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DART+ (DART Expansion)

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 143 ✭✭ yascaoimhin


    Early indications show one of the new DART routes will operate from Drogheda to Connolly, and the other route will be from Connolly to Greystones



  • Registered Users Posts: 829 ✭✭✭ gjim


    Any more details on this? I presume these routes are in addition to the existing Malahide to Bray/Greystones route? Having to change just to cross the Liffey sounds retrograde - and more like the DB experience.



  • Registered Users Posts: 311 ✭✭ Ireland trains


    There won't be capacity for darts to terminate at Connolly from the south.

    There's documents somewhere relating to the Connelly upgrade that mention proposed services.

    Can't remember off the top of my head but think they were:

    Greystones/Bray-Malahide /Drogheda with additional services north from Connelly

    GCD/Heston-Hazelhatch

    Docklands-Maynooth/M3PW



  • Registered Users Posts: 69 ✭✭ densification


    Just trying to picture a service pattern with the least possible conflicts.

    Drogheda- Connolly (Semi-Fast, using Clongriffin loops) 4-6tph, Malahide-Connolly (Slow) 6tph, Howth- Howth Junction Shuttle

    M3 to Spencer Dock via MGWR 4tph, Maynooth to Bray/Greystones via GSWR (Drumcondra) 8tph

    Hazelatch to GCD/DL 6tph/5tph

    This isn't the -best- service pattern, but at least nobody has to wait outside Connolly for a train to pass.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,618 ✭✭✭ thomasj


    that contradicts their plans

    "Delivery of this DART+ West will support existing communities and support future sustainable development. It will serve all existing stations along the railway corridor between Maynooth Station and M3 Parkway Station to Connolly Station and to the proposed Spencer Dock Station using electrical power, which has a lower carbon footprint than the current diesel trains. The frequency and quality of service will provide a viable transport alternative for surrounding communities other than private car travel. This will assist in Ireland reducing road congestion and greenhouse gas emissions from transport, thereby helping to combat climate change."




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,377 ✭✭✭ jlang


    Upgrading the Maynooth line as planned in DART+ West and then only giving a choice of Drumcondra or the Docks with only a bus/Luas or hike back to Connolly or the city centre would seem a backward step. Docklands is useful as an option for those it suits as a destination and as a way to get extra capacity but Connolly/TaraSt/Pearse (as destination or for transfer to DART) is where the majority want to go.

    I can't see Maynooth services to Connolly being dropped after only DART+ West. Won't be at least until one of the proposed tunnels is operational: Either Metrolink allowing a transfer a city bound Metro at Glasnevin or a DART Underground allowing the trains to continue past Docklands (swing back to Pearse etc).



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,512 ✭✭✭✭ Zebra3


    Maynooth line users can switch at Broombridge to the Luas.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 16,380 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Sam Russell


    Isn't Docklands on the Red Luas line?



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,251 ✭✭✭ AngryLips


    What's the prospect of having an interchange between the Docklands line and the Northern line services?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 13,046 ✭✭✭✭ loyatemu


    it would be slightly ridiculous to "upgrade" the Dart and then make it so you can't transfer from one Dart line to another without a 15 minute walk.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,046 ✭✭✭✭ loyatemu


    yeah I wasn't clear whether Glasnevin would be available before Metrolink opens (which will probably be 5 years after Dart+)

    You'd still have the question of whether there will be capacity if large numbers of Maynooth-line passengers are trying to pile onto (already packed) Kildare-line Darts at Glasnevin to get to the City Centre. I guess the plan is that between some transferring onto the Luas, and some going onto Docklands the numbers will spread themselves out.



  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 20,896 Mod ✭✭✭✭ bk


    Personally I’d question if people really want to go to Connolly or if it just happens to be where people are currently use to going to?

    In many ways the proposed Spencer Dock station will be far more central to all the offices around the area where I assume most people are heading, then Connolly is, in particular if they can get the new pedestrian bridge built too to connect into the south docks.

    Sure if your destination is O’Connell St/Henry Street, Spencer Dock is 18 minutes walk, versus 10mins from, Connolly, but then you will have the Luas red line right at the door of Spencer Dock station, so that sounds ok, specially as it tends to be quieter on that end of the red line.

    And of course if you really want to go to Connolly, Tara etc., you can change in Glasnevin and in future Metrolink there too. And of course not forgetting the Green line Luas. Lots of options really.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,618 ✭✭✭ thomasj


    exactly . The FAQs are stating


    Will any services to stations stop/be affected by the project?

    The project will continue to serve all the existing stations along the Maynooth and M3 Parkway lines (including Pelletstown which is under construction). Some DART+ West services will terminate at the new Spencer Dock Station. The main change will be positive as there will be more frequent train services and higher passenger capacity.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,251 ✭✭✭ AngryLips


    If they connect the Drumcondra line to the new Spencer Dock station, what would be the point of electrifying the Newcomen line and connecting it to the interchange at Glasnevin when it doesn't serve Drumcondra? Is it needed for through services through the Phoenix Park tunnel or are they doing it just for redundancy? It's a shame additional stops near Drumcondra aren't in scope.



  • Registered Users Posts: 829 ✭✭✭ gjim


    The point is capacity, I'm guessing.

    It's an important component of the overall system - the capacity will be there from the start to cope with full DART/suburban and potentially intercity schedules from both the west and southwest.

    Otherwise you're funnelling trains from both directions onto a single pair of tracks after Glasnevin. Effectively, it can be considered a form of 4-tracking and avoids recreating a newer version of the northern line bottleneck.

    The Newcomen line can be used for express services to the new Spencer Dock station while the interchange at Cross Guns gives passengers on such trains great options if Spencer Dock doesn't suit as a terminus.



  • Registered Users Posts: 311 ✭✭ Ireland trains


    Has there been any mention about how Sligo services will be affected by DART+?I would imagine journey times will be impacted and will they still terminate in Connolly.



  • Registered Users Posts: 311 ✭✭ Ireland trains


    Any update on the public consultation for Dart costal north.

    Was due January but unless it’s published tomorrow it’s been delayed



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  • Registered Users Posts: 22,840 ✭✭✭✭ lawred2


    Connolly is the primary stop for the IFSC. So yeah people definitely want to go to Connolly.



  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 20,896 Mod ✭✭✭✭ bk


    Some do obviously. But the Docklands has now expanded far beyond the original IFSC and I'd argue that the location of Spencer Dock station is more central and convenient for the majority of office workers in the Docklands area. Specially if they build the new pedestrian bridge.

    The walk from Connolly to IFSC house is 5 minutes. From Spencer Dock 13 minutes.

    The walk from Connolly to the Central Bank offices is 17 minutes, from Spencer Dock 4 minutes.

    Winners and losers there of course. But I'd suspect with the scale of development going on near Spencer Dock, that it will end up at a higher density then Connolly.



  • Registered Users Posts: 22,840 ✭✭✭✭ lawred2


    Maybe for silicon docks but Connolly is still best for the North quays



  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 20,896 Mod ✭✭✭✭ bk


    Sorry, I think we cross posted there, I added to my post:

    "The walk from Connolly to IFSC house is 5 minutes. From Spencer Dock 13 minutes.

    The walk from Connolly to the Central Bank offices is 17 minutes, from Spencer Dock 4 minutes.

    Winners and losers there of course. But I'd suspect with the scale of development going on near Spencer Dock, that it will end up at a higher density then Connolly."

    I'd argue that it is not only better for the Silicon Docks, but also the majority of the North Docks too.



  • Registered Users Posts: 88 ✭✭ DoctorPan


    Pushed back to May due to a consultation about Ashtown design being planned instead



  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 9,113 Mod ✭✭✭✭ CatInABox


    When is the Ashtown one going to be launched then? And what's happening there that needs a such a delay on another consultation?

    Very frustrating. It's just another sign that our infrastructure teams are grossly under-resourced that they can't run these consultations in parallel.

    Thanks for the update DoctorPan, even if it's not what we wanted to hear.



  • Registered Users Posts: 88 ✭✭ DoctorPan


    Dunno, all I heard was DART Coastal was being pushed back to Mayish due to the NTA wanting one to do with the options in Ashtown. I would hazard it will launch in the next month or so.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,511 ✭✭✭ Former Former Former


     And what's happening there that needs a such a delay on another consultation?

    The first proposals (August 2020) were pretty widely accepted by the locals. However, when the second consulation happened, they had completely redone the proposals for Ashtown and rerouted the road through the stables, completely obliterating them with no real explanation why. As you can imagine, this didn't go down well.



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  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 9,113 Mod ✭✭✭✭ CatInABox


    Ah yes, I had heard about those stable, but was mad busy at the time, just didn't even register that it was related.

    It's mad that something relatively small could push back another, larger consultation. Running the Coastal consultation would mean that they'd know about any potential "Ashtowns" sooner.



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