How Bout Dem Bears?

kennyb3

gufc21 wrote: »

Its on sky

First round only though.

I ll watch it 'fake' live Friday evening as can't justify staying up with work next day.

I love the draft though, doing the research, watching videos and doing mock drafts. The night itself is brilliant and I ll watch 2nd and 3rd round on phone.

Just wish we had more picks. Really like to trade back in first add another pick in top 75 to give us 4 in that region. Better chance of getting at least 2 starters out of that and hopefully 3.

Badabing

Bears sign TE Pascoe, no link yet sorry

crunchie44

Perfect thanks. Finish work at 12 so straight home for few beers and watch the draft

SameOleJay

Excited for the week ahead now. I can’t remember a time when there was such little consensus on the top prospects. From what I’m reading Winston, Williams and Cooper are the three home run prospects at 7. The likelihood is none of them will be there.

So who would you be happy with and is there a position you want to avoid at 7? It looks heavy odds on that it’s an edge rusher or wide-out. White? Fowler? Beasley?

From the entire draft I’m hoping for contributors at receiver, edge rusher and d-line. There’s not much there at safety. A project at running back might be worthwhile too.

kennyb3

SameOleJay wrote: »

Excited for the week ahead now. I can’t remember a time when there was such little consensus on the top prospects. From what I’m reading Winston, Williams and Cooper are the three home run prospects at 7. The likelihood is none of them will be there.

So who would you be happy with and is there a position you want to avoid at 7? It looks heavy odds on that it’s an edge rusher or wide-out. White? Fowler? Beasley?

From the entire draft I’m hoping for contributors at receiver, edge rusher and d-line. There’s not much there at safety. A project at running back might be worthwhile too.

I wouldn't touch Winston with a bargepole - so thankfully he won't be there.

I'd love Williams but it's unlikely he'll be there.

It really comes down to value imho. The edge rushers seem a hit and miss/boom or bust lot. No one player sticks out. I've changed my mind back and forth on them and it really depends what you wan't from them. I'd trust this staff though with whoever they pick.

Good chance at least one if not both Beasley & Fowler are off the board to the Jags & Redskins before we pick anyway. Ray has foot issue, and #7 is too rich for Gregory & Dupree for me.

Shelton looks the safest pick if Williams is gone to me - I think he is a 3 down player - many don't but 7 might be bit rich in some peoples mind but I think he is a 7-10 year solid player. You don't try be smart you just pick him. My ideal scenario is to trade down a few spots and still pick him up but that's risky obviously. I'm not sure if he's what Fangio looks for in his NT though.

The obvious one seems to be to pick one of White or Cooper (whichever one falls) as only Raiders and Jets above us in the market for WR. However as I alluded to above I don't really see the point of this when you've a QB you've not much trust in and you want to run the ball with a leaky oline. The less Jay throws the better. Also with such a deep WR draft 1 or 2 good ones will easily be there at 39 when we pick again.

None of the tackles are worth a pick at 7 either imho.

So in summary I see it as:

1. Take a WR at 7 (safe)
2. Take an edge rusher at 7 (riskier but you have to trust this staff at this point given the experience)
3. Take shelton at 7
4. Trade back and get more picks in what looks a deep draft that lacks top end talent

I'm probably taking option 4, unless Williams falls to us. If you can go back to say 12 (300 points on trade chart) and get an extra pick inside top 65 I think that's ideal. It's likely that Shelton, one of the edge rushers, a top OT and a top WR is available.

You've 3 more picks then in top 75 to attack OT/DT/OLB/WR/ILB (you can cover 3 of the 5 with other covered by 1st round pick).

We've so many holes we need the picks. I could have added RB & CB & S to that list too which is scary.

It's really hard to tell at this point - it all depends how the draft falls, value, how enamoured they are with a player.

I think the edge rushers are the key - do they love one? Do they think they are an average bunch and go a different direction.

padraig_f

kennyb3 wrote: »

4. Trade back and get more picks in what looks a deep draft that lacks top end talent

I'm probably taking option 4, unless Williams falls to us. If you can go back to say 12 (300 points on trade chart) and get an extra pick inside top 65 I think that's ideal. It's likely that Shelton, one of the edge rushers, a top OT and a top WR is available.

Trading back seems to make a lot of sense, but need a partner willing to trade up as well. May be hard to get value for trading back in this kind of draft.

Poll of pundits' top-10s on MMQB:
http://mmqb.si.com/2015/04/27/philip-rivers-trade-titans-chargers-nfl-draft/6/

Not a lot of consensus, but no-one has Amari Cooper going lower than 3, so looks like Kevin White will be the only WR option.

kennyb3

Yep you always need a partner and we could do with being a tiny higher but you never know. The Browns for example could love white or one of the edge guys. There is talk of New Orleans going after one of edge guys (2 first round picks and whoever they like mighn't get to first one at 13). They seem like the immediately obvious two for a trade imo.

Would be ideal in my mind but we've talked about doing so for years and never really done so.

Only 6 picks with all our holes is worrying really - I think we need to play the %'s really. Otherwise we're really relying on these coaches development skills.

Emery was such a disaster - we invested multiple picks at DT last year, multiple at LBer the year before and multiple at safety over the 3 years and we are still talking about those as areas of need & weaknesses. Not to mention our 1st round DE/OLB who shall not be named.

Out of 3 full draft we've Long, Jeffrey & Fuller as starting players. That's scary really. Ferguson still has a good chance though. I don't hold out much hope for too many others based on what I saw on the field.

edit: Also just to add the guy that could really help us move back is Gurley. He'll likely be there at 7 and there could be a good few teams interested. Yes it's a running back and at top of the 1st round but you just know one team will do something to get him.

kennyb3

If the Brockers rumours could somehow be true it would be amazing

kennyb3

http://wgnplus.com/2015/04/29/10-bears-things-what-you-need-to-know-from-the-bears-first-minicamp-practice/

Realt Dearg Sec

kennyb3 wrote: »

http://wgnplus.com/2015/04/29/10-bears-things-what-you-need-to-know-from-the-bears-first-minicamp-practice/

Forte's hold out is idiotic in so very many ways. He's got exactly zero guaranteed money this year, and in all probability will be cut next year. He's looking for an extension that I just don't see him getting. And however good he's been, at his position at his age and with no cap implications, he has no leverage. What he has is a look of a guy who is "me first" team second. Which is fine, it's a business, but when that extends to skipping camps, in a team whose collapse last year was partly due to a lack of team cohesion, there really isn't room going forward for people like that. He has everything to lose.

Now the bears would lose a great rb, but so what? We'd be drafting a new one next year anyway as part of the rebuild, and if he's throwing the toys out if the pram , much as I love his play (and own his jersey) and much as he was a rare highlight in last year's offense, I'd be neither shocked nor devastated if he was cut.

incidentally I heard he didn't attend to receive his Brian piccolo award a few days ago, which would be seen as a very serious snub by halas hall.

The other two not attending I had heard nothing about till I read that article. Not players I want to hear about the possibility of being reticent, but Bennett at least has enough history of being a pre season pain in the hole that I wouldn't worry about him.

kennyb3

He's since come out and said it was cause he was speed trading. Yet fox seemed annoyed. I Reckon he'll play this year and then be gone.

Not showing for the award was bad form.

Ratliff I'd imagine it's a personal/training issue. Doubt there is much up there. Otherwise they ll just draft a NT in 2nd or 3rd and use them with ego.

As for Marty God knows - he had great year yes but he's only 2 years into a contract. They are unlikely to put up with his bull IMHO, he's far from a premium player despite what he thinks of himself.

kennyb3

Marty apparently on the trading block as is mcclellin,who I'd happily take a bag of crisps for.

Realt Dearg Sec

kennyb3 wrote: »

Marty apparently on the trading block as is mcclellin,who I'd happily take a bag of crisps for.

Wow, I'm surprised about Marty. I mean, I agree he's not as great as he rates himself but he's a real receiving option. Given we've lost Marshall, and forte is acting the child, we really don't need to be going looking fir a TE again as well. Don't think we'll get any first year starter at that position in the draft.

McClellin? Pfff, someone had to have the squares eventually to admit he's a bust.

SameOleJay

I'll be so pis$ed if Marty goes.

Decent receiving tight-ends are so rare.

kennyb3

I wouldn't love it but at same time I'd rather he go and have a together team rather than the circus that was lat year. Fox & Pace are being clear - the circus has left town.

Innish_Rebel

So who do we hope the bears take???

I wouldn't mind a trade back for some additional picks. I know a lot of mock drafts have the WR's heading our way (and a CB from the "expert" ??????). But I'm not sure Jeffery will be a year older & wiser, I was thinking Wilson looked a real prospect until he broke the collerbone. I feel - take pressure off offence, i.e. stop conceding - draft defensive side in early rounds...

kennyb3

The less we throw the ball the better, so I don't want a WR in the 1st - we can get a #2/#3 WR in RD2 or 3. Jeffrey, Royal & a nd/3rd rounder is sufficient imho (esp if Marty doesn't go and Wilson could develop but is over hyped at present). However if cooper is there I take him as he is a can't miss prospect.

So with likliehood Cooper is gone we go edge rusher, DT (Shelton) or OT.

7 for any of the OT is way too early so we'd want to trade back to do that imho.

So i take Shelton or whoever they fancy as the edge rusher assuming one falls.

I hope it's Shelton as I just can't work out the edge guys - all have their strengths and weaknesses. I'll trust teh staff given it's experience if they take one but I really won't know how to feel.

I just pray that Williams somehow falls, if not then Cooper falls and then if not they just pick Shelton. That's my hopes in order really.

Also just to add I want no part in a CB at 7, Fuller was a better prospect for me than Waynes and we got him at 14. The CB's in the 20-25 range are very comparable to him, if not better depending on what teams are looking for.

Realt Dearg Sec

Obviously Williams is the ideal but he won't drop to us. After that I would want a trade back but as I said in the draft thread, I don't see one being available this year. I'd be pretty happy with Shelton too, but I also like Vic Beasley if he gets past the jets. Would not like a corner either, apart from the fact that there isn't any value there, it's a rare position that we aren't totally desperate in right now (one that can switch to safety would be nice but not in the first round)

kennyb3

I'd re-build our front 7 first, if we can't get pressure doesn't matter the CB. (fuller was killed when Rodgers had all day at Solider field)

That's why I'd like Shelton. Try running on him, McDonald & Ratliff. And it will free up McPhee (& others) to rush the passer more than play the run.

We are one injury to McDonald or Ratliff away from having no front 3 to be honest. Ego & Jarvis Jenkins on the line? We need more good players there for sure. Hence I'd be all over that Brockers trade but it won't happen it seems.

I'd also like to add to our Oline with best OT or guard in 2nd/3rd/4rd, as we need Oline men that can help run the ball.

My draft would draft would be something like this:

7 - Shelton
39 - Harold
71 - Best OT/G
106 - Best WR

or

7 - Best edge guy (say Beasley for example)
39 - Jordan Phillips
71 - Best OT/G
106 - Best WR

You get the picture. I could easily swap around the 1,2,3,4. I just don't want the OT/G or WR (Cooper aside) in the first unless we trade back at least 4/5 spots.

There are so many ways we can go as we've holes but I'd really like a DT/OLB/OT or G in 3 of first 4 rounds. They just have to look for value and good solid football players not guys that are athletes or who need massive development. I'd even be happy with an Eric Kendricks at 39 given you just know he's going to be a good player.

I really think we ideally want more picks though unless Williams or Cooper fall.

SameOleJay

If this tweet is accurate then trading down is pretty much off the cards as far as I’m concerned.

Terrible value.

If Amari Cooper or Leonard Williams make it to 5, Browns & Skins resume discussions. 2 Players atop Browns Board. Deal consist Picks 12 & 43

kennyb3

Right time to click unfollow as I won't get to watch until Friday night.

Enjoy the draft if you are staying up and hopefully it will be good to us.

Oat23

Been so distracted with other crap over the past few weeks, the draft has blindsided me. I have no idea about any of the players other than the main ones, and the ones I've seen play from time-to-time over the past few seasons. I've done no research at all as I thought the draft was in mid May

Lets hope it goes well for us.

Realt Dearg Sec

Not a pick I'm happy with. He could turn out great and I hope he does of course, but we shouldn't have been in a position of betting on white. To me it's like Pace has inherited a team full of defensive needs, then created a desperate need for receiving options, and forced his own hand on the first round pick. I really hope this works out, but even if it does, it puts us one more year away from finding the difference maker we need on defence, the guy we haven't had since 54. Unless they have a serious surprise in round two.

Either way I'm not delighted there.

Guffy

Horrible pick imo. Prob the best on the board but we really needed to sort our D out

SameOleJay

Alot of defensive talent left for day 2.

But yeah, we're certainly pinning our hopes on Fangio.

padraig_f

Don't follow college football or didn't do any draft research, so don't know about the other options, but like what I heard about Kevin White....freak athlete, can beat players down the field or win in the air.

Pace said his draft strategy was to pick best-player-available, and he stuck to that. It's a passing league, there's a big need at WR after Marshall leaving, so I'm happy with the pick.

Obviously a lot of needs elsewhere, but I think Pace realises he's not gonna fix it in one draft, so best-player-available makes sense to me.

SameOleJay

I have no issue if people think White will bust or he hasn't got the goods but if you agree he was BPA I don't think you can hold the pick against Pace.

What's interesting is that there is some great talent at offensive line still there. I wonder if Pace will pass on D again if his top prospect there is an o-lineman.

ABajaninCork

I'm glad everyone thinks the same. I thought White was a HORRIBLE pick. Especially, as Vic Beasley was still there at No. 7...

Personally, I'd have liked to see the Bears trade up to get Williams, but I like Beasley too and think both will do well.

The Bears can't draft for toffee. Apart from Urlacher, and Kyle Long there have been some awful first round picks. I still can't get over the fact the Bears drafted Benson and left Cadillac Williams on the board all those years ago...

Realt Dearg Sec

ABajaninCork wrote: »

I'm glad everyone thinks the same. I thought White was a HORRIBLE pick. Especially, as Vic Beasley was still there at No. 7...

Personally, I'd have liked to see the Bears trade up to get Williams, but I like Beasley too and think both will do well.

The Bears can't draft for toffee. Apart from Urlacher, and Kyle Long there have been some awful first round picks. I still can't get over the fact the Bears drafted Benson and left Cadillac Williams on the board all those years ago...

I don't think it's a horrible pick, I just would have preferred a defensive guy, and certainly wouldn't have been over the moon about picking a wr early when there's such depth there. White has huge potential. As to the bears drafting badly, this is the first time pace has done it so it's too early to tell. Also he hasn't had time to implement his own system for drafting so I would hood judgement until about 2017 if we're giving him a chance to build the team he wants. So yeah, I'm not big on white, but you can't miss in the top ten so it's no big deal I guess.

Regarding Kyle long, though, everyone thought he was a horrible pick at the time. It'll take time to see whether the draft has been a good one, but I'm very happy with the second round pick anyway, think he's going to be there day one, literally a huge addition, and a steal in the second round. Grasu I have heard a lot of people raving about so we'll see, but I don't know much about him.

mayordenis

Think we've drafted well so far, C and DT were absolutely needed, and I think we took the player with the biggest upside in round 1.

The big comparison people are throwing out for White is Larry Fitz but with speed, and while you can't read too much into comparisons like that, if it's even 50% true he'll be special.

I think people forget just how bad our offense was last year, horribly frustrating and Marshall was a big part of that, had turned into a guy with a **** attitude, mostly injured, and slow when on the field.

If, and it's a big if, we keep Alshon, we have the potential for one of the best receiving groups around.