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Bookmakers Bitch/Moan/Groan thread - See mod warning Post 1!

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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,698 ✭✭✭zimmermania


    Did you notice if the reserves were priced up?
    Yes the reserves were priced up but not listed as reserves,my main gripe is that under no circumstances whatsoever can a punter get 4 places as the safety limit is 14 runners but yet the board with the horses priced up shows 17 runners and 1/4 the odds.

    The board should read 3 places as that is the only outcome that can occur.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,277 ✭✭✭✭thesandeman


    Yes the reserves were priced up but not listed as reserves,my main gripe is that under no circumstances whatsoever can a punter get 4 places as the safety limit is 14 runners but yet the board with the horses priced up shows 17 runners and 1/4 the odds.

    The board should read 3 places as that is the only outcome that can occur.

    Oh I know. I'm just wondering do they bring in a rule 4 as well seeing as the reserves (or others) won't be running.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,698 ✭✭✭zimmermania


    Oh I know. I'm just wondering do they bring in a rule 4 as well seeing as the reserves (or others) won't be running.
    I doubt it but would not put it past them.


  • Site Banned Posts: 880 ✭✭✭whiteshorts


    Looking through bookie sign on offers and noticed Bet365 have slashed their opening offer!
    Used to be "matched 1st deposit up to 200 and didn't need to be rolled before betting and was abloe to withdraw after betting the 1st 200".
    Easiest way was to place 200 on something and place the bonus 200 on the same event so a 400 stake for the price of 200.
    Now it's matched as free bets up to 100 available after settled bets of the original 100, so no extra cash and bonus bet stakes not refunded.
    Strange that new account openings have soared (as have profits) in last year.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 137 ✭✭5555555555


    Hi,

    I'm not much of a gambler but I logged on to PP to put a bet on the Champions league final tomorrow. I noticed that all my betting history had been wiped, including two open bets i had since 2016.

    I contacted the PP live chat and they said there had been a system migration last year and this was why i could not see my betting history. They also said if my bets come in I will be paid.

    Has anyone else had the same issue ?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,426 ✭✭✭montyrebel


    what were the open bets?


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,249 ✭✭✭Juwwi


    Did a treble Saturday in a Boyles shop ,

    I wrote €50 treble on the docket and in the stake box put 50 ,

    I changed my mind and decided I'd put €70 on it ,I changed the stake box to €70 and paid €70 ,the girl stamps it €70 .

    I forgot to change the €50 treble on the docket to €70 tho .

    Went into collect today and was being offered a €50 treble and €20 refund for an over stake .

    Argued the point l had 70 wrote down the bottom and paid 70 its obvious l wanted a €70 bet .

    Got paid in full eventually but someone on the end of the phone was advising the girl to pay only a €50 treble .

    I wonder if it had of lost would they of returning €20 or say it all went on a €70 treble.

    Bunch of chancers .


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,698 ✭✭✭zimmermania


    robbie1977 wrote: »
    Did a treble Saturday in a Boyles shop ,

    I wrote €50 treble on the docket and in the stake box put 50 ,

    I changed my mind and decided I'd put €70 on it ,I changed the stake box to €70 and paid €70 ,the girl stamps it €70 .

    I forgot to change the €50 treble on the docket to €70 tho .

    Went into collect today and was being offered a €50 treble and €20 refund for an over stake .

    Argued the point l had 70 wrote down the bottom and paid 70 its obvious l wanted a €70 bet .

    Got paid in full eventually but someone on the end of the phone was advising the girl to pay only a €50 treble .

    I wonder if it had of lost would they of returning €20 or say it all went on a €70 treble.

    Bunch of chancers .

    You would not not have a hope of getting your 20 back.
    Staff are not trained and do not understand anything about betting as a rule.


  • Registered Users Posts: 34 JagoMoon


    Just wondering if anyone else is having the same experience as myself. Firstly Id like to say I'm just betting in shops at the moment so betting online is not the issue. So anyways, I find a bet i like i check oddschecker see the price for the two bets 4/6 & 1/1, then double check with the bookmakers website everything the same. But then when i go to the shop I'm told the prices in the shop are 8/15 and 10/11. Staff reinforce the point shop prices are different to online.

    I just don't get how they can rip people off like that. Rant over!


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,611 ✭✭✭Dr. Bre


    JagoMoon wrote: »
    Just wondering if anyone else is having the same experience as myself. Firstly Id like to say I'm just betting in shops at the moment so betting online is not the issue. So anyways, I find a bet i like i check oddschecker see the price for the two bets 4/6 & 1/1, then double check with the bookmakers website everything the same. But then when i go to the shop I'm told the prices in the shop are 8/15 and 10/11. Staff reinforce the point shop prices are different to online.

    I just don't get how they can rip people off like that. Rant over!

    Is it to encourage people to set up online account? I know the golf that online paddy will pay top ten but in shop only 7.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 34 JagoMoon


    Dr. Bre wrote: »
    Is it to encourage people to set up online account? I know the golf that online paddy will pay top ten but in shop only 7.

    I just don't get how their prices can differ from online to their shops. Surely the company should be able to stand over their prices on all their platforms. It just seems like they're ripping people off in the shops.


  • Registered Users Posts: 723 ✭✭✭slimshady007


    JagoMoon wrote: »
    I just don't get how their prices can differ from online to their shops. Surely the company should be about the stand over their prices on all their platforms. It just seems like they're ripping people off in the shops.

    It's all about data. They got nothing on a Joe soap walking in to a shop but online they can track your bets, your stakes, profit/losses, etc so they can limit your account if needs be. In the shop they have no such edge and have to take the bet most of the time hence why they don't give offers as good as online to reduce their exposure. Agree it's wrong but not sure there's any law against it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,893 ✭✭✭✭PopePalpatine


    My own personal theory is that they're taking advantage of the average person who still hangs around in their shops. Take a look inside a bookie's, what do you see? It's mostly >50-year-old guys who can barely figure out how to use Facebook, never mind Oddschecker.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,698 ✭✭✭zimmermania


    My own personal theory is that they're taking advantage of the average person who still hangs around in their shops. Take a look inside a bookie's, what do you see? It's mostly >50-year-old guys who can barely figure out how to use Facebook, never mind Oddschecker.

    Generalisations are never entirely accurate.In one of my local shops i get 1/4 the odds all handicaps singles and more importantly multiples rather than the 1/5 available online.

    I also find that the 4 places sometimes offered on races with less than 16 runners offers some value.Shops are essential if one has a "live" one and wants to hold onto an online account.Punters should use whatever suits them best and i find that using both methods is best for me.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,853 ✭✭✭Glenbhoy


    Generalisations are never entirely accurate.In one of my local shops i get 1/4 the odds all handicaps singles and more importantly multiples rather than the 1/5 available online.

    I also find that the 4 places sometimes offered on races with less than 16 runners offers some value.Shops are essential if one has a "live" one and wants to hold onto an online account.Punters should use whatever suits them best and i find that using both methods is best for me.

    Would agree to an extent, shops can be very useful, especially taking advantage of specials. An added benefit of shops is that you don't fritter away your winnings on a late night nasl game, just for the interest!! I tend to have my bets decided on long before I enter the shop, go in, write them out and head off. No need to hang around for the day, trying to resist the allure of virtual racing, remember, there's nothing virtual about your winnings as I heard them say last time I was in!!!


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,853 ✭✭✭Glenbhoy


    Has anyone else noticed the amount of changes downwards between quoted prices and prices immediately prior to striking bets, particularly in-running? Seems to me that these reductions are pretty systematic and simply another way of increasing margins, am I being paranoid or has anyone else noticed similar. It's pretty widespread across the board.
    Some bookmakers 'very helpfully' allow you to change your settings to ignore such changes and strike the bet anyway, something I would strongly recommend is avoided.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,133 ✭✭✭akelly02


    Went into Boyle’s to withdraw €600 that I have on my online account.

    I rang customer services beforehand , they said just bring ID and my acc number and there will be no problem.

    Call into shop and your one rings it in and says no, the money has to go back to the card as it came from the card.

    I told them I done this last month in a different shop and there was no problem.

    They said they only gave it to me last time as a gesture. I was never notified it was a gesture

    In the end she ended up giving me half as a ****ing gesture

    Anyone face anything similar?


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,698 ✭✭✭zimmermania


    akelly02 wrote: »
    Went into Boyle’s to withdraw €600 that I have on my online account.

    I rang customer services beforehand , they said just bring ID and my acc number and there will be no problem.

    Call into shop and your one rings it in and says no, the money has to go back to the card as it came from the card.

    I told them I done this last month in a different shop and there was no problem.

    They said they only gave it to me last time as a gesture. I was never notified it was a gesture

    In the end she ended up giving me half as a ****ing gesture

    Anyone face anything similar?

    That is just crazy,i have no trouble withdrawing cash with my cash card in Powers.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,336 ✭✭✭✭Collie D


    In Powers you can only withdraw the surplus on your last deposit in shop i.e. You deposit €100 online and turn it into €200. You would only be able to take your €100 profit out in shop.

    Could be the same in Boyles.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,133 ✭✭✭akelly02


    Collie D wrote: »
    In Powers you can only withdraw the surplus on your last deposit in shop i.e. You deposit €100 online and turn it into €200. You would only be able to take your €100 profit out in shop.

    Could be the same in Boyles.

    It’s a joke, money is money . Of course squandered some of the €300 out of pure thickness also


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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,698 ✭✭✭zimmermania


    akelly02 wrote: »
    It’s a joke, money is money . Of course squandered some of the €300 out of pure thickness also

    I did not know that,i have never deposited in a shop i use paypal online but it is nonsensical that one cannot draw out ones own money.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,133 ✭✭✭akelly02


    I did not know that,i have never deposited in a shop i use paypal online but it is nonsensical that one cannot draw out ones own money.

    i know, i was so annoyed , i was in the shop for a good 20 mins before the old lady says i cant withdraw my own money


  • Registered Users Posts: 23,850 ✭✭✭✭mailburner


    Why is it some bookies offer you a 100% cashout after you have place a bet an other 80-85%...think it might be 85minimum but not certain?

    I have a 50 single on with bet365 right now and I can cash out for full amount yet if it was betway to name one that would be 40-45 tops

    I hate that!

    It's another reason bet365 are the top bookie I guess.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,595 ✭✭✭LizardKing


    Had a PP account I setup in 2007 .. got an email saying the €7.19 in funds would be taken unless i signed in (some dormant account charge)

    logged in (eventually after getting help via chat) and made some bets to use up the cash. Then I was watching the National and said feck it and loaded money via CC and laid a few bets. lost most of the money.

    Next day noticed cash advance fees on the CC (I recall this back in the day and forgot they charge it)

    I then got onto PP to remove the CC as the UI did not allow it (says to talk to support)

    The fella said he'd take a look and then says no you need to do X, Y and Z ( take photos of the card and send to some email)

    I was like , WTF ... surely this is illegal... he said no its due to money laundering rules... I said a feck this I will be closing my account

    They let you load money into PP on the cards no problems but make it really difficult to remove the cards!!!!

    I have to wait for some open bets to close first before I close my account.

    I'm just wondering in todays GDPR world if they can deny my request to remove my personal information?

    Its obviously a ploy to make it harder for gamblers to remove methods to top up

    #RANTOVER


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,981 ✭✭✭3DataModem


    LizardKing wrote: »
    Had a PP account I setup in 2007 .. got an email saying the €7.19 in funds would be taken unless i signed in (some dormant account charge)

    logged in (eventually after getting help via chat) and made some bets to use up the cash. Then I was watching the National and said feck it and loaded money via CC and laid a few bets. lost most of the money.

    Next day noticed cash advance fees on the CC (I recall this back in the day and forgot they charge it)

    I then got onto PP to remove the CC as the UI did not allow it (says to talk to support)

    The fella said he'd take a look and then says no you need to do X, Y and Z ( take photos of the card and send to some email)

    I was like , WTF ... surely this is illegal... he said no its due to money laundering rules... I said a feck this I will be closing my account

    They let you load money into PP on the cards no problems but make it really difficult to remove the cards!!!!

    I have to wait for some open bets to close first before I close my account.

    I'm just wondering in todays GDPR world if they can deny my request to remove my personal information?

    Its obviously a ploy to make it harder for gamblers to remove methods to top up

    #RANTOVER

    Making a deposit on a dormant account, and then asking for the funding method to be removed, is an absolutely massive money laundering and fraud trigger for online bookmakers. And yes they all say "but I'm not money laundering" and they all say "but it's a tiny amount of money" etc etc.

    Almost all of their regulators (in your case the relevant regulator is probably Malta) require cashouts to be first processed back to the method used to deposit.

    If you want to be forgotten (persuant to article 17 of GDPR) then they have the ability to refuse, as they are required to hold data - especially financial data - to comply with various laws, and that is one of the grounds where refusal to comply with a request is allowed.

    (note: I don't work for PP, but I do work in the gambling sector)


  • Registered Users Posts: 933 ✭✭✭Tomw86


    I don't often use Bet365 for tennis betting, but did this morning.

    One selection won because his opponent retired and they settle it as VOID, rather than a winner. I have been on the phone to them and apparently this is their policy.

    It is an absolute disgrace and cop out.

    As far as I can see, PP and Betfair would settle that as a winner.

    Has anyone else any experience of this?

    I would urge people to avoid Bet365 tennis betting like the plague due to this.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,479 ✭✭✭The Rooster


    Tomw86 wrote: »
    I don't often use Bet365 for tennis betting, but did this morning.

    One selection won because his opponent retired and they settle it as VOID, rather than a winner. I have been on the phone to them and apparently this is their policy.

    It is an absolute disgrace and cop out.

    As far as I can see, PP and Betfair would settle that as a winner.

    Has anyone else any experience of this?

    I would urge people to avoid Bet365 tennis betting like the plague due to this.
    First came across this last year at Wimbledon. Last leg of a 4 fold, my lad was 2 sets to 1 up and 3-0 up in 4th set when his opponent retired. My lad was 2/1 underdog, but that leg was settled as Void. My return was 150 instead of 450 if the other fecker hadn’t thrown the towel in!

    I think that was with BV. Very annoying and I had no idea that was the rule, but when I checked the rules it was there alright. And me being me, it felt much more like a 300 loss rather than a 150 win!

    I suppose it can save accas too, if it’s your pick that retires when he’s near beaten.


  • Registered Users Posts: 933 ✭✭✭Tomw86


    First came across this last year at Wimbledon. Last leg of a 4 fold, my lad was 2 sets to 1 up and 3-0 up in 4th set when his opponent retired. My lad was 2/1 underdog, but that leg was settled as Void. My return was 150 instead of 450 if the other fecker hadn’t thrown the towel in!

    I think that was with BV. Very annoying and I had no idea that was the rule, but when I checked the rules it was there alright. And me being me, it felt much more like a 300 loss rather than a 150 win!

    I suppose it can save accas too, if it’s your pick that retires when he’s near beaten.

    Yeah can work both ways too I suppose.

    Cost me 40 quid yesterday as my lad was 1 set up and 3-0 up in a 3 set match.

    It is definitely in the T&C's for tennis betting, but it is inconsistent with all other sports where if your player (esp relating to golf) retires you do not get a refund and if in matchplay you would get awarded the win.

    Lesson learnt I suppose.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,479 ✭✭✭The Rooster


    Tomw86 wrote: »
    Yeah can work both ways too I suppose.

    Cost me 40 quid yesterday as my lad was 1 set up and 3-0 up in a 3 set match.

    It is definitely in the T&C's for tennis betting, but it is inconsistent with all other sports where if your player (esp relating to golf) retires you do not get a refund and if in matchplay you would get awarded the win.

    Lesson learnt I suppose.

    Presumably there is some logic to it, but can't say I understand it!

    Must lead to the odd temptation for a lad to say he's injured when he's on the verge of defeat if he knows he has mates who put on a lot of wedge on him to win!


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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,981 ✭✭✭3DataModem


    Tomw86 wrote: »
    Yeah can work both ways too I suppose.

    It is definitely in the T&C's for tennis betting,.

    Because tennis is absolutely full of cheating... it is the sport that the gambling business trusts the least.

    If you are losing a match you can retire to void bets rather than take the loss and crystallise the bet. It is also very hard to detect cheating / fixing.

    Even at the high levels, there have been cases where friendly players have ensured matches finish in 2 sets rather than three (i.e. the loser of the first agrees to throw the second), which gives the winner more rest and recuperation time and less injury chance for the next round.

    Certain tennis-playing sisters used to be accused of this early in their career.


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