So our education system suffers because of rich old people

Shmuck

Because rich people over 70 just don't feel like paying for medical cards god bless them, our education system, one of the key factors in the celtic tiger will suffer.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/1022/budgeteducation.html

Because rich people who could easily afford to pay for medical cards bitched and moaned, there is now no chance of the government backtracking on their plans to increase class sizes. The long term competetiveness of our economy will now be dramatically reduced. It's widely accepted that improvements in our education system was one of the main reasons in our economic boom.

But sure what do old people care, they only care about number one, **** everyone else, **** the future of Ireland, they'll all be dead and buried when the **** really hits the fan so what do they care. Selfish bastards :mad:

I'm gonna ****in deck the next old person I see on the street.

amacachi

Yeah, hit an old person, hilarious.

The original propsal was a joke, but I think the limit has been set a bit too high now.

Maybe if teachers did more than 5 out of 9 classes a day it would be possible to have smaller class sizes?

FX Meister

seems like you're only thinking of yourself too.

jhegarty

Stop bitching on here and organize a protest...

FX Meister

amacachi wrote: »

Maybe if teachers did more than 5 out of 9 classes a day it would be possible to have smaller class sizes?

Yeah, cause classes are all a teacher has to do. :rolleyes:

Shmuck

FX Meister wrote: »

seems like you're only thinking of yourself too.

How am I only thinking of myself? I've said before on here I would accept to be taxed a lot more than I currently do and I earn just slightly more than minimum pay.

amacachi

FX Meister wrote: »

Yeah, cause classes are all a teacher has to do. :rolleyes:

Half an hour of marking a day as well I suppose.

I forgot it's blasphemy to criticise teachers.

partyatmygaff

Still in school in a class of 30

Dont see any harm in making classes a bit bigger, As long as you have a competent teacher that can control the class and force people to learn (i.e. an asshole that instills the fear of god in you and make you learn by force).

amacachi

A bit of streaming depending on ability would sort a lot of things out, but that's just seen as discrimination these days. Even in the UK where it exists it's on the verge of being phased out.

Conor108

Ah well, I wont do medicine just to spite those old people*:D lets see how useful those cads are then!




*Also ridiculous points (585-ish FFS)

genericgoon

Shmuck wrote: »

Because rich people over 70 just don't feel like paying for medical cards god bless them, our education system, one of the key factors in the celtic tiger will suffer.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/1022/budgeteducation.html

Because rich people who could easily afford to pay for medical cards bitched and moaned, there is now no chance of the government backtracking on their plans to increase class sizes. The long term competetiveness of our economy will now be dramatically reduced. It's widely accepted that improvements in our education system was one of the main reasons in our economic boom.

But sure what do old people care, they only care about number one, **** everyone else, **** the future of Ireland, they'll all be dead and buried when the **** really hits the fan so what do they care. Selfish bastards :mad:

I'm gonna ****in deck the next old person I see on the street.

Children can't vote. Who gives a crap about them?

gazzer

Shmuck wrote: »

Because rich people over 70 just don't feel like paying for medical cards god bless them, our education system, one of the key factors in the celtic tiger will suffer.

I'm gonna ****in deck the next old person I see on the street.

Totally wrong. The reason that our education system is suffering is because the gob****es in government squandered all of that money that was generated during the celtic tiger away. In a way the government are lucky that the global credit crunch happened cos if it hadnt it would have been blatantly obvious how they fcuked up our economy. We went from being (apparantly) the most successful contry in the EU to the first one to have a recession. Bertie Ahern telling people to buy houses cos they were great value and that the boom would only get 'boomier' and so many people bought into it and bought houses for vastly overpriced houses which meant huge tax takes coming in to the governments coffers. They knew that it couldnt go on forever but did they budget and put money aside.. did they fcuk.


If they government had'nt decided to bail out their builder buddies by giving them 1.65 billion in the form of the sub prime Home Choice Loans then they could have used that money to reduce class sizes.

Stark

Shmuck wrote: »

I'm gonna ****in deck the next old person I see on the street.

The correct term is "old dear".

4Xcut

FX Meister wrote: »

Yeah, cause classes are all a teacher has to do. :rolleyes:

Although they have to mark homework, set exams and so on, their day officially end at around 4. Not only this but they get months and months off, paid. Why not have them mark state exams in the summer, speed that process up? They have excellent perks on mortgages, excellent wages, etc.

The problem with teachers in this country is that a lot of them seem to fall into it after oing arts. I would think that its common enough that someone does arts, decides to teach for a few years untill they decide what they want to do and ends up staying for the cushy job rather than actually genuinely wanting to teach.

ntlbell

FX Meister wrote: »

Yeah, cause classes are all a teacher has to do. :rolleyes:

No they have to tan themselves for 2/3 months a year at my expense also :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

axel rose

Shmuck, I think you messed up on the title of this thread......The education system suffers because the the horsey set are too good to pay tax on their millions. As for the "artists"...:rolleyes:

Run_to_da_hills

Shmuck wrote: »

Because rich people over 70 just don't feel like paying for medical cards god bless them, our education system, one of the key factors in the celtic tiger will suffer.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/1022/budgeteducation.html

Because rich people who could easily afford to pay for medical cards bitched and moaned, there is now no chance of the government backtracking on their plans to increase class sizes. The long term competetiveness of our economy will now be dramatically reduced. It's widely accepted that improvements in our education system was one of the main reasons in our economic boom.

But sure what do old people care, they only care about number one, **** everyone else, **** the future of Ireland, they'll all be dead and buried when the **** really hits the fan so what do they care. Selfish bastards :mad:

I'm gonna ****in deck the next old person I see on the street.

Would you go out and kill babies because the mi*cky money is not means tested?.

You should blame those that sh*tted on their own door step and wound up every old one in the country over the age of 70 just for the sake of getting in.

Fighting Irish

So why work hard all your life and be sensible with your money? I could just do as little as possible and let the gov cover my bill?
What do you class as rich? A lot of middle class people will be hit by this.

Shmuck wrote: »

Because rich people over 70 just don't feel like paying for medical cards god bless them, our education system, one of the key factors in the celtic tiger will suffer.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/1022/budgeteducation.html

Because rich people who could easily afford to pay for medical cards bitched and moaned, there is now no chance of the government backtracking on their plans to increase class sizes. The long term competetiveness of our economy will now be dramatically reduced. It's widely accepted that improvements in our education system was one of the main reasons in our economic boom.

But sure what do old people care, they only care about number one, **** everyone else, **** the future of Ireland, they'll all be dead and buried when the **** really hits the fan so what do they care. Selfish bastards :mad:

I'm gonna ****in deck the next old person I see on the street.

axel rose

Agree with fighting irish here. A lot of these 'rich' oaps were paying some of the highest levels of tax back in the 1980s, (I think it was 54%-too tired to check).
Many were paying mortages when interest was at 16%. They were the ones that were keeping the country up when the last recession was at its worst. (That would be the recession when people were actually poor and not in debt).
The least that can be done is that the government can look after their health in later years.
As for the crap that there are elderly millionaires using medical cards....whatever dude :rolleyes:. The reality is that they would be availing of their private healthcare. I wonder how many of these millionaire oaps have actually applied for the medical card?

Piste

Sick poor people are more important than sick old people, the money the government saves from the withdrawal of medical cards for over 75s should be put towards the people who need it most- the people who genuinely can't afford it.

Of course some over 75s would automaically fall into this group too so they'd be covered and old people who can afford to pay will have to pay.

Either healthcare should be automatically free for everyone or it should be automatically free for no one, and only given for free to people who can't afford it.

Toto Wolfcastle

Lmao at people who think teachers only teach 5 classes a day! I have 8 tomorrow and by the time I sit into the car I'll be wrecked, but I'll still have to go home and correct tests and copies.

And also lmao at the people who give out about teachers' holidays. Lads, if you want teachers to work during the summer then the kids will have to give up their holidays too! And if you want the same holidays as teachers, then become a teacher!

Anyway, back on topic. I can't tell you how angry the teachers I work with are over the changes the budget has brought about. Larger class sizes, the elimination of paid substitution for pretty much all except certified leave. It's not feasible. More than anything, the kids will suffer.

I'd gladly add on an extra 1% to the new levy, as would a lot of my colleagues, if these changes could be abolished.

Silly old people taking all the attention!

Oh and there are plenty of people over 70 who can well afford medical care without a medical card. My grandparents and their friends fall into this category. Why should they get free what they can afford to pay for?

4Xcut wrote: »

Why not have them mark state exams in the summer, speed that process up?

Just as a matter of interest, who do you think marks the exams in the summer? Genuine question.

ArseBurger

Shmuck wrote: »

Because rich people over 70 just don't feel like paying for medical cards god bless them, our education system, one of the key factors in the celtic tiger will suffer.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/1022/budgeteducation.html

Because rich people who could easily afford to pay for medical cards bitched and moaned, there is now no chance of the government backtracking on their plans to increase class sizes. The long term competetiveness of our economy will now be dramatically reduced. It's widely accepted that improvements in our education system was one of the main reasons in our economic boom.

But sure what do old people care, they only care about number one, **** everyone else, **** the future of Ireland, they'll all be dead and buried when the **** really hits the fan so what do they care. Selfish bastards :mad:

I'm gonna ****in deck the next old person I see on the street.

Get a job. You'll need one to pay for your fees. Like most of us had to. Take a leaf out of the work ethic book belonging to those old people. They're the ones that paid taxes when your parents were struggling to bring you up.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Any fvckwit who thinks classes are too small obviously has no kids, or no respect for the kids they do have: this is NOT about teachers, it's about KIDS. (It's amazing how many people want child abusers hung up and quartered, but are quiet prepared to screw them themselves if it saves a few extra euro in tax...)

FOGOFUNK

Cant wait to donkey punch my nana.

partyatmygaff

well im still in school and I know for certain (Atleast with 6/7 of my teachers) that they all do NOT teach a full 8 classes a day(Not saying you dont).
I know this by being a nosey little prick and having a look through my teachers' timetables and from what they say.
For example: One of my teachers was looking wrecked one day and when asked why she told us it was because she had only 1 free class all day and cant believe how we students survive every day with a full 8 classes AND 3 hour length homework and study.

Most of my other teachers Minus English, Irish and Maths do Not have a full 8 class day.

partyatmygaff

FOGOFUNK wrote: »

Cant wait to donkey punch my nana.

:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:


You do know what donkey punch means right??????

:pac::pac::D


courtesy of urban dictionary
number 2

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=donkey%20punch!

FOGOFUNK

partyatmygaff wrote: »

:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:


You do know what donkey punch means right??????

:pac::pac::D

Haha yeah

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

partyatmygaff wrote: »

well im still in school and I know for certain (Atleast with 6/7 of my teachers) that they all do NOT teach a full 8 classes a day(Not saying you dont).
I know this by being a nosey little prick and having a look through my teachers' timetables and from what they say.
For example: One of my teachers was looking wrecked one day and when asked why she told us it was because she had only 1 free class all day and cant believe how we students survive every day with a full 8 classes AND 3 hour length homework and study.

Most of my other teachers Minus English, Irish and Maths do Not have a full 8 class day.

Were you nosey enough to ask them how much time they spend planning lessons and correcting your work?

partyatmygaff

Not nosey, just couldnt give a crap how long they took to correct it, planning lessons doesnt seem to be to demanding a task tbh unless im missing something.

Maths for example never changes its always

1. See if any problems with the homework
2. Correct Homework
3. Start Classwork on the next exercise and take notes
4. Get Homework

And Repeat
Maybe for practical subjects like science yeah but I doubt it would be that bad

Toto Wolfcastle

partyatmygaff wrote: »

well im still in school and I know for certain (Atleast with 6/7 of my teachers) that they all do NOT teach a full 8 classes a day(Not saying you dont).
I know this by being a nosey little prick and having a look through my teachers' timetables and from what they say.
For example: One of my teachers was looking wrecked one day and when asked why she told us it was because she had only 1 free class all day and cant believe how we students survive every day with a full 8 classes AND 3 hour length homework and study.

Most of my other teachers Minus English, Irish and Maths do Not have a full 8 class day.

You're right....there are days when teachers have less than 8 classes a day. The free classes are usually for planning and correcting. I would rarely sit down for a chat!

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

partyatmygaff wrote: »

Not nosey, just couldnt give a crap how long they took to correct it, planning lessons doesnt seem to be to demanding a task tbh unless im missing something.

Maths for example never changes its always

1. See if any problems with the homework
2. Correct Homework
3. Start Classwork on the next exercise and take notes
4. Get Homework

And Repeat
Maybe for practical subjects like science yeah but I doubt it would be that bad

Bif of a contradiction there: one minute you're nosey wnough to look though teachers timetables, the next you couldn't care less...?
Why don't you take the oppertunity now to ask Janey?

rossie1977

axel rose wrote: »

Agree with fighting irish here. A lot of these 'rich' oaps were paying some of the highest levels of tax back in the 1980s, (I think it was 54%-too tired to check).
Many were paying mortages when interest was at 16%. They were the ones that were keeping the country up when the last recession was at its worst. (That would be the recession when people were actually poor and not in debt).
The least that can be done is that the government can look after their health in later years.
As for the crap that there are elderly millionaires using medical cards....whatever dude :rolleyes:. The reality is that they would be availing of their private healthcare. I wonder how many of these millionaire oaps have actually applied for the medical card?

some were here, however some were not here during the 1980s, my mother is a housekeeper for a pair (brother and sister) who spent their life in england and have houses all the place (sold one for 250k two years ago), never worked a day in ireland come back home and get a medical card and abuse the system completely now they have it

partyatmygaff

eh, according to my history teacher when we asked her what she does when she has a few free classes in a row she says she goes around to a nearby shopping centre to spend the time there

To top it off shes one of the schools best teachers too

partyatmygaff

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

Bif of a contradiction there: one minute you're nosey wnough to look though teachers timetables, the next you couldn't care less...?
Why don't you take the oppertunity now to ask Janey?

Ah ya see, I only want to see what they end up doing all day just to see what they have to do compared to the students, I couldnt give a crap how long they spend correcting my work or planning lessons tbh(No offence intended to any teachers btw)

byhookorbycrook

• Class Size: Irish classes are already the second highest in Europe. Next year, your child’s class could be even more crowded.
• English Language Teachers: Hundreds of English language teachers will go in schools. The only help most newcomer children will now get is in an already over-crowded class. This will affect all pupils.
• School Books: Funding for free books for poor children is withdrawn in 90% of schools.
• Substitute Teachers: From 1 January 2009 there will be no substitute cover for teachers on uncertified sick leave. Schools may have to send children home as the government won’t pay teachers.
• Equipment Grants: All equipment and resource grants for resource teachers working with special needs children abolished.
• Traveller Children: Funding of €4.3m for Traveller children slashed.
• Library Books: €2.1m is gone from school library grants.

Online petition here

http://www.petitiononline.com/class08/petition.html



and there's a protest outside the Dáil on Weds at 6.30

hopalong85

janeybabe wrote: »

You're right....there are days when teachers have less than 8 classes a day. The free classes are usually for planning and correcting. I would rarely sit down for a chat!

yeah, and what time does your working day finish? how many months paid holidays do you get per annum? planning and correcting?! lol most of the "correcting" my homework etc. got involved about 5 ticks and some random mark that popped into the teachers head.
serious amount of incompetent teachers out there imo who have no right to be "educating" anybody.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

hopalong85 wrote: »

yeah, and what time does your working day finish? how many months paid holidays do you get per annum? planning and correcting?! lol most of the "correcting" my homework etc. got involved about 5 ticks and some random mark that popped into the teachers head.
serious amount of incompetent teachers out there imo who have no right to be "educating" anybody.

I'm sure you'll be backing that last statement up and citing examples...?

hopalong85

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

I'm sure you'll be backing that last statement up and citing examples...?

why would i do that? i said imo, so it's hardly like i'm stating it as fact or anything. from my own personal experience though, and from talking to friends who went to different schools, there are a lot of incompetent teachers in secondary schools in this country. some of my teachers were actually a serious joke, coming in late constantly etc.

axel rose

rossie1977 wrote: »

some were here, however some were not here during the 1980s, my mother is a housekeeper for a pair (brother and sister) who spent their life in england and have houses all the place (sold one for 250k two years ago), never worked a day in ireland come back home and get a medical card and abuse the system completely now they have it

Oh for Gods sake Rosie! You know TWO PEOPLE who you hear are wealthy, earned their money abroad and have a medical card. :rolleyes:

Are you really suggesting that this example gives any weight to your arguement? Could you not have looked for a smaller sample?

On a separate point I would question your mothers professionalism..she appears to have little respect for her employers private business.

Trotter

amacachi wrote: »

Half an hour of marking a day as well I suppose.

I forgot it's blasphemy to criticise teachers.

Its fine to criticise teachers, just be accurate in what you're moaning about. It takes hours to mark work if its done right, and very few do 5 out of 9 every day. Thats just made up. Criticise away, but get the facts right first.

Anyway, the old "you get too much money and holidays" nugget I see all the time on boards is just odd. Its not like people who come up with that were banned from teaching. Do the postgrad, get the holidays and the huge money! Its that easy! Honest!

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

hopalong85 wrote: »

why would i do that? i said imo, so it's hardly like i'm stating it as fact or anything. from my own personal experience though, and from talking to friends who went to different schools, there are a lot of incompetent teachers in secondary schools in this country. some of my teachers were actually a serious joke, coming in late constantly etc.

Nope. You never said it was opinion, and it very much looks like you stated it as fact. Experiences are fine, but without them you post looks spiteful and backup by nothing stronger than gossip and insinuation.

partyatmygaff

Trotter wrote: »

Its fine to criticise teachers, just be accurate in what you're moaning about. It takes hours to mark work if its done right, and very few do 5 out of 9 every day. Thats just made up. Criticise away, but get the facts right first.

Anyway, the old "you get too much money and holidays" nugget I see all the time on boards is just odd. Its not like people who come up with that were banned from teaching. Do the postgrad, get the holidays and the huge money! Its that easy! Honest!

hey here now, Im not making this up people, I have seen most of my teachers timetables one way or another atleast 6 or 7 have 5 (Some of them even have 4 classes on some days).

Lesson planning is surely not that horrifyingly difficult and most if not all my teachers seem to make it up on the fly (works well too)

Correcting i gotta agree with though especially for English teachers and the subjects where essays can and will stretch out to 8 pages long EACH, But its not as if they have a deadline to get the homework corrected by, my english teacher for example took 2 months to get our copies back.

hopalong85

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

Nope. You never said it was opinion, and it very much looks like you stated it as fact. Experiences are fine, but without them you post looks spiteful and backup by nothing stronger than gossip and insinuation.

yup. i certainly did say it was my opinion. "imo" is short for "in my opinion". my experiences and the experiences of many other people who went to different schools are that there are a serious amount of incompetent teachers in irish secondary schools.

i'm not spiteful at all lol. i did fine in in my leaving, but that was down to me, not my teachers. hey, i might even become a teacher myself someday, 3 months paid holidays every summer, that would rock man! not to mention thos tax free cash in hand grind classes!

hopalong85

Trotter wrote: »

Its fine to criticise teachers, just be accurate in what you're moaning about. It takes hours to mark work if its done right, and very few do 5 out of 9 every day. Thats just made up. Criticise away, but get the facts right first.

Anyway, the old "you get too much money and holidays" nugget I see all the time on boards is just odd. Its not like people who come up with that were banned from teaching. Do the postgrad, get the holidays and the huge money! Its that easy! Honest!

postgrad?! huh?! not all of my teachers had postgrads that's for sure! have the regulations changed or something?

Stark

Good work if you can get it. Permanent teaching jobs are hard to come by these days, most teachers have to do years of going from contract to contract and being paid by the hour.

Trotter

partyatmygaff wrote: »

hey here now, Im not making this up people, I have seen most of my teachers timetables one way or another atleast 6 or 7 have 5 (Some of them even have 4 classes on some days).

Lesson planning is surely not that horrifyingly difficult and most if not all my teachers seem to make it up on the fly (works well too)

Correcting i gotta agree with though especially for English teachers and the subjects where essays can and will stretch out to 8 pages long EACH, But its not as if they have a deadline to get the homework corrected by, my english teacher for example took 2 months to get our copies back.

I'm a primary teacher. I spend 2-3 hours a day on admin and planning after my class has gone home. I'm not asking for a medal, just the respect that I do the same work as anyone else.

Anyway.. The government can well afford to make cuts elsewhere and not increase class sizes. Kids can't lobby like builders and bankers, so its a no brainer.

Interestingly, here's a pre election broadcast from the Green Party.
The first 30 seconds is enough really.

RandolphEsq

Stark wrote: »

The correct term is "old dear".

You can't say 'old' as that implies negative connotations and that they are somehow a lower class to the rest of society.

I think the correct term is the non-not-so-young

heyjude

Shmuck wrote: »

Because rich people over 70 just don't feel like paying for medical cards god bless them, our education system, one of the key factors in the celtic tiger will suffer.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/1022/budgeteducation.html

Because rich people who could easily afford to pay for medical cards bitched and moaned, there is now no chance of the government backtracking on their plans to increase class sizes. The long term competetiveness of our economy will now be dramatically reduced. It's widely accepted that improvements in our education system was one of the main reasons in our economic boom.

But sure what do old people care, they only care about number one, **** everyone else, **** the future of Ireland, they'll all be dead and buried when the **** really hits the fan so what do they care. Selfish bastards :mad:

I'm gonna ****in deck the next old person I see on the street.

I think you'll find if you check that the concessions to the building industry in the budget far exceed in value the savings that would have been made from removing medical cards from over 70s or from the education cutbacks, but in all the furore over the medical cards, people seem to have missed the fact that given a choice between our children, our elderly, our lowest paid workers and our builders, the builders were the clear winners, while the other three were 'put to the sword' with attempted cutbacks(some now partially reversed).

If Fianna Fail had given a bit less to the building industry, they could have avoided the other issues altogether, but the builders paid for their tent in Galway and now they're collecting their dues.

partyatmygaff

Trotter wrote: »

I'm a primary teacher. I spend 2-3 hours a day on admin and planning after my class has gone home. I'm not asking for a medal, just the respect that I do the same work as anyone else.

Anyway.. The government can well afford to make cuts elsewhere and not increase class sizes. Kids can't lobby like builders and bankers, so its a no brainer.

Thats primary school which is different, im talking about secondary schools here and so is everyone else i think but Primary School teachers do have more work to do since they teach everything in the class from Irish, maths, english, history, P.E., SPHE all by themselves and thats why primary school teachers plan out lessons to keep pupils interested and so they can learn.

Secondary school teachers on the other hand are either one of 2 things
Incompetent mentally retarded fools with no grasp of what they're doing (Yes there are some people this bad)

or


Absolutely great people who somehow can get you to learn and know what they're teaching inside and out.

Still though secondary schools imo have a much easier time than primary school teachers (Well atleast for Junior infants upto 2nd class or so when they're still little kids)

is_that_so

Shmuck wrote: »

But sure what do old people care, they only care about number one, **** everyone else, **** the future of Ireland, they'll all be dead and buried when the **** really hits the fan so what do they care. Selfish bastards :mad:

I'm gonna ****in deck the next old person I see on the street.

Nah, sorry can't see the connection myself no matter how hard I try but we shouldn't let that get in the way of a very fine rant.
Be careful now you might meet these.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ygy7UDADXDg

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055404215

our education system is gettin cut backs not because of elderly people but because they are gonna spend 6.5 BILLION keepin property prices too high

In particular the scheme will screw people who have ALREADY BOUGHT and are in negative equity as it only benefits newly built houses

i.e developers.


check out the link. Fight back