out. Try that with radioactive particles!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,654 ✭✭✭shadowninty


    No I didn't think you were attacking me, no worries :)

    I do understand the fear of radiation - it can't be seen and is so difficult to block. A lot of the fear is probably cold war era which is why young people like my don't fear it that much.
    I doubt the place is going to be that messed up. They may put up an exclusion zone but its not a Chernobyl Raquel situation where inner bits of the reactor were strewn out.

    Do i think it is worth it? Yes, I do. There ate millions of Asthmatics in this world due to pollution from fossil fuels.
    Tens of Thousands of square kilometers of land has been destroyed by and oil. The same for the sea.
    Look, I'm fairly liberal and pro-Green but I'm a realist. Its not plausible to ever power the worlds ever increasing power consumption with renewables. It is plausible with nuclear. What with climate change and the massive pollution in the world today, Nuclear IS the safe option, it IS worth the risk.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 256 ✭✭Statistician


    And i know that the place isn't going to turn into an A bomb but it has turned into something almost as ugly.
    Apparently we have a 'melt through' scenario, where the fuel is melting down through the confinements. What happens if this reaches the water table? Do we get a huge steam explosion like they said would happen at Chernobyl?

    If there was a huge steam explosion, then fuel would be ejected over a wide area, like a dirty bomb. I wonder if this scenario is worse than an A bomb?
    Remember, there is a lot of fuel in this site, so it might only need one of these reactors' fuel to reach the water table.

    Does anyone know if this situation is still a possibility?


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,029 ✭✭✭shedweller


    Wasn't fuel already strewn around when the gas exploded? In any case, that can be reasonably easily cleaned up. It's the water table is the worry.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,463 ✭✭✭Solnskaya


    No I didn't think you were attacking me, no worries :)

    I do understand the fear of radiation - it can't be seen and is so difficult to block. A lot of the fear is probably cold war era which is why young people like my don't fear it that much.
    I doubt the place is going to be that messed up. They may put up an exclusion zone but its not a Chernobyl Raquel situation where inner bits of the reactor were strewn out.

    Do i think it is worth it? Yes, I do. There ate millions of Asthmatics in this world due to pollution from fossil fuels.
    Tens of Thousands of square kilometers of land has been destroyed by and oil. The same for the sea.
    Look, I'm fairly liberal and pro-Green but I'm a realist. Its not plausible to ever power the worlds ever increasing power consumption with renewables. It is plausible with nuclear. What with climate change and the massive pollution in the world today, Nuclear IS the safe option, it IS worth the risk.
    This, exactly, and what you wrote after it Shadow, makes me think you are dreadfully naive, (and to me you come across in your earlier posts as being very naive indeed). The whole downplaying of the threat of radiation has been a key strategy in the aftermath of Chernobyl-"look, it's not so bad, very few have died, nature is returning to normal"--utter BS. Also, you are worried about Fukushima being ruined, I'm not, I'm worried about the hundreds of thousands globally that will quietly contract cancer, uncounted by any statistician, linked by no-one to either Chernobyl nor Fukushima, and ignored by the powers that be. Mainly, I'm worrried about my kids, and theirs if they have them. And before you tell me they are going to be grand, and all this is just a minor incident with no long term effects, spare me, because I am an old, hardbitten cynic.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,654 ✭✭✭shadowninty


    Solnskaya wrote: »
    This, exactly, and what you wrote after it Shadow, makes me think you are dreadfully naive, (and to me you come across in your earlier posts as being very naive indeed). The whole downplaying of the threat of radiation has been a key strategy in the aftermath of Chernobyl-"look, it's not so bad, very few have died, nature is returning to normal"--utter BS. Also, you are worried about Fukushima being ruined, I'm not, I'm worried about the hundreds of thousands globally that will quietly contract cancer, uncounted by any statistician, linked by no-one to either Chernobyl nor Fukushima, and ignored by the powers that be. Mainly, I'm worrried about my kids, and theirs if they have them. And before you tell me they are going to be grand, and all this is just a minor incident with no long term effects, spare me, because I am an old, hardbitten cynic.
    Ok then, I wont say anything :)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,654 ✭✭✭shadowninty


    shedweller wrote: »
    Wasn't fuel already strewn around when the gas exploded? In any case, that can be reasonably easily cleaned up. It's the water table is the worry.

    I would agree there, I am also a bit worried about the sea, but I guess on quantities of scale it will be ok? I'm not sure what happens if someone is so unlucky to get a bit of fish with some deadly isotope.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,463 ✭✭✭Solnskaya


    Ok then, I wont say anything :)
    say whatever you want, just don't accept all of the garbage that is spouted about how radiation is fun, sure itt'll be grand, etc. If a wealthy, hypertechnical nation like Japan has a problem theat it admits it is almost powerless to contain, start worrying, ffs.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,654 ✭✭✭shadowninty


    Solnskaya wrote: »
    say whatever you want, just don't accept all of the garbage that is spouted about how radiation is fun, sure itt'll be grand, etc. If a wealthy, hypertechnical nation like Japan has a problem theat it admits it is almost powerless to contain, start worrying, ffs.
    Look, I understand radiation is dangerous. It causes cell mutation, therefore cancer, and other worrying things.
    I do worry about the radiation dose the workers may be receiving (although the meters are messed up or something? wtf?), but the body should be able to deal with anything the people outside the exclusion zone are receiving.
    I also worry about the long term damage to the workers of the stress - one poor man (in his fifties?) has died already :(


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,029 ✭✭✭shedweller


    I also worry about the long term damage to the workers of the stress - one poor man (in his fifties?) has died already :(
    Thats true, the workers are sure to have problems. The entire exclusion zone is going to have problems for the forseeable future.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,463 ✭✭✭Solnskaya


    yes, and what about all the things and stuff the people have had to abandon. I'm sure they can come back later and collect them. I do hope all the bunnie rabbits in the zone are ok. They govt spokesman for the nice tepco people said that bunnie rabbits are able to do just fine after a small dose of radiation. And i'm sure all the food will be fine, they said it would be.

    this thread is so full of vacuous, uninformed crap I thought I might add a little more.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,800 ✭✭✭take everything


    Apparently we have a 'melt through' scenario, where the fuel is melting down through the confinements. What happens if this reaches the water table? Do we get a huge steam explosion like they said would happen at Chernobyl?

    I'd be shocked if a melt through reaching the water table goes unreported.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,312 ✭✭✭AskMyChocolate


    Solnskaya wrote: »
    Gotta laugh. In the same breath as an admission that supporting the theory that an early meltdown had not occurred was wrong, you now state that the release of radiation is not life threatening. Any slight(ie massive) chance you may be hopelessly, totally wrong about this as well?
    Overheal does not work in Fukumshima, nor is he someone with involvement in the situation.
    He can only go by what info he has and his understanding of that info means. And that goes for all of us.
    I don't find your gleeful tone at him being wrong nice either, I could swear there are people in this forum who want the place to break the laws physics and turn into an A-bomb.

    We can only hope that the workers in the plant will not suffer long term consequences, and the same for the environment.


    In all fairness Solnskaya, there have been a number of pro-nuclear drumbangers in this thread, who have looked smugly and condescendingly down on anyone who didn't share their view; calling them tinfoil hat merchants, scaremongers etc.. but Overheal has never been one of them.


    Yes, he is pro-nuclear. Yes, he is pro-establishment. But he has been an excellent contributor to this thread, and has delivered information, which a number of us are glad of, in as even-handed and informative way as is possible.

    I think it is unfair of you to try to paint him as a TEPCO lackey.

    Right from the start of this thread, for worried ignorant Joe Soaps like me, himself and Rob A. Bank have posted useful links, without lowering themselves to childish behaviour, regardless of their viewpoint. They have interpreted things differently, but have helped a lot of people who don't know enough, to see both sides of the story.

    To accuse either of being from Fox News or Worldwide Socialist Weekly to me seems patently unjust. Just my opinion.

    Choco


This discussion has been closed.
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