How many people would want Karate in the Olympics?

Sid_Justice

I don't see the justification for 2 different types of wrestling in the games. I'd doubt anyone that doesn't wrestle knows what the difference is. if they're going to have two types why not have freestyle and submission? obviously i don't do greco.

DaBrow

Sid_Justice wrote: »

I think it's a bit premature for a sport that doesn't even have a proper world championships to go looking for olympics recognition.

I've love to see submission grappling make it to the games but i won't hold my breath. wouldn't mind if they got rid of Greco.

Sorry??

There is the WKF World Championships

There are plenty of other Championships aswell but the World Karate Federation (IOC Recognised) which is one of only two Officially recognised International Bodies for Karate has these events.

The WKF WORLD KARATE CHAMPIONSHIPS are held every 2 years, the last time they were held was 2008.

Doug Cartel

Sid_Justice wrote: »

I don't see the justification for 2 different types of wrestling in the games. I'd doubt anyone that doesn't wrestle knows what the difference is. if they're going to have two types why not have freestyle and submission? obviously i don't do greco.

They've been there since the early days of the modern games. The selection criteria really only applies to additions. There's probably a quite a few older events they could do with culling, but that's not something I want to get started on right now.

Doug Cartel

Chris89 wrote: »

Karate is just so boring to watch unless youre involved in it.

I could say the same about a lot of the sports. I can remember discussing judo with non judo people during the last games, and they were not impressed.

Furious-Dave

DaBrow wrote: »

Sorry??

There is the WKF World Championships

There are plenty of other Championships aswell but the World Karate Federation (IOC Recognised) which is one of only two Officially recognised International Bodies for Karate has these events.

The WKF WORLD KARATE CHAMPIONSHIPS are held every 2 years, the last time they were held was 2008.

Just watched some of it there on Youtube. A lot of unnecessary shouting. How is it that Knockdown Karate fighters don't do nearly as much "Kiai"? Sorry but I'm with Chris89 on this one, it's boring to watch. The Kyokushin vs TaeKwonDo clip was cool though. Knockdown is the only type of Karate competition I could stick watching.

Doug Cartel

The shouting is to get the judges to notice that you "hit" your opponent. It's not as necessary in knockdown, because it's much easier for the judges to notice when somebody has been beaten half unconscious.

Chris89

Surely if you were good enough at hitting you wouldnt need to shout for the judges to notice you made contact.

its a snooze to watch.

Furious-Dave

Doug Cartel wrote: »

The shouting is to get the judges to notice that you "hit" your opponent. It's not as necessary in knockdown, because it's much easier for the judges to notice when somebody has been beaten half unconscious.

Ye I suppose that makes sense. The first KO in the KK vs TKD video looked sore, POW! Right in the liver Although looking at it again it's hard to tell which of the final 2 punches did the damage.

Doug Cartel

Sidenote: You should check out kendo, where hits don't count at all unless you cut, stamp and shout at the same time. I used to train judo in a building where our hall was connected to another where they trained kendo. The noises you'd hear coming out of that place were unreal.

joepenguin

Charlie3dan wrote: »

The martial arts that are in the Olympics have been changed to suit the Olympics. While this might mean greater exposure for the art I think some of the changes are to the detrement of the art.

The problem is now that the wkf have changed alot of their rulings etc to make them more olympic friendly but they are not in. Imo all the detrimental changes have taken place but there is still no recognition.

From a spectator point of view i can see how its not interesting. Mainly the contact issue. Try to convince someone to watch a game of football where you are not allowed score goals, and if a team do score a goal then that is deemed unfair and they get disqualified. Becasue thats what people outside of the sport karate world see when the see wkf style fights.

DaBrow

Furious-Dave wrote: »

Just watched some of it there on Youtube. A lot of unnecessary shouting. How is it that Knockdown Karate fighters don't do nearly as much "Kiai"? Sorry but I'm with Chris89 on this one, it's boring to watch. The Kyokushin vs TaeKwonDo clip was cool though. Knockdown is the only type of Karate competition I could stick watching.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uBhtnP_vTwc&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2OZi8KoSjMQ&feature=related

WKF is mainly Semi-contact but Full-Contact does exist too

Chris89

DaBrow wrote: »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uBhtnP_vTwc&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2OZi8KoSjMQ&feature=related

WKF is mainly Semi-contact but Full-Contact does exist too

watched that video there, the world champs promotions one.

The deal seems to be, it doesnt matter if you get absoloutely boshed in the face, as long as you bosh someone marginally sooner.

In pretty much every one of the examples, both people get punched, one just lands milliseconds sooner.

There is no sporting appeal, and no aesthetic appeal either. Because of what i noted above, its not even appealing as a display of skill.

I do appreciate that this is all coming from me, who has no clue about the ins and outs. But i think thats a great point in itself as 99% of the people watching the olympics also wont have a breeze what all the shouts are for.

Furious-Dave

DaBrow wrote: »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uBhtnP_vTwc&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2OZi8KoSjMQ&feature=related

WKF is mainly Semi-contact but Full-Contact does exist too

I was going to make a comment but I can see this entire thread becoming a completely off topic Karate debate

DaBrow

Furious-Dave wrote: »

I was going to make a comment but I can see this entire thread becoming a completely off topic Karate debate

I must admit, you're right.

This is about Karate being cheated out of the Olympics...

Chris89

nobody wants to watch it. its as simple as that

Roper

I think they should include Karate chopping. Blocks, wood, ice, that sort of thing. They could do it on the weightlifting platforms.

Only chopping though. There's a shortage of chopping in the Olympics.

DaBrow

Chris89 wrote: »

nobody wants to watch it. its as simple as that

http://www.wkf.net/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=217:aips-poll-karate-and-rugby-7s-are-the-medias-choice-for-new-olympic-sports&catid=42:wkf-news&Itemid=109

"A total of 305 journalists from 83 countries registered their vote.
Sport Votes Percentage
Karate 120 20.48%"


http://www.aipsmedia.com/index.php?page=news&cod=3806&tp=n

Chris89

That post made no sense and im afraid those links might be pr0n.

I represent the people, there is allready so many snoozes in the olympics..like, that one where they ski around and shoot weird guns.

From a spectators point of view, there is ABSOLOUTELY no need for a fight where youre not actually allowed to fight... to be included in the olympic games.

I appreciate you would like to see it in there and thats cool. But people who dont do karate's couldnt care less.

DaBrow

Chris89 wrote: »

That post made no sense and im afraid those links might be pr0n.

I represent the people, there is allready so many snoozes in the olympics..like, that one where they ski around and shoot weird guns.

From a spectators point of view, there is ABSOLOUTELY no need for a fight where youre not actually allowed to fight... to be included in the olympic games.

I appreciate you would like to see it in there and thats cool. But people who dont do karate's couldnt care less.

You're not a Karateka, so I fail to see how you represent their opinion....

Martial Artists in the IOC apart from Taekwondo & Judo Practioners have no representation publicly, how do you know they don't want Karate in the Olympics?

You're confusing the winter games with the Summer Games, but the Olympics is an event which entirely military themed in origin.

The last link is the International Sports Press Association, I hardly think you'll see people taking their clothes off there! That post shows what sport they would like to see as an olympic event, Karate came tops!!!

Chris89

I mean i represent the people who arent karatekakas or whatever.

I did karate when i was a kid, and my uncle is an 5th dan blackbelt a Dublin karate school, so im not hating on karate or anything, i just dont see its place in the olympics.

My point is, theres allready enough events that shouldnt be in there from a spectators point of view, so why add another.

Charlie3dan

I think it should be judged on it's merit as a sport rather than whether people want to watch it. Take ANY sport in the olympics and you can argue that it's no good to watch.
But that's not the point.

As for people not understanding what's going on, again you could argue this for any sport. I doubt non practitioners understand the finer details of the scoring for Judo, Gymnastics and Diving. Again, that's not the point.

As for fighting without being able to hit, well that can be easily solved by making the gloves bigger/ wearing TKD body protectors/ headgear. But then that's not karate. That's not worth adding to the Olympics because these types of sports are already there.

What Karate does offer is a striking art with more variety than boxing, more "realism" than TKD, and more action than judo. That's why it should be considered. (with respect to other sports mentioned).

However, for reasons I stated earlier in the thread, I still personally don't want to see Karate in the Olympics.

yomchi

Chris89 wrote: »

your facebook group still only has one member by the way.

Chris89 take this as a warning, anymore sniping will result in a ban from the forum.

DaBrow

Well this group so far has 4 members, I'm sure it will grow but I have seen an interesting flow of opinions here.

me_arse

There is a silver lining with Karate not being admitted as an Olympic participant sport: If it were, the level of funding for countries such as Spain, Italy, France, Russia and GB etc would be much more than what Ireland would ever dream of receiving and we would never acheive a medal at any WKF/EKF event in the future. Its sad but true unfortunately. The difference in standard of the Irish (ONAKAI) squad and most European countries is noticeable at the moment, and if the spaniards, french, italians got more funding we wouldn't stand a chance against them.

To summarise, from an Irish point of view it is probably a good thing that it didn't get in.

joepenguin

Charlie3dan wrote: »

I think it should be judged on it's merit as a sport rather than whether people want to watch it. Take ANY sport in the olympics and you can argue that it's no good to watch.
But that's not the point.




What Karate does offer is a striking art with more variety than boxing, more "realism" than TKD, and more action than judo. That's why it should be considered. (with respect to other sports mentioned).

Good points. It's really annoying how it got snubbed due to lack of sponsorship compared to rugby and golf. I love karate but as a spectator sport I know its not what the public want to see. However as you said it should be about the sport itself.

The wkf recently attempted to make it more spectator friendly but personally i prefer watching fights from the 80s and 90s.

DaBrow

joepenguin wrote: »

I love karate but as a spectator sport I know its not what the public want to see. However as you said it should be about the sport itself.

The wkf recently attempted to make it more spectator friendly but personally i prefer watching fights from the 80s and 90s.

I think there are plenty of people whom are very angry that it was snubbed... I mean for the love of god don't Golf & Rugby have enough events already that are big as the olympics?

joepenguin

DaBrow wrote: »

I think there are plenty of people whom are very angry that it was snubbed... I mean for the love of god don't Golf & Rugby have enough events already that are big as the olympics?

Yeah they are two pro sports. Its like soccer, ask any aspiring player what is the one medal they would like to win and you will hear premiership, champs league, world cup etc. no-one will mention the olympics. Even though it should be regarded as the pinnacle of sport.

Rugby and golf have their major events and shouldnt have been included ahead of ANY amature sport.

DaBrow

4 more members in 24 hours... Not bad.

Anymore takers?:)

DaBrow

joepenguin wrote: »

Yeah they are two pro sports. Its like soccer, ask any aspiring player what is the one medal they would like to win and you will hear premiership, champs league, world cup etc. no-one will mention the olympics. Even though it should be regarded as the pinnacle of sport.

Rugby and golf have their major events and shouldnt have been included ahead of ANY amature sport.

Hey guys... 143 Members now after 1 week!!!

136 Up from last time!

Chris89

How many facebook fans are you hoping to get before you hand this copper fastened evidence of interest to the olympic council, Captain cool.

Hey olympics, captain cool here, do you not know about how much people love karate or what.