Should TG4 be closed down in the 2011 budget?

GizAGoOfYerGee

2011 will be a harsh year for Ireland with massive cuts dictated by the ECB and the IMF.

Non-critical goverment agencies such as those that support and promote the Irish language will be the first to go and see a massive reduction in funding.

Closing down TG4, the trophy of the Irish language in modern Ireland, would surely be one of the first to go.

TG4 paused for thought as it awaits post-budget fate

TG4, THE Irish language television station, is nervously awaiting the forthcoming budget and hoping the Government will not reduce its funding any further in 2011. Industry sources however suggest more cuts are on the way as well as a possible change in how the broadcaster is funded.

State funding for TG4 increased from €10 million in 2001 to €36 million last year. This year, TG4’s subsidy runs to €32 million and, in the view of some observers, that’s still too much.

The Bord Snip report led by Colm McCarthy recommended that, in future years, TG4 should be financed from the television licence fee.

“TG4 and RTÉ should identify and implement cost savings, including potential for sharing facilities. The subvention to TG4 should be reduced to achieve savings to the exchequer of at least € 10 million.”

TG4’s director general Pól Ó Gallchóir counters: “It doesn’t really make any difference to us where the money comes from, whether it’s commercial revenue, the licence fee or direct State aid, as long as we have adequate resources. We are aware of what is happening internationally and nationally. We all have to make cuts and TG4 isn’t immune, but we can’t cut internally any more.

“All our staff took a 9 per cent voluntary pay cut and we are paying less for the programmes we buy from the independent sector.”

Now 14 years on air, TG4’s aim is to be a mainstream channel for a niche audience. Its audience share in October was 4 per cent and the most-watched programme on TG4 last month was its screening of the two International Rules games. In fact, three of its top five programmes were sporting events.

Due to its small market share, TG4’s commercial income is small too. Airtime and sponsorship sales income amounted to a net €1.85 million last year, down by a third on 2008. This commercial revenue just about covered the station’s advertising and marketing budget of €1.4 million, never mind another €11 million in staff and other overheads.

Two-thirds of TG4’s expenditure is on bought-in programming. In effect, TG4 is a State employment scheme for hundreds of jobs in the independent programme production sector.

TG4’s spend on commissioned programmes amounts to €18 million a year and another €5 million is channelled to Irish-language programme makers though the Broadcasting Authority of Ireland (funded out of the licence fee) and from the Northern Ireland Irish Language Broadcasting Fund.

According to Ó Gallchóir: “The independent production sector is unable to bear further price reductions from TG4. It is due to already operating at 2002 equivalent budget levels and absorbing up to 10 per cent price reductions from TG4 in 2009.

“Further reductions will simply result in job cuts and a knock-on impact on the Irish production sector and on the economy overall.”

His argument has some merit. The stone walls that decorate the Connemara landscape are a legacy of public works programmes from another century. Although the walls will endure longer than Hector i gCeanada , the skills development that the State funds through TG4 is more relevant to a knowledge economy than masonry.

The bottom line for TG4 is that it needs to try harder to produce programming that people want to watch. Ó Gallchóir insists the station’s output is becoming more mainstream. “Even though we are mainly an Irish language station, nobody will watch a station purely because it’s in Irish. We have to provide quality programming on a par with other stations.

“We now have a lot of emphasis on music programmes where the spoken word isn’t that important. We also broadcast many sporting events where the spoken word isn’t that important either. We are trying to make all our programming as user-friendly as possible.”

Still, not a few sceptics view the TG4 project as a costly white elephant; two successive cuts in the station’s exchequer funding signals that political enthusiasm for the station may be waning.

A system for funding TG4 on a long-term basis has never been worked out and the station’s year-to-year existence is on a political grace and favour basis.

Says Ó Gallchóir: “Lack of certainty regarding annual funding levels makes it difficult for TG4 to plan our longer-term development.”

starbelgrade

Is it still going?

Mike 1972

Bizzare as it sounds I would close down RTE 1 and 2 and let TG4 have their licence money on condition that they set up a second channel for English speakers (TE1 ?).

Ive no interest in Irish but I have a lot of respect for the way TG4 produce quality programming on a small budget unlike the so-called "public service broadcaster"

a mainstream channel for a niche audience.

Dean820

I'm sure all five of TG4 viewers would be devastated.

johngalway

Over my dead body. Leave it alone.

EvilMonkey

Where is the Leave TG4 as it is cut RTE's funding option?

alwaysadub

No! Leave it alone. They have some great programmes on at times.

Mrmoe

No leave it alone, where would all the hot weather girls go?

Sticky_Fingers

Erm Do TG4 actually get much out of the license fee? I thought they were pretty much self suffice with regards funding.

OPENROAD

Sticky_Fingers wrote: »

Erm Do TG4 actually get much out of the license fee? I thought they were pretty much self suffice with regards funding.

Did you read the OP?

AnneElizabeth

Let it die along with everything else Irish-language related.

Sardonicat

starbelgrade wrote: »

Is it still going?

Yup, just watched "Curb Your Enthusiasm" on it.
Very Celtic Dawn

D-Generate

Although I end up reading the subtitles and don't speak a word, I must say that some of their shows like Scannal are excellent and highly informative. It is one of the few shows made in Ireland that I watch now that I live abroad.

krudler

Fcuk no, TG4 pisses all over RTE's progamming, their movie choices are fantastic. and they were the first Irish station to show The Wire.

wow sierra

Theres a lot of over reaction to the IMF/EU bailout, suggesting we are losing our sovereignty etc. One of the things which make us a sovereign nation is our language, and TG4 shows it is alive and well.

In a TV world dominated by XFactor, The Apprentice, Strictly come dancing, I'M a celebrity etc we need some quality. Tá TG4 ar fheabhas agus tá sé de dhíth sa saol atá inniu ann. Tá sé i bhfad níos fearr ná bheith ag éisteacht leis na magairlí asail ar Frontline srl.

Sardonicat

wow sierra wrote: »

Theres a lot of over reaction to the IMF/EU bailout, suggesting we are losing our sovereignty etc. One of the things which make us a sovereign nation is our language, and TG4 shows it is alive and well.

In a TV world dominated by XFactor, The Apprentice, Strictly come dancing, I'M a celebrity etc we need some quality. Tá TG4 ar fheabhas agus tá sé de dhíth sa saol atá inniu ann. Tá sé i bhfad níos fearr ná bheith ag éisteacht leis na magairlí asail ar Frontline srl.

Thanks for posting in a language I don't understand. Appreciate that.

PanchoVilla

Keep TG4 and combine RTE 1 and 2. RTE 1 gets something like 40% of the budget and it shows absolute rubbish most of the time. TG4 is by far the best station of the three, though I don't really watch much any more.

OPENROAD

Sardonicat wrote: »

[/B]
Thanks for posting in a language I don't understand. Appreciate that.

I think the translation might be above the post, not 100% sure mind.

skelliser

I think you should change the thread title to:

Should RTE be closed down in the 2011 budget?

Pat Kenny 800k a year
Miriane Finuncan 4 hours radio a week 500k a year
joe "ff mouth piece" Duffy 400k a year
Ryan "fianna fail shill" tubridy 600k a year
and the countless talentless wannabe celebs who only got a job in RTE cause daddy worked there

TG4 > RTE


Thread Fail

OPENROAD

If you want to keep TG4 then reduce the amount of funding significantly that RTE receives and as someone suggested merge rte 1 and rte 2.

starbelgrade

wow sierra wrote: »

Theres a lot of over reaction to the IMF/EU bailout, suggesting we are losing our sovereignty etc. One of the things which make us a sovereign nation is our language, and TG4 shows it is alive and well.

.

Sovereignty means that a territory has complete independant authority over its own jurisdiction. It has absolutely nothing to do with language.

Mike 1972

wow sierra wrote: »

In a TV world dominated by XFactor, The Apprentice, Strictly come dancing, I'M a celebrity etc we need some quality. .

To be fair TG4 do carry their own versions of most of these programmes even though it doesnt dominate their schedules to the same extent.

wow sierra

Sardonicat wrote: »

[/B]
Thanks for posting in a language I don't understand. Appreciate that.

Translation: TG4 = good Frontline & general media gobsh*tes = Bad . Apologies for posting in our first language which also happens to be the subject of the thread.

PeterIanStaker

Keep it, its only a TV station, not a money-furnace like the HSE or minister's expenses.

Dean820

The top RTE crowd should take a hit, they are well over-paid. I'm sure if RTE cut Pat Kenny's wages tomorrow he would be annoyed but who else is going to employ him?

randylonghorn

TG4 creates a lot of employment, directly and indirectly, in areas where options for employment are very limited ... and without paying the scandalous rates to "big names" that RTE does.

OPENROAD

PeterIanStaker wrote: »

Keep it, its only a TV station, not a money-furnace like the HSE or minister's expenses.

Quite a big subsidy though, sure keep it, but you need to cut significantly in other areas , unless of course all that we have been hearing in the last week, actually did not happen.

starbelgrade

Dean820 wrote: »

The top RTE crowd should take a hit, they are well over-paid. I'm sure if RTE cut Pat Kenny's wages tomorrow he would be annoyed but who else is going to employ him?

I hear there's a job going to spare on a local radio station in Cork.

They're looking for another wanker to fill the vacancy.

Should suit Kenny to a tee.

smk89

Without tg4 where will I get my porn disguised as arty french movies shown on some Friday nights?

Paparazzo

TV4 shows quality movies. Get rid of TV3 or whatever the fúck it's called.

Sardonicat

wow sierra wrote: »

Translation: TG4 = good Frontline & general media gobsh*tes = Bad . Apologies for posting in our first language which also happens to be the subject of the thread.

The subject of the thread is TG4.

The majority language of this country is English. By a million miles, whatever it states in the constitution and whatever aspirations were held by some fascistic blokes at the turn of the century, English is the predominate language spoken here. All Irish people can understand English, so do us the courtesy of posting in that language we all understand on a forum that is not designated for Irish speakers, or at the very least, a translation.

Despite 12 years of school here I came out with more French than Irish. I lay the blame for that firmly at the door of the policy makers who decided how to teach it. A sizeable number of Irish people really do not care if no-one speaks it or not. I am not one of them, but God, do I hate the language fascists.

Mike 1972

randylonghorn wrote: »

TG4 creates a lot of employment, directly and indirectly, in areas where options for employment are very limited .

the same argument can be made to justify just about any area of public spending though.

PeterIanStaker

OPENROAD wrote: »

Quite a big subsidy though, sure keep it, but you need to cut significantly in other areas , unless of course all that we have been hearing in the last week, actually did not happen.

I'm sure its a subsidy, but then again how much does it cost to keep the HSE on life support, or to ferry useless ministers from point A to point B in a chauffeur driven Merc to spout more bulls hit?

GizAGoOfYerGee

wow sierra wrote: »

Apologies for posting in our first language which also happens to be the subject of the thread.

You have to remember that there is a large minority of people in AH that are staunchly against the Irish language. Every poll I've seen here on AH regarding the Irish language is 75% in support and 25% against. (I mean to root out all these polls and post them in a new thread at some stage to prove my stats)

Considering that only a fraction of those 75% supporters of Irish actually speak the language, I think that says a lot about the general opinion by Irish people about the language. They want to be able to speak it, but were left burned by the awful Irish curriculum.

The answer is simple: All public schools in Ireland should be Gaelscoils by 2060!

starbelgrade

Paparazzo wrote: »

TV4 shows quality movies. Get rid of TV3 or whatever the fúck it's called.

Why would you get rid of a commercial station that pays for itself?

I don't like the station.

I don't like KFC either, but I wouldn't call for it to be shut down.

OPENROAD

PeterIanStaker wrote: »

I'm sure its a subsidy, but then again how much does it cost to keep the HSE on life support, or to ferry useless ministers from point A to point B in a chauffeur driven Merc to spout more bulls hit?

I agree , but it might have escaped your attention the country is in the ****, as I said keep TG4 but maybe merge rte and rte 2, and make cuts elsewhere.

Corsendonk

krudler wrote: »

Fcuk no, TG4 pisses all over RTE's progamming, their movie choices are fantastic. and they were the first Irish station to show The Wire.

Movie choices use to be good, the foreign language movie on friday night was good but then they started to repeat them more often and moved the slot. Some of the western films they show are fairly old copies too and not in the best nick. Curb your Enthusisam is very good.

Scrap it but move the lovely girls to RTE 1 and 2. Early retire Kenny, Finucane, Duffy and all the others overpaid staff and fill the slots with the lovely girls and the better presenters from TG4.

Sardonicat

GizAGoOfYerGee wrote: »

You have to remember that there is a large minority of people in AH that are staunchly against the Irish language. Every pole I've seen here on AH regarding the Irish language is 75% in support and 25% against. (I mean to root out all these polls and post them in a new thread at some stage to prove my stats)

Considering that only a fraction of those 75% supporters of Irish actually speak the language, I think that says a lot about the general opinion by Irish people about the language. They want to be able to speak it, but were left burned by the awful Irish curriculum.

The answer is simple: All public schools in Ireland should be Gaelscoils by 2060!

I'm not anti-Irish. I just can't speak it! And I don't need to be made to feel like a twit for that by someone who can.

Not everyone wants all schools to be Gaelscoils!

Mike 1972

Corsendonk wrote: »

Scrap it but move the lovely girls to RTE 1 and 2. Early retire Kenny, Finucane, Duffy and all the others overpaid staff and fill the slots with the lovely girls and the better presenters from TG4.

If all you want from TV is eye candy perhaps you should be watching the satellite porn channels ?

Sharkey 10

Leave tg4 alone its the only decent domestic channel far better than rte

Corsendonk

Mike 1972 wrote: »

If all you want from TV is eye candy perhaps you should be watching the satellite porn channels ?

Its a recession I can't afford satellite channels! When I can, I will get you to recommend some channels

johngalway

Sardonicat wrote: »

I'm not anti-Irish. I just can't speak it! And I don't need to be made to feel like a twit for that by someone who can.

Not everyone wants all schools to be Gaelscoils!

Who's making you feel that way?

Genuine question.

I'm from Conamara and can't speak Irish worth a damn but I'll defend and value the language and culture we have.

I never seen it as something to beat another over the,head with.

starbelgrade

Sharkey 10 wrote: »

Leave tg4 alone its the only decent domestic channel far better than rte

I don't watch TV much, but when I do, it's mostly RTE for their sports coverage, which in all fairness, is excellent.

I don't even think I can get a signal for TG4.

krudler

Paparazzo wrote: »

TV4 shows quality movies. Get rid of TV3 or whatever the fúck it's called.

:eek:

But then where will we watch the savage intellectualism of Jeremy Kyle and watch such critically acclaimed shows as "The boy with a pineapple for a head" and "Forbidden love: one man and his donkey" ?

PeterIanStaker

krudler wrote: »

:eek:

But then where will we watch the savage intellectualism of Jeremy Kyle and watch such critically acclaimed shows as "The boy with a pineapple for a head" and "Forbidden love:one man and his donkey" ?

3e of course!!

GizAGoOfYerGee

Sardonicat wrote: »

I don't need to be made to feel like a twit for that by someone who can.

I have never deliberately excluded people by speaking in a language that they can't understand. It is entirely rude and does nothing to promote the language.

If you think people are speaking in Irish just to exclude you, they are assholes. Don't blame the language itself.

Mike 1972

Corsendonk wrote: »

I can't afford satellite channels!

A lot of them are free once youve discovered theres more to satellite than 28East/$ky

distraction

best channel we got...IMO

so many great docs and dramas....and movies, tis got it all

jimmycrackcorm

TG4 is a model for ordinary public subsidized broadcasting. It works. I'm biased though because my kids are going through gaelscoil and it helps that they can wath Dora As gaelige during breakfast. whilst not Gaelgoirs, both myself and the missus watch Ros Na Run - it's a bit like a very serious series of Fr. Ted, it gets addictive. I can't stand any of the normal soaps, but herself who controls the tv remote is addicted to all the usual soaps from 7-9. But we share this.

Apart from that, do we really want to turn oursleves into another generic english -language society and totally cut out any sense of Irishness - didn't we already have the penal times for that?

Wastage does not include our core values.

OPENROAD

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

TG4 is a model for ordinary public subsidized broadcasting. It works. I'm biased though because my kids are going through gaelscoil and it helps that they can wath Dora As gaelige during breakfast. whilst not Gaelgoirs, both myself and the missus watch Ros Na Run - it's a bit like a very serious series of Fr. Ted, it gets addictive. I can't stand any of the normal soaps, but herself who controls the tv remote is addicted to all the usual soaps from 7-9. But we share this.

Apart from that, do we really want to turn oursleves into another generic english -language society and totally cut out any sense of Irishness - didn't we already have the penal times for that?

Wastage does not include our core values.

Genuine question here would you be willing to pay a bit extra for it, in terms of licence fee?

johnmcdnl

I love TG4 documentaries actually - with the small budget they have they have a brilliant line up of shows...

Anyone who wants it shut down obviously just doesn't watch it simply because it's in irish and bitching about how useless the irish lanuage is is just cool these days and especially on here - and no other reason...

RTE 1 or RTE 2 to be shut down any day over TG4

maybe cut tub's or pat kenny's wages and a few more wages here and there and it'll be enough to set up TG5