Dark Souls

AnCapaillMor

CrazyFish wrote: »

I am having a horrible time fighting the gaping dragon. I summon Solaire in to give me a hand but every time he lasts less than a minute. My main weapon up to this point has been a handaxe which has been upgraded but I am finding it difficult to actually hit the dragon at all. I have tried using some other swords but they are just to weak. I am trying to use the gold pine resin which helps enough but in my last two attempts I have been one shotted by its tail attack.

Have you the ring that lets you run through water? It's very handy against him, makes dodgy a lot lot easier.

CrazyFish

Cheers for the hints lads. I got lucky and was able to summon two players to help me with the battle.

johnny_ultimate

Twilightning wrote: »

God forbid PC gamers actually expect a quality, stable online service released alongside a good PC port instead of just rolling over and accepting whatever's offered. It was good they actually listened to the petition and went ahead with the port but there's no really any excuse for cutting corners with an online service as universally panned as GFWL.

No excuse?

I'd imagine it's much easier to port the online components from XBL to GFWL.

From Software are inexperienced with PC development. Perhaps GFWL is closer to what they're comfortable with.

Steam is far less significant in Japan than it is here.

A niche game like Dark Souls would easily benefit from the extra marketing push Microsoft are able to provide.

A healthy relationship with Microsoft is ultimately to the benefit of From and Namco / Bandai, for various commercial and professional reasons.

How could we possibly know the reasons behind the decisions? I'd imagine they're complex.

Ultimately, you get the game with extra content, a few extra pop-up windows notwithstanding. It is complete conjecture at this point from either side to call it a good or a bad port. But yet more complaining from gamers (gamers who are already encouraging piracy and waiting for sales) when they're finally getting the game they campaigned to get is, IMO, bad form.

danthefan

First playthrough, just killed the Gargoyles and rang the first bell. Quality game.

Twilightning

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

No excuse?

I'd imagine it's much easier to port the online components from XBL to GFWL.

Easier isn't essentially always the best choice. GFWL certainly isn't the best choice for this or any PC port.

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

From Software are inexperienced with PC development. Perhaps GFWL is closer to what they're comfortable with.

They certainly are inexperienced, to the point where it's that dire that there's nearly no point it picking up the port for reasons outlined in the article I'm linking at the end of this post.

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

Steam is far less significant in Japan than it is here.

So is Microsoft in general, even moreso than Steam I'd imagine. The PS2 probably sells more than the 360 does in Japan. There's still no justifiable reason being stated in favour of GFWL being used with this release that doesn't involve their saving time/cutting corners or being chalked up to their inexperience with the PC. I thought the reasons GFWL should be used should be in benefit to the consumer, not them.

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

A niche game like Dark Souls would easily benefit from the extra marketing push Microsoft are able to provide.

GFWL =/= an onslaught of marketing and advertising on Microsoft's end in benefit of a given title. Dawn of War II was a major RTS title and a highly anticipated sequel that featured GFWL (which was later dropped by Relic Entertainment in favour of Steamworks, I wonder why) and I didn't see a single bit of advertising promoting the game from Microsoft's end.

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

A healthy relationship with Microsoft is ultimately to the benefit of From and Namco / Bandai, for various commercial and professional reasons.

From the way you're wording this I'd almost think you were a Microsoft rep on a sales pitch at Namco.

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

How could we possibly know the reasons behind the decisions? I'd imagine they're complex.

Somehow I doubt it.

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

Ultimately, you get the game with extra content, a few extra pop-up windows notwithstanding. It is complete conjecture at this point from either side to call it a good or a bad port. But yet more complaining from gamers (gamers who are already encouraging piracy and waiting for sales) when they're finally getting the game they campaigned to get is, IMO, bad form.

I'd refer you back to the image I posted on the last page of this thread, it really is a lot more than "a few extra pop-up windows". The image in itself doesn't begin to outline the numerous difficulties people have had with GFWL's online service as regards multiplayer and the service itself corrupting people's saves. And here's where GFWL isn't the only glaring issue that should be addressed. They really aren't trying. I'm just waiting for a select group of people here to blatantly overlook everything that From Software are doing wrong with this release and call anyone who finds fault with it 'entitled' simply because we should be happy with whatever they give PC gamers since they petitioned for the port.

johnny_ultimate

Twilightning wrote: »

I'd refer you back to the image I posted on the last page of this thread, it really is a lot more than "a few extra pop-up windows". The image in itself doesn't begin to outline the numerous difficulties people have had with GFWL's online service as regards multiplayer and the service itself corrupting people's saves. And here's where GFWL isn't the only glaring issue that should be addressed. They really aren't trying. I'm just waiting for a select group of people here to blatantly overlook everything that From Software are doing wrong with this release and call anyone who finds fault with it 'entitled' simply because we should be happy with whatever they give PC gamers since they petitioned for the port.

I don't necessarily agree with the points I made, I'm pointing them out as devil's advocate because some of the attitudes here and elsewhere really bother me - such as advocating piracy on flimsy grounds.

Maybe the port will be shoddy - too early to call yet, especially when everyone's baying for blood. But here's a simple reality, IMO greater than any complaints being made: you're still getting Dark Souls, a game that is almost perfect in its current state (a handful of misjudged difficulty spikes and frame rate shuddering aside, perhaps). These things didn't bother any of us who have played and completed it. And so if you get the same game that still plays more or less identically to the console versions, any complaining is pretty much unwarranted. Did any of us bemoan the lack of higher resolution or graphical filters? Not a ****ing chance, we were too busy hearting the heck out of the game. Because first and foremost you're playing Dark Souls for the gameplay and experience, not to show off your gaming PC.

Yes, a hugely optimised PC port with Steamworks would be ideal (have you seen anyone denying that, or excusing iffy PC ports?), but it's impractical for technological and commercial reasons that I think are pretty self-evident. Why spend resources From don't have on a port that in a best case scenario is going to sell less than its console brethren while it gets pirated to **** in the meantime? Instead, make do with the fact that you're getting one of the best games of the last decade. I assure you, it'll be worth any annoyances GFWL will potentially throw at you.

And, as your linked article points out, GFWL isn't even a certainty yet. Play Dark Souls. Be happy.

gizmo

Twilightning wrote: »

There's still no justifiable reason being stated in favour of GFWL being used with this release that doesn't involve their saving time/cutting corners or being chalked up to their inexperience with the PC. I thought the reasons GFWL should be used should be in benefit to the consumer, not them.

The reasoning is two fold and pretty straight forward I would have thought. From the exerpt from the interview here it's layed out pretty clearly.

"For Games for Windows Live, that's the established server we used for our 360 version for the console - that is the main reason that we've picked the Xbox Live server," he explained, before referring us to the hotel manager. Not really.

So, as I said earlier, they had already hooked up to two online systems, one of which could be reused on the PC via GFWL so it made sense to reuse that code for the PC version. Would it have been nicer to use Steamworks in the face of potential GFWL issues client-side? Yep. But in terms of the actual online functionality the game would need, there would have been no harm in using GFWL for it.

Also, combine that with...

“However, due to the lack of experience of creating PC games, both as a director and a company, we need more time to adapt to what PC gamers would want with regard to mods, so at this time we’re not announcing anything.

And the point is reinforced. You also need to factor in the fact that they were aiming for an August release date, probably to capitalise on the momentum of the online campaign and also avoiding the cluster**** release schedule come Oct where they would have needed to pump a good bit more into advertising in order to get the game noticed.

Twilightning wrote: »

I'm just waiting for a select group of people here to blatantly overlook everything that From Software are doing wrong with this release and call anyone who finds fault with it 'entitled' simply because we should be happy with whatever they give PC gamers since they petitioned for the port.

The only real area they can be considered entitled is by examining this paragraph from the VG247 article...

Sadly, a PC port also brings with it the inevitable rise in the threat of piracy. With seemingly little being done to deliver a PC version that takes full advantage of the host platform’s strengths, the threat of piracy will not be combated by enticing potential pirates to pay to receive added value extras and so Namco Bandai will have to instead rely on DRM measures.

While I certainly don't agree with obtrusive DRM, the notion that a certain set of gamers will pirate your game unless you give them additional value is just entitled nonsense. Thankfully no one has brought that up here yet so hopefully the accusation won't be thrown around.

danthefan

Capra Demon, fookin' hell. Managed to kill the dogs but haven't taken so much as a single health point from him yet.

penev10

danthefan wrote: »

Capra Demon, fookin' hell. Managed to kill the dogs but haven't taken so much as a single health point from him yet.

The dogs in the narrow arena are a pain. I find if you leg it up the stairs, let the dogs follow, get in a few hits, drop down when the Capra approaches, go back to the entrance, l;et the dogs follow, should be ablke to kill em before the Capra arrives. Keep double rolling behind the Capra as he begins his attack and he should be open for a few attacks. Really helps if you have a ranged attack (long weapon, soul arrow, fireball or firebombs)

danthefan

Awesome, got him. About 5 times in a row I died before reaching the stairs. From then on it's kinda cheap because you can just wait for him to come up, drop down, he'll drop down after you and takes a minute to recover, but that's obviously the way he's designed.

Burning Eclipse

danthefan wrote: »

Capra Demon, fookin' hell. Managed to kill the dogs but haven't taken so much as a single health point from him yet.

I'm not the first to point this out, but there comes a time in Dark Souls when

Capra is a standard enemy

.

Haven't played this in a few months, must get back to New Game plus... I wanna see how quickly I can ring both bells

johnny_ultimate

I'd say along with 'closing gate of doom' that Capra Demon fight is amongst the game's most... misguided difficulty spikes.

But yeah if you get lucky and get up on the narrow ledge at the top of the stairs, the fight is grand. Getting to that point - pre-empted by those ****ing ninja bastards - is the fun part :pac:

But the

Capra demons down in the lava depths, when you're armed with Crystal homing soulmass, is probably the game's most brilliant grinding spot

ancapailldorcha

Don't worry about fighting them as regular enemies. The main reason the first one is so hard is the enclosed space you fight him in and the 2 dogs. His 2 handed lunge can't be blocked so don't try. As has been suggested, try and get to the stairs to funnel the dogs.

Burning Eclipse

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

I'd say along with 'closing gate of doom' that Capra Demon fight is amongst the game's most... misguided difficulty spikes.

Gotta agree... I died more times than I care to remember before I figured out that fight... Contrast to the Gaping Dragon which looked great, but I killed on my first attempt.

2smiggy

Back down in the tomb of the giants

i sailed through the catacombs without dying , and got to the bonfire in the tomb. i have died a good few times since though, often those skeleton dogs !

also getting invaded a bit , and when i do manage to get to nito alive no summon signs there :eek:

i may have been drinking the first time i beat nito, as i cannot seem to remember the fight or what i did to win.

i have changed my strategy to holding my black knight greataxe +5 and my divine falcon + 5 in my right hand, and shield and catalyst in left hand. hoping to nearly kill them with my great axe and finish them off with my divine weapon. i died once doing this before the champions league started last night.

what did ye do for this battle ?

danthefan

On first playthrough, just killed the Gaping Dragon. Nice fight compared to the Capra Demon with all the space you have.

My problem now is I was cursed by those frog type things, how do I get myself un-cursed?

This really is an incredibly well realised game. The level design imo is just superb, and when I die I nearly always feel it's my fault, despite the difficulty.

2smiggy

danthefan wrote: »

On first playthrough, just killed the Gaping Dragon. Nice fight compared to the Capra Demon with all the space you have.

My problem now is I was cursed by those frog type things, how do I get myself un-cursed?

This really is an incredibly well realised game. The level design imo is just superb, and when I die I nearly always feel it's my fault, despite the difficulty.

the creepy lad in the church tower beside where you killed the gargoyles will sell you purging stones. they are expensive, i forget the exact amount. you can also trade a red eye orb with snuggly the crow for 2 purging stones i believe.

a balls having to track back to get these, but with only half your normal health it is really necessary to get un-cursed

danthefan

2smiggy wrote: »

the creepy lad in the church tower beside where you killed the gargoyles will sell you purging stones. they are expensive, i forget the exact amount. you can also trade a red eye orb with snuggly the crow for 2 purging stones i believe.

a balls having to track back to get these, but with only half your normal health it is really necessary to get un-cursed

Grand thanks, will try buy a couple of them if I have the souls.

Actually the Gaping Dragon gave me 25k worth. So hopefully I don't lose them. In fact better buy a few levels.

Arawn

danthefan wrote: »

Grand thanks, will try buy a couple of them if I have the souls.

double yer soul levl in 1000's iirc

danthefan

Also, what's the story with Pyromancy, where/when/how can I upgrade it?

2smiggy

after the depths and blightown you will come to quauhags domain, after you defeat her, there is a covenant you can join through a hidden wall. here you can upgrade your glove using souls. joining the covenant gives you a shortcut down here when you have the lord vessel.

penev10

danthefan wrote: »

Also, what's the story with Pyromancy, where/when/how can I upgrade it?

You can rescue Laurentius who is trapped in the Depths near where the evil chef zombie is. Thats probably the easiest way. You can also find Queelana in Blighttown on one of the patches of ground in the middle of the swamp (but there are some unestablished conditions to her appearing so she isn't always there). The final way is to defeat Quelaag and find the hidden tunnel nearby after you ring the bell. Theres a guy there who can upgrade your flame too.

ancapailldorcha

Is there a good way to cut off Seath's tail? I'm on NG+ and it's the only dragon weapon I don't have.

Arawn

have another player distract him and hack away, its how i got it

Kirby

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Is there a good way to cut off Seath's tail? I'm on NG+ and it's the only dragon weapon I don't have.

He tries to turn to face you. If you position yourself on one of his "legs" he kind of pushes you around quicker than you can run. This allows you a few free swipes at the tail. But it takes a while and you do sometimes get hit by his AoE spine thingy he does.

penev10

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Is there a good way to cut off Seath's tail? I'm on NG+ and it's the only dragon weapon I don't have.

Use a weapon with a good range. Even if the tail clips throught the cave wall you can still get it as your weapon goes through the wall too! Try a weapon with a horizontal sweep rather than a stabbing motion as you've more of a chance of hitting the sweet spot. A type of halberd or hammer. If you're a magic/pyro kind of guy try AOE stiff like firestorm.

ancapailldorcha

I didn't know magic could do it. I got it first time round. I let Seath break the crystal himself and I got the tail. I may have aimed for too thick a bit in the first playthrough. Now I've got a sword I can't use.
Cheers!

danthefan

penev10 wrote: »

You can rescue Laurentius who is trapped in the Depths near where the evil chef zombie is. Thats probably the easiest way. You can also find Queelana in Blighttown on one of the patches of ground in the middle of the swamp (but there are some unestablished conditions to her appearing so she isn't always there). The final way is to defeat Quelaag and find the hidden tunnel nearby after you ring the bell. Theres a guy there who can upgrade your flame too.

Sweet thanks, I had rescued that guy from the barrel but had no idea who he was or where he went, just found him there earlier.

penev10

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

I didn't know magic could do it.

It's just damage based afaik so if you do the required amount to that very specific area - bingo! Never managed it with Firestorm myself mind.

Best weapon is the Great Club (The one you get form the Infested Barbarians in Blighttown) imo. R2 attack is horizontal and thrusts forward. Can get it in one hit with the right stats.

CrazyFish

About to fight smough and ornstein. Looks like its going to be a tough one.