Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Why it is in YOUR OWN INTEREST not to strike or protest at this time (mid May 2010).
Options
Comments
-
-
-
-
-
-
Advertisement
-
-
-
-
-
-
Advertisement
-
-
-
-
DeVore you nearly convinced me... thing is though, a lot of people like me have no trust in anyone anymore.
Speculators, the markets, that's all over my head tbh.
What you are arguing though, is that we should trust you that a protest would be detrimental, when, with all due respect, you are just "someone (with credentials of course) off the internet".
Don't mean to offend at all, it's just I find it hard accept that I should trust you, just the same as I'd find it hard to accept politicians views right now.
To me a protest would be a way to encourage some new (real) politician to emerge. Realistically, of the thousands of dissatisfied people in the country, there must be some people like you who have a valuable message to communicate, and would be honest, "on our side" people. But so far these people have not stepped out(in?). Maybe with the assurance that thousands of proactive (by that I mean, people who are willing to march, and will probably vote en masse) people may back them, some of these budding "people defenders" might take the plunge. Who would commit their current life to politics when we're all sitting like big lumps waiting for things to happen to us ?
I am French DeVore, and back in France as you well know, protests and strikes are a daily occurence. This is nothing new, this has been going on since the 60s. Not all protests are hijacked, and most protests are peaceful. Obviously you are more likely to hear about the non-peaceful, or hijacked ones on the news. But the pressure is there on the government, on a regular basis. I can just picture the politicians sat at a big shiny table in a meeting room, coming up with all sorts of ideas, with one fellow interjecting every so often : "jaysus, don't even think about it, don't you know they'll be down in a flash, marching up to us and demanding audiences" (in French
).
But you see, that is exactly what I (don't want to talk for all others) would like to see in Ireland. For the politicians to not just come up with an idea, act on it, and if the people don't like it well... ok.
It is their job to develop an idea into something palatable and efficient at the same time, and to aim to please everyone while taking efficient measures.
Just like in France, it could be a constant struggle, and tension, and lots of opportunities to give out and moan. But the fact is, they're better off than we are right now, and there is some sort of a dialogue between the government and the people, and it's on-going. We're not talking spectacular achievements here, we're talking genuine negociations, not just pretend beforehand ones.
I think a peaceful protest has the power to instill a bit of a dialogue between the people and the decision makers, and would generate this kind of beneficial tension, especially so while there are no elections.
Sorry I tend to go on so
.
As it happens, I can't go up to Dublin, but I will support them, and hope that with excellent organisation they can escape the hijacking/violent hassle from a mindless minority.0 -
-
-
You've been protesting since the 60s every week as you say, so... not very effective then eh?
I'm not religious but I think the only phrase that will work here is;May 1968 was a political failure for the protesters, but it had an enormous social impact. In France, it is considered to be the watershed moment when a conservative moral ideal (religion, patriotism, respect for authority) shifted towards a more liberal moral ideal (equality, sexual liberation, human rights) that today better describes French society, in theory if not in practice.I][URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed"]citation needed[/URL][/I Although this change did not take place solely in this one month, the term mai 68 is used to refer to this general shift in principles, especially when referring to its most idealistic aspects.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/May_1968_in_France
'When god closes a door he opens a window'.
This irrational fear of 'speculators' focusing their attention on us is ridiculous.
You'd think, from reading your passages, that nobody knew anything about Ireland & it's situation & that it's only a matter of time before they cast their powerful brow upon us & eat us alive :rolleyes:
As far as I know, from a transcription of an imf meeting may 6, is that the IMF's view on Ireland is that we are implementing measures to cope with things.
Also, in this passage she says of Greece;Well, every country is a little different, and I think, given the situation, countries are looking and considering what they can best do. We had already talked about the need for some countries to look at, to make sure that they had sufficient measures in place and under consideration. Others are Ireland and Spain. I believe Ireland’s already implementing.
http://www.imf.org/external/np/tr/2010/tr050610.htm
That sounds good, but my knowledge of the IMF is that they are robber barons in terms of policy, but I couldn't be sure.We have deliberately designed a package of financial support that gives Greece the ability to stay out of the markets for more than 18 months until 2012.
However, protesting the governments actions has nothing to do with attracting the gaze of father IMF :rolleyes:
I wouldn't put it past you to think that your perspective is that the Greek protests caused the IMF to go to Greece at this stage, we see how you put down all of French protesting history with one fell swoop 'Lisbon Treaty' and think the case is settled.
I can't spend my time on the internet trying to convince people with skewed perspectives of the actions of thousands of people, google is there.
Why not do a thought experiment, pretend your in another persons head for a second, and google the history of protests & their acheivements. Just one opinion counter to yours, try and include it before condemning the history of people's actions, it's simply incorrect to come out with sweeping statements like these...0 -
Lisbon Treaty.
DeV
Be all and end all of everything ?
French people did vote for Sarkozy, as opposed to Segolene Royal who was, I think, advocating a referendum.
You do seem very pessimistic DeVore.
I'd rather think that yes, people can change things, rather than sit there thinking there are no solutions.
I trust the people proposing to go down protesting more than the current politicians. It's unfortunate that violent individuals should geopardize the effect of a protest, and again I hope tonight's goes peacefully.0 -
sponsoredwalk wrote: »
'When god closes a door he opens a window'.
we see how you put down all of French protesting history with one fell swoop 'Lisbon Treaty' and think the case is settled.
it's simply incorrect to come out with sweeping statements like these...
Exactly.
@DeVore : Go tell the French people their protests over the last 40 + years have been in vain then, better not let them waste more time on the streets ? 0 -
-
Advertisement
-
Mountainsandh wrote: »Exactly.
@DeVore : Go tell the French people their protests over the last 40 + years have been in vain then, better not let them waste more time on the streets ?
Christ how can people not get it? Protesting against our government in this case and against cuts will at best achieve nothing. If it was gay marriage, or something, protest away, it won't lead to others calling in their debts.0 -
Join Date:Posts: 29920
Its an incontravertible argument against your claim that the government pay more attention to you because you protest.Mountainsandh wrote: »Be all and end all of everything ?
French people did vote for Sarkozy, as opposed to Segolene Royal who was, I think, advocating a referendum.
You do seem very pessimistic DeVore.
I'd rather think that yes, people can change things, rather than sit there thinking there are no solutions.
I trust the people proposing to go down protesting more than the current politicians. It's unfortunate that violent individuals should geopardize the effect of a protest, and again I hope tonight's goes peacefully.
DeV.0 -
-
It's funny that the only video on this page was totally focused on the few protesters at the very front of the walk.
Here is what happened afterwards.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=51svKk_0FEY
0 -
-
Join Date:Posts: 29920
How is that video any different to the one I posted.sponsoredwalk wrote: »It's funny that the only video on this page was totally focused on the few protesters at the very front of the walk.
Here is what happened afterwards.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=51svKk_0FEY
If anything it shows LESS rioting because its been edited by that (surely not biased) Trade Union TV....
What exactly was your point there....
Oh and lol at the guy complaining about the government clinging to power, cos like the SWP didnt just try to *seize* power (in their own little trotsky way). The only way you will get me to ever vote for FF would be to make it a two horse race with those people who only see their right to XYZ and stuff the rest of us.
DeV.0 -
-
-
If anything it shows LESS rioting because its been edited by that (surely not biased) Trade Union TV....
It showed the same scene from a different camera, it showed more clearly how that guard was hit too btw... The guard in your video that is holding his head (I think from the video I posted, I'm not 100% but It does look like it!) is (I think) visibly hit by that idiot with the white pole thing. If you rewatch it you'll notice one guard erupt afterwards an push everyone away forcefully.What exactly was your point there....
My point was to show that there was more to the event that took place than to focus on what a few people did while trying to get inside the grounds to be heard.
People stayed around & had speakers etc... You certainly would get the impression that everything ended after the small incident at the gate from your video.Oh and lol at the guy complaining about the government clinging to power, cos like the SWP didnt just try to *seize* power (in their own little trotsky way).
Ah we see the 1917 linkage. I don't know what you're trying to imply by linking the SWP to a man who, because of disowning himself from the revolution that was perverted from it's original intention, ended up being axed in the back of the head - but we all know the intent of those godwin-esque allusions :rolleyes:
As for protests in general, what would satisfy you? You'd expect a speaker to get up with an economic draft & point-by-point plan and deliver a technical lecture to a crowd of non-economists with the way you've made it out to be. This just illustrates another dissociation with what a protest is about (google is there as I keep saying - just to sidestep the interrogatory question 'well what is a protest about then?).
How are people supposed to let the government know that they are unhappy with them?Its an incontravertible argument against your claim that the government pay more attention to you because you protest.
DeV.
Sir, this is the lowest post I've seen you make throughout this whole thread. I'd expect at least a critical perspective instead of the many sweeping claims from you seeing as you appear so organised with your insider's information but comments like this & equating demonstraters with the idiots in Greece who did that to the bankers (accidentaly but that's still no excuse!) is really illustrating ulterior motives & other things I'd rather not mention.
Oh, and it wasn't US who got the economy into this messChrist how can people not get it? Protesting against our government in this case and against cuts will at best achieve nothing. If it was gay marriage, or something, protest away, it won't lead to others calling in their debts.
As long as it's something trivial like human rights or equality, protest away.
However, if there's money involved it's not trivial any longer :mad:0 -
Advertisement
-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=51svKk_0FEY
Advertisement