Irish Debt Clock?

Milky Moo

Does the toll on the clock ever go down like or is it constantly being driven up?don't loan repayments ever get factored in?

Note: the answer to these questions may result in me hiding under my bed

ScumLord

Dinter wrote: »

The worst case scenario is the country reverts back to where we were before a succession of Fianna Fail governments built and then subsequently squandered the State's largesse.

I wouldn't even give them that credit. We where a country in the right place at the right time. The world was experiencing a boom time and we just so happened to get our oar in, Ireland was in such a good position any fool of a party could have done the deal.

Darragh29

thelordofcheese wrote: »

I assume after the peoples glorious revolution jobs will magically appear and everything will be sweetness and light?

Cool, sign me up.

We have to start somewhere. Don't forget how much money we are paying to run a parliment! We haven't got a big ask here, just let us live in peace and give us opportunities to work hard and leave us at it.

If the government can't provide the relatively low level of ledership that is required to provide those things to the country, then this government should get off the f*cking pot and stop lying to us. This government are too job creation what Shane Mc Gowan is to sobriety.

My name is URL

easyeason3 wrote: »

I'm not in the public sector. I worked in it previously & saw first hand exactly what goes on.
98% of people I worked with could not be faulted so that is why it annoys me so much when I hear people painting all of the public sector with the one brush.

And they didn't have a bigger part than any of the rest of us in the economic downturn.

Mass dismissals will never happen because each & every public servant will strike together, regardless of department, which will mean little or no vital services provided.

Are you taking the piss? Of course the individuals that work in the public sector are decent people.

That's a non-issue. Decent people get laid off every day.

Mass dismissals will never happen because they'll all strike...?!!

Is that the best reason we have for keeping overstaffed departments? That if we try to change that, they'll all hold the country to ransom.

Pretty weak argument there for somebody trying to stick up for them

cop on to yourself ffs

thelordofcheese

Darragh29 wrote: »

We have to start somewhere. Don't forget how much money we are paying to run a parliment! We haven't got a big ask here, just let us live in peace and give us opportunities to work hard and leave us at it.

If the government can't provide the relatively low level of ledership that is required to provide those things to the country, then this government should get off the f*cking pot and stop lying to us. This government are too job creation what Shane Mc Gowan is to sobriety.

Yeah, your plan seem to entirely hinge on riding a wave of dissatisfaction with the government to the shores of wellnowwhat land.

Also, i find it funny you think that small government and lack of regulation will get us out of this mess, seeing as the exact same lack of regulation got us into this mess.

Darragh29

thelordofcheese wrote: »

Yeah, your plan seem to entirely hinge on riding a wave of dissatisfaction with the government to the shores of wellnowwhat land.

Also, i find it funny you think that small government and lack of regulation will get us out of this mess, seeing as the exact same lack of regulation got us into this mess.

What we need is from government is leadership, imagination and courage. It's not a huge ask but you'll find it exceptionally lacking amongst corrupt individuals such as Fianna Fail members who have been pursuing an agenda all of their own in recent years in association with builders, developers and other such vested interests.

dvpower

And while the recession continues, we continue to give pay rises to public servants. A full pay freeze, including all increments and promotions is required.

Pay for the average Irish public sector worker was €50,598 per annum in March 2009, up by 3.4 per cent from €48,932 in March 2008

If that wasn't bad enough, we continue to add numbers to the public service. We need a recruitment embargo.

CSO figures show that the total number of public sector workers rose to 371,200 by the end of March 2009. This compared with 368,300 in March 2008, an increase of 0.8 p.c.

givyjoe81

annabellee77 wrote: »

Who said I'm a public servant??? If you knew anything you'd know I couldn't access this site if I was.

"very comfortable" eh....... Daddy a banker????:rolleyes:

And "could see this country soon enough resemble and anarachic thrid world country"
PMSL:D........I so have to send the link to this thread on to people to give em a laugh on a Wednesday!!

It's spelt 'anarchic' BTW........

Now come off it, you dont really think he's comfortable because he's a banker do you? This notion that all 'bankers' are somehow living a life of luxury is just ignorance being perpetuated all over this site. Do you know anyone that works in a bank by any chance, i can assure you the average worker, particuarly those front of shop, have had to deal with brainless drones giving them dogs abuse for the wrongdoings of a few senior executives/management.

My own sister saw the years of shares she had earned turned practially worthless by the this mess, i can assure you, she aint comfortable.

No one, who is reasonable, will argue that the nurses etc arent working hard, with the tasks they are given, but the whole admin side of this across the PS is a joke, they're are issues of overstaffing with nurses, as highlighted by the OECD report, which speaking to a doctor friend, is a fact which affirms. Not the nurses fault, but still needs to be addressed.

There is also a serious issue of inflated wages in the PS, which has NOT been sufficiently addressed. We overpay our Public Servants time out of number over our European Counterparts, particularly nations of comparable size, even accounting for higher cost of living here.

Bottom line with too many public servants is that unfortunately, they dont seem to grasp the basics of economics, or the simple principles that underlie business and apply to ALL public servants who are emplyoyees of the state, YOU CANT SPEND MORE THAN MONEY THAN YOU HAVE COMING IN, using debt to pay wages is financial suicide. Cuts have to be made end of story, and no bitching and moaning is ever going to change this fact, especially the usually moronic line, 'yeah well... they bailed out the bankers..'

For future reference, pointing out spelling errors is a really feeble tactic for trying to 'discredit' one's opinion. And how on earth is the chap supposed to know that PS servants cant access this site, im assuming you mean in work, plenty of em posting on boards during work hours!

Dinter

dvpower wrote: »

And while the recession continues, we continue to give pay rises to public servants. A full pay freeze, including all increments and promotions is required.

This doesn't take into account the pension levy decreases though.

dvpower wrote: »

If that wasn't bad enough, we continue to add numbers to the public service. We need a recruitment embargo.

Most of the reforms etc being introduced are only in the last few months. These figures aren't really accurate.

givyjoe81

Dinter wrote: »

This doesn't take into account the pension levy decreases though.



Most of the reforms etc being introduced are only in the last few months. These figures aren't really accurate.

So the public service figures (CSO) on its own numbers cant be trusted? :rolleyes:

dvpower

Dinter wrote: »

This doesn't take into account the pension levy decreases though.

Granted. But compare this to the private sector - massive redundancies, little job security, many pensions decimated and almost across the board pay cuts. There is a real mismatch between public and private sector workers and this is fuelling the kind of over the top recriminations seen in this thread.

Dinter wrote: »

Most of the reforms etc being introduced are only in the last few months. These figures aren't really accurate.

The figures are up to March this year. They are from the CSO, so I presume that they are accurate.

But doesn't this post illustrate the problem? We are in the midst of a financial disaster and there appears to be no urgency to take real action.

galwayrush

Has the Clock been re-possessed yet?:rolleyes:

My name is URL

easyeason3 wrote: »

There won't be mass dismissals regardless of what you think.
IT WILL NOT BE POSSIBLE.
I'd nearly like to see the government try this & for the entire public sector to go on strike just to show people like you how much of an impact it will have.

gtfo

Do you seriously believe the garbage you type? Then you say, "they're dead right'!... To hold a nation at ransom when so many people are being fobbed off by the government.

Its idiotic

Jumpy

dan719 wrote: »

Eh I never said they were. In fact I was arguing the opposite. Perhaps you should read the thread next time.

He was quoting your post, he wasnt arguing against you.

Gumbo

givyjoe81 wrote: »

Now come off it, you dont really think he's comfortable because he's a banker do you? This notion that all 'bankers' are somehow living a life of luxury is just ignorance being perpetuated all over this site. Do you know anyone that works in a bank by any chance, i can assure you the average worker, particuarly those front of shop, have had to deal with brainless drones giving them dogs abuse for the wrongdoings of a few senior executives/management.

My own sister saw the years of shares she had earned turned practially worthless by the this mess, i can assure you, she aint comfortable.

No one, who is reasonable, will argue that the nurses etc arent working hard, with the tasks they are given, but the whole admin side of this across the PS is a joke, they're are issues of overstaffing with nurses, as highlighted by the OECD report, which speaking to a doctor friend, is a fact which affirms. Not the nurses fault, but still needs to be addressed.

There is also a serious issue of inflated wages in the PS, which has NOT been sufficiently addressed. We overpay our Public Servants time out of number over our European Counterparts, particularly nations of comparable size, even accounting for higher cost of living here.

Bottom line with too many public servants is that unfortunately, they dont seem to grasp the basics of economics, or the simple principles that underlie business and apply to ALL public servants who are emplyoyees of the state, YOU CANT SPEND MORE THAN MONEY THAN YOU HAVE COMING IN, using debt to pay wages is financial suicide. Cuts have to be made end of story, and no bitching and moaning is ever going to change this fact, especially the usually moronic line, 'yeah well... they bailed out the bankers..'

For future reference, pointing out spelling errors is a really feeble tactic for trying to 'discredit' one's opinion. And how on earth is the chap supposed to know that PS servants cant access this site, im assuming you mean in work, plenty of em posting on boards during work hours!

i assume we can use the same logic and say that not all public service workers earn anywhere near the quoted average of 50k and are living lives of luxury too?

jumpguy

Look lads, we can't just keep blaming the past. That's whats really annoying me. All the opposition are saying is "Fianna Fáil got us into this mess!" Nobody is looking at how to get us out, I don't see any opposition bringing forward their own great ideas. Everyone is only thinking about bitterness.
In the Dáil, the recession is a mere political game. Bash the government as much as possible, the government sugar-coating everything (as we've always done...remember WW2 was called "The Emergency"? For Christ's sake, we're not retarded). It's broken politics at it's best. I read an article a few months ago that summed it up very neatly why we're being so badly effected. The USA is one of those countries trying to dig itself out of the problem, they're in a hole, and they're clambering out. They're improving their infrastructure, health care systems, etc. Ireland, however, is doing the cowardly move. Hunkering down and digging in. Trying to "ride it out" as you'd say.
It's time Irish politics got a fresh rethink.