FAQ: Analogue, DTT, Aerials

lucernarian

Running through USB1?! That will be a problem in and of itself regardless of what CPU is used.

fat-tony

Antigrav wrote: »

OK. You guys zoomed in pretty quickly on what is most probably the issue. This may be a thread for the HTPC Forum. Anyway . . .

It only a pentium 2GHz, 1Gb RAM and graphics card definitely doesn't have H.264 decoding :rolleyes:

I'm running Ubuntu 10.10, and MythTV back-end as decoder.

Even more likely as a bottleneck is that the DVB-T adapter is an Hauppauge Nova-T running through a USB 1.0 port

Wishful thinking, or what? :P

You're surely making a rod for your own back with that configuration;)
HTPC forum for sure!

warlikedave

Antigrav wrote: »

OK. You guys zoomed in pretty quickly on what is most probably the issue. This may be a thread for the HTPC Forum. Anyway . . .

It only a pentium 2GHz, 1Gb RAM and graphics card definitely doesn't have H.264 decoding :rolleyes:

I'm running Ubuntu 10.10, and MythTV back-end as decoder.

Even more likely as a bottleneck is that the DVB-T adapter is an Hauppauge Nova-T running through a USB 1.0 port

Wishful thinking, or what? :P

USB 1 standard:

The original USB 1.0 specification, which was introduced in January 1996, defined data transfer rates of 1.5 Mbits/s "Low Speed" and 12 Mbit/s "Full Speed".The first widely used version of USB was 1.1, which was released in September 1998. The 12 Mbit/s data rate was intended for higher-speed devices such as disk drives, and the lower 1.5 Mbit/s rate for low data rate devices such as joysticks

It shouldnt be too much of a bottleneck for an SD channel but HD could be problematic although my old computer had a dtt tuner plugged into a usb 1.1 and it ran ok for the most part. you could compare the channel broadcast bit rate to the max transfer rate of your usb port to usb device to determine the transfer rate of data (bandwidth per sec) neeeded

your processor will do most of the work if you do not have a nvidia or ati dedicated graphics to handle the encoding so 2ghz could be a problem also

Media centre is also a ram hogger in terms of how much.

The basic spec setup id recommend for a media pc is the old one i had

Core 2 duo e4400 2ghz (good if somewhat outdated processor)
2 gb DDR2 667mhz ram (should do but faster ram and 4gb might be a better option)
Geforce 8800 gts 614mb gddr3 (this will handle your encoding np)

That is the basic setup in my opinion...however at the other end of the scale my new pc runs a sat dvb s2 card and dvb t usb tuner np

core i7 2600k 3.4ghz
8gb 1600 ddr3 mhz ram
GTX 560 1gb gddr5

So you can see that there are a wide range of cheap to expensive components which could boost your performance like a dedicated grpahics card like a 8800gts or anywhere above to hadle the encoding and maybe a bit more ram or a upgrade in processor between core 2 duo or an i3 i5 or i7 (i7 2600k actually has a graphics chip within the processor itself which is a first ever for a processor so that processor would excell in encoding with the right motherboard and without a intregated graphics card). also using a native resolution for your monitor helps altho i have always had mine at 1800x1010 roughly

Hopefully this can give you a better insight into what ye might need to upgrade or change to improve your performance along with a good ariel and tuner card/usb device

I have used XP vista and 7 with this and no issues...did triall run ubuntu's first release but i never configured it for media centre operation so i cant really help in temrs of linux compatibility iwth media centre codecs and the hardware req on that particular OS but it shouldnt be more demanding then any of microsofts releases in terms of hardware compatibility.

---

A question from myself for anyone - ive been picking up some of the uk freeview channels 3 miles south of arklow in excellent weather on an indoor ariel for short periods before it breaks up completely (BBC strong ITV weak and challel 4 and 5 is very weak). i have access to an east facing wall. What ariel would i need to mount on this east facing wall may i ask (and note that there are trees in the way) to get reliable reception of the uk freeview service? i cant put it on a chimney so ill have to mount it at window height on a two story house with one line of trees parallel to the east facing wall in the way.

warlikedave

warlikedave wrote: »

USB 1 standard:

The original USB 1.0 specification, which was introduced in January 1996, defined data transfer rates of 1.5 Mbits/s "Low Speed" and 12 Mbit/s "Full Speed".The first widely used version of USB was 1.1, which was released in September 1998. The 12 Mbit/s data rate was intended for higher-speed devices such as disk drives, and the lower 1.5 Mbit/s rate for low data rate devices such as joysticks

It shouldnt be too much of a bottleneck for an SD channel but HD could be problematic although my old computer had a dtt tuner plugged into a usb 1.1 and it ran ok for the most part. you could compare the channel broadcast bit rate to the max transfer rate of your usb port to usb device to determine the transfer rate of data (bandwidth per sec) neeeded

your processor will do most of the work if you do not have a nvidia or ati dedicated graphics to handle the encoding so 2ghz could be a problem also

Media centre is also a ram hogger in terms of how much.

The basic spec setup id recommend for a media pc is the old one i had

Core 2 duo e4400 2ghz (good if somewhat outdated processor)
2 gb DDR2 667mhz ram (should do but faster ram and 4gb might be a better option)
Geforce 8800 gts 614mb gddr3 (this will handle your encoding np)

That is the basic setup in my opinion...however at the other end of the scale my new pc runs a sat dvb s2 card and dvb t usb tuner np

core i7 2600k 3.4ghz
8gb 1600 ddr3 mhz ram
GTX 560 1gb gddr5

So you can see that there are a wide range of cheap to expensive components which could boost your performance like a dedicated grpahics card like a 8800gts or anywhere above to hadle the encoding and maybe a bit more ram or a upgrade in processor between core 2 duo or an i3 i5 or i7 (i7 2600k actually has a graphics chip within the processor itself which is a first ever for a processor so that processor would excell in encoding with the right motherboard and without a intregated graphics card). also using a native resolution for your monitor helps altho i have always had mine at 1800x1010 roughly

Hopefully this can give you a better insight into what ye might need to upgrade or change to improve your performance along with a good ariel and tuner card/usb device

I have used XP vista and 7 with this and no issues...did triall run ubuntu's first release but i never configured it for media centre operation so i cant really help in temrs of linux compatibility iwth media centre codecs and the hardware req on that particular OS but it shouldnt be more demanding then any of microsofts releases in terms of hardware compatibility.

BostonB

Dunno if this is relevant but I've a Core 2 duo 2Ghz with a 7900GT graphic card (a laptop) and it plays HD. Anything I had with lesser spec wouldn't.

FRIENDO

warlikedave wrote: »

USB 1 standard:

---

A question from myself for anyone - ive been picking up some of the uk freeview channels 3 miles south of arklow in excellent weather on an indoor ariel for short periods before it breaks up completely (BBC strong ITV weak and challel 4 and 5 is very weak). i have access to an east facing wall. What ariel would i need to mount on this east facing wall may i ask (and note that there are trees in the way) to get reliable reception of the uk freeview service? i cant put it on a chimney so ill have to mount it at window height on a two story house with one line of trees parallel to the east facing wall in the way.

Living East/South/East of Gorey, Put up a Triax 52B aerial with a plug in single booster getting perfect UK Freeview on all channels, channel 42,43,46 and 49 100% signal and strength, however unable to combine with saorview as I live in a week saorview area.
Nice to have extra channels such as Yesterday, Quest, Challenge, 5# and 5 USA, 4music and Viva also works out cheap for multiroom.

Antigrav

warlikedave wrote: »

warlikedave wrote: »

Hopefully this can give you a better insight into what ye might need to upgrade or change to improve your performance along with a good ariel and tuner card/usb device

Upgraded server to 2.8Ghz Dual Core and it now works fine.

Capt'n Midnight

paddyp wrote: »

Yeah literally millions of people in the UK were conned into getting new antennae I'm sure the same will happen here. Digital requires far lower signal levels than analogue so if you have a good picture on analogue without amps, combiners and other shennanigans you will be 99% sure to have a perfect digital signal.

If in the UK go to BBC teletext page 284 , if you can read the page your existing aerial is OK

Do RTE have something like this yet ??

How do we get it shouted from the rooftops to prevent people here being ripped off buying overpriced foil that won't survive a storm ?

Can I test my aerial before the digital switchover? UK only
You can test your current aerial through analogue Teletext. This test is designed to check if your current aerial will need to be replaced or upgraded to receive digital TV through your aerial after the switchover.

The test pattern is broadcast on Teletext page 284 on BBC1, BBC2, ITV1, Channel 4 and S4C. You should carry out the test on all channels and under different weather conditions (fog, rain, fine dry weather, etc) to achieve a more accurate and objective result. If there are more than 4 squares missing (randomly spaced – complete lines missing are fine) then your aerial needs checked or replaced. Ideally, the screen should display a full grid of vertical/horizontal white boxes.

Peter Rhea

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

If in the UK go to BBC teletext page 284 , if you can read the page your existing aerial is OK

Do RTE have something like this yet ??

Noticed it on TG4 at one stage, about a year ago (maybe longer), not sure how long it was there.

A lot of RTE analogue is VHF so the test would be irrelevant in that case.

lucernarian

Many people can use the their Freeview-only flatscreen TV to see if they can tune in the channels anyway and at what quality, even if they can only hear them. That's a 100% guaranteed way to check for Saorview coverage (even if it may be borderline reception)

Beyond that, the saorview coverage map from RTE is good if a little conservative. A proper outdoor aerial setup should work if you're right beside an area marked as covered (unless there's large buildings right beside you, blocking the path to the transmitter)

Seanh111

could anyone tell me what I would need to get saorview on my laptop? Bit of a newbie but would be handy for college to have TV on my laptop!

The Cush

Seanh111 wrote: »

could anyone tell me what I would need to get saorview on my laptop? Bit of a newbie but would be handy for college to have TV on my laptop!

http://www.mpeg4ireland.com/saorview-dtt-on-a-pc

tadgh

Seanh111 wrote: »

could anyone tell me what I would need to get saorview on my laptop? Bit of a newbie but would be handy for college to have TV on my laptop!

Just use http://www.magnetwebtv.ie

NUTZZ

Just a quick question guys, my parents have an outdoor aerial in their house for all the terrestrial channels, if they were to get a Saorview box would the aerial have to be re-aligned or does it come from the same transmitter that its currently aligned to?

Thanks for any info!

Vince Cable

NUTZZ wrote: »

. . . my parents have an outdoor aerial in their house for all the terrestrial channels

If they have all the terr. channels, including TV3, with reasonable reception, they should be fine.

A lot of the smaller transmitters with no TV3 are will not carry Saorview.
See http://coverage.rtenl.ie/RTENLcoveragechecker.php

NUTZZ

Vince Cable wrote: »

If they have all the terr. channels, including TV3, with reasonable reception, they should be fine.

A lot of the smaller transmitters with no TV3 are will not carry Saorview.
See http://coverage.rtenl.ie/RTENLcoveragechecker.php

Thanks for the info! Yeh they have RTE 1, 2 and TV3 in perfect quality, we've never had a decent picture for TG4 though, none of the installers over the years could get a better picture, the parents are based in the midlands!

Edit: Just had a look at that map you posted, looks like they're pointed at Cairn Hill

Vince Cable

NUTZZ wrote: »

. . . looks like they're pointed at Cairn Hill

Should be fine in that case. There are some instances where the reception of TV3 may not be indicative of Saorview availability, such as privately funded community transmitters or commercial 'deflectors'.
Also Mt. Leinster reception may require a different aerial.

Oh_Noes

Hey guys, just looking to see what my situation is. I'm thinking of upgrading to a saorview compatible tv but not sure if it's an option.

At the moment I only have a 15" tv and a 5 year old one-for-all indoor aeriel (little amplified one with a loop and rabbit ears). I recieve RTE 1,2, TV3 and TG4 to a reasonable standard, not crystal clear by any means; slightly fuzzy but watchable enough.

I'm in central Athlone, in an apartment so I can't erect a roof aeriel. Should I bother getting a Saorview TV? Is there any kind of aeriel I could use indoors?

warlikedave

Oh_Noes wrote: »

Hey guys, just looking to see what my situation is. I'm thinking of upgrading to a saorview compatible tv but not sure if it's an option.

At the moment I only have a 15" tv and a 5 year old one-for-all indoor aeriel (little amplified one with a loop and rabbit ears). I recieve RTE 1,2, TV3 and TG4 to a reasonable standard, not crystal clear by any means; slightly fuzzy but watchable enough.

I'm in central Athlone, in an apartment so I can't erect a roof aeriel. Should I bother getting a Saorview TV? Is there any kind of aeriel I could use indoors?

Can ye borrow a usb dvb-t tuner or set top box? that could help ye determine if you can get saorview not much else i can recommend really

Oh_Noes

Unfortunately not, everyone I know seems to have Sky but I'm not much of a TV head so I never bothered much about it. There's even a satellite dish connection in the place but I really only like to watch the domestic stations.

I read somewhere that if you can pick up the terrestrial stations to a good standard on analogue then you will be able to pick up DTT. Is this a myth?

The Cush

Oh_Noes wrote: »

I read somewhere that if you can pick up the terrestrial stations to a good standard on analogue then you will be able to pick up DTT. Is this a myth?

If you get TV3 you should get Saorview. You may have to play around with the aerial for best signal and it may be prone to some interference because it's located indoors.

My example, no analogue reception from Woodcock Hill but I get reasonable reception of DTT with an aerial pointing in a different direction.

haymur

Can you put two coax cable into the connector box on a attic/roof aerial to feed two tv with digital signal. I have one fitted and it works well but would like to feed another set from same aerial without having to fit a power amp

Peter Rhea

Use a splitter on the single feed coming from the aerial.

haymur

Peter Rhea wrote: »

Use a splitter on the single feed coming from the aerial.

I thought of that but was afraid I might get a big signal loss

Peter Rhea

You'll get worse if you just jam 2 cables into the aerial connection.

haymur

OK Thanks for advice

Billyie

hi..guys ..just having a block in my thoughts..and wonder how to run the two signals i have now.,...respectively...analouge UPC signal And the Irish digital from a UHF Aerial...into one coax ..for connection into back of tv
Thanks for any help...
I have tried it using a T piece(f-Plug connections) and back to co ax plugs for connection at TV....but the UPC analouge was badly affected.
Then tried a one in ..one out plugged in distributon amp...but also analoge was poor.....am i missing something..?

Really need a brain wave here..any help appreciated...Billyie

lucernarian

You'd need a special combiner which has VHF to UHF ch 50 or 51 on one leg for the UPC input, and then UHF ch 50/51 to 68 on the other leg for Saorview assuming you're in Dublin/Northeast/counties Sligo, Clare, east co. Galway or Wexford town and a few other places.

It's location dependent really. Saorview has to come in on the channels above what UPC use otherwise you can't combine the two cables.

Sam Russell

@Billyie

Where are you based - or in other words, which channel do you get Saorview on?

Billyie

Hello...thanks mate... are those special spiltters easy to get....??
im in waterford city......where i get my digital channels on CH45....and i am 99% certain these digital channels are from Mount Leinster....(although there is a transmitter in the city)
I am also 99% certain that my digital channels from mount Leinster are betwen channels 39 to 49...!!!
so is it correct to say i would need a splitter with one leg of the input side of this splitter to carry only between ch 39 to ch 49 (my digital channels), while the other side of this splitter would need to carry the vhf / uhf channels from UPC ( i dont know the actual channel no's).
And so on the output side of this splitter...both sets of signals would be of good quality to tv...??
And so there is no more swapping of co-ax cables...???
Thanks if you can advise if i am understanding this properly..and what do i ask for when purchasing....Thanks Billyie.