RTÉ DTT Reception difficulties in parts of the south east.

jabarrett35

I have to agree with Black Briar. I live in Tramore and I had my aerial facing towards Mt Leinster and I could not get Irish DTT most of the time. I had to get my aerial moved to the Dungarvan relay which is fine for me because I live at high elevation and on the Dungarvan side of the town. However for others it's signal will not be strong enough. Even if you do not get Presely the mere fact that it is on the same channel is going too cause problems. Unless you live inland you will not be able to get Mt Leinster with any certainty no matter where you suggest we stick our aerials.

Gerry Wicklow

Like may others I already have aerials pointing to both masts. I no longer get DTT from Mt L since they reduced power. The bottom line is that a simple flick of a switch by RTENL to CH39 would eliminate all problems on both sides of the sea.
Since when is asking for common sense "whinging"?

FRIENDO

Good post jabarrett35, I live in Co. Wexford and was able to recieve Irish DTT on channel 39, however since the change to channel 45 I lost all reception. "I ONLY HAVE THE ONE AERIAL."
Mabey a previous post will take note of this fact.

STB

jabarrett35 wrote: »

I have to agree with Black Briar. I live in Tramore and I had my aerial facing towards Mt Leinster and I could not get Irish DTT most of the time. I had to get my aerial moved to the Dungarvan relay which is fine for me because I live at high elevation and on the Dungarvan side of the town. However for others it's signal will not be strong enough. Even if you do not get Presely the mere fact that it is on the same channel is going too cause problems. Unless you live inland you will not be able to get Mt Leinster with any certainty no matter where you suggest we stick our aerials.

Hi jabarret. This is a recent quote I saw from someone which seems to give an opposing view of reception in Tramore on 27/9/2010. He seems to have no problem.

"Waterford Ciy in-fills are:

22 (currently on-air), 25, 28 and 32. I am receiving on a horizontal pointed at Mt. Leinster, so I am assuing H, but the signal is so strong ... )"

Perhaps you could find out what is different in his set up? It may help you. Tlaavtech is the posters name.

jabarrett35

Hi STB Tramore is a quite a big town, if you are on the Waterford side and more inland then I agree Mt Leinster should be fine, but a long the coast that's not the case. The waterford fill ins would be out of range due to topography. We will have to hope that the Dungravan relay will cover the higher parts of the town. May be RTENL will give us are own relay:D

STB

STB wrote: »

Black Briar we will have to agree to disagree. The local installers seem to be of the differing opinion too!

If you are referring to the thread on the wexford forum,that has been taken to pm but lets just say you are wrong in that view.
I know two local installers who one hundred percent agree with my view and have seen the problems.
Some yes ,who want to sell a sat system for UK and Irish channels are singing a different tune.
Some others are saying one thing to one person and a different to another depending on what they want to hear.We can't blame anyone for that,thats business.
The thing is,we are people who are early adopters of digital so we are the few experiencing this situation now..
The shít will hit the fan when everybody has to go digital.

People with High gain aerials pointing the wrong way towards Wales and giving out about not being able to receive DTT are at cross purposes with themselves. You cant be doing both. Make a choice* or use seperate aerials and boxes.

How many times do I have to say to you ,presely comes in around north wexford on grids pointed to mt leinster without mastheads.. and you should know that those are one of the lowest gain you can find.It even is being received as far as Swords on a dongle in lifts,so you can imagine how it wrecks mt leinster on those days.
Said aerials are bringing in perfect tv3/tg4 analogue but digital 50% of the days is unreliable in a lot of areas.
These people are being asked to get saorsat.... instead of rte going to 39 or some other unused channel thats allocated?

Its an inconvenience, we get the point. Anyone who has read the two specific stickies on this topic on this forum and the campaign thread in the Wexford forum will have got the point.

This is a discussion forum you know where things are discussed.It's also a great resource, not a place where we tell people to shut up if you don't like what you are hearing.

Are the local TDs being told that Freesat mirrors Freeview - and that Freeview is a UK directed service that is subject to weather/atmospheric conditions and that the reason for RTE being affected is the positioning of people aerials ? Pre Freesat I might have agreed with you.

This thread is about the mess that presely causes aerial reception of mt leinster dtt rte by the way in parts of the southeast and how the wrong channel is the cause of that.

Your comments about freesat therefore are irrelevant here.

I am not the one doing the whinging.........Thanks for the level headed reply by the way, can you keep it impersonal (your presumptions on whether it effects me may not be true! ).

It's you that accused us of being whingers first in post number 26... to which I replied so don't be accusing me of making something personal.I attack the post and not the poster.
You are making it quite obvious this problem doesn't affect you and that you'd be quite happy to have those not having their perfect analogue mt leinster reception replaced by perfect digital terrestrial reception,just go buy a saorsat system.
Frankly having them to have to do that,spending money unnecessarally when it could easily be corrected by a channel change is whats unacceptable.

I don't live in the area but personally I think it's madness. The "frequency planning" at Mount Leinster, Drogheda and Navan stinks of jamming to me (yes I've said that before).

Why do they see the need to broadcast on a frequency they can't use when there are others free which they can use? I'm sure there's plenty out there who don't have aerials pointing towards Wales that will be affected by this so I don't think it's an issue of choice.

The Cush

Karsini wrote: »

I don't live in the area but personally I think it's madness. The "frequency planning" at Mount Leinster, Drogheda and Navan stinks of jamming to me (yes I've said that before).

Who is jamming who? The frequencies were allocated at the same conference. I think the UK should change their allocation and stop jamming ours.

I'm not sure that it's jamming myself,just sloppy planning and right now some over zealous property rights defence of the shared muxes that leinster and presely have..at the totally unnecessary ultimate expense of the consumer.
I did think jamming for the crack.. was behind Leinster's prolonged quatro mux tests because if it really was a test to see what were the long term effects of the 2 tx's being on the same channel versus the clear ch 39,then they've done nothing about it except accept theres a problem and bury their heads in the sand.

RTENL don't have to behave like the rest of us in a commercial environment though as they are government owned living mostly on the golden goose that is the licence fee.
If they did,this wouldn't be happening.

Mike 1972

Even when one can differentiate between transmitters by moving aerials it doesnt solve the problem of not being able to diplex two aerials in order to receive both.

The Cush wrote: »

I think the UK should change their allocation and stop jamming ours.

Ummmm werent they there first ?

The Cush

Mike 1972 wrote: »

Ummmm werent they there first ?

Neither country had a problem with it at the planning conference. And we know ComReg's position

Please also note that within the Republic of Ireland no protection is afforded to television services originating from outside the Republic of Ireland.

Something else that occured to me this week since Mullaghanish's second mux appeared and Truskmore previously, which of the current 3 unused commercial multiplexes will they power up as the second mux at Mt Leinster? I'll hazard a guess at Ch 39 which should make everyone happy except maybe if they don't switchoff Ch 45.

Gerry Wicklow

Deleted User wrote: »

RTENL don't have to behave like the rest of us in a commercial environment though as they are government owned living mostly on the golden goose that is the licence fee.
If they did,this wouldn't be happening.

I wonder what reception is like in Dublin 4?

STB

Deleted User wrote: »

If you are referring to the thread on the wexford forum,that has been taken to pm but lets just say you are wrong in that view.
I know two local installers who one hundred percent agree with my view and have seen the problems.
Some yes ,who want to sell a sat system for UK and Irish channels are singing a different tune.
Some others are saying one thing to one person and a different to another depending on what they want to hear.We can't blame anyone for that,thats business.
The thing is,we are people who are early adopters of digital so we are the few experiencing this situation now..
The shít will hit the fan when everybody has to go digital.

How many times do I have to say to you ,presely comes in around north wexford on grids pointed to mt leinster without mastheads.. and you should know that those are one of the lowest gain you can find.It even is being received as far as Swords on a dongle in lifts,so you can imagine how it wrecks mt leinster on those days.
Said aerials are bringing in perfect tv3/tg4 analogue but digital 50% of the days is unreliable in a lot of areas.
These people are being asked to get saorsat.... instead of rte going to 39 or some other unused channel thats allocated?


This is a discussion forum you know where things are discussed.It's also a great resource, not a place where we tell people to shut up if you don't like what you are hearing.

This thread is about the mess that presely causes aerial reception of mt leinster dtt rte by the way in parts of the southeast and how the wrong channel is the cause of that.

Your comments about freesat therefore are irrelevant here.

It's you that accused us of being whingers first in post number 26... to which I replied so don't be accusing me of making something personal.I attack the post and not the poster.
You are making it quite obvious this problem doesn't affect you and that you'd be quite happy to have those not having their perfect analogue mt leinster reception replaced by perfect digital terrestrial reception,just go buy a saorsat system.
Frankly having them to have to do that,spending money unnecessarally when it could easily be corrected by a channel change is whats unacceptable.

No I told you the way it is from a objective point of view. You dont like it. We disagree. Dont attack people for disagreeing.

Freeview is the UK. When Wexford becomes part of the UK you can complain to the BBC and Ofcom about your non reception of their channels.

Its quite clear what your gripe is judging by your first sticky here and then your attempt at a second from a differing perspective (interference to Irish DTT). In the fullness of time this situation will sort itself out without lobbying anyone with angles.

The alternative satellite setup I suggested was for UK stations not Saorsat.

If you want to receive the UK stations get a satellite dish like the rest of the country will have to.

We are no longer living in the analogue era, digital UK stations are available via satellite.

This is my last post on the subject and infact here. I will not tolerate bullying and I am aware you were a mod here so you should know better.

STB

STB wrote: »

No I told you the way it is from a objective point of view. You dont like it. We disagree. Dont attack people for disagreeing.

Freeview is the UK. When Wexford becomes part of the UK you can complain to the BBC and Ofcom about your non reception of their channels.

Its quite clear what your gripe is judging by your first sticky here and then your attempt at a second from a differing perspective (interference to Irish DTT). In the fullness of time this situation will sort itself out without lobbying anyone with angles.

The alternative satellite setup I suggested was for UK stations not Saorsat.

If you want to receive the UK stations get a satellite dish like the rest of the country will have to.

We are no longer living in the analogue era, digital UK stations are available via satellite.

This is my last post on the subject and infact here. I will not tolerate bullying and I am aware you were a mod here so you should know better.

Hello ? ? This thread is about RTE reception difficulties here in a part of Ireland where there doesn't have to be difficulties.
You are,unsucessfully I might add,trying to deflect it into something else.
Why I don't know.

lgs 4

Deleted User wrote: »

If you are referring to the thread on the wexford forum,that has been taken to pm but lets just say you are wrong in that view.
I know two local installers who one hundred percent agree with my view and have seen the problems.
Some yes ,who want to sell a sat system for UK and Irish channels are singing a different tune.
Some others are saying one thing to one person and a different to another depending on what they want to hear.We can't blame anyone for that,thats business.
The thing is,we are people who are early adopters of digital so we are the few experiencing this situation now..
The shít will hit the fan when everybody has to go digital.

How many times do I have to say to you ,presely comes in around north wexford on grids pointed to mt leinster without mastheads.. and you should know that those are one of the lowest gain you can find.It even is being received as far as Swords on a dongle in lifts,so you can imagine how it wrecks mt leinster on those days.
Said aerials are bringing in perfect tv3/tg4 analogue but digital 50% of the days is unreliable in a lot of areas.
These people are being asked to get saorsat.... instead of rte going to 39 or some other unused channel thats allocated?


This is a discussion forum you know where things are discussed.It's also a great resource, not a place where we tell people to shut up if you don't like what you are hearing.

This thread is about the mess that presely causes aerial reception of mt leinster dtt rte by the way in parts of the southeast and how the wrong channel is the cause of that.

Your comments about freesat therefore are irrelevant here.

It's you that accused us of being whingers first in post number 26... to which I replied so don't be accusing me of making something personal.I attack the post and not the poster.
You are making it quite obvious this problem doesn't affect you and that you'd be quite happy to have those not having their perfect analogue mt leinster reception replaced by perfect digital terrestrial reception,just go buy a saorsat system.
Frankly having them to have to do that,spending money unnecessarally when it could easily be corrected by a channel change is whats unacceptable.[/QUOTE YOUR AWAYS GOING TO HAVE TV RECEPTION OVER SPILL I HAVE BEING PORTUGAL AND SPAIN AND ITS THE SAME THING THERE THEY WATCH EACH OTHER TV CHANNELS IF ITS THERE AND ITS FREE WHY NOT, BUT IF WANT TO BE A KILL JOY USE BLOCKING FILTERS

lucernarian

This shouldn't be so complicated. If people rely on using Mt. Leinster for TV and have their signal interfered with by Preseli, then there is an issue. Completely irrespective of the fact that overspill viewing takes place. The reports on this forum have made it clear this is happening so far. Whether saorview ERPs have a long way to improve or not, I don't know. But the frequency allocation between the two is not adequate.

But nothing can be done until the service is publicly launched. You can't complain to ComReg over a signal that's not supposed to be received by the public.

Lg4, what are you mentioning portugal and Spain for? That scenario is of relevance only if a viewer in spain can't watch TVÉ because of a portugese broadcast. And filters can't cure co-channel interference.

Also typing in caps is the online equivalent of shouting or being very forceful. If you turn caps lock off, your message will be easier for everyone to read.

The Cush

lgs 4 wrote: »

These people are being asked to get saorsat.... instead of rte going to 39 or some other unused channel thats allocated?

I think they might switch-on Ch 39 as Mt Leinster's second mux with either Ch 42, 45 or 49 as the equipment is already installed for these muxes. So no need for Saorsat.

Second muxes appear to be running at Truskmore, Mullagahanish and now Arklow (Chs.21 & 24)

lgs 4

To_be_confirmed wrote: »

This shouldn't be so complicated. If people rely on using Mt. Leinster for TV and have their signal interfered with by Preseli, then there is an issue. Completely irrespective of the fact that overspill viewing takes place. The reports on this forum have made it clear this is happening so far. Whether saorview ERPs have a long way to improve or not, I don't know. But the frequency allocation between the two is not adequate.

But nothing can be done until the service is publicly launched. You can't complain to ComReg over a signal that's not supposed to be received by the public.

Lg4, what are you mentioning portugal and Spain for? That scenario is of relevance only if a viewer in spain can't watch TVÉ because of a portugese broadcast. And filters can't cure co-channel interference.

Also typing in caps is the online equivalent of shouting or being very forceful. If you turn caps lock off, your message will be easier for everyone to read.

sorry about the caps ,the channel slots where aloted by EBU they got it wrong if they thing that overspill doesnt happen so in the case of mount leinster somebody will have to move channels

watty

It seems to me there are three separate issues:

1) Some people in Wales losing the Com Mux (it's lower power than PSB Mux) due to Irish Interference. Ofcom will bang on Comreg's door.

2) Some people with ordinary aerials pointed at Mt Leinster losing signal due to Welsh Interference. This is a Comreg issue. Not RTE NL. Comreg ought to be talking to Ofcom.

3) Some people want to get Presili and Mt Leinster. That's nice. But it's a lower priority than #1 & #2 and if #1 & #2 is sorted then #3 is inherently fixed.

Comreg and Ofcom need to talk and agree a solution which is then implemented by RTE NL here and Arqiva or whoever there.

Keep calm everyone.

Unfortunately it's the 2nd worst and worst Quangos for Telecoms & RF in all of EU I think...

The Cush

The Cush wrote: »

I think they might switch-on Ch 39 as Mt Leinster's second mux with either Ch 42, 45 or 49 as the equipment is already installed for these muxes. So no need for Saorsat.

Second muxes appear to be running at Truskmore, Mullagahanish and now Arklow (Chs.21 & 24)

They wouldnt want to be switching on 42 or 49 or it will have the same problems of poor and flakey reception due to presely.

Why don't they sensibly request the use of 30 and 34,also cleared internationally for mt leinster and they have no co channel issues or ultimately use the TG4 and TV3 analogue channels after 2012 ?

Why should they pick the less effective channels?

watty

Write to Comreg and BAI.

lgs 4

and maybe the french could get in the act too with there overspill ,there nice big high power mast in brittany which is nice for the people in the south of england ,lets be lite hearted but this

The Cush

lgs 4 wrote: »

the channel slots where aloted by EBU

No, the ITU in conjunction with the ERO, ComReg and Ofcom.

Deleted User wrote: »

Why should they pick the less effective channels?

Possibly because the equipment is already installed

watty wrote: »

Write to Comreg and BAI.

and the ITU

lgs 4

ebu european broadcasting union, what is the ITU

watty

The International Telecommunications Union. They agree between Governments who gets what where.
Wikipedia is your friend on TLAs and other jargon.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ITU

The Cush

lgs 4 wrote: »

ebu european broadcasting union, what is the ITU

watty wrote: »

The International Telecommunications Union. They agree between Governments who gets what where.
Wikipedia is your friend on TLAs and other jargon.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ITU

The Radio Regulations is their bible.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_Regulations

watty

A bargain at 308 Swiss Francs (printed or disc) About 232 EUR

Antenna

watty wrote: »

2) Some people with ordinary aerials pointed at Mt Leinster losing signal due to Welsh Interference. This is a Comreg issue. Not RTE NL. Comreg ought to be talking to Ofcom.

The 'ordinary aerials' are usually going to be Group A (as was for analogue there).
These will have perhaps around zero or negative gain at DTT channel 45, and who knows what poor F/B ratio depending an aerial .
A group A aerial would however have a useful gain at the Channel 39 suggested for use. It would make sense to use a lower channel for the PSB MUX, so as to work with existing aerials

tlaavtech

STB wrote: »

Hi jabarret. This is a recent quote I saw from someone which seems to give an opposing view of reception in Tramore on 27/9/2010. He seems to have no problem.

"Waterford Ciy in-fills are:

22 (currently on-air), 25, 28 and 32. I am receiving on a horizontal pointed at Mt. Leinster, so I am assuing H, but the signal is so strong ... )"

Perhaps you could find out what is different in his set up? It may help you. Tlaavtech is the posters name.

jabarrett35 wrote: »

Hi STB Tramore is a quite a big town, if you are on the Waterford side and more inland then I agree Mt Leinster should be fine, but a long the coast that's not the case. The Waterford fill ins would be out of range due to topography. We will have to hope that the Dungravan relay will cover the higher parts of the town. May be RTENL will give us are own relay:D

Sorry for the delay - Ryder cup-itus

My address is somewhat misleading ... I live in Tramore, but work in Waterford City. The City in-fills are exactly that - City in-fills, and get nowhere near Tramore.

I nearly replied to jabarratt's statement about Mt. Leinster in Tramore, but didn't. I was going to say that I didn't know what the problem was - until I went to watch the Rugby on Saturday. Signal was pants. I don't have exact readings, but signal level has definitely dropped off in the last week. I mostly use DTT at home for Radio, but on Saturday night/Sunday morning it was constantly dropping.

I presume that they have dropped the signal levels to reduce interference in Wales, but my indoor ariel may now need to become an outdoor :mad:

RTENL - USE 39 FFS.

upsilon

newleaf wrote: »

Black Briar, notice you say you're getting DTT from Kippure. Should I be able to get it in Northside Arklow? Doesn't come up on any search at the moment. Just on VHF aerial, but that was fine when DTT was good up to May.
Also do you think I'd get UK free to air on aerial? Here was never great for UK analogue.

Arklow Digital TX is ON on channel 21. I get it 85% in mountain Bay. I have UHF aerial pointing at mount leinster in Wexford. Did not even need to turn the area. RTE HD Test transmission is ON. Stunning !!!