HKC ALARM Installation

altor

Can you post a picture of the contact, Honeywell have a lot of different types.

Officer Goodbody

Yea Sure,

Its a EMPS 85 reed contact. Sorry the picture attached is a little small had to download it form the internet, dont have my camera with me today.

Contact has 5 terminal and is a normally closed contact.

altor

There is no tamper switch on this contact so just wire dual end of line and set the hardware to same.

Officer Goodbody

Thanks Altor.

I wired it as you have shown originally and the panel just keeps saying tamper fault and zone fault. The hardware has been changed to dual end of line.

To try and clear the fault I moved the resistors to the next terminal in the block and it seem to work, as per sketch 2. The problem here is I'm not sure what I did was correct.

Also sketch 1 is a copy of the sketch that came with the contact.

Whats the difference between single end of line and dual end of line?

cheers

altor

Yes, thats correct, I just used an old contact I had as a drawing, the lay out of the contact was different in the Honeywell contact.

The panel picks it up as follows :
Dual covers alarm and tamper, single would only cover alarm or tamper, all depends on how the installer installs it. Dual is always the best way to have it done.

ALL CLOSED 4K7
OPEN 9K4
TAMPER 000000

Officer Goodbody

Thanks Altor,

So the sketch2 that I attached is correct and this is a dual end of line installation.

What did you mean by the following.

ALL CLOSED 4K7
OPEN 9K4
TAMPER 000000

altor

Yes thats is correct.

If you put a meter across the cable in the panel you will get the following :

ALL CLOSED 4K7 Device closed
OPEN 9K4 Device open
TAMPER 000000 Device tamper open

Officer Goodbody

Thanks Altor,

I want to put shock sensors only on the windows upstairs even though they all have openings. I personally dont think anyone would be able to access via an upstairs window without the aid of a ladder or creating a vibration.

There seems to be lots of types and manufactures of shock sensors on the market. Can you advise on a particular shock sensor you would recommend.

Thanks

altor

I would use the HKC shock sensors. If you need something slimmer I would use the ASTEC slim sensors, both are very good and reliable to use. I agree, shock sensors will pick up on a would be intruder trying to force open the window or trying to take out the glass. If there is no access to the windows it is unlikely someone is going to try get in them, a few places I have being to lately have had the sliding door glass removed. They only had a contact installed on it. If you have one in your house make sure you install a shock sensor plus a contact to cover it properly.

Officer Goodbody

Thanks Altor,

Altor I have three windows I want to put a shock senor and seperate contact on in series with four other windows that will just have a shock sensor on. The reason I want to use the sepearte contact is because the shock sensor will be positioned half way down on the window frame and the window opens from the bottom. I have attached a sketch showing a wiring layout for this arrangement using dual end of line. If you have time can you please have a look at it and let me know if I have the wiring correct.

Thanking you in Advance

altor

I have attached a few drawings that should help you out
If you need any more help let me know..

Officer Goodbody

Hi Altor,

Thanks for the attached drawings and they diffential do help however the arrangement that I drew in my previous post is different to all the attached drawings.

The wiring arrangement that I have is as follows:
Window 1: Seperate shock sensor and seperate contact,
Window 2: Seperate shock sensor only
Window 3 Seperate shock sensor
Window 4 : Seperate Shock sensor
Window 5: Seperate shock sensor and seperate windoe contact.

The reason I'm using a seperate window contact rather than a dual sensor is because the window opens from the bottom and the shock sensor is mid window.

Thanks

Officer Goodbody

Sorry spelling error, diffential should be definitely

altor

If they are on a loop it wont make any difference as there is only alarm and tamper on them. The resistors will be going in the last device.

Officer Goodbody

Thanks Altor,

I drew up the attached sketch just to make sure I had the terminals correct for each device in series. Am I right in saying that you just wire in the contact as another device in series and not as a spur from the shock sensor.

Thanks for your help to this point.

altor

The tamper is correct but the alarm is wrong. I will make you up a drawing later that will sort it for you.

altor

In the shock, join the two blacks together in a connector block.

Officer Goodbody

Altor,

Dont really understand your last post.

Did you mean I should wire the black wire as you have shown on my sketch and disregard totally the black wire I had shown.

"In the shock, join the two blacks together in a connector block" Do you mean I should terminate the two black wires in the same termination on the shock sensor or a new connector block:)

altor

Correct, just follow the black line I entered. When you come to the shock sensor the black cable need to be joined together in a connector block as you dont have a free terminal on the shock sensor to join them in.

All this is doing is continuing the black cable from the first sensor to the resistor.

I hope you can follow it

Officer Goodbody

Okay Thanks,

Is that the same for the blue wire?

altor

Follow the blue also, that is in and out through the sensor. Let me know how you get on.

Officer Goodbody

Altor,

I went ahead and bought the Astec shock sensors as per your recommendation.

I installed the circuit as per my attached sketch taking into account your comments from my previous submission, however I seem to be getting a continuous "open contact" on the panel, where do you think I may have gone wrong?

I have changed the hardware to Dual EOL but change no other setting.

altor

If you have a multimeter set it on continuity and check the magnets are lined up correctly to close the reed on the sensor.

Officer Goodbody

Thanks Altor,

I put a multimeter across the black and red wires and measured a resistance of 9k4 so something is open somewhere. I also checked the continuity across the contact and both of them are closed, any other ideas

altor

You will need to check for loose cables.

Officer Goodbody

Okay please help, i have done everthing i know to try and get this circuit to work. I have checked all cables and connections and im still getting 9k4, open circuit, really starting to fall out of love with astec. Those anyone know if there is something special with astec shock sensors that i need to know or even a way to test them to make sure they are working correctly.u

altor

Take the resistors out of the last sensor. Connect the black cable into the contact where the 2 legs of the resistor was. This will close off the circuit. On the first sensor disconnect the 2 black cables from the sensor. Set your meter on continuity. Working back from the last sensor on the loop check continuity between the black and blue cable on each sensor. You may have a broken cable causing the open circuit.

KoolKid

How many sensors are in this loop? If there are a lot, to speed things up start in the middle.Close off the end going to the panel. If it closes from there work forward, if its still open work back towards the panel. Either way you eliminate half the devices .(Unless of course there is more than one open:eek:)

Officer Goodbody

Thanks lads for the help, have to say loving this discussion forum.

I tried everything that you lads mentioned in your previous post and I think I may have found the problem, correct me if Im wrong.

There appeared to be no link at all from one contact/spare terminal to the other contact spare terminal. So reterminated the blue wire as shown on the attached sketch and everything seems to working fine. What do you lads reckon or have I made a security alarm fundamental error. :cool:

altor

Good to see you found the problem. The sensors you bought are shock sensors, not MCs which have a shock and a reed built in to show the opening of the window.