Israeli apartheid

Mr. SS · 20-05-2010 8:18pm

Nodin wrote: »

That would be the guy that spied on his own people for Israel.....

Does that somehow justify what Hamas is doing or what is your point exactly?

Mr. SS · 20-05-2010 8:41pm

wes wrote: »

None the above backs up your claim of apartheid as per your definition. Just typical nonsensical hyperbole. Apartheid involves a system of segregation, along racial lines:

So you are using the term, due to me not agreeing with you earlier regarding Israel apartheid, as per the quoted post above.

Correct, who's to say the palestinians in gaza who do not agree with Hamas are not a nation of their own, if they hold different beliefs and values and do not wish to apart of what Hamas are creating then surely they have the right to be considered their own nation, and therefore are being subjugated under the rule of another nation, in exactly the same fashion Israel subjugates the palestinians, Hamas subjugates those who do not agree with them and have been successful in convincing many in Gaza that the fatah brigade are as bad as the israelis resulting in the lynching of said members and their wholesale banishment from Gaza.

As you say race is a social construct, and Hamas have been very successful in socialy constructing fatah members to be different and so have mostly become driven out of Gaza.

wes wrote: »

Also, care to provide some links that shows when Hamas drove Jews out of Gaza please? AFAIK, they did nothing of the sort, so I am interested in where you are getting your information from.

It goes to show that every Jew had to flee Gaza from the fact that (my mistake, it was 24, not 26) 24 synagogues were abandonned, and subsequently destroyed. I would construe this as tantamount to the Jews being driven out as what Jew would hang around to see what is going to happen next? Obviously they would flee for their lives. People don't just abandon their homes for no reason, and 24 synagogues are the remnants of a substantial population.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200509/s1457992.htm

The article above concludes that this will be a moral test for the palestinians. The article below documents how they failed that test miserably:

http://www.haaretz.com/news/palestinians-torch-synagogues-in-former-gaza-settlements-1.169372

wes · 20-05-2010 8:48pm

Mr. SS wrote: »

Correct, who's to say the palestinians in gaza who do not agree with Hamas are not a nation of their own, if they hold different beliefs and values and do not wish to apart of what Hamas are creating then surely they have the right to be considered their own nation, and therefore are being subjugated under the rule of another nation, in exactly the same fashion Israel subjugates the palestinians, Hamas subjugates those who do not agree with them and have been successful in convincing many in Gaza that the fatah brigade are as bad as the israelis resulting in the lynching of said members and their wholesale banishment from Gaza.

As you say race is a social construct, and Hamas have been very successful in socialy constructing fatah members to be different and so have mostly become driven out of Gaza.

Neither Fatah or Hamas consider themselves or each other to be separate racial groups, ethnic groups, or a nation, nor does anyone else. So once again, your claim has no basis.

Also, you repeated rejected the notion above dozens of time already in the thread. So, I do find the above claim to be rather odd.

Mr. SS wrote: »

It goes to show that every Jew had to flee Gaza from the fact that (my mistake, it was 24, not 26) 24 synagogues were abandonned, and subsequently destroyed. I would construe this as tantamount to the Jews being driven out as what Jew would hang around to see what is going to happen next? Obviously they would flee for their lives. People don't just abandon their homes for no reason, and 24 synagogues are the remnants of a substantial population.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200509/s1457992.htm

The article above concludes that this will be a moral test for the palestinians. The article below documents how they failed that test miserably:

http://www.haaretz.com/news/palestinians-torch-synagogues-in-former-gaza-settlements-1.169372

So Hamas drove no Jews out then, and they just torched Synagogues that were built on land stolen from Palestinians, by Zionist colonists. It is a massive stretch to suggest that there destruction is tantamount to expelling Jews. Hamas did no such thing, and your claim is simple hyperbole.

Also, an article saying something is a moral test does not make it so. Those Synagogues were built on land stolen from Palestinians, by Zionist colonists, while I don't agree with there destruction, making out there destruction to be tantamount to driving Jews out of Gaza is absurd.

**EDIT**
Btw, it wasn't just Hamas who destroyed the Synagogues and other buildings, and the destruction took place before they took over Gaza. So your entire argument make no sense at all, and is filled with numerous errors, and factual inaccuracies.

Also, Israel were the ones who removed the illegal colonists, who left Gaza before the destruction of all the buildings in the former colonies by various groups before Hamas took over.

So basically, your entire claim is nonsense, as per usual.
**END EDIT**

Rebelheart · 20-05-2010 8:52pm

I never contribute to these Palestinian threads but did anybody hear the interview on Lyric Fm last Monday with Ronan Tynan?

It can be found here: http://www.rte.ie/lyricfm/player_av.html?0,null,200,http://dynamic.rte.ie/quickaxs/209-lyrc-martywhelanatmidday-Monday.smil (go to 1.37.40)

He began talking about this and I couldn't help but think that the guy had his entire career ruined simply because some woman accused him of making an anti-Semitic remark.

Mr. SS · 20-05-2010 9:14pm

wes wrote: »

Neither Fatah or Hamas consider themselves or each other to be separate racial groups, ethnic groups, or a nation, nor does anyone else.

Exactly how do you know that. How do you know what people think in a police state? Race is a social construction and Hamas are building heavily.

When you treat people like dirt, they tend to disassociate from you:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I1M4eH9Kk7I&feature=related

wes wrote: »

So Hamas drove no Jews out then, and they just torched Synagogues that were built on land stolen from Palestinians, by Zionist colonists. It is a massive stretch to suggest that there destruction is tantamount to expelling Jews. Hamas did no such thing, and your claim is simple hyperbole.

Land which was taken before that by Egypt from Israel so your point doesn't hold water, surely the act of giving back the land should be met with more respect than that. Either way the point is regarding discrimination by Hamas, and it occurs unabated:

http://www.israeltoday.co.il/default.aspx?tabid=178&nid=14789

Mr. SS · 20-05-2010 9:20pm

wes wrote: »

So basically, your entire claim is nonsense, as per usual.

Please refrain from calling my arguments nonsense.

Mr. SS · 20-05-2010 9:26pm

Rebelheart wrote: »

I never contribute to these Palestinian threads but did anybody hear the interview on Lyric Fm last Monday with Ronan Tynan?

It can be found here: http://www.rte.ie/lyricfm/player_av.html?0,null,200,http://dynamic.rte.ie/quickaxs/209-lyrc-martywhelanatmidday-Monday.smil (go to 1.37.40)

He began talking about this and I couldn't help but think that the guy had his entire career ruined simply because some woman accused him of making an anti-Semitic remark.

This is the PC bull**** world we live in. Everyone takes exception to everthing, oh except for Irish people, everyone can make as many drunk jokes as they want about us an were suppose to grin and bear it!

Mr. SS · 20-05-2010 9:27pm

Mr. SS wrote: »

This is the PC bull**** world we live in. Everyone takes exception to everthing, oh except for Irish people, everyone can make as many drunk jokes as they want about us an were suppose to grin and bear it!

Boards censors the word ****! are they serious??? Boards is part of the PC brigade of censorship of freedom of speech.

wes · 20-05-2010 9:35pm

Mr. SS wrote: »

Exactly how do you know that. How do you know what people think in a police state? Race is a social construction and Hamas are building heavily.

When you treat people like dirt, they tend to disassociate from you:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I1M4eH9Kk7I&feature=related

Again, you provide no evidence at all to back up anything you have said. What you saying simply has no basis in fact or reality. Hamas, and Fatah are separate political groups, and this fact is well known. You have consistently provided no proof of your most recent laughable and absurd claims.

Mr. SS wrote: »

Land which was taken before that by Egypt from Israel so your point doesn't hold water, surely the act of giving back the land should be met with more respect than that. Either way the point is regarding discrimination by Hamas, and it occurs unabated:

http://www.israeltoday.co.il/default.aspx?tabid=178&nid=14789

I never disagreed that Hamas are discriminating, in fact I have said the opposite several times in this thread.

i just disagreed with your claims about Hamas engaging in Apartheid, which are of course untrue, and don't fit any reasonable definition of the term, including the one you provided.

Mr. SS · 20-05-2010 9:40pm

wes wrote: »

Again, you provide no evidence at all to back up anything you have said. What you saying simply has no basis in fact or reality. Hamas, and Fatah are separate political groups, and this fact is well known. You have consistently provided no proof of your most recent laughable and absurd claims.

You never provided proof that race was a social construct, its hilarious then that you turn around and accuse me of the same.

From the Washington Post:

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"Why is Israel withdrawing from Gaza?
[/FONT]
In announcing the "Disengagement Plan" in December 2003, Prime Minister Ariel Sharon said the withdrawal was to increase security of residents of Israel ... Hamas, the Islamic Resistance Movement, claims that the withdrawal is the result of violent Palestinian resistance to Israeli occupation."

Even Hamas claim they drove out the Jews!

wes · 20-05-2010 9:55pm

Mr. SS wrote: »

Please refrain from calling my arguments nonsense.

Sorry, but I find your argument to be nonsensical, and I will detail exactly why in this post.

Look you claimed that Hamas destroyed those Synagogues, when it the PA and not just Hamas, and your own links say it was the PA for goodness sake. It also occurred in 2005 (again from your own links) before Hamas took over Gaza, and before Cast Lead.

So how exactly were Hamas engaged in Apartheid (as you wrongly claim), before they came into power? The entirety of your argument made no sense what so ever, so that is why I referred to it as nonsense, because it made no sense at all to me.

You made numerous false claims, and I will now detail several of them:

Mr. SS wrote: »

Also the raizing to the ground of 26 synagouges after operation cast lead would suggest the outcasting and discrimination of Gaza's Jews. Only difference is that Hamas is so forceful in this regard, it has driven all of the jews out of Gaza.

You claim the Synagogues were destroyed only by Hamas and after Cast Lead, but that happened in 2005 before Hamas were in charge of Gaza, and before Cast Lead, and it was the PA who ordered them destroyed. So Hamas did not destroy them on there own.

You then claim they drove out all the Jews out of Gaza, when it was the IDF who removed Jewish colonists from Gaza. before they destroyed teh synagogues located in the former colonies, and not Hamas.

So everything you say above is false, and as such nonsense.

Mr. SS wrote: »

It goes to show that every Jew had to flee Gaza from the fact that (my mistake, it was 24, not 26) 24 synagogues were abandonned, and subsequently destroyed. I would construe this as tantamount to the Jews being driven out as what Jew would hang around to see what is going to happen next? Obviously they would flee for their lives. People don't just abandon their homes for no reason, and 24 synagogues are the remnants of a substantial population.

Now let take a look at the above. You again make the similar false claims, about Hamas causing Jews to leave.

Jewish colonists in Gaza were removed by the IDF, and that all took place before Hamas were in power, and before the Synagogues were destroyed by the PA. So another false claim.

Secondly as your own link confirms that your claims about Hamas destroying the synagogues after Cast lead is also a false one:

Palestinians to demolish abandoned Gaza synagogues

Last Update: Monday, September 12, 2005. 8:21am (AEST)

The Palestinian Authority says it will demolish 24 synagogues in the Gaza Strip after Israel refused to raze the buildings before its departure from the territory.

Click here for full article

Your own link shows that it was the PA, who destroyed the Synagogues and not just Hamas, and if you look at the date, that happened in 2005, long before the Hamas takeover, and before Caat lead. So, once again you make a bunch of false claims, which are dis-proven, by your own link.

So, your arguments are nonsense, as they are based on false claim, after false claim, and even your own links prove your various false claims. So how else am i suppose to refer to arguments that constantly make false claim, after false claim?

wes · 20-05-2010 9:58pm

Mr. SS wrote: »

You never provided proof that race was a social construct, its hilarious then that you turn around and accuse me of the same.

As I said earlier, I am finished with the earlier argument, about race.

Mr. SS wrote: »

From the Washington Post:

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"Why is Israel withdrawing from Gaza?
[/FONT]
In announcing the "Disengagement Plan" in December 2003, Prime Minister Ariel Sharon said the withdrawal was to increase security of residents of Israel ... Hamas, the Islamic Resistance Movement, claims that the withdrawal is the result of violent Palestinian resistance to Israeli occupation."

Even Hamas claim they drove out the Jews!

Nope, they claim the withdrawal of Israel forces, and there colonists was due to them. In face your quote use the exact word "withdrawal", and they say violent "Palestinian" resistance, not just Hamas resistance. So there claiming the withdrawal was due to all Palestinian resistance. So you claims are to put it nicely a bit of a stretch.

Also, those colonists were there illegally in violation of International law. So there removal by the IDF, is perfectly above board in accordance with International law. They were colonists and had no right to be there under International law. They were btw removed by the Israeli government and not Hamas. They claimed that Palestinian resistance (and not Hamas resistance) forced out the Israeli forces and colonists, but this is not the same as your claim that they drove the Jews out.

So once, again you make another false claim, and try to twist the facts to suit your false narrative.

**edit**
Also, all of the above occurred before Hamas were in power btw, and it also occurred before cast lead. Also, the IDF removed Israeli colonists before the synagogues, were ordered destroyed by the PA. None of your claims add up, and as such you entire argument is based on a bunch of factually inaccuracies, and distortions, with a time line that is completely backwards. Once again, your entire argument make no sense at all, due to all the factual inaccuracies, and bizarre claims.
**end edit**

Mr. SS · 20-05-2010 10:52pm

wes wrote: »

Look you claimed that Hamas destroyed those Synagogues, when it the PA and not just Hamas, and your own links say it was the PA for goodness sake. It also occurred in 2005 (again from your own links) before Hamas took over Gaza, and before Cast Lead.

I should have said the palestinians. Sorry, Hamas has just become synomous with Gaza in my mind.

wes wrote: »

So how exactly were Hamas engaged in Apartheid (as you wrongly claim), before they came into power?

With the Synagogues no, but with anyone who dissents from the Hamas point of view in Gaza. Thats why I put forward the idea that Hamas are engaged in constructing the idea that the PA is as bad as Israel itself, in order to create this separation between the two, something which this cartoon shows, which is simply sick. Hamas' treatment and execution of Fatah members is in fact worse:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ImXMTTbyok

wes wrote: »

You claim the Synagogues were destroyed ... before they destroyed teh synagogues located in the former colonies, and not Hamas.

Already accepted. For the second time.

wes wrote: »

Jewish colonists in Gaza were removed by the IDF, and that all took place before Hamas were in power, and before the Synagogues were destroyed by the PA.

I provided a reference from a world newspaper in which Hamas claimed they drove them out as a result of their violence. Oh sorry I forgot Hamas only became terrorists after they won the election. I had wrongly presumed that they had been engaged in terrorist activities for years previously.

wes wrote: »

Secondly as your own link confirms that your claims about Hamas destroying the synagogues after Cast lead is also a false one

Already accepted. For the third time.

wes wrote: »

Your own link shows that it was the PA, who destroyed the Synagogues and not just Hamas, and if you look at the date, that happened in 2005, long before the Hamas takeover, and before Caat lead.

Already accepted. For the forth time.

wes wrote: »

So, your arguments are nonsense, as they are based on false claim, after false claim, and even your own links prove your various false claims.

Repeatly pointing out the same mistakes I made over and over again, does not mean I am making mistakes again and again, simply that you keep pointing it out.

Nodin · 20-05-2010 11:23pm

Mr. SS wrote: »

Does that somehow justify what Hamas is doing or what is your point exactly?

....that being a paid agent of Israel rather undermines his credibility. That's my point, exactly.

Mr. SS wrote: »

In announcing the "Disengagement Plan" in December 2003, Prime Minister Ariel Sharon said the withdrawal was to increase security of residents of Israel ... Hamas, the Islamic Resistance Movement, claims that the withdrawal is the result of violent Palestinian resistance to Israeli occupation."

Even Hamas claim they drove out the Jews! ?

8,000 colonists, given 1/3 of the total area of Gaza by the occupying power...You might as well say that resisting an attack by the IDF is anti-semitism...I find that you're being entirely dishonest in this discussion, and this further underlines my view. You've done anything and everything to avoid discussion of "Israeli Apartheid", save perhaps to address the facts.

wes · 20-05-2010 11:42pm

Mr. SS wrote: »

I should have said the palestinians. Sorry, Hamas has just become synomous with Gaza in my mind.

With the Synagogues no, but with anyone who dissents from the Hamas point of view in Gaza. Thats why I put forward the idea that Hamas are engaged in constructing the idea that the PA is as bad as Israel itself, in order to create this separation between the two, something which this cartoon shows, which is simply sick. Hamas' treatment and execution of Fatah members is in fact worse:

I never disputed anything Hamas has done. Just some of you conclusions.

Mr. SS wrote: »

Already accepted. For the second time.

Alright.

Mr. SS wrote: »

I provided a reference from a world newspaper in which Hamas claimed they drove them out as a result of their violence. Oh sorry I forgot Hamas only became terrorists after they won the election. I had wrongly presumed that they had been engaged in terrorist activities for years previously.

You clearly said they did all these things after Cast Lead. So, I was perfectly right to point out the many flaws at the time, but fair enough you have admitted to various errors.

Also, the IDF removed colonists, who had no legal right to be in Gaza in the first place. So the removal of colonists who were illegal stealing land that didn't belong to them, is perfect correct with in International law, and IDF did the removal.

Also, I never disputed Hamas engaging in terrorism at all. They certainly did so before hand, but you claimed they did all those things after Cast Lead, and not me. I know you have accepted your errors, but everything I said was in response to those errors, before this post.

Mr. SS wrote: »

Repeatly pointing out the same mistakes I made over and over again, does not mean I am making mistakes again and again, simply that you keep pointing it out.

I was explaining why I considered your posts to be nonsense (e.g. they made no sense to me, hence why I used that term), so i felt I needed to go into greater detail, and hence why I repeated myself in greater detail, because I felt the need to clarify why I said what i did.

NaNach · 20-05-2010 11:54pm

I cannot believe the amount of ignorance about Israel. Perhaps, its isn't ignorance but the desire to HATE JEWS!

This is one reason I no longer live in Ireland. The Irish people have been ingrained by the Catholic Church to hate Jews.

It's so sad to see the Irish youth that hate the church, hate Israel! They simply have fallen for the extreme left propaganda, that decided to align itself with Muslim terrorists!

There has always been a Jewish population in the land of Israel since at least 4000 years now -- documented by archaeology and other sciences. The land of Israel was taken over by the Ottoman Empire (not by Arabs)! Palestinians never called themselves Palestinian until 1964!!!! Jews called themselves Palestinians since 1st Century C.E. Palestinians are not native to the land of Israel!!! Most Jews are, including my Jewish relatives!

All citizens of the State of Israel have the right to vote and run for public office. You cannot discriminate on the basis of race, creed, colour, religion, gender, OR SEXUAL ORIENTATION!!!! Do you know how many women and gay men are murdered each year by Muslims????????????

I want you watch a short video on the Jews trying to live on land that no one else wants, that no one else develops, cultivates, or takes care of! Do you know why there a such a thing called the "Green Line".

http://www.vimeo.com/11850095

And btw if ye hate Israel so much, get would of anything made by Intel and Motorola, in fact get rid of all your mobile phones!!!

G-d Bless,
RÍAIN Ó SEÓIRSE

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wes · 21-05-2010 12:45am

NaNach wrote: »

I cannot believe the amount of ignorance about Israel. Perhaps, its isn't ignorance but the desire to HATE JEWS!

Ah yes, the old accuse everyone of being a racist, without a shred of proof.

NaNach wrote: »

This is one reason I no longer live in Ireland. The Irish people have been ingrained by the Catholic Church to hate Jews.

It's so sad to see the Irish youth that hate the church, hate Israel! They simply have fallen for the extreme left propaganda, that decided to align itself with Muslim terrorists!

So you accuse others of racism, and then claim all Irish people hate Jews? I am sorry, but your claim of all Irish people having a ingrained hatred of Jews, is racist. You are making a claim about an entire nation of people, and a false one at that.

NaNach wrote: »

There has always been a Jewish population in the land of Israel since at least 4000 years now -- documented by archaeology and other sciences. The land of Israel was taken over by the Ottoman Empire (not by Arabs)! Palestinians never called themselves Palestinian until 1964!!!! Jews called themselves Palestinians since 1st Century C.E. Palestinians are not native to the land of Israel!!! Most Jews are, including my Jewish relatives!

The Palestinians are native to the land in question, and this has been proven with genetic evidence, and is well proven fact.

NaNach wrote: »

All citizens of the State of Israel have the right to vote and run for public office. You cannot discriminate on the basis of race, creed, colour, religion, gender, OR SEXUAL ORIENTATION!!!! Do you know how many women and gay men are murdered each year by Muslims????????????

Nope, Palestinians are regularly discriminated against actually. Covered in the media on a daily basis.

NaNach wrote: »

I want you watch a short video on the Jews trying to live on land that no one else wants, that no one else develops, cultivates, or takes care of! Do you know why there a such a thing called the "Green Line".

http://www.vimeo.com/11850095

The Palestinians clearly want the land, to deny that they want it is nothing short of laughable. If they did not want it, there would be no conflict. Also, the whole desert bloom nonsense, was old when Zionists made that absurd claim decades ago. The Palestinian would happily cultivate, if Zionists extremists didn't steal there land, and thus separating Palestinians from there crops, that is if they don't destroy them that is.

NaNach wrote: »

And btw if ye hate Israel so much, get would of anything made by Intel and Motorola, in fact get rid of all your mobile phones!!!

Those are multi-nationals that develop products the world over. Intel also makes some of its stuff here in Ireland.

NaNach · 21-05-2010 12:54am

Right, of course, being Irish meslef, and having grown up in Ireland, I would not know anything about the Irish people!!! You provide no proof whatever, you spout off LIES and propaganda, and just tell people its been proven!! You are an expert in fallacies. Have you ever been to Israel????? I lived in Jerusalem for two years! I also have a degree in Jewish Studies. I just might know more than you do! And yes I believe you are a JUDAEPHOBE!

wes · 21-05-2010 1:08am

NaNach wrote: »

Right, of course, being Irish meslef, and having grown up in Ireland, I would not know anything about the Irish people!!! You provide no proof whatever, you spout off LIES and propaganda, and just tell people its been proven!! You are an expert in fallacies. Have you ever been to Israel????? I lived in Jerusalem for two years! I also have a degree in Jewish Studies. I just might know more than you do! And yes I believe you are a JUDAEPHOBE!

I have provided proof on this thread several times over for my various claims, as have other posters. Also, you haven't provide any proof yourself, for any of your claims either.

Your claims about the Irish people are simply false, in case you haven't checked my location to the right, i live here too, and don't take to kindly with someone painting every single last Irish person as a racist.

NaNach · 21-05-2010 1:10am

For feck's sake you know I did not mean every fecking single Irish citizen~! You are just being a bollocks!

pat58 · 21-05-2010 1:15am

WOW relax breath in and out into a brown bag if needed ,we all hear you ,just seems as if you are on a bit of a rant,;);)people will liston to you a bit better then:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

wes · 21-05-2010 1:18am

NaNach wrote: »

For feck's sake you know I did not mean every fecking single Irish citizen~!

Well, from reading your post, I got the distinct impression that you were saying that. Thanks for clearing that up.

wes · 21-05-2010 1:31am

NaNach wrote: »

The Forgotten Refugees: Jews From Arab Lands

Your normally expected to comment on the articles you post, btw.

Also, the actions of other Arab states are hardly the fault of the Palestinians, and see no reason why they should be blamed for the actions of others. They are already paying for one crime they didn't commit. I see no reason why they should pay for another.

wes · 21-05-2010 2:01am

The major hole in the above articles reasoning, is that it ignores that fact Israeli colonists in the West Bank and East Jerusalem, can vote in Israel elections, and Palestinians living there can't. Hence the charge of Apartheid. The US did not try and colonizs Japan, hence why the 2 are not comparable.

Also some examples of Palestinians in Israel protesting discrimination:
Palestinian Bedouins Citizens of Israel Protest Discrimination and Theft of Their Land

HRW on discrimination of Bedouin:
Israel: End Systematic Bias Against Bedouin

Plenty of other example of discrimination by Israel against them as well.

NaNach · 21-05-2010 2:11am

They are not colonists! And they could if they wish to apply for citizenship. The land was WON, fair & square after we were invaded yet for a second time!!! You only list links from Anti-Israel websites!!!

wes · 21-05-2010 2:16am

NaNach wrote: »

They are not colonists! And they could if they wish to apply for citizenship. The land was WON, fair & square after we were invaded yet for a second time!!! You only list links from Anti-Israel websites!!!

Yes, they are colonists, and this is recognized by International law. The source I provided are not Anti-Israeli as you claim, and I at least comment on the links I provide, as opposed to whole sale copy and pasting articles and not commenting on them.

NaNach · 21-05-2010 2:23am

International law??? ROTFLMAO! You say nothing about all the International laws that the so-called "Palestinians" have broken over the last 60 years!! Why because you are a Judeophobe!

wes · 21-05-2010 2:25am

NaNach wrote: »

A common misperception is that all the Jews were forced into the Diaspora by the Romans after the destruction of the Second Temple in Jerusalem in the year 70 C.E. and then, 1,800 years later, suddenly returned to Palestine demanding their country back. In reality, the Jewish people have maintained ties to their historic homeland for more than 3,700 years.

The Palestinian are themselves descended from Jews, and have just as much claim. Also, they were the majority before 1948, after which they were ethnically cleansed.

NaNach wrote: »

The Jewish people base their claim to the Land of Israel on at least four premises: 1) the Jewish people settled and developed the land; 2) the international community granted political sovereignty in Palestine to the Jewish people; 3) the territory was captured in defensive wars and 4) God promised the land to the patriarch Abraham.

Under International law Israel only has claim to the 1967 borders. Also, God gave you the land, is as valid as me saying God gave me the land. Palestinians also settled and developed the land btw. Also, Israel has engaged in several aggressive wars, and there is no legal claim under international law, where you get to keep land you take, in any kind of war defensive or otherwise.

Scofflaw · 21-05-2010 2:45am

NaNach wrote: »

You are beyond ignorant!!!! Palestinians are not descended from Jews!!! They were not ethnically cleansed!!! The vast majority of them did not come the area until after 1900!!!! You absolutely are ignorant of actual factual HISTORY!!! And there is no need to argue with someone so bigoted and filled with irrational hatred for people he doesn't even know at all!!! I am here to post the truth, not to argue with a Jew-hating fecker like you!

For a week, you're not here at all, because you're rude and aggressive. Come back in the same style and you'll be banned again, this time for good.

Also, the great long screeds of copypasta? No.

moderately,
Scofflaw

[EDIT]Ban upped to two weeks for abusive and idiotic PM response to moderation.[/EDIT]

anymore · 21-05-2010 11:58am

wes wrote: »

The Palestinian are themselves descended from Jews, and have just as much claim. Also, they were the majority before 1948, after which they were ethnically cleansed.

Under International law Israel only has claim to the 1967 borders. Also, God gave you the land, is as valid as me saying God gave me the land. Palestinians also settled and developed the land btw. Also, Israel has engaged in several aggressive wars, and there is no legal claim under international law, where you get to keep land you take, in any kind of war defensive or otherwise.

Does this mean you reject the validation that Islamic Holy Books gives to Jewish claims to the Holy land ?

Israeli apartheid

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