Traffic Blues - RTE1 - May 31st

McCrack

I'm still not convinced on the NI registered car. It seems to be really stretching it to arrest under S107 assuming the driver gave a name/address and the Garda did not have reasonable grounds for believing them to be false.

I mean not carrying identification is not an arrestable offence by itself.

The public place one, again going by it's normal everyday meaning and the legislation does indicate what a public place is:

(8) In this section "public place" includes any highway and any other premises or place to which at the material time the public have or are permitted to have access, whether on payment or otherwise, and includes any club premises and any train, vessel or vehicle used for the carriage of persons for reward.

I'd be seriously questioning the arrest/charge on this basis alone.

currythis

On a lighter note,the female garda in donegal was pretty decent,y'know for a gard!

Our man in Havana

Do members of AGS get dicked around much by lorry drivers taking their breaks at very convenient (for them) moments/places?
I would be assuming that he could make the Gardaí go away by use of his stalling tactic i.e. a more urgent call would come thru whilst he is waiting?

Also is it true you can only get them for overloading if they are within a certain distance of a weighbridge?

DubMedic

Last night's Traffic Blues is now available on RTE Player.

http://www.rte.ie/player/#


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timmywex

Was just listening to the joe duffy show there, and from reading the thread in motors;

I think the main thing is the lack of legal knowledge of the ordinary public, they all scream for cars to be seized and the likes, but as has been pointed out here, nothing can be done from a legal point of view.

People constantly comparing to uk/ni aswell and why wasnt this and that done. I think it shows the level of giving out and the likes.

People dont know the law re jlo's, nor the seizure powers. Rte really should have done a better job to explain what happened (be it refered to jlo/prosecution pending etc)

SV

So what abouts the one with the overloaded car?
Surely they have the power to stop that car from moving anywhere whilst it is overloaded?

Trojan911

Bond-007 wrote: »

If that was the case, I could not drive down to my local hardware store and purchase a slashook. Would you not need the element of intent?

No problem going in and buying the slashook and then taking it home for it's designated purpose (over 18 etc).

Wrapped up in store bag & receipt in hand and heading home = no issues.

Hidden in your coat walking downtown long after shops are shut = issues.

Say I get stopped and my car is searched, all above board etc, and the officer pulls a baseball bat from the boot. He/She would be well justified in questioning me about its presence and my intentions. As there is just the bat it wouldn't look to good for me.

Now say there is a proper base ball & catching mitt next to the bat then the officer would still be justified in asking me about these items but the gravity of suspicion would be less due to the set being complete i.e, "Yes officer, I was playing ball with my son in the park today. We do this often"

It's all about justification.

Hooch

Bond-007 wrote: »

Do members of AGS get dicked around much by lorry drivers taking their breaks at very convenient (for them) moments/places?
I would be assuming that he could make the Gardaí go away by use of his stalling tactic i.e. a more urgent call would come thru whilst he is waiting?

Also is it true you can only get them for overloading if they are within a certain distance of a weighbridge?

No we dont to be honest. Get hassle a lot when the driver is the owner but never refused to come to weight bridge before. That member should have made the demand for the driver to accompany her, not wait for his meal break. Drivers have madatory rest periods......but dont have to be taken to the exact minute I.E. cannot pull into hard shoulder of a motorway to stop at the exact minute, they must wait for a designated rest area.

25km is max we can demand a truck to come to weigh bridge.

nice guy always

nice guy always wrote: »

No we dont to be honest. Get hassle a lot when the driver is the owner but never refused to come to weight bridge before. That member should have made the demand for the driver to accompany her, not wait for his meal break. Drivers have madatory rest periods......but dont have to be taken to the exact minute I.E. cannot pull into hard shoulder of a motorway to stop at the exact minute, they must wait for a designated rest area.

25km is max we can demand a truck to come to weigh bridge.

Could she have examined his tacograph and see if he was due his break? I know the demand over-rules this but might have got another offence of him. The road transport unit up here wouldn't have stopped with the weight. they would have been all over the truck.

Hooch

foreign wrote: »

Could she have examined his tacograph and see if he was due his break? I know the demand over-rules this but might have got another offence of him. The road transport unit up here wouldn't have stopped with the weight. they would have been all over the truck.

Problem is foreign, and is very apparant from the series, that alot of the Traffic members have very little knowledge of the RTA, and mostly Road Transport legislation. Im not the be all and end all of trucks but I know my few offences and stick to what I know. That way I cant be wrong!

I wouldnt be suprised it she didnt know the first thing about the tacho!!!

*and yes your right the tacho would show the hours he was driving and in fact can be sent to mapping in dublin to calcuate the exact road he travelled based on speed etc!!! Tachographs have a huge amount of info on them*

Trojan911

nice guy always wrote: »

Tachographs have a huge amount of info on them

I would be confident enough to say the "Tachograph" is to the truck as the "Black Box" is to the plane. They do hold a mass of information.

Imagine if private cars were required to have them also.... It would knock out most speeding offence disputes.....

Hooch

SV wrote: »

So what abouts the one with the overloaded car?
Surely they have the power to stop that car from moving anywhere whilst it is overloaded?

Not a bit of power to stop it....none. No such offence as overloading in afraid, and before you say it....yes there should be.

Trojan911 wrote: »

I would be confident enough to say the "Tachograph" is to the truck as the "Black Box" is to the plane. They do hold a mass of information.

Imagine if private cars were required to have them also.... It would knock out most speeding offence disputes.....

Correct!

Random

Not a bit of power to stop it....none. No such offence as overloading in afraid, and before you say it....yes there should be.

Surely they could be done under something like dangerous driving or something?

SV

nice guy always wrote: »

Not a bit of power to stop it....none. No such offence as overloading in afraid, and before you say it....yes there should be.

Wow..

I feel sorry for Traffic Corps Gardaí.

Hooch

SV wrote: »

Wow..

I feel sorry for Traffic Corps Gardaí.

I feel sorry for me too:p.

Thats a big problem....public think we have more power than we have. If they pulled one Garda from every division and specialised unit in the state and asked them to review and make recommendations on law there would be some great changes....for the better

Hooch

Random wrote: »

Surely they could be done under something like dangerous driving or something?

Nope....dangerous driving wouldnt cut it....remember posts AGS must act within the law. The LAW makes no provision for overloading. Thats at fault....not us

SV

nice guy always wrote: »

I feel sorry for me too:p.

Thats a big problem....public think we have more power than we have. If they pulled one Garda from every division and specialised unit in the state and asked them to review and make recommendations on law there would be some great changes....for the better

*ahem*
for the record I drive by the law at all times.


ah no, that's so ridiculous.
They basically fined the driver for an offence..which they continued to carry out when they drove off?
Surely there's grounds there for stopping the car?
They couldn't possibly drive off without commiting an offence..

Hooch

SV wrote: »

*ahem*
for the record I drive by the law at all times.


ah no, that's so ridiculous.
They basically fined the driver for an offence..which they continued to carry out when they drove off?
Surely there's grounds there for stopping the car?
They couldn't possibly drive off without commiting an offence..

Thats it. I'd love to tell you they should have done more but I cant.

We dont know if the driver was summons but if I had stopped her im afraid she would be getting 5 yes count them 5 tickets (still only 2 points as the offence was at the same occasion but the fine would be €400) Also due to the events I would have prosecuted for provisional licence and maybe litter polution act!!!

Should I change my username to Robocop:p

Seriously though...nothing we can do with overloaded cars.

Turner

I dont know why they dont show more footage from the Garda chopper.

In Templemore we were shown hours of footage of some of the wildest chases filmed by the Garda helicopter.

Exactly like what you would see on road wars.

I dont know, Garda managment must not want the public to know so many chases occur every day.

Whitewater-AGS

nice guy always wrote: »

There is a power of arrest for Section 53 where no injury etc was occured. Cant find it on irish statute but i'll get me law book out for it. Its a common arrest around the country. No power of detention (serious harm or death has Section 4 detention) but arrest for purpose of charging, name address etc etc. As I say McCrack I cant back it up now but i'll try dig it out for you.

In relation to Sec 9(1) offensive weapons Act, most iof not all judges accept that in this act a public place is your vehicle (not like some RTA offences:rolleyes:).

Trojan made a good point there, one was recently thrown out in Cork when the driver gave evidence that he lived in his car and sop it was his abode and a private place. This is another one that is convicted all over the country. Reasonable defence was inserted in the act to cover the likes of someone going to work as a chef or going fishing etc.

NGA I feel let down, and for mr crack the power of arrest for dangerous driving is section 53(6) of the road traffic act 1961-2006

Hooch

Whitewater-AGS wrote: »

NGA I feel let down, and for mr crack the power of arrest for dangerous driving is section 53(6) of the road traffic act 1961-2006

Thats for serious harm or death. I always thought it said and/or but thats ommitted in Irish Statute book. We'll have to pull out the legals books lads!!

Chief, I agreed 100%. Hours of good footage from AS. Should have been used!

deadwood

Mmmm.

Tacos.

Whitewater-AGS

nice guy always wrote: »

Thats for serious harm or death. I always thought it said and/or but thats ommitted in Irish Statute book. We'll have to pull out the legals books lads!!

Chief, I agreed 100%. Hours of good footage from AS. Should have been used!

You sure i'm 99% sure it covers all d/drive not just serious harm or death?

Hooch

Whitewater-AGS wrote: »

You sure i'm 99% sure it covers all d/drive not just serious harm or death?

Thats what im saying, I know it did.....but read it from irish statute book.....it says different. Maybe a typo on their part?

gdamedic

Anyone notice the student with the bicycle jacket?

Hogzy

It is so stupid that the gardai can just let a woman drive off when she has 5 kids in the back, i dunno if its the fault of the legislature to not give them the power to do so but isnt it a little stupid like. In the UK they would be made walk or get a taxi. JOKE!!!!

DubMedic

Hogzy wrote: »

It is so stupid that the gardai can just let a woman drive off when she has 5 kids in the back, i dunno if its the fault of the legislature to not give them the power to do so but isnt it a little stupid like. In the UK they would be made walk or get a taxi. JOKE!!!!

I don't see the funny side of what your trying to joke about.

You are quite literally mis-informed about Irish Road Laws & the powers that AGS have when dealing with these offences. Again, as others have pointed out, it is not fair to say that the UK Police can do this that and the other. This is Ireland last time i checked. Different laws, different legal system.

As for your post about get this thread back on topic, the majority of posters here are members of AGS, i'm sure they know what they are talking about and it has relevance.

Moderators will take action if action needs to be taken, action has not been taken as yet therefore there is no need to post something that is OT.

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Our man in Havana

It is strange that an offence is allowed to continue by allowing them on their way.

Hogzy

DubMedic wrote: »

I don't see the funny side of what your trying to joke about.

You are quite literally mis-informed about Irish Road Laws & the powers that AGS have when dealing with these offences. Again, as others have pointed out, it is not fair to say that the UK Police can do this that and the other. This is Ireland last time i checked. Different laws, different legal system.

As for your post about get this thread back on topic, the majority of posters here are members of AGS, i'm sure they know what they are talking about and it has relevance.

Moderators will take action if action needs to be taken, action has not been taken as yet therefore there is no need to post something that is OT.

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LOL i meant to say ITS A JOKE!!!!

Hogzy

Bond-007 wrote: »

It is strange that an offence is allowed to continue by allowing them on their way.

My point exactly!!!