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AZ Congresswoman assassination MK ultra mind control operation

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    #92
    joebucks
    Closed Accounts Posts: 728 ✭✭✭joebucks


    gizmo wrote: »
    Assuming it's going to be by insanity. Pretty much saw that one coming a mile away. :o

    Fair play geez.


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    #93
    gizmo
    Registered Users Posts: 8,405 ✭✭✭gizmo


    joebucks wrote: »
    Fair play geez.
    If I said :( instead of :o would I still have gotten the sarcastic reply?

    My point was, if the sole defence is going to be insanity then much of the evidence and/or background info on his motives may possibly be whitewashed. The fact that it is insanity however, is of little surprise, especially given the defence lawyers history of negotiating plea deals.


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    #94
    joebucks
    Closed Accounts Posts: 728 ✭✭✭joebucks


    gizmo wrote: »
    If I said :( instead of :o would I still have gotten the sarcastic reply?

    No.

    My point was, if the sole defence is going to be insanity then much of the evidence and/or background info on his motives may possibly be whitewashed. The fact that it is insanity however, is of little surprise, especially given the defence lawyers history of negotiating plea deals.

    The thing is Gizmo, if I was asked to give a verdict on what I have seen about this case I would concur with your view.
    However given Loughners own interest in mind control and similarities between this case and other possible MK Ultra participants such as the Unabomber, that I feel it is a topic worthy of discussion on this forum. Some people may find that is in bad taste however it is a topic that is covered on many other CT sites I have visited, so I don't see the problem people have with the different elements of the case being discussed here, regardless of how obscure they may seem.


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    #95
    gizmo
    Registered Users Posts: 8,405 ✭✭✭gizmo


    joebucks wrote: »
    The thing is Gizmo, if I was asked to give a verdict on what I have seen about this case I would concur with your view.
    However given Loughners own interest in mind control and similarities between this case and other possible MK Ultra participants such as the Unabomber, that I feel it is a topic worthy of discussion on this forum. Some people may find that is in bad taste however it is a topic that is covered on many other CT sites I have visited, so I don't see the problem people have with the different elements of the case being discussed here, regardless of how obscure they may seem.
    As do I, which is why I'm concerned regarding the insanity plea which I believe will lead to all other evidence being discounted. That may include his involvement in the Centre of Consciousness Studies as BB pointed out earlier and where exactly he got the inspiration for his youtube videos etc...

    To be clear, I don't doubt for a second he was mentally disturbed, I don't particularly think he was involved in any MK-ULTRA activity but I would like to know what set him off. The insanity plea, in my opinion, will probably not deal with these subjects in an in-depth manner which is why I've said the above.


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    #96
    petebricquette
    Registered Users Posts: 489 ✭✭petebricquette


    joebucks wrote: »
    No.




    The thing is Gizmo, if I was asked to give a verdict on what I have seen about this case I would concur with your view.
    However given Loughners own interest in mind control and similarities between this case and other possible MK Ultra participants such as the Unabomber, that I feel it is a topic worthy of discussion on this forum. Some people may find that is in bad taste however it is a topic that is covered on many other CT sites I have visited, so I don't see the problem people have with the different elements of the case being discussed here, regardless of how obscure they may seem.

    Right, maybe it's the fact that Loughner and the 'other possible MK Ultra participants' involved in atrocities such as this could all have similar types of mental problems leading them to become bombers/school shooters? My view on this is that it's just a madman who read up a bit on conspiracy theories before posting rambling videos to YouTube. But I will concede that it's absolutely vital to look into everything before accepting the general consensus.


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    #97
    joebucks
    Closed Accounts Posts: 728 ✭✭✭joebucks


    petebricquette wrote: »
    Right, maybe it's the fact that Loughner and the 'other possible MK Ultra participants' involved in atrocities such as this could all have similar types of mental problems leading them to become bombers/school shooters? My view on this is that it's just a madman who read up a bit on conspiracy theories before posting rambling videos to YouTube. But I will concede that it's absolutely vital to look into everything before accepting the general consensus.

    Well the question I would ask regarding this is, what is the cause of these mental problems? It is reported that Kaczynski underwent MKUltra type experimentation aged 17. Is it the result of undergoing such testing that influenced his behaviour later in his life? What are the long term effects on other subjects of this type of experimentation?
    Did Loughner undergo similar experimentation? Is there a history of schizophrenia in Loughner's family?


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    #98
    gizmo
    Registered Users Posts: 8,405 ✭✭✭gizmo


    I found this bit of info extremely interesting. Evidence like that should hopefully ensure they can't use insanity as a scapegoat given that he seemed fully aware of the consequences of his actions.


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    #99
    Brown Bomber
    Site Banned Posts: 8,331 ✭✭✭Brown Bomber


    Gag Order Sought for Tucson Shooting Victims' Autopsies


    Published March 01, 2011
    | Associated Press


    012611_loughnersketch.jpg
    AP
    Jan. 24: In this artist rendering, Jared Lee Loughner, right, makes a court appearance with his lawyer, Judy Clarke, at the Sandra Day O'Connor United States Courthouse in Phoenix, Ariz.



    PHOENIX -- Federal prosecutors are seeking to bar the release of the autopsy results for six people killed in a Tucson rampage targeting U.S. Rep. Gabrielle Giffords.


    Court records show the request to U.S. District Judge Larry Burns for the gag order was filed Monday by prosecutors who say the families of five of the victims objected to the release of the reports.
    The prosecutors also are seeking to prevent Pima County's deputy chief medical examiner, Dr. Eric Peters, and his staff from talking to the media about the case.


    Jared Loughner is accused of shooting Giffords and 18 others.
    Killed in the January shootings were 9-year-old Christina-Taylor Greene, federal Judge John M. Roll and Giffords aide Gabriel Zimmerman. The other three were bystanders Dorothy Jean Morris, Phyllis Schneck and Dorwan Stoddard.



    Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/03/01/gag-order-sought-tucson-shooting-victims-autopsies/#ixzz1FONb0Rwp


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    #100
    CiaranMT
    Registered Users Posts: 4,092 ✭✭✭CiaranMT


    Arizona gunman unfit for trial


    Shooting suspect Jared Loughner is not mentally competent to stand trial on charges he killed six people and wounded US Congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords in January, a federal judge ruled today.

    US District Judge Larry Burns found Mr Loughner (22), described by his lawyers as "gravely mentally ill," was incapable of understanding the proceedings against him and assisting in his own defense.

    The decision came shortly after Mr Loughner was hustled out of the courtroom for an outburst that disrupted the hearing. He spent five weeks undergoing psychiatric evaluations at a federal prison hospital in Missouri.

    Mr Loughner, a college dropout who investigators say has a history of mental problems, is accused of opening fire on Ms Giffords and a crowd of bystanders attending a "Congress on Your Corner" event outside a grocery story.


    irishtimes.com


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    #101
    Talk E
    Closed Accounts Posts: 461 ✭✭Talk E


    So, they went for the "gravely mentally ill," option, instead of killing him. Interesting.


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    #102
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 81,694 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    described by his lawyers as "gravely mentally ill," was incapable of understanding the proceedings against him and assisting in his own defense.
    Actually that doesnt surprise me, given his nihilism and his penchant for obsessing over such topics as the nothingness of language.


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    #103
    Axe Rake
    Registered Users Posts: 240 ✭✭Axe Rake


    Assassination Attempt May Not Be What I Appears wrote:
    The appearance of FBI Director Robert Mueller at the Arizona assassination site might be a puzzle to some. Mueller’s resume is such that whenever the enterprise wants to cover up an ugly situation, they put Bob in charge of the investigation – and Bob is the best clean-up guy around. (BCCI CIA banking investigation, the Noriega-CIA connections, Iran-Contra investigation which cleared the Bush Enterprise of any involvement, 9-11 Investigation, which cleared the Enterprise of it’s involvement).(1)

    There is no way to put this gently. Mueller is there to ensure that Enterprise ties to this young shooter are not exposed. They will be found. Researchers need to be vigilant as shortly after these pieces of evidence are uncovered, they will disappear into the “classified information” lock box. The Enterprise requires a major media distraction from any investigation into the discovery of the body Air Force Secretary John Wheeler the III’ body in a dumpster last week.(2) John Wheeler’s assassination was bungled by someone who allowed the body to be discovered, and the Arizona media drama has been put in play as a distraction, nothing more. The assassinations in Arizona are meaningless other than as a distraction for the bigger cover-up.

    “Wheeler was the assistant to the Secretary of the Air Force in the George W. Bush Administration. It was the Secretary of the Air Force who discovered that Richard Cheney had set up an alternative chain of command to the nuclear weapons wing of the AF. In the process, six minutemen missiles armed with nuclear warheads were secretly transported from Minot AFB to Barksdale AFB. The later is the chief staging base for the Middle East war. The alarm system for the weapons was deactivated for the transport, something that not even the base commander could authorize. The orders had to have come from above. Many point to Cheney. Before the warheads could be flown via B-52 to the Iraq/Iran theater, the Secretary of the Air Force ordered the stand-down of all B-52 flights. When he discovered the alternative chain of command to Cheney, he fired all military personnel who were involved. Cheney was said to have been livid. The Secretary ordered an investigation of what the AF press release called an oversight, and 70 enlisted men and 5 officers were removed from the Minot nuclear system. At the same time, people involved began to die mysteriously. Wheeler is only the latest casualty.” (3)

    That said, within weeks and months of the aborted theft being discovered in 2007, at least 4 of the involved crewmembers died, and it is reported now that 6-8 may be dead.

    1. http://www.scribd.com/doc/17233336/September-11-Commission-Report-Revised-December-2008
    2. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/40893781/ns/us_news/
    3. http://femalefaust.blogspot.com/2011/01/oh-it-was-john-p-wheeler-iii-who-was.html


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