M6 - Galway City Ring Road [planning decision pending]

what_traffic

what_traffic wrote: »

The idea that you think the current proposals are "a proper effective scheme". The delays alone putting it to planning show that it is nothing of the sort.

I think you are adding 1 and 1 and getting 3,no offence meant.

The delays in the application, so we've been told, are due to them attempting to make the application as resistant to appeals as possible. I can only assume this is in relation to environmental issues.

If there's one good thing about the previous appeals and court cases it has at least meant that, this time around, they are endeavouring to abide by the legal and regulatory requirements which they have often only made scant attempts at in the past.

We do something in work where any submissions we make to external bodies, are challenged and put through the ringer in the expectation that by the time its actually submitted, every possible angle has been looked at and addressed so that there are as few delays as possible once submitted.

I have no problem with the delay if it means that they are doing what is required in that regard.

Now, if they lodge the application and lose because of an environmental objection, then I'll have no problem in regarding them as incompetent

marno21

The N6 Galway Ring Road group met with ABP for one final time before submission this month. The N6 Galway Ring Road scheme will now be submitted to ABP following Governmental approval.

The final design of the scheme will be published this week

http://www.n6galwaycity.ie/phase-3/bulletin-16-update-of-project-timeline-28052018/

serfboard

marno21 wrote: »

http://www.n6galwaycity.ie/phase-3/bulletin-16-update-of-project-timeline-28052018/

From that link:

a CPO has not been served on any property to date as part of this project

Let the fun and games begin.

what_traffic

serfboard wrote: »

From that link:Let the fun and games begin.

Indeed. This Ring Road is going to be very expensive. Big difference in property values now in Galway City 2018 compared with 2013 when this project was started.

marno21

The latest design (and presumably final design) for the N6 Galway Ring Road scheme has been published:

http://www.n6galwaycity.ie/phase-3/design-update-current-design-01062018/

The scheme will be sent to An Bord Pleanala in June 2018 pending Governmental approval. It is expected that the planning process will be lengthy with considerable objections forthcoming.

Aontachtoir

marno21 wrote: »

The latest design (and presumably final design) for the N6 Galway Ring Road scheme has been published:

http://www.n6galwaycity.ie/phase-3/design-update-current-design-01062018/

The scheme will be sent to An Bord Pleanala in June 2018 pending Governmental approval. It is expected that the planning process will be lengthy with considerable objections forthcoming.

Has anyone spotted any changes in the final design compared to the one from August 2017?

Kermit.de.frog

Please tell me that is not an at grade cross road at the junction with the existing M6 in the middle of the flyover slips!

specialbyte

I'm quite disappointed with this design tbh. One of the major issues we have had with the M50 in Dublin is that it is next to impossible to cross from one side to the other unless you're in a car. The M50 divides communities and the 3 county councils of Dublin have been trying multiple schemes over the years to try and improve access for pedestrians and cyclists over the M50 in a safe way. It is hard to retrofit this stuff in though. It looks like absolutely no thought has been put into how pedestrians and cyclists will be able to get from one side of the ring road to the other in a safe way.

It might seem unnecessary now as there aren't huge numbers of pedestrians and cyclists crossing the ring road alignment now but as Galway city builds out probably onto both sides of the ring road we are going to leave tons of people with no other option than to drive. Given Galway's traffic issues right now we don't want to dig ourselves into that hole even further. Almost all of the bridges over the ring road could be 3-4 meters wider and include a segregated cycle path and pedestrian path on them. Another small change would be to include a pedestrian and cycle path on the Corrib River Bridge to also make it easy for pedestrians and cyclists to move from one side of the river to the other without having to go all the way into Galway city.

Lots of minor design changes now could be hugely important for pedestrians and cyclists safety.

Chris_5339762

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Please tell me that is not an at grade cross road at the junction with the existing M6 in the middle of the flyover slips!

I don't think so. Its hard to tell, but it looks bridgey to me.

Chris_5339762

Chris_5339762 wrote: »

I don't think so. Its hard to tell, but it looks bridgey to me.

Looks like they've left open which road is over and under the bridge, or simply omitted the bridge symbol.

Chris_5339762

Yeah looking at it there is no need for connections there as they are all catered for, apart from maybe bottom left to left.

North is on the left of that picture by the way.

Bobeagleburger

Has the connection to N59 being moved slightly further west? Good if it has.

Imo, it should have been even further west but obviously that would be much more expensive

marno21

Another article on the planning submission being "imminent"

https://galwaybayfm.ie/galway-city-bypass-proposal-to-move-forward-in-coming-weeks/

marno21

ABP consultation with local authority regarding this scheme concluded on Thursday last.

http://www.pleanala.ie/casenum/HC0002.htm

The scheme is still awaiting for Governmental approval before being sent to ABP. I am at a loss as to why this has to be dragged on any longer.

Zzippy

marno21 wrote: »

ABP consultation with local authority regarding this scheme concluded on Thursday last.

http://www.pleanala.ie/casenum/HC0002.htm

The scheme is still awaiting for Governmental approval before being sent to ABP. I am at a loss as to why this has to be dragged on any longer.

The government has to consider whether there are enough votes in it for them, or if the money would be better spent buying votes in Dublin.

spacetweek

Zzippy wrote: »

The government has to consider whether there are enough votes in it for them, or if the money would be better spent buying votes in Dublin.

That is a ridiculous description of how the system works.

Chris_5339762

Coupled with the fact that this scheme was at the very top of the cost/benefit ratio analysis the government did.

Zzippy

spacetweek wrote: »

That is a ridiculous description of how the system works.

Perhaps the heat has affected your sarcasm detector?

marno21

If anything it's the opposite. Badly needed rail projects in Dublin unbuilt while a half empty train trundles along a line built for transporting cattle passing through villages

marno21

Unless it's submitted for planning over the weekend, yet another missed target for this scheme.

Originally to be submitted for planning in Q3 2016, it'll now be Q3 2018 before this is submitted. So far this year, it's been announced that it would be submitted in January, April, May and June.

What's another month. I would imagine the start date of 2021 is now in question. If so it'll be a 2026 completion.

Bobeagleburger

If its completed within 10 years I'll be surprised

marno21

Issues with demolition of sprawl near Barna

https://galwaybayfm.ie/officials-urged-to-reconsider-boglands-for-outer-city-ring-road-corridor/

This is now 21 days late on its last target of June 2018, or 659 days late on its original target of Q3 2016

Donegal Storm

Poster on skyscrapercity saying its likely been delayed until at least October :rolleyes:

Aontachtoir

Donegal Storm wrote: »

Poster on skyscrapercity saying its likely been delayed until at least October :rolleyes:

Any explanation given?

marno21

Aontachtoir wrote: »

Any explanation given?

In short (thanks to Sponge Bob on SSC for this)

Minister for Transport can't sign off on projects over €100m so this has to be approved by cabinet. It's now expected to be approved by cabinet in October as part of the budget. Unfortunately, the ring road is only part of a larger scheme called the "N6 Galway City Transport Project", which also includes a public transport project namedropped as "BusConnects Galway" in the NDP. Unfortunately, BusConnects is not advanced and hasn't begun yet, so cannot get approval to continue without initial appraisal work complete.

There now has to be work done to seperate out the projects and advance the TII element of the project on its own and let the NTA handle the bus section itself.

This is the type of situation that would've been avoided had the Minister had any interest in his departmental duties rather than spending his whole time sticking his nose in other departments and concentrating on constituency issues with no relation to transport.

what_traffic

marno21 wrote: »

Minister for Transport can't sign off on projects over €100m so this has to be approved by cabinet. It's now expected to be approved by cabinet in October as part of the budget. Unfortunately, the ring road is only part of a larger scheme called the "N6 Galway City Transport Project", which also includes a public transport project namedropped as "BusConnects Galway" in the NDP. Unfortunately, BusConnects is not advanced and hasn't begun yet, so cannot get approval to continue without initial appraisal work complete.

Its so pathetic really. 4 years ago at the public launch here in Galway City they were talking about the public transport element been important to the success of the "N6 Galway City Transport Project". Thought it was a smoke screen at the time - and it looks like it was as they have sat on there hands on it since then. Probably thought they could plough on ahead and then do some of the public transport once road was completed in 2025/2030.

Bobeagleburger

Wow, are these people getting funded from taxpayers money?

Ameteur stuff.

Zzippy

marno21 wrote: »

In short (thanks to Sponge Bob on SSC for this)

Minister for Transport can't sign off on projects over €100m so this has to be approved by cabinet. It's now expected to be approved by cabinet in October as part of the budget. Unfortunately, the ring road is only part of a larger scheme called the "N6 Galway City Transport Project", which also includes a public transport project namedropped as "BusConnects Galway" in the NDP. Unfortunately, BusConnects is not advanced and hasn't begun yet, so cannot get approval to continue without initial appraisal work complete.

There now has to be work done to seperate out the projects and advance the TII element of the project on its own and let the NTA handle the bus section itself.

This is the type of situation that would've been avoided had the Minister had any interest in his departmental duties rather than spending his whole time sticking his nose in other departments and concentrating on constituency issues with no relation to transport.

Sounds like they want to build the road without any commitment to improving public transport or driving a change in transport choice. What a shock! :rolleyes:

Zzippy

Suburban mindset – An Irishman’s Diary on Galway’s search for a European vision

marno21

Zzippy wrote: »

Sounds like they want to build the road without any commitment to improving public transport or driving a change in transport choice. What a shock! :rolleyes:

TII have no interest in the public transport section, it has nothing to do with them. That's the job of the NTA. When the bypass is built, the existing N6 will be handed over to the council and TII will only be concerned with the new N6 and the approach roads from outside the city. These projects should have been totally independent of each other from day 1

This is a mess that could be avoided if the Minister for Transport had even a remote interest in what was going on in his department aside from going to rugby games and persecuting first time drink driving offenders and learner drivers.

This is only part of it. There's the ongoing issues with the runway at Dublin Airport, the fact that TII have no projects available to build in 2022 or so due to lack of interest in reactivating projects when they had to be done, the utter failure in trying to fix 150 sections of dangerous national road by 2020 and only managing 60 or so and the list goes on