Kleeneze Reps. asking for catalogue back.

seamus

oceanclub wrote: »

Good to know - not that there aren't equally stupid laws.

Not being able to know what I was thinking about last year , there are "book club" scams that run whereby you sign up to the book club, they send you books and if you don't send them back, you get billed for it. This gets around the problem of unsolicited mail because you've agreed to receive these books.

I don't even know if it stills goes on tbh. The whole pretence was that someone signs up thinking that it will let them order cheap books via mail. They don't understand that they've agreed to the "book club" sending them books randomly and billing them for anything they don't send back.

Kleeneze catalogues.....could go either way. Can they be considered mail, even though they aren't actually delivered through the post? I imagine the reps believe that it's the same as handing the person the catalogue (like handing them a magazine), and therefore you would be obliged to return it. But fair game, if it comes through my letterbox then it's mail and it's mine to bin, contrary to what I said last year

Haven't seen one of these catalogues in years, thankfully.

rubadub

Mrkleenezeman wrote: »

It's a local call rate number - free to me because I have a phone package that gives me free phone calls to all landline numbers (like many people do)

I do not have free calls, I also highly value my free time. The MD in my place has an excellent response to cold callers/phone survey people.
Survey man- Could you take part in a survey about your business etc
MD- Are you being paid to do this?
Survey man-Yes
MD- Great how much are you going to pay me and how will I receive the money?
Survey man-ehhh we don't pay you.
MD- So you get paid for your time and expect mine for free, are you serious!?!
Survey man-ehhhhhh
MD hangs up....

Mrkleenezeman wrote: »

Reduce the number of catalogues out there by letting any Kleeneze, Betterware, Avon, Timberland, Lidl, Aldi,Co-op, Royal Mail distributors know if you don't want their product/information

This is more crazy expectations/demands, again expecting me to give up my valued free time. The onus should be on the spammer to find out if somebody wants their advertisement, not the "spammee". It is crazy and wasteful that they are so presumptuous. From reading this thread and others the presumption should obviously be that people do NOT want these catalogues.

Mrkleenezeman wrote: »

the world will be less polluted, and a better place for you being nice to another human being.

:eek: that is the most twisted faulty logic I have heard in a good while. If they bothered to ask people there would be far less of these catalogues produced there would be far less waste etc.

Mrkleenezeman wrote: »

Reuse the catalogues that are out there by returning them all to their owners, including the Aldi/Lidl/Co-op flyers.

Again my valuable time & money, do you suggest I post them back, drive around, deliver by hand, nobody in their right mind would do this, I'm beginning to think you are just winding people up with this nonsense.

Mrkleenezeman wrote: »

Kleeneze don't feel the loss of catalogues so much as the independant distributors do.

Here's a tip for you, if you have to pay to work in a job them more than likely its a scam, I view the kleeneze system as a scam. I knew this when I was 15 and went to a "job opportunity" seminar in a local hotel, they were selling kids black sacks and wanted them to go door to door selling them. Thing was it was cheaper to buy the black sacks in any shop than from them. They wanted housewives etc to take pity on these poor kids and buy the now well overpriced bags.

This whole forced face to face collection thing is a similar enough marketing ploy as using those kids -you seem to be well able to trot out the whole emotional blackmail attempts yourself.

Mrkleenezeman wrote: »

If your child acted in such a spiteful way would you praise or punish them?

I would praise a child for getting rid of rubbish in the recycling bin, there is nothing spiteful about it. I think it is good to discourage this type of spamming and show the spammers it is not a profitable way to go about business.

Mrkleenezeman wrote: »

but don't let them think that you want another one, that's just petty and pathetic.

If it is binned I would have thought that is message enough that you do not want them -not that they even bothered to ask if I wanted one in the first place. Thankfully I have no doorbell and am out most of the time so do not have to deal with them. And like the other poster said I am not about to litter my own garden with reams of flyers left out for people to pick up again.

oceanclub

Reading this thread is a bit of a eyeopener. I'd realised the Kleeneze thing was a bit of a pyramid scheme thing, but didn't realise how emotional blackmail is used to get people to buy stuff ("buy my mop or I'll be thrown out of my negative equity house" seems to be the underlying tagline).

P.

tommy21

Rubadub speaketh the truth!

Cabaal

tommy21 wrote: »

Rubadub speaketh the truth!

Indeed he does, the point regarding Mrkleenezeman and trying to attack people emotioinally is very valid especially considering the repeated rants

case in point from his posts:

After all you have no idea why these people have chosen to be Kleeneze distributors, perhaps it's because they are close to having their house repossesed and are doing everything they can to stop them loosing their family home.

Walk a mile in the other man's shoes before you condemn them!

Please try to remember that these are real human beings, and they do have feelings. There is absolutely no reason to deliberately cause them harm, emotional or financial.

I would recommend that perhaps you see an anger management counsellor, you obviously have 'issues'

That would be the average guy on the street who is trying desperately hard to bring in an extra 100 Euros a week or so

All pathetic to be honest, I must see if I can find my violin as it would go great which his sob stories. :rolleyes:

Mrkleenezeman

Haddockman wrote: »

Nah. He just does not want your spam pushed through his letterbox.

SPAM?

Where are you in the pyramid?

I'm not in any pyramid.
Pyramid selling is illegal.
I know it's complicated and hard for someone of such little intelligence to follow, BUT...
A pyramid scheme is where people get paid a proportion of the registration/ franchise/ joining fee when someone they introduce to the scheme joins.
Because the emphasis is on people joining, there is no requirement to support the individual who has shelled out their hard earned cash and because of this honest hard working people got burned by pyramid schemes way back when. That's why they were made illegal.

In Kleeneze, if someone becomes a distributor through me, then does absolutely nothing, I don't just get nothing, I get less than nothing. I get nothing from Kleeneze, and I hand people like you ammunition on a plate. Obviously this hurts my business, especially locally, where I have a good reputation, earned by honest hard work.

If I don't help and support my team, to achieve whatever it is that THEY want to achieve (nothing to do with me), as I promise I will when I meet them before they join, they are far more likely to get disgruntled and quit.

If you've ever had any business dealings at all you'll know that a happy customer will tell a few friends, but one that you upset will tell EVERYBODY.

If you want to know where I am in the pay plan?
I'm not going to tell you, because you won't know what it means anyway

tommy21

Mrkleenezeman wrote: »

If you want to know where I am in the pay plan?
I'm not going to tell you, because you won't know what it means anyway

Try me instead. Off the top of my head I presume you get a cut of whatever the seller sells?

rubadub

Mrkleenezeman wrote: »

SPAM?

Just another word for unsolicited mail, or junk mail.

From wikipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kleeneze

Since the 1980s, Kleeneze has used a different approach, using catalogues which each Independent Distributor delivers to householders and then fulfills the orders. This method is not without drawbacks as many people throw away junk mail without reading it although many distributors have devised strategies to minimise the losses.

They seem to recognise it as being junk mail. I presume one ingenious brilliant strategy might be actually asking people if they want it, rather than showing an utter lack of respect and just dumping unwanted items into peoples private homes -and then having the cheek to actual expect them to store it, write notes, ring companies etc.

JohnC.

Yes, it is true they are very careful to keep it just on the legal side of being a pyramid scheme.

Though I particularly like these two bits from their own site

Remember, it is illegal for a promoter or a participant in a trading scheme to persuade anyone to make a payment by promising benefits from getting others to join a scheme.

If your friends and family like the idea of earning an extra income, then you can help them start their own home shopping business.

They become part of your ‘team’ and as they build their home shopping businesses, we’ll support them and reward you.

Before going on to outline the bonuses you get for building a bigger business.

Boggles

Can't believe this thread is still going.

Mrkleenezeman wrote: »

If I don't help and support my team, to achieve whatever it is that THEY want to achieve (nothing to do with me), as I promise I will when I meet them before they join, they are far more likely to get disgruntled and quit.

WTF does that even mean???

It's Simple, just stop throwing shíté into peoples houses and having a period when you don't get your rubbish back.

/thread

rubadub

In google if you type in "is kleeneze a" it automatically suggests "is kleeneze a scam"

First hit is then
http://www.squidoo.com/kleeneze

Why Kleeneze can make you cry. Here are the negatives.
What is it about Kleeneze that causes 99% of new distributors to quit? And what causes only 8.5% of those who don't quit to put orders through regularly?

Whether you are a current Kleeneze distributor, or just thinking about joining, or even an ex-distributor, this page is for you.

What are your thoughts?

A day in the life of a Kleeneze Distributor....
Independent Kleeneze Distributors are self-employed representatives of the company and earn a 21% commission from the sale of any items from any catalogues which they distribute, either to friends and family or door to door.

A Distrubutor with Kleeneze has this job to do before she earns any money:

1. The Kleeneze distributor buys a few hundred catalogues from Kleeneze, spending their own money. [Yes, the kleeneze company makes a profit from the sale of the catalogues to distributors]

2. The Kleeneze distributor posts a few hundred catalogues door to door, with a little note inside of what day they will be recollecting them.

3. The Kleeneze distributor waits whilst some of the people look through the catalogues and think about ordering things.

4. The Kleeneze distributor re-walks the same route as before, but this time knocking on the doors asking for the catalogue back (to re-use next time).

5. The Kleeneze distributor takes whatever catalogues they could re-collect home with them and counts up the orders, then enters them in on the Kleeneze website, under their name.

6. The Kleeneze distributor takes delivery (at their house) of all the products that all the customers ordered, then sorts them for each customer.

7. The Kleeneze distributor drives back around all the houses knocking the doors giving people what they ordered and collecting the cash.

8. The Kleeneze distributor finally takes all the cash home, keeps 21%, and sends the rest to Kleeneze UK LTD head office.

9. The Kleeneze distributor repeats the whole process the following week.

Wow...

The Vampire Distributors?
The goal of every Kleeneze Distributor is to recruit enough people into his or her Kleeneze business, who deliver catalogues door to door and repeat the 8 steps above, so that Mr or Mrs Kleeneze Distributor don't have to do it themselves.

This is because Kleeneze Distributors earn a percentage of the sales generated by the distributors they recruit.

Given the scarily-high drop out rate of new Kleeneze distributors, Mr Kleeneze Distributor succeeds in creating an "automatic residual income" only by recruiting an insane amount of new people. This is called Vampire Marketing.

New blood, new blood, new people, new people. Because no customers can put in orders directly with the company. So for any distributor to earn RESIDUAL income and not have to work for it is by having tons of new people. And those new people would need new people. And those new people.... you get the idea...

Someone has to be out there delivering catalogues! This is NOT the case in many other business opportunities, and there is no reason Kleeneze can't have their customers order directly from them and still pay the agent who introduced them.

There is plenty more in the link, it is easier to read it there in its original format.

zuroph

Mrkleenezeman wrote: »

I know it's complicated and hard for someone of such little intelligence to follow,

I'm not a regular on this forum, and neither are you judging by your 4 posts, but this sort of piss-ignorant mudslinging personal crap is not tolerated on Boards. Cop the fcuk on and have some self-respect before you resort to name-calling, it really is embarrassingly juvenile, and isn't going to help you win any debate, nor help with anyone taking your side. Grow up.

Mrkleenezeman

achecketts wrote: »

If anything comes through my letter box, as far as I'm concerned I can do with it what I wish.

You're dead right, legally. Morally, well you make your own mind up.
Ever had a windscreen washing blokey approach you at the lights?
If you don't want your windscreen washing do you have the right to tip his bucket of soapy water away?
I know you get aggressive people that will just start washing your windscreen without you asking - there are idiots in all walks of life - but almost all the ones I've come across just move on to the next car when you say 'no thanks'

I'm afraid I take pride in the outside appearance of my home, so I'm certainly not going to leave a plastic bag or magazine in my front garden for days on end until it's collected. I spend enough time picking up rubbish that's made it's way onto property without adding to it myself.

Valid point, but how do i know that before you tell me?
When we deliver catalogues unsolicited we ALWAYS pick up next day, but granted we also see other catalogues lying around for weeks on end.

If someone knocks on the door and asks if I want it, then I'll happily oblige if I'm interested, otherwise it becomes trash.

I would hope that if you say you don't want it then they wouldn't deliver it? but it's nice to know that you would just give a straight answer.

In all honesty I think I've delivered two catalogues (by accident) to people who have told me they don't want it. Not bad considering we started out delivering to 4,000 houses. But, believe it or not, it's not the most intellectually chalenging task, putting catalogues through letter boxes, and occasionally the mind wanders.

JohnC.

Mrkleenezeman wrote: »

Ever had a windscreen washing blokey approach you at the lights?
If you don't want your windscreen washing do you have the right to tip his bucket of soapy water away?

The obvious difference there is that he hasn't actually given me his bucket of water for a week. If he had, then yes, I wouldn't be keeping his water for him. But in reality, he hasn't given me his water so I would have to actually take it from him first. Whole different story.

Jumpy

zuroph wrote: »

I'm not a regular on this forum, and neither are you judging by your 4 posts, but this sort of piss-ignorant mudslinging personal crap is not tolerated on Boards. Cop the fcuk on and have some self-respect before you resort to name-calling, it really is embarrassingly juvenile, and isn't going to help you win any debate, nor help with anyone taking your side. Grow up.

Actually it pretty much ensures I will bin any Kleeneze stuff that comes through my letterbox. Way to represent

rubadub

Mrkleenezeman wrote: »

I know you get aggressive people that will just start washing your windscreen without you asking - there are idiots in all walks of life

There sure are, some aggressive advertisers even dump stuff into people private property, appalling isn't it, no consideration at all.

I'm afraid I take pride in the outside appearance of my home

Mrkleenezeman wrote: »

Valid point, but how do i know that before you tell me?

Most people I know of take pride in the appearance of their house, it would be far more respectful and reasonable for me to presume people DO take pride in it, but you do the exact opposite. Your logic is so messed up its beyond belief... You should ask before doing it, simple as that. You won't even get to ask the likes of me since I have no doorbell and will remove it if I move to a new house with one, so if nobody is home do not dump it in, you should presume it will be binned.

As I said before -The onus should be on the spammer to find out if somebody wants their advertisement, not the "spammee". It is crazy and wasteful that they are so presumptuous. From reading this thread and others the presumption should obviously be that people do NOT want these catalogues.

oceanclub

zuroph wrote: »

I'm not a regular on this forum, and neither are you judging by your 4 posts, but this sort of piss-ignorant mudslinging personal crap is not tolerated on Boards. Cop the fcuk on and have some self-respect before you resort to name-calling, it really is embarrassingly juvenile, and isn't going to help you win any debate, nor help with anyone taking your side. Grow up.

It's no wonder that Mr Kleeneze went anonymous rather than using his normal boards.ie login; he's the worst advertisement for his own company that you could imagine.

P.

dudara

This thread has served its purpose. Closed.

dudara