National Postcodes to be introduced

marmurr1916

Richard Cantwell ‏@ManAboutCouch Oct 2 Dublin City, Ireland
Interesting, as part of #Census16 @CSOIreland Enumerators will be recording the #eircode of every dwelling. #IRLOGI20

plodder

marmurr1916 wrote: »

Richard Cantwell ‏@ManAboutCouch Oct 2 Dublin City, Ireland
Interesting, as part of #Census16 @CSOIreland Enumerators will be recording the #eircode of every dwelling. #IRLOGI20

Surely, the CSO would already have the Eircode for every dwelling. So, why would enumerators need to record it?

byrnefm

I see that the new car registration certificates have an Eircode field on the 'New Owner Details' section, when visiting a friend today who just changed cars.

larchill

Likewise for the RF150 - non use of vehicle.

GJG

plodder wrote: »

Surely, the CSO would already have the Eircode for every dwelling. So, why would enumerators need to record it?

You have stumbled across the whole point of the system. Redundancy.

Mostly post can be delivered without an Eircode. Mostly, enumerators can get the form right without an Eircode. Most things can be done mostly right without it. Eircode takes that 95 per cent to, perhaps, 99.9 per cent.

People complaining that things are got 95 per cent right without it, or that there still might be 0.1 per cent errors with it, are simply missing the point.

plodder

GJG wrote: »

You have stumbled across the whole point of the system. Redundancy.

Mostly post can be delivered without an Eircode. Mostly, enumerators can get the form right without an Eircode. Most things can be done mostly right without it. Eircode takes that 95 per cent to, perhaps, 99.9 per cent.

People complaining that things are got 95 per cent right without it, or that there still might be 0.1 per cent errors with it, are simply missing the point.

That makes more sense. They will check the Eircode, rather than record it (the forms would already have the Eircode on them presumably)? I think it will make sense to do that where the address is ambiguous, and people more likely to know their Eircode.

ukoda

GJG wrote: »

You have stumbled across the whole point of the system. Redundancy.

Mostly post can be delivered without an Eircode. Mostly, enumerators can get the form right without an Eircode. Most things can be done mostly right without it. Eircode takes that 95 per cent to, perhaps, 99.9 per cent.

People complaining that things are got 95 per cent right without it, or that there still might be 0.1 per cent errors with it, are simply missing the point.

People have a very narrow view of its usefulness

What percentage will it bring down insurance fraud? And what monetary savings?

What percentage faster will data capture on a website be and what percent more accurate will it be?

If delivery companies stopped moaning and started using it for route planning, what percentage of fuel savings would they achieve? And other efficiencies around less rescheduled deliveries because they can't find the house

What percentage of time will be cut off call centre calls where agents don't have to spend minutes looking for vague addresses, what savings will that bring?

There are a whole host of benefits eircode could bring to the Irish economy if given a chance. But we'd rather have another thing to moan about and blame the government for.

Even in your 2 scenarios, When you're talking about massive industry and millions of transactions, going from 95% to 99% could mean millions of euros in savings.

ukoda

moyners wrote: »

I've noticed a considerable change in tone from the FTAI on twitter, especially since the GIS conference a few weeks back.

https://twitter.com/newsfromftai/status/654940060257751040

i did predict that! now i can add to the list "we want sat navs to adopt it ASAP"

ukoda wrote: »

I find the FTAI stance funny, it went from:

It's of no use to any of our members

Some of our members won't use it

Part of it might be of some use to our members


What's next I wonder? They are about 3 steps away from coming full circle and supporting eircode

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=96243442&postcount=7031

GJG

ukoda wrote: »

People have a very narrow view of its usefulness

What percentage will it bring down insurance fraud? And what monetary savings?

What percentage faster will data capture on a website be and what percent more accurate will it be?

If delivery companies stopped moaning and started using it for route planning, what percentage of fuel savings would they achieve? And other efficiencies around less rescheduled deliveries because they can't find the house

What percentage of time will be cut off call centre calls where agents don't have to spend minutes looking for vague addresses, what savings will that bring?

There are a whole host of benefits eircode could bring to the Irish economy if given a chance. But we'd rather have another thing to moan about and blame the government for.

Even in your 2 scenarios, When you're talking about massive industry and millions of transactions, going from 95% to 99% could mean millions of euros in savings.

I disagree. I think that most people are getting on with discovering how useful it is and incorporating it in their businesses. I was going to use the phrase 'slowly but surely' in that sentence, but it's actually progressing quite quickly. Only a tiny minority are interested it in the nay-sayers; they are either irrelevant, or quickly making themselves so. I wrote this on 3 August:

GJG wrote: »

• Search for the exact string “Dublin D01”
• Search for the exact string “Dublin D02”

The two Eircode results, between them, as of my searches, give 858 and 2,870 results.

The equivalent total is now over 17,000. That's a pretty impressive rate of growth.

ukoda

GJG wrote: »

I disagree. I think that most people are getting on with discovering how useful it is and incorporating it in their businesses. I was going to use the phrase 'slowly but surely' in that sentence, but it's actually progressing quite quickly. Only a tiny minority are interested it in the nay-sayers; they are either irrelevant, or quickly making themselves so. I wrote this on 3 August:



The equivalent total is now over 17,000. That's a pretty impressive rate of growth.

Perhaps I should rephrase my post to say "But *some people* would rather have another thing to moan about and blame the government for.

I do believe the next 6 to 12 months will see a lot of growth in eircode uptake

I saw this on Twitter:

https://twitter.com/autoaddress/status/654696747537580032

Does anyone know who the courier company is?!

irishgeo

Deleted User wrote: »

True, but this site was the first to change the word postcode to eircode when you changed the country name.

what site was this?

irishgeo

irishgeo wrote: »

what site was this?

It was a UK based site selling LED's that has an Irish clone.

MBSnr

Hmmm...
Not sure what is going on... ;-)

Surely FTA Ireland are nearly full circle now...

https://twitter.com/newsfromftai/status/654942606649085952

clewbays

larchill wrote: »

Likewise for the RF150 - non use of vehicle.

Good example here of how to add an Eircode field to the Capital Acquisitions Tax form using two boxes, shading and partitioning:

http://www.revenue.ie/revsearch/search?q=eircode&btnSearch=Find

ukoda

https://twitter.com/ran_more/status/656801008073486336




Seems PayPal have integrated eircode....for Germany.... Hahahaha

Mountainsandh

I just tried to amend my PayPal address after seeing the post above, and I can't. It doesn't even ask me for Eircode specifically, it says postcode, and that it should be 5 digits.

I suspect the above screenshot is doctored. Maybe it's just me ?

ukoda

Mountainsandh wrote: »

I just tried to amend my PayPal address after seeing the post above, and I can't. It doesn't even ask me for Eircode specifically, it says postcode, and that it should be 5 digits.

I suspect the above screenshot is doctored. Maybe it's just me ?

It's possible, but I don't see why a guy in Zürich would doctor a form and publicly tweet PayPal complaining about it

Mountainsandh

ukoda wrote: »

It's possible, but I don't see why a guy in Zürich would doctor a form and publicly tweet PayPal complaining about it

I would hazard a guess that, the guy seemingly following 3 Ireland Online, House Dublin, and retweeting endless English language Irish reference tweets, is in fact Irish, or has a strong link to Ireland.

I would further guess that the guy may, just like us, participate in online debates about Eircode, and wish to make a point ?

Do people in Germany know what Eircode is, and that it is something we just "adopted" ?

But hey, these are all just wild guesses.

1huge1

Happy to see uptake is on the increase.

Anyone have any info on if google will be implementing it onto maps?

FishOnABike

1huge1 wrote: »

Happy to see uptake is on the increase.

Anyone have any info on if google will be implementing it onto maps?

If the only car available was a 595cc Trabant we would all be driving 595cc Trabants.

Increased usage of eircodes is not an endorsement of eircode. It is just a consequence of it being all we have.

ukoda

FishOnABike wrote: »

If the only car available was a 595cc Trabant we would all be driving 595cc Trabants.

Increased usage of eircodes is not an endorsement of eircode. It is just a consequence of it being all we have.

I believe the other car on the road here is loc8 code, it had 5 years to embed itself as useful and gain wide spread adoption, it failed.

If it had succeeded and became popular to the point of widespread adoption, eircode would never have seen the light of day. But it didn't.

Sam Russell

I tried to use Eircode to find an place. I had its address but it just told me there were too many addresses. So much for using it to find a place. I had a house name, townland, and post town - no joy.

ukoda

Sam Russell wrote: »

I tried to use Eircode to find an place. I had its address but it just told me there were too many addresses. So much for using it to find a place. I had a house name, townland, and post town - no joy.

Why don't you ask the person who lives / works there to give you their eircode? Isn't that the idea behind it really, get the eircode and you don't have to worry about fiddling around with address searches

Given that the house name is more than likely a vanity name that's not in the offical address database, in reality all you probably had to search with was townland and post town

Sam Russell

ukoda wrote: »

Why don't you ask the person who lives / works there to give you their eircode? Isn't that the idea behind it really, get the eircode and you don't have to worry about fiddling around with address searches

Given that the house name is more than likely a vanity name that's not in the offical address database, in reality all you probably had to search with was townland and post town

I tried all of the possibilities with Eircode - all useless. I do not know the addressee at all, so I cannot ask them.

All I can get is OS style map with lots of little dots for houses, but if you do not know which house then you are bunched.

ukoda

Sam Russell wrote: »

I tried all of the possibilities with Eircode - all useless. I do not know the addressee at all, so I cannot ask them.

All I can get is OS style map with lots of little dots for houses, but if you do not know which house then you are bunched.

Well yes, if you don't know what you're looking for...then usually it's hard to find

Sam Russell

ukoda wrote: »

Well yes, if you don't know what you're looking for...then usually it's hard to find

As you say - with or without Eircode.

I thought Eircode was to be able to sort this but obviously not. Non-unique addresses are still not sorted which is what should have been done first.

I do not accept that it is impossible to solve except that everyone involved says it is intractable and so cannot be solved. The Gordian knot springs to mind.

ukoda

Sam Russell wrote: »

As you say - with or without Eircode.

I thought Eircode was to be able to sort this but obviously not. Non-unique addresses are still not sorted which is what should have been done first.

I do not accept that it is impossible to solve except that everyone involved says it is intractable and so cannot be solved. The Gordian knot springs to mind.

I'll go back to my earlier point, at this stage everyone should have been given their eircode, ask the person for it and then you have their unique address.

Impetus

One of the Eircode’s primary selling points from the outset coming from gov.ie is that it is supposed to provide a unique address to each household/business in the country. The idiots “responsible” did not think through the implications of almost 50% of addresses in Ireland having no street/road name and house number. 99% of those (mainly rural) “unaddressed” buildings can’t be found in the database, because of data privacy laws – ie one can’t put the name of the householder into the system, and expect a search to work. Because it will not.

Zero account was taken of public feedback. The arrogant state, driven by the incompetent cso.ie drove the agenda. Wasting public money in the process.

While proper postcodes are essential to a modern society – they can’t be a replacement for a road/street name and building number. It is like cities and towns without waste collection, where the public are encouraged to dump the contents of their bins on the street. Let the mess happen. Because the incompetent ejits in power don’t care about best practice, so long as they collect their salary and a few state pensions – with a capital cost of 10 million + in many cases.

Farms and similar have no farm or property name on which a search could be performed.

The second, and nearly as bad defect of the non-system is the randomisation of the last four characters, and outside Dublin city, the meaninglessness of the entire code. Stop anybody in the street and chances are they can't state their postcode, or any postcode.

Then there is the initial letter – Cork has codes beginning with T and P. Meanwhile the C code has been assigned to Navan.

The Minister, and public servants (both of whom are grossly incompetent) who signed off on this project owes the country an apology for wasting c 30 Million EUR.

It seems to me that Ireland needs to go back to the origin of the issue and start again –firstly using the database derived from the Eircode system, give every house a number on a street/road name, if they don’t have one. Divide the country into perhaps 5’000 zones and give each zone a 5 digit postcode. This will ensure that there is no duplication of townland/road names within a zone. It will also allow an address structure to be formatted which is precise, easy to find, and compliant with best practice mail sorting and package logistics.

None of the main international logistics services uses the Eircode.

DHL does not – they black out the postcode space if you select country = Ireland
http://dct.dhl.com/


ups.com


https://www.fedex.com/ratefinder/standalone?method=destinationCountryChange


It doesn’t even work on Google maps – maps.google.com


Eircode so far is 30 mil EUR + down the drain. And it is no easier to find a home or office from the address, unless they are in a big city or town. And many parts of big cities have named houses refusing to display the building number, which makes the search even more time wasting. But what is 30 million in a country that wasted 60 billion EUR during the peak of the Celtic (Tiger) (read Ejit) period.

Impetus

ukoda wrote: »

I'll go back to my earlier point, at this stage everyone should have been given their eircode, ask the person for it and then you have their unique address.

Nobody remembers it. It is a random number. Chances of them remembering somebody else's code are as close to 0 as to be inconceivable.

You are obviously/would appear to be a "spokesperson" for the incompetents behind the Eircode. <snip>

MarkK

Impetus wrote: »

Nobody remembers it. It is a random number. Chances of them remembering somebody else's code are as close to 0 as to be inconceivable.

I remember my eircode easily.

Some of us are old enough to have had to remember all our friends 6 or 7 digit phone numbers as we did not have mobiles and had to dial each digit individually! by hand! each time!

So remembering the 4 characters of the local part of an Eircode is not much of s stretch.